Tell me I'm fat...

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MaybeLed
MaybeLed Posts: 250 Member
edited August 2016 in Health and Weight Loss
Tell me I’m fat.

I’m 20lb into a 120lb target loss, the only people who have noticed is my husband and his great-aunt So I’m by no means ‘done’ yet.

So I listen to This American Life quite a bit. I caught an episode lately that I just can’t get out of my head. Episode and transcript here: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/589/tell-me-im-fat.

This just brought up so many feelings that I have about being fat, and though I’m actively doing something about it.

The thought on the tube that I take up too much room, and I don’t do things, or go places where it’s going to be uncomfortable, is one of the main motivators for getting this thing going.

I want to be like Lindy West, saying being fat is not a moral issue. If you have a problem with me it’s YOUR problem. I’m not a bad person because I’m obese, I’m not lazy and stupid. Though I know others think it’s true. I do feel useless that I let myself get to 270lb.

I recently got into a discussion with some friends.
(Background there’s 10 of us in this chat group, we met through charity work so we’re all slightly different, all live in the same area and socialise frequently, 2 girls (including me) and 2 guys are ‘fat’ 3 are just normal weight and 3 are totally fitness focussed)

The other fat girl who’s almost 30, got the ‘you’d be pretty if you weren’t so fat you need to control yourself, and your mother needs to stop feeding you’ at a party. So naturally she had a moan to us about it, the never-been-fat lot were dreadfully supportive. ‘tell her to f*** off’, ‘thump her’, ‘you’re awesome’. I was not so effusive but just told her about some of my regular comebacks. Whereas the guys were ‘wait, is this a thing that happens to women?’

This friend has privately moaned to me about her weight. So I know she’s not totally happy being as big as she is. But all I can give her is generic advice, selfish as it sounds I’m not ready to have people along on my ride when I’m still finding my way. But it got me thinking, she is publically being pro-fat acceptance, but on a personal level she’s not ok with it. and these were talked about in the podcast.

My big fear is the feelings that Elna Baker described. The fat me feels like the ‘real’ me so I worry about changing relationships as I lose weight. And it’s partly that fear that stops me pushing so hard some days. The future is so abstract that I can’t yet imagine this being normal.

I’m lucky in that I have a secure Marriage, my husband actively (but politely) pursued me for 2 years while we were friends and I was big. So I know he was not just attracted to me physically, and we know each other well. So that is one of the fears I don’t have….

So in summary, I’m bad at getting to the point and I’m not sure I have one. Just wondered if others had any thoughts.
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Replies

  • HippySkoppy
    HippySkoppy Posts: 725 Member
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    Hmmm, just a thought here in that you seem to be very conflicted.

    On the one hand that you don't want to be defined with the negative stereotypes that often accompany the term "Fat" ie: personal insults such as the assumption of laziness and stupidity. Yet you are at the same time afraid of letting go of the 'persona' and attachment that you have for your current size.

    All I can offer is at my highest of 278 lbs I WAS uncomfortable and bloody unhappy. Was there negativity from the World towards me, no doubt, but like you I had a loving family and devoted Husband - that wasn't enough.

    I wanted to live and I couldn't do that to the fullest while obese. Yes I felt shame too but I didn't dwell on the what ifs I just found myself wanting so much more that could only be achieved if I started looking after my health.

    If anything the relationships got better along with my self-esteem improving and me feeling on top of the World for taking charge for a change and not being a slave to over eating, burying my feelings in food and whatever else I deluded myself into thinking while I mindlessly piled on the pounds.

    For what it's worth, try to give yourself a break here. No one can predict the future. Do this for yourself if you want and believe you HAVE to want it bad cause it's a long road and you are going to face challenges, get discouraged, bored and pissed of at times but the rewards are unbelievable and you will be amazed as just how remarkable life can be when you aren't burdened down with obesity.

    I wish you all the best.
  • 4legsRbetterthan2
    4legsRbetterthan2 Posts: 19,590 MFP Moderator
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    But all I can give her is generic advice, selfish as it sounds I’m not ready to have peoble along on my ride when I’m still finding my way.

    Honestly, I would encourage you to find some people on MFP to be friends with that are like minded and/or have similar goals to you, and just make that your "friend base" when it comes to weight loss. Having your husband on board is probably important too, since he is such a big part of your life, but it sounds like that is not really an issue. I have personally decided that weight loss is like religion and politics, you only broach those subject with certain people. There is just so much mis-information out there and a world full of people "trying to lose weight" but who aren't really trying, that is can be a mess to get sucked into. Having some good MFP friends and a supportive husband and not really involving anyone else in my life about my weight loss has worked best for me. If she does ask for advice and you give it, don't get overly invested in her progress. It is her burden, not yours.
    The fat me feels like the ‘real’ me so I worry about changing relationships as I lose weight. And it’s partly that fear that stops me pushing so hard some days.

    I am a bit of a loan wolf IRL, so I don't have a whole lot of friends, just a couple really close ones. So far I can say I have not had any issues with my friendships or marriage. There are so many things that define a person besides their weight. Hopefully, you have hobbies and interests in common with the people you care about, so those things will not change. As long as you don't get all consumed by your diet and start letting that define you, or become a preachy annoying health freak, you will probably not see any changes here :)
  • MaybeLed
    MaybeLed Posts: 250 Member
    edited August 2016
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    @HippySkoppy Thanks, I suppose I am conflicted. I have always been overweight so it's not like 'I wish I had my 18 year old body back'

    I do get a bit uncomfortable, but I'm realtively fit (for my weight) and I'm not unhappy. I've always been comfortable with men and always had friends I liked and a close family, (which I know you said you did too).

    I'm getting there and I don't see going back, my health is important, especially as the women in my family live forever I would rather be as healthy as possible for as long as possible. I think it was the direct thought from some one that had lost 100lb + that they lost trust in people's motivations for being nice to them. having not been slim since I was about 14 I guess i've missed the fat discrimination as I've never known anything different.
  • rennickm1986
    rennickm1986 Posts: 70 Member
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    Directly telling someone that isn't a close friend or family that they're obese and (adding on) could be pretty if they lost weight is a f***ed up thing to do. I mean do people generally give a look to their friend or spouse when someone enormous comes lumbering down an aisle? Sure, but nothing to make the person aware of it so they feel s****y about themselves. I don't get the tendency for girls to feel the need to be nasty. I'm sure guys do this, but I hear it way more often from women. Lose the weight for your health, your marriage, your lifestyle etc. Not for jeering women.
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
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    Interesting topic, even if exactly what it is isn't certain (which I think is fine!). I haven't listened to that program yet but want to, and I've read some stuff from Lindy West.

    I guess my view--as someone who was quite fat, lost weight, don't think being fat is a moral issue--is that it's perfectly reasonable and okay to both be pro fat acceptance and unhappy with being fat. I don't judge others for being fat and support the idea that they should be treated with respect, and I didn't hate myself for being fat (well, not at the point I lost weight, I've had self hatred issues during my life), but I am also happier having lost weight and am happy to help others if they ask questions (and none of my business if they do not). I suspect I didn't mind being fat--at least for a time--as much as many do, and in some ways it is protective for me (I tend not to focus on physical appearance, was in pretty good health and active most of the time I was fat, and found the fact I was less noticed in some ways easier). However, I eventually did want to lose more than the trade-offs. Part of this was health-related (risk factors), part that it made being active and achieving certain goals easier, and of course part was physical (I say I don't care about looks but I do more than I admit and I like how I look when thin better). And, sure, the views of others aren't irrelevant to me. But this aside, I don't think people should feel ashamed for being fat or apologize for it, and they certainly should not be treated badly (they shouldn't be embarrassed for asking for a seat belt extender, but a doctor mentioning health risks or being expected to buy two seats if you actually use two seats to me are not shaming, but realities).

    Ugh, anyway, what I like about fat-acceptance is the idea that one should love oneself fat or thin, that one's acceptability and right to be treated as respectfully as anyone else does not depend on those others finding your shape appealing. Also, that one can focus on aspects of health besides weight loss, like eating well and exercise, even if one finds it too stressful or counterproductive (due to mental issues, past dieting, whatever) to focus on weight loss. I actually did have a fear that I could not lose weight (not reasonable, which I knew) when I first lost weight, so focusing on eating well and exercise was a good approach for me (and I lost quickly doing that anyway, and gained trust in the weight loss aspect). For someone with a bad dieting history and self-hatred rooted in being fat, I see that as even more so.
  • LPflaum
    LPflaum Posts: 174 Member
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    MaybeLed wrote: »
    I'm getting there and I don't see going back, my health is important, especially as the women in my family live forever I would rather be as healthy as possible for as long as possible. I think it was the direct thought from some one that had lost 100lb + that they lost trust in people's motivations for being nice to them. having not been slim since I was about 14 I guess i've missed the fat discrimination as I've never known anything different.

    I think its great that your primary focus is on being as healthy as possible for as long as possible. The research at this point is pretty clear that the longer we carry that extra weight around, the more stress we put ourselves through and the higher the chances that something terrible happens- heart disease, stroke, diabetes, etc.

    I would say that as you continue to lose more weight, you are probably going to notice that people treat you differently. I was never terribly overweight (5'7, 160, and the muscle tone of the staypuft marshmallow man), but as I've lost lbs and toned up I've noticed that not only am I getting more attention from men, but women are nicer to me, bartenders are quicker to get me drinks, etc. You can't allow this to make you distrustful, but there's never anything wrong with being a little bit guarded with people you don't know. It sounds like you have a great marriage and a lot of great friends, those things will keep you grounded. Ultimately, you will still have the amazing support network and you'll be healthier and maybe happier. Don't let fear of the unknown get between you and your goals. You'll be more than fine!

    Also, whoever told your friend she'd be "pretty if she lost weight" is a jerk.
  • garbagebody
    garbagebody Posts: 7 Member
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    Hi MaybeLed :)

    I could relate to a lot of what you said in your post, especially the worrying about taking up too much room and not doing things that are uncomfortable. It's a huge motivator for me too. I can't speak to the male experience, but I find that because women are socialized to take up less space, I am hyper aware of how much space I'm using up and it's very stressful. I won't even attempt air travel until I'm significantly smaller.

    I don't feel like the fat me is the real me, but I completely get what you're saying because I feel the exact same way about my mental health, I was held back for so long because I was afraid to get help because I felt like my mental illness was 'me' and without it, who the hell am I? It was something I couldn't even imagine and it was really scary. I still struggle with this tbh, but I 100% know how that feels.

    The trick is to imagine yourself doing all those things that you felt too limited by your weight (or mental health for me) to do. I guess like a goal for yourself, so you can start to imagine yourself at that place. So for example, if you haven't been able to hike a mountain because of your weight and it's something you've always wanted to do, having that goal in mind will propel you forward and make the future a little less scary and unknown.

    And I know you said you don't want to include your friend in your journey yet, which I get. I feel like if I tell people about it too soon I'll jinx myself or look like an idiot if I fail (maybe that's not what you meant exactly). But I think it could be a good thing, you guys could encourage each other and push each other to succeed.

    And lastly I totallllly get the whole personal double standard thing. Like I look at other fat women and think they are beautiful and am totally an advocate of everyone feeling good at any size. But for myself it feels like a moral issue, like I've internalized all those things personally. idk.

    Anyway, I'm bad at getting to the point too but I think my point is:

    38384392.jpg

    Also going to listen to that podcast now :D
  • MaybeLed
    MaybeLed Posts: 250 Member
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    4legsRbetterthan2 wrote: »
    Honestly, I would encourage you to find some people on MFP to be friends with that are like minded and/or have similar goals to you, and just make that your "friend base" when it comes to weight loss. Having your husband on board is probably important too, since he is such a big part of your life, but it sounds like that is not really an issue.

    I’ve tried to do that, I’ve got a few people who are in similar boats on different parts of their journey (how far can I stretch this analogy). My Husband without counting has just joined me (and lost 25lb the git, joking). I’ve not talked about it really, apart from on here, The only people who I’ve told are my mum, my husband and the guy I eat lunch with daily (when he asked). So just need to get on with it.
  • MaybeLed
    MaybeLed Posts: 250 Member
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    rennickm1986 wrote: »
    Directly telling someone that isn't a close friend or family that they're obese and (adding on) could be pretty if they lost weight is a f***ed up thing to do. I mean do people generally give a look to their friend or spouse when someone enormous comes lumbering down an aisle? Sure, but nothing to make the person aware of it so they feel s****y about themselves. I don't get the tendency for girls to feel the need to be nasty. I'm sure guys do this, but I hear it way more often from women. Lose the weight for your health, your marriage, your lifestyle etc. Not for jeering women.

    Yep it was a woman who make those coments to her :astonished: . Honestly for her, it made her cry then she ate some cake. Not getting into feminist issues as that's another topic, but I've been torn-down ten times by a woman for every time by a man.
  • AJF230
    AJF230 Posts: 81 Member
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    Ah, that TAL episode. That's what got me aboard my own plan to finally trim down. I figured, If I could maintain 206 for 10-15 years, why not just maintain where I should be (I *think* 185-190) ? That episode got me to read /fatlogic and recognize some of the fatlogic I had been using on myself.
    Ms West just sounded insane to me. Her whole attitude was "I'm fine" despite HUGE amounts of medical data that show statistically otherwise. Plus, all the HAES crowd is young. The real impact comes later, after age 40. Joints wear out, chronic diseases develop. No one person is a statistic, but we CAN generalize about large populations and there is an epidemic of obesity in America.

    Here's another point....there is no "permanent" you. You're growing, evolving. We all are. That's going to happen one way or the other. Take charge of it and take it where you want. Renew your mind, the body follows that. Not the other way around.
  • JeromeBarry1
    JeromeBarry1 Posts: 10,182 Member
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    Ah, self-perception. An interesting thing I experienced today ... Looking in the mirror, I didn't see fat me who has lost some weight. I saw skinny me who has put some weight on.
  • Verdenal
    Verdenal Posts: 625 Member
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    MaybeLed wrote: »
    Tell me I’m fat.


    This friend has privately moaned to me about her weight. So I know she’s not totally happy being as big as she is. But all I can give her is generic advice, selfish as it sounds I’m not ready to have people along on my ride when I’m still finding my way. But it got me thinking, she is publically being pro-fat acceptance, but on a personal level she’s not ok with it. and these were talked about in the podcast.


    It's important to be honest. In another forum, someone posted a fat acceptance video with several morbidly obese women. The first thing the first woman in the video said was:

    "Would I be happier if I were thin?

    No."

    I said I didn't believe that and that of course fat people deserve dignity and respect like everyone else, but that purely at the level of health, it was self-delusion to suggest that being that overweight was healthy. I was accused of being "dismissive." I said nothing of the kind.

    It was pointed out that they were attractive and successful. I didn't say they weren't. My comment was related to their excessive weight. I discussed a documentary on morbidly obese women, "All of Me," in which the women initially said they were delighted with being fat, but as time emerged, their unhappiness was clear. I alluded to a video posted in this forum in which a morbidly obese man said it was ridiculous for fat people to suggest that being very obese did not have health consequences: he was on 15 medications.

    I said that Fat Acceptance is misguided.

    I got banned.

    I guess my point is that I'm tired of fat people who think I'm obsessed with their weight. I have troubles of my own. I would never go up to an overweight person and comment on their weight, that's rude. What they do about their weight is their business. But if you put a statement about obesity being healthy and even desirable in my face in the form of a video or article, I will vigorously disagree.
  • lemurcat12
    lemurcat12 Posts: 30,886 Member
    edited August 2016
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    Saying fat comes with health risks, which is of course true, is not the same thing as telling someone who is fat that she cannot be happy and fat or that she must be lying to herself about being happy.

    I think it's wrong to assume that fat acceptance means you don't want to lose weight or it's somehow a betrayal of what you believe in to lose weight. Being fat (or any particular body shape) is not who you are. I do think it was possibly easier for me to lose weight because I was not fat when I first became an adult (I never really saw myself as fat even when I was -- and of course I knew I was, it just wasn't how I was in my head, the default me I pictured). But me fat was as much me as me not fat, and I think that's the same for everyone, even if not being fat seems weird to you.

    And I am aware that some in the FA movement will say that there's a conflict between FA and wanting to lose, but those are extremists and they are wrong. And so are people who say that being pro FA means you are justifying being fat. Like I said upthread, accepting myself made it much easier to be healthy (and lose weight) than hating myself ever did, and I can see how focusing on behaviors like eating well and exercise could be an approach that works for some more than focusing on weight loss (and it will usually lead to weight loss anyway).
  • Twiley510
    Twiley510 Posts: 377 Member
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    Self perception is my struggle. I've lost over 70 lbs since last March. I can see the difference in clothes (from 20W to 8 misses). Lots of people tell me I'm "tiny". But all I see is the 50 lbs I still need to lose, the fat rolls in my belly and my bingo-wing arms. I still feel fat even though many I encounter give me praise and want to know how I'm losing so much.

    I also worry about the relationship evolution. My significant other jokes that I will leave him when I am fit. He is disabled so losing weight is more difficult for him and exercise is not an option. I know he is joking, but in the back of my mind I keep the saying "Behind every joke is a grain of truth." So I wonder if he really feels that way deep inside.
  • MaybeLed
    MaybeLed Posts: 250 Member
    edited August 2016
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    Thanks for all the input. Honestly I had to look up at HAES, as I'd not come across it before (I'm in the UK). I was mortified for my friend obviously and just thought that person was awful. Frankly I'd never comment on someones weight, just like I wouldn't comment on their dress sense, wrinkles or acne. But as I've seen before shame doesn't work. Encouraging more health can only be good though.

    At the moment I'm in my 20's, not on any medication, generally healthy and can walk for miles.

    BUT... I know the chance of that continuing reduces with every year I stay Obese.

    AND... I work and volunteer in healthcare, it's depressing seeing people without toes lost to diabetes, with pressure sores when they can't get out of bed. That's not the middle-to-old-age I want for myself.

    I know I'm not addressing all the issues raised. but the podcast really struck me in a way not many things have. Made me confront a few points that were on the periphery of my consciousness, because like all humans I’m a big hot mess of contradictions!
  • gothchiq
    gothchiq Posts: 4,598 Member
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    The only fat I'm particularly concerned about is the fat I'm wearing. too much = blood sugar too high and my clothes pinch. Keep it off = do better physically and wear all the cute clothes. Much happier with less knee pain, no chafing, etc. I'm not one to rag on others for being fat. Their body, their business.
  • tomteboda
    tomteboda Posts: 2,171 Member
    edited August 2016
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    "Wherever you go, there you are"

    Losing weight doesn't make you a different person. This is at the root of Lindsay's message (I heard the program on NPR while walking). I did not become stupid, lazy, or bad when I gained weight, and being thinner did not make me intelligent, industrious, or good.

    Of course my physical, emotional, mental, and spiritual well - being are affected by each other, as everyone's are because we're complex creatures. People who think wellness in one area creates or destroys wellness in the others are deluding themselves. But physical well-being can have a ripple effect (as can it's loss).

    Everything in life requires a decision and sacrifices. Only a person can decide for themselves which choices are right for them at this time, and we never have a full view of what others are struggling with. The world would be a lot better place with a good deal more compassion.

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