Do you guys think it's ok to eat.......
Replies
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Sandytoes71 wrote: »thx guys and gals.amusedmonkey wrote: »Cholesterol (except for triglycerides) is often cumulative, so is A1c, so in that regard one "unhealthy" meal once or twice a month will likely not affect the numbers by much. Take note that the closer to the test the meal is the higher of an effect it will have on your A1c, so to get the most accurate results if you do end up deciding to consume something "unhealthy", position it somewhere in the middle between your A1c tests. Keep in mind that blood sugar spikes can be dangerous even if it's a single incident. Since you are not officially diabetic yet, chances are your spikes are milder.
When I used to be pre-diabetic (no longer am after weight loss), I used a glucose meter to see how my body reacts to certain foods. You would be surprised how your body reacts to some things. In my case in average portions oatmeal and barley produced barely any spike, french fries and cookies produced an acceptable spike (I was happy about that) but rice produced an unacceptable spike (I was sad about that). I needed to play around with the portions of the foods that produced an unacceptable spike in order to make them acceptable again. What I considered acceptable was anything below 160 (preferably below 140) at 1 to 2 hours after the meal and a return to near normal (my normal) at 4-5 hours after a meal.
It can be a lot of work, but if there is something you really love and still want to include every now and then it's worth it. I usually did a 1,2 and 4 hour tests for any new food I was unsure about, and if it produced a spike within the acceptable range I tested again a few days later to double check the result, then acted accordingly.
Now of course you will want to discuss this with your doctor, they may have valuable input.
I will try this, thank you!
You are welcome. This is what I did with my doctor in agreement. Yours may have a different opinion.
Just one more thing, don't test the food in isolation. You don't usually eat rice alone or potatoes alone. Test them in the meals you eat most often or enjoy the most. The way a certain food affects your blood sugar can vary depending on how you prepare it or what you eat with it. Generally, adding fiber and protein produces a smoother spike, and the less processed a grain is the milder of a spike it has. Also, for me personally adding some lemon juice or vinegar (acidic stuff) gave me a nicer spike, and cold potato salad was kinder to my blood sugar than a hot baked potato with a side salad.
If your doctor agrees what you will want to do is make a short list of the meals you like but consider unhealthy and test them one by one with at least a few days between the testings. Some findings may surprise you!0 -
Perhaps its better to think about ways to make your favorite "bad" foods better for you! So I just went to check out the different foods you're talking about. There was no cholesterol in tortilla chips, corn tortillas, salsa, vegetables, or guacamole. I actually think avocados are good for lowering bad cholesterol so take advantage of that. The parts that have cholesterol were the cheese, sour cream, and meat. If you use fat free sour cream, it cuts down on the cholesterol. A low fat cheddar and being aware of not eating too much would help with the cholesterol or you could replace it with the tostitos con queso cheese sauce which surprisingly only has 5mg of cholesterol and 40 calories per 2 table spoons. Then theres just the meat to worry about which you could replace with veggie ground if you REALLY wanted to.0
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When I started CICO last August my cholesterol level was sky-high at 9.2 but my blood sugar was fine. My doctor said reducing dietary cholesterol would make very little difference as cholesterol levels are mainly determined by genetics and that medication was necessary. After 3 months of medication + a low cholesterol diet my cholesterol level was down to 3.7 [normal]. I have no way of knowing what percentage is due to medication and what percentage to diet thought I expect its mainly the medication. I still have to take the medication as my doctor says my cholesterol level will rise again without it, even though I still eat a low cholesterol diet. Go by what your doctor tells you.1
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Sandytoes71 wrote: »Do you guys think it's ok to eat one unhealthy meal a week or every other week if I'm trying to get my cholesterol down and improve my A1C number? I know I can eat whatever I want as long as it fits into my calorie goal for the day and still lose weight as that is how I lost weight before, but this time it's different for me. This time, i'm mostly eating to improve my horrible cholesterol and blood sugars (pre diabetic) and also lose weight. So, I've really turned my diet around and eat pretty healthy now. I started almost a month ago with lots of success, but I need to know if eating an unhealthy meal every now and then will keep my cholesterol from getting better. I'm wanting to eat chips and salsa and a taco tomorrow and am going to try to keep under my calorie goal, but I'm worried I will be screwing up my cholesterol and stuff. I mean, can I still be healthy and eat bad fats from time to time? I guess I'm looking for people who have experience with trying to get healthy on the inside?
I would say cheats are a bad idea. It is probably healthier to embrace a new way of eating and find treats within that woe than sabotage yourself once a week.
I eat a low carb high fat to treat my prediabetes. It works like a charm. Within days of switching my det my BG was normal. I also found that it cut my sugar and carb cavings after about a week, and reduced my appetite. I was able to cut calories and lost about 40 lbs fairly quickly... The weight loss did NOT help with my insulin resistance. My BG is only normal if I eat low carb and moderate protein. As soon as I go off plan my BG goes right back up. Not good. Elevated BG, even at prediabetic levels hurts the body and can even lead to kidney disease. It isn't worth it i my case.
Plus cheats would keep me missing sugar. No thanks. I would at her make myself some sugar free low carb treats like cheese cake, fat bombs, or cookies which won't hurt my health.
A LCHF det can help with cholesterol. Cholesterol is worsened by high carbs unless you are eating very low fat, especially triglycerides. Triglycerides generally go down on a high fat low carb diet. Also, HDL will go up, Lp(a) often drops, and LDL stays the same but switches to the larger fluffy pattern a - all good changes.
If interested in LCHF, I recommend reading Dr Bernstein's Diabetes Solution. Bernstein is a T1D who has perfectly managed his diabetes with diet and very little insulin in an era when diabetics were nearing their life expectancy in their 40s. Really good plan. Also, cholesterol Clarity or the Great Cholesterol Myth are good books to read for patients who have doctors who still just look at total cholesterol.
Best wishes.1 -
Sandytoes71 wrote: »Do you guys think it's ok to eat one unhealthy meal a week or every other week if I'm trying to get my cholesterol down and improve my A1C number? I know I can eat whatever I want as long as it fits into my calorie goal for the day and still lose weight as that is how I lost weight before, but this time it's different for me. This time, i'm mostly eating to improve my horrible cholesterol and blood sugars (pre diabetic) and also lose weight. So, I've really turned my diet around and eat pretty healthy now. I started almost a month ago with lots of success, but I need to know if eating an unhealthy meal every now and then will keep my cholesterol from getting better. I'm wanting to eat chips and salsa and a taco tomorrow and am going to try to keep under my calorie goal, but I'm worried I will be screwing up my cholesterol and stuff. I mean, can I still be healthy and eat bad fats from time to time? I guess I'm looking for people who have experience with trying to get healthy on the inside?
I would say cheats are a bad idea. It is probably healthier to embrace a new way of eating and find treats within that woe than sabotage yourself once a week.
I eat a low carb high fat to treat my prediabetes. It works like a charm. Within days of switching my det my BG was normal. I also found that it cut my sugar and carb cavings after about a week, and reduced my appetite. I was able to cut calories and lost about 40 lbs fairly quickly... The weight loss did NOT help with my insulin resistance. My BG is only normal if I eat low carb and moderate protein. As soon as I go off plan my BG goes right back up. Not good. Elevated BG, even at prediabetic levels hurts the body and can even lead to kidney disease. It isn't worth it i my case.
Plus cheats would keep me missing sugar. No thanks. I would at her make myself some sugar free low carb treats like cheese cake, fat bombs, or cookies which won't hurt my health.
A LCHF det can help with cholesterol. Cholesterol is worsened by high carbs unless you are eating very low fat, especially triglycerides. Triglycerides generally go down on a high fat low carb diet. Also, HDL will go up, Lp(a) often drops, and LDL stays the same but switches to the larger fluffy pattern a - all good changes.
If interested in LCHF, I recommend reading Dr Bernstein's Diabetes Solution. Bernstein is a T1D who has perfectly managed his diabetes with diet and very little insulin in an era when diabetics were nearing their life expectancy in their 40s. Really good plan. Also, cholesterol Clarity or the Great Cholesterol Myth are good books to read for patients who have doctors who still just look at total cholesterol.
Best wishes.
A whole food plant-based diet will surely reduce you chol. levels. Not eating a burger everyday, using oils, and loading up on dietary fats (sat. fats).
http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/25/3/417.short
"CONCLUSIONS—Total and saturated fat intake were associated with a higher risk of type 2 diabetes, but these associations were not independent of BMI. Frequent consumption of processed meats may increase risk of type 2 diabetes."0 -
Sandytoes71 wrote: »salt does that to you, but u say once your sugar problems were gotten control of, then it was ok if u occasionally ate lots of sugar/carbs? Ok, but I'm wondering how it would work with cholesterol. Do I need to be perfect with my diet until cholesterol is under control or can I slip up every now and then and STILL get my cholesterol under control?
The dietary cholesterol has very little effect on blood cholesterol levels.
However, sugar and carbs in the diet have a strong connection to raised blood sugar levels. Do what you can for lowering the sugar.amusedmonkey wrote: »Cholesterol (except for triglycerides) is often cumulative, so is A1c, so in that regard one "unhealthy" meal once or twice a month will likely not affect the numbers by much. Take note that the closer to the test the meal is the higher of an effect it will have on your A1c, so to get the most accurate results if you do end up deciding to consume something "unhealthy", position it somewhere in the middle between your A1c tests. Keep in mind that blood sugar spikes can be dangerous even if it's a single incident. Since you are not officially diabetic yet, chances are your spikes are milder.
When I used to be pre-diabetic (no longer am after weight loss), I used a glucose meter to see how my body reacts to certain foods. You would be surprised how your body reacts to some things. In my case in average portions oatmeal and barley produced barely any spike, french fries and cookies produced an acceptable spike (I was happy about that) but rice produced an unacceptable spike (I was sad about that). I needed to play around with the portions of the foods that produced an unacceptable spike in order to make them acceptable again. What I considered acceptable was anything below 160 (preferably below 140) at 1 to 2 hours after the meal and a return to near normal (my normal) at 4-5 hours after a meal.
It can be a lot of work, but if there is something you really love and still want to include every now and then it's worth it. I usually did a 1,2 and 4 hour tests for any new food I was unsure about, and if it produced a spike within the acceptable range I tested again a few days later to double check the result, then acted accordingly.
Now of course you will want to discuss this with your doctor, they may have valuable input.
I drink two glasses of water before dinner.it fills you up and you eat less calories .0 -
Sandytoes71 wrote: »Do you guys think it's ok to eat one unhealthy meal a week or every other week if I'm trying to get my cholesterol down and improve my A1C number? I know I can eat whatever I want as long as it fits into my calorie goal for the day and still lose weight as that is how I lost weight before, but this time it's different for me. This time, i'm mostly eating to improve my horrible cholesterol and blood sugars (pre diabetic) and also lose weight. So, I've really turned my diet around and eat pretty healthy now. I started almost a month ago with lots of success, but I need to know if eating an unhealthy meal every now and then will keep my cholesterol from getting better. I'm wanting to eat chips and salsa and a taco tomorrow and am going to try to keep under my calorie goal, but I'm worried I will be screwing up my cholesterol and stuff. I mean, can I still be healthy and eat bad fats from time to time? I guess I'm looking for people who have experience with trying to get healthy on the inside?
I would say cheats are a bad idea. It is probably healthier to embrace a new way of eating and find treats within that woe than sabotage yourself once a week.
I eat a low carb high fat to treat my prediabetes. It works like a charm. Within days of switching my det my BG was normal. I also found that it cut my sugar and carb cavings after about a week, and reduced my appetite. I was able to cut calories and lost about 40 lbs fairly quickly... The weight loss did NOT help with my insulin resistance. My BG is only normal if I eat low carb and moderate protein. As soon as I go off plan my BG goes right back up. Not good. Elevated BG, even at prediabetic levels hurts the body and can even lead to kidney disease. It isn't worth it i my case.
Plus cheats would keep me missing sugar. No thanks. I would at her make myself some sugar free low carb treats like cheese cake, fat bombs, or cookies which won't hurt my health.
A LCHF det can help with cholesterol. Cholesterol is worsened by high carbs unless you are eating very low fat, especially triglycerides. Triglycerides generally go down on a high fat low carb diet. Also, HDL will go up, Lp(a) often drops, and LDL stays the same but switches to the larger fluffy pattern a - all good changes.
If interested in LCHF, I recommend reading Dr Bernstein's Diabetes Solution. Bernstein is a T1D who has perfectly managed his diabetes with diet and very little insulin in an era when diabetics were nearing their life expectancy in their 40s. Really good plan. Also, cholesterol Clarity or the Great Cholesterol Myth are good books to read for patients who have doctors who still just look at total cholesterol.
Best wishes.
A whole food plant-based diet will surely reduce you chol. levels. Not eating a burger everyday, using oils, and loading up on dietary fats (sat. fats).
http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/25/3/417.short
"CONCLUSIONS—Total and saturated fat intake were associated with a higher risk of type 2 diabetes, but these associations were not independent of BMI. Frequent consumption of processed meats may increase risk of type 2 diabetes."
There appears to be two ways to lower cholesterol. The high carb (unrefined) low fat and protein diet. The other is a high fat low carb diet.
The problems seem to come along with a diet high in carbs and fat.
I know cholesterol is improved on a high fat low carb diet. I've seen it time after time. The only exception is a very small minority who have sat fat increase their triglycerides. And as I am someone who developed insulin resistance (partially from steroid use) and am using a LCHF diet to successfully treat insulin resistance, I know it works.
Read Peter Attia's blog, or the Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living for more science from the other side of the argument.0 -
...but it's not nearly as effective at controlling BG as a low carb diet is, which is also a concern of the OP.A whole food plant-based diet will surely reduce you chol. levels.
I know what you mean, but I think it's confusing to call it that. Here's how I'd describe the "danger zone": if you're eating a high fat diet, and your carbs/protein aren't low enough to make you ketogenic, then your body's main source of fuel is still carbs, and you will have lots of fat in your blood, meaning high cholesterol, that doesn't get used up. Normally your carbs need to be 50g or less to get into ketosis. In ketosis, fat becomes your main source of fuel, so you use up much of the fat in your blood, meaning normal cholesterol. So here's where I think what you wrote was confusing - you are basically saying anything more than 50g of carbs is a "high carb" diet. No offense, but I disagree. I've seen 150g and less be called low-carb, so it pays to clarify. But to back up what you're saying, I went on a 100g carbs/day diet after I was diagnosed, and it controlled my BG really well. Unfortunately, my LDL went through the ceiling. After seeing this, I switched to ketogenic, and my cholesterol plunged down to my previous level.The problems seem to come along with a diet high in carbs and fat.
Actually, it's about 1/4, and it also increases LDL. I happen to be one of those. It's tough to be on a ketogenic, low sfa diet.The only exception is a very small minority who have sat fat increase their triglycerides.
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leosmith66 wrote: »
...but it's not nearly as effective at controlling BG as a low carb diet is, which is also a concern of the OP.A whole food plant-based diet will surely reduce you chol. levels.
I know what you mean, but I think it's confusing to call it that. Here's how I'd describe the "danger zone": if you're eating a high fat diet, and your carbs/protein aren't low enough to make you ketogenic, then your body's main source of fuel is still carbs, and you will have lots of fat in your blood, meaning high cholesterol, that doesn't get used up. Normally your carbs need to be 50g or less to get into ketosis. In ketosis, fat becomes your main source of fuel, so you use up much of the fat in your blood, meaning normal cholesterol. So here's where I think what you wrote was confusing - you are basically saying anything more than 50g of carbs is a "high carb" diet. No offense, but I disagree. I've seen 150g and less be called low-carb, so it pays to clarify. But to back up what you're saying, I went on a 100g carbs/day diet after I was diagnosed, and it controlled my BG really well. Unfortunately, my LDL went through the ceiling. After seeing this, I switched to ketogenic, and my cholesterol plunged down to my previous level.The problems seem to come along with a diet high in carbs and fat.
Actually, it's about 1/4, and it also increases LDL. I happen to be one of those. It's tough to be on a ketogenic, low sfa diet.The only exception is a very small minority who have sat fat increase their triglycerides.
No, I never said anything over 50g of carbs is high carb.
I consider below 100 to 150g of carbs per day, depending on the person, to be low carb. I consider under 50g to be very low carb. In my mind, a higher carb diet is carbs make up 45-50+% of a person's diet.
I eat very low carb and I have been in ketosis for over 7 months. My macros are 5% carbs, 20% protein and 70% fat. I am looking forward to having cholesterol checked. I wouldn't be surprised if my LDL is slightly up because pattern a (healthy fluffy LDL) will increase, mostly replacing the denser pattern b. Total LDL is not a helpful test for CAD in my opinion.
Triglycerides usually go down on a LCHF diet but in a minority it increases. I don't remember it being as high as 1/4 but you may be correct.0 -
First, if you're talking to a specialist doctor in your condition, consult them, and be specific in one what you mean. That's the most reliable thing to do. Note specialist, I tend to think general practitioners get very little training in nutrition and many of them are just, if not more, susceptible in falling for diet fads.
I say specific because no one here even knows what you mean by 1 unhealthy meal a week or every other week. Literally, I have no idea what you think an unhealthy meal means, nor what your daily intake is. If eating 1 unhealthy meal a week means eating 8,000 calories in 1 sitting with 200+ grams of saturated fat, and 200+ grams of sugar in one sitting, I'm going to say no, that's not going to work, you're not going to fix that with a deficit the rest of the week. If you're losing weight, and can still lose while having say 1 or 2 servings of ice cream with your dinner once a week for 640 calories, ~30-50 grams of saturated fat and ~50 grams of sugar, while staying at just maintenance calories for the day while still deficit all other days of the week, I'd guess you'd be okay. I'd still fall back to talk to your specialist, as I have no idea how severe your state is or close to diabetes.
Generally speaking, for anything impacted by insulin sensitivity / metabolic syndrome (diabetes / pre-diabetes and cholesterol included), losing weight is usually going to trump other dietary considerations for improving health. After losing weight, increasing activity is probably what's the next most likely to trump other things in terms of improving the condition. After those two, dialing in your diet comes in, and that's where you'll have to weigh your "unhealthy" versus "healthy" meal intake.0 -
I'll also recycle one of my answers to another post about what I've seen decent evidence for in terms of improving cholesterol:
First, if you're overweight, losing weight will tend to help. It will particularly help with triglyceride levels and LDL levels, which will lower total cholesterol. Extremely low calorie diets have a tendency to make HDL worse, but you shouldn't be doing one without a doctor's supervision, anyway.
Second, Exercise will help. There is more evidence for cardio in that realm over strength training, but a little bit of anything is better than a whole lot of nothing. It is particularly strong in helping raise HDL.
Third, eliminated trans fats to any extent possible. In particular, trans fats from hydrogenated oils are clearly and strongly associated with cholesterol. Natural trans fats occurring in some cheeses and meats are mixed.
Fourth, reduce saturated fats. The long term evidence of saturated fat in cardiovascular disease and long term cholesterol is a bit of a mixed bag, but there is clear evidence in the short term of it raising cholesterol. The biggest effect it has might be that every calorie of saturated fat is less calories from whole grains, mono unsaturated fat, and polyunsaturated fats. If you regularly eat sour cream, a quick substitution is Greek yogurt, replacing saturated fats with protein.
Fifth, oatmeal, and possibly other unprocessed whole grains with high amounts of soluble fiber. There is evidence that oatmeal binds up bile released by the digestive system, forcing the body to replace it. The key ingredient to make bile is ... cholesterol, so your body has to use it up making new bile.
Sixth, plant stanols by eating more plants, soy in particular. Stanols are molecules in plants that work similar to cholesterol, so in humans they might trigger receptors that make your body think you have a high amount of cholesterol already, so that it doesn't need to make more.
Seventh, for low HDL, nuts, seeds, fish, flax, and things that contain omega 3's are noted to have some effects. In some rare instances a lack of some dietary protein might be the culprit.0 -
Be careful of any advice you get here. There are some people that preach certain diets as cure-alls or the only way to go with no real concern for your individual situation. Talk to your doctor and monitor what works for you.0
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Thanks for all of the information everyone. I'm gonna have to re read your comments to take everything in and I'm researching other sources too. And thank you for your personal experiences and kudos to you who have really got a handle on this
God Bless!!!!! 0 -
I apologize then, because I clearly don't understand what you mean by high fat high carb. I've heard the term thrown around a lot by diabetics who are in the habit of calling anything that's not ketogenic "high carb". What would be the macros for high fat high carb (10/45/45?) and could you please cite it with a study or blog or something?I consider below 100 to 150g of carbs per day, depending on the person, to be low carb. I consider under 50g to be very low carb. In my mind, a higher carb diet is carbs make up 45-50+% of a person's diet.
To reiterate, what I believe is unless you're in ketosis, the more fat you have in your diet, the worse your cholesterol. I don't have a study to cite, but it's explained well in this Ketogenic Diet Video.0 -
Sandytoes71 wrote: »Do you guys think it's ok to eat one unhealthy meal a week or every other week if I'm trying to get my cholesterol down and improve my A1C number? I know I can eat whatever I want as long as it fits into my calorie goal for the day and still lose weight as that is how I lost weight before, but this time it's different for me. This time, i'm mostly eating to improve my horrible cholesterol and blood sugars (pre diabetic) and also lose weight. So, I've really turned my diet around and eat pretty healthy now. I started almost a month ago with lots of success, but I need to know if eating an unhealthy meal every now and then will keep my cholesterol from getting better. I'm wanting to eat chips and salsa and a taco tomorrow and am going to try to keep under my calorie goal, but I'm worried I will be screwing up my cholesterol and stuff. I mean, can I still be healthy and eat bad fats from time to time? I guess I'm looking for people who have experience with trying to get healthy on the inside?
I would say cheats are a bad idea. It is probably healthier to embrace a new way of eating and find treats within that woe than sabotage yourself once a week.
I eat a low carb high fat to treat my prediabetes. It works like a charm. Within days of switching my det my BG was normal. I also found that it cut my sugar and carb cavings after about a week, and reduced my appetite. I was able to cut calories and lost about 40 lbs fairly quickly... The weight loss did NOT help with my insulin resistance. My BG is only normal if I eat low carb and moderate protein. As soon as I go off plan my BG goes right back up. Not good. Elevated BG, even at prediabetic levels hurts the body and can even lead to kidney disease. It isn't worth it i my case.
Plus cheats would keep me missing sugar. No thanks. I would at her make myself some sugar free low carb treats like cheese cake, fat bombs, or cookies which won't hurt my health.
A LCHF det can help with cholesterol. Cholesterol is worsened by high carbs unless you are eating very low fat, especially triglycerides. Triglycerides generally go down on a high fat low carb diet. Also, HDL will go up, Lp(a) often drops, and LDL stays the same but switches to the larger fluffy pattern a - all good changes.
If interested in LCHF, I recommend reading Dr Bernstein's Diabetes Solution. Bernstein is a T1D who has perfectly managed his diabetes with diet and very little insulin in an era when diabetics were nearing their life expectancy in their 40s. Really good plan. Also, cholesterol Clarity or the Great Cholesterol Myth are good books to read for patients who have doctors who still just look at total cholesterol.
Best wishes.
A whole food plant-based diet will surely reduce you chol. levels. Not eating a burger everyday, using oils, and loading up on dietary fats (sat. fats).
http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/25/3/417.short
"CONCLUSIONS—Total and saturated fat intake were associated with a higher risk of type 2 diabetes, but these associations were not independent of BMI. Frequent consumption of processed meats may increase risk of type 2 diabetes."
You're citing a paper on impact of fats on diabetes, to claim a plant based diets will lower cholesterol? Do you log that post in MFP exercise under stretching?0 -
Yes, it's okay.0
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