Can we settle this calorie debate???
Replies
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I'm a math teacher. It drives me crazy there isn't a set answer to this....a yes or no would be fantastic. I've been doing this for 50 days and have lost 11.5 pounds so things are moving in the right direction. I just want to know if what I am doing is causing my body harm. I don't plan on staying at this once I reach my target weight...but it seems like the consensus is to eat half workout cals back. I'm never going to be hungry...
A math guy that wants exactness on the output side but doesn't use a food scale and just kinda wings the input side
I'm just laughing because I'm Ms Analytical as well and I see myself here if I on't stay on top of it. The exercise trackers, machines and estimates are notoriously optimistic. I use every gadget and data collector know to man from gamins, to HRM, to cadence sensors, to power meters and if I eat back all of my calories I don't lose.
Try half and see how it goes.3 -
I'm a chemist, working on a PhD. So data and numbers are my life.
What I did to figure out the answer to this question (in my case, it was if the exercise calories Fitbit was giving me were okay to eat), I tracked my intake, Fitbit-given output, and weight for 7 or 8 weeks.
I made some excel spreadsheets and calculated how much weight I should have lost, based on what I ate, versus how much weight I actually lost. I didn't include my first few weeks of weight loss data since that included a lot of water weight.
The numbers matched within less than a pound, in my favour, which led me to accept the conclusion that my Fitbit gives accurate numbers and I can eat back all my exercise calories it gives me and lose according to plan.4 -
If MFP says my goal is 1500 calories, and I burn 600 calories, should I be eating a total of 2100 calories? Or get my 1500? I've been told both by friends on here. I don't use a food scale every time so I adjust for variage counting. I would love to get a definitive answer on this. Thanks in advance....
Definitive answer is you should be eating back your exercise calories because that how the tool works and how your goal was arrived at. The goal is 1500 + exercise calories.
The complication is that estimating calories can be difficult.
Avoid the simplistic "eat 50%" thing as that's ludicrous to assume a whole database is off by some standard percentage.
What exercise are you doing to get your supposed 600 cal burn?
Unless you are very small 1500 is already an aggressive goal, don't make the process harder than it has to be. Adherence is a huge part of being successful or failing.
In the end both your intake and output are estimates, all you have to do is set a reasonable weight loss rate that you can adhere to and make adjustments based on results over time.
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For those who have a strength training routine, do you eat back those calories?
I've seen many heavy lifters on here say they don't even bother logging it?
MFP gives me like 198 calories for 1 hour of lifting, should I eat those calories back?0 -
I'm a math teacher. It drives me crazy there isn't a set answer to this....a yes or no would be fantastic. I've been doing this for 50 days and have lost 11.5 pounds so things are moving in the right direction. I just want to know if what I am doing is causing my body harm. I don't plan on staying at this once I reach my target weight...but it seems like the consensus is to eat half workout cals back. I'm never going to be hungry...
A math guy that wants exactness on the output side but doesn't use a food scale and just kinda wings the input side I'm just laughing because I'm Ms Analytical as well and I see myself here if I on't stay on top of it. The exercise trackers, machines and estimates are notoriously optimistic. I use every gadget and data collector know to man from gamins, to HRM, to cadence sensors, to power meters and if I eat back all of my calories I don't lose.
Try half and see how it goes.
This is exactly what I was thinking. I'm a data junkie and I'm a math teacher like the OP. I try to keep my data as accurate as possible with the use of a Fitbit Charge HR and a food scale. I couldn't imagine wanting a precise answer on my CO without trying to accurately track my CI and use my own data to my advantage.
I'm trying to maintain my weight. I eat back all of my exercise calories unless my appetite wants me to eat a bit less or a bit more. I follow my hunger cues first and foremost. It's been working for me.0 -
If MFP says my goal is 1500 calories, and I burn 600 calories, should I be eating a total of 2100 calories? Or get my 1500? I've been told both by friends on here. I don't use a food scale every time so I adjust for variage counting. I would love to get a definitive answer on this. Thanks in advance....
Just 1500. I don't know why people on here think they should eat back their exercise calories when even the mfp dietician says you shouldn't. And people on here wonder why they have a hard time losing weight, jeez...0 -
ummijaaz560 wrote: »For those who have a strength training routine, do you eat back those calories?
I've seen many heavy lifters on here say they don't even bother logging it?
MFP gives me like 198 calories for 1 hour of lifting, should I eat those calories back?
200 for an hour seems fine to me ..try it for a few weeks and see1 -
They measure activity through METSCalorie counters on treadmills and machines etc account for TOTAL calories, which includes the calories that you would have lost during that time by just sitting on the couch instead of exercising.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Let's not major too much in the minors here. If weight loss is the goal, and MFP has you set for 1500, then WITHOUT exercise with this calorie intake you lose weight. Any added exercise will increase your deficit, so like most say, eat back about half.
If your weight continues to reduce and your clothes are getting looser, then continue.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition 0 -
seekingdaintiness wrote: »If MFP says my goal is 1500 calories, and I burn 600 calories, should I be eating a total of 2100 calories? Or get my 1500? I've been told both by friends on here. I don't use a food scale every time so I adjust for variage counting. I would love to get a definitive answer on this. Thanks in advance....
Just 1500. I don't know why people on here think they should eat back their exercise calories when even the mfp dietician says you shouldn't. And people on here wonder why they have a hard time losing weight, jeez...
Oh no, it's you again. You come into every thread about exercise calories and write this. Every time I see you, I write how wrong you are and how much I dislike seeing you post. Stop doing this already. You have disordered thinking as evidenced by your profile and old username; you shouldn't be allowed to offer advice to anyone about weight loss.3 -
@ummijaaz560ummijaaz560 wrote: »For those who have a strength training routine, do you eat back those calories?
I've seen many heavy lifters on here say they don't even bother logging it?
MFP gives me like 198 calories for 1 hour of lifting, should I eat those calories back?
Yes I do. It's impossible to measure so the MFP estimate based on METS and body weight is good enough to be reasonable.
It's probably way under for me as I tend to lift a fairly high volume of weight in my session.
A lot of the "lifters" on here don't do a lot of cardio and might use the TDEE method which includes an average amount. So they are eating back exercise calories but a daily average instead of on the day of exercise.
I do a load of cardio so prefer the MFP method.1 -
Uh, from her blog:seekingdaintiness wrote: »
Now if you’re trying to lose weight, chances are you’ll be on the hungry side even without exercising since MyFitnessPal’s weight loss calorie goals are calculated independent of exercise. The upside to this is that those exercise calories become a “bonus”–so if your workout leaves you feeling a bit hungry afterwards, by all means you should enjoy the bump in calories and eat something. (Just read the 5 tips below beforehand to make the most of them!)
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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seekingdaintiness wrote: »
That doesn't say you shouldn't eat back your exercise calories. It gives some common sense advice on when to eat them for the average dieter. Have you actually read it?2 -
ummijaaz560 wrote: »For those who have a strength training routine, do you eat back those calories?
I've seen many heavy lifters on here say they don't even bother logging it?
MFP gives me like 198 calories for 1 hour of lifting, should I eat those calories back?
Try eating the calories back for a while and compare to how you feel/ lose weight.
I eat all my calories back and I feel like my body needs that energy to recover.
If I don't I feel more sluggish, but I am not good at handling large deficits.
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Great advice on seeing how eating the lifting calories goes!
Especially since my lifts suffer a bit being in a 500 calorie deficit.0 -
You are supposed to eat exercise calories with MFP. That is how it is set up.
The numbers may not be precise though.
Some people choose to eat only a portion of the exercise calories to account for errors in calorie burn estimates. That works pretty well for most people.
Some people choose to eat none of their exercise calories. I feel that is unnecessary personally.and could lead to unhealthy undereating if you are pretty active.
^^^This!^^^
If you are chronically hungry and tired, eat. If you feel good and are losing at an appropriate amount per week, don't, or eat half.
I log steps only most of the time even though I have a fairly active job. Most days it's fine but sometimez, after an especially busy day I will add an hour or so of activity to my log. If I can tell when I need the extra by how I feel. Too many days of undereating in a row and I am tired, dragging and grouchy. Not a great combo for a housekeeper working with other staff and paying guests.1 -
I think in order to get an accurate answer, you should ask a professional who has studied your type of diet. We're all laypeople here who, through trial and error, either pass or fail. Some of us completely abandon our prospective diet once a goal weight is reached. You get that?
Now, here's my take on it: Do not eat anything back. You need to be calorie deficient in order to lose weight. There! My opinion only. You can adjust your calories once you're in maintenance.0 -
seekingdaintiness wrote: »
@seekingdaintiness From the dietician -
3. Remember, the calories you eat and exercise off are estimations, and we’re more likely to overestimate calories burned from exercise. If hunger hits between meals, start slow–particularly if you’re trying to lose or maintain your weight. Begin by eat back a percentage of your exercise calories (say, 50%) rather than all of them, and see how you feel in 20-30 minutes.2 -
Thank you to everyone with their feedback. Was very helpful and insightful. Out of curiosity is there a cheap way to find my body fat number? Maybe something I could do on my own?0
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Now, here's my take on it: Do not eat anything back. You need to be calorie deficient in order to lose weight. There! My opinion only. You can adjust your calories once you're in maintenance.
You're already in a calorie deficit if you eat the calories MFP gives you. Eating back exercise calories doesn't make that original deficit magically disappear, unless you're grossly miscalculating something.2 -
Weighing your food is very important - there is a reason why MFP has a food diary and the fat, protein and carbs for just about everything you can buy that goes in the mouth - when you freehand pour olive oil and think it's only 5ml, its probably double or even more! Things like oils and nuts are high in calories and being a few mil/grams over will add a lot of calories. I personally don't use exercise calories because I am disabled and my exercise options are limited but I do what I can, however, outside of the exercises I do, I spend most of my time in a chair so I'm not burning more calories from walking to the shops, doing lots of active housework, etc. I think the more active you are, the more likely you would need those extra calories.0
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What if you're STILL in calorie deficit when you eat calories back though? Are you saying there won't be weight loss?Now, here's my take on it: Do not eat anything back. You need to be calorie deficient in order to lose weight. There! My opinion only. You can adjust your calories once you're in maintenance.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Thank you to everyone with their feedback. Was very helpful and insightful. Out of curiosity is there a cheap way to find my body fat number? Maybe something I could do on my own?
Now you are opening a can of worms. I use a higher end BIA scale but you'll find many vocal posters here hate that method. The cheapest is using body tape measurements and calipers to measure skin folds. You need to do multiple measurements at each location and average them or something. More sites improve the accuracy, but it is difficult to get consistent results. There are lots of online calculators.
I'm going to get a DEXA scan in about a week. However that is costing me $125. With I know how much my BF% is changing I don't know the base value very closely.0 -
If MFP says my goal is 1500 calories, and I burn 600 calories, should I be eating a total of 2100 calories? Or get my 1500? I've been told both by friends on here. I don't use a food scale every time so I adjust for variage counting. I would love to get a definitive answer on this. Thanks in advance....
You can give yourself the definite answer on this in about 6 weeks time. Choose one way or the other but stay consistent on whether or not you are going to eat your exercise calories or not. Log your calories eaten and your weight loss over that period of time. Work out your TDEE bearing in mind that for each pound lost you are adding 3500 to the total calorie intake. If you have lost more or less than expected, adjust your intake!
The only problem with this is if your possible deficit is rather extreme and causing LBM loss, including muscle mass.
Muscle as energy source is only 600 cal / lb.
When you do it also matters - and you MUST have knowledge of all the reasons for fast water weight gain and loss - obviously water has weight but no calories - so that throws the whole 3500/lb out the window.
Example:
First week dieter - losses 4 lbs eating at was was thought to be 1000 cal deficit - eating 1400.
So is this actually correct - 4 x 3500 / 7 days = 2000 deficit, so TDEE was really 3400?
No, of course not - everyone should realize first week or two of water weight drop.
Ok - dieter 8 weeks in has family reunion and eats 2800 of picnic dinner - gains 4 lbs total that week, actually overnight but still in the weekly weigh-ins.
4 x 3500 / 7 days = 2000 surplus average daily for week - so TDEE is really average eaten 1600 - 2000 = negative 400?
No, of course not - everyone should realize you eat at maintenance or above and at the least carb/water storage increases, and likely sodium water retained in this case too.
Same with big lifting workouts and repair water retained.
Just saying - it's decent formula if used correctly - but unless someone knows all the caveats - you could easily chase an already too low goal even lower and make matters worse.1 -
OP: Check these links here on MFP, for fun - they seem like something a math guy could love.
MFP Data Export Tool - The Overview
Getting your personalized calorie burn formula
Weight loss is just a giant, fun real-world science-fair project for grown-ups, if you ask me. Those (and some of the info linked in them) play into that view.3 -
ummijaaz560 wrote: »Great advice on seeing how eating the lifting calories goes!
Especially since my lifts suffer a bit being in a 500 calorie deficit.
Yeah, I tried not eating mine back because they were small anyway (the lifting calories - I was eating the larger rowing/spinning calories). But I found myself hungrier the day after, so I started spending those calories, or most of them, on some (oversimplifying) extra carbs before and/or protein after, even though I was already getting reasonable protein. I felt better.1 -
Christine_72 wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »Christine_72 wrote: »Oh boy, i think I'll just stick to estimating lol
Excuse me for thinking that a few minutes of basic arithmetic to make use of all the data from the logging I do anyway is a small price to pay for actually knowing what results I should really expect based on how much I'm eating, rather than going on forever losing two pounds for every one pound MFP tells me I will lose.
Or don't excuse me. I don't see anything to apologize for in being able to calculate an average. And I don't see anything funny about it ("lol"). Shaming people (especially women) for being able to do arithmetic is wrong on so many levels.
Shaming? If anything, i was shaming myself for being hopeless at math! I very much admire your arithmetic skills, If i had the patience and nous to work it out for myself i would, but alas I am not mathematically minded. @lynn_glenmont I apologise for offending you, that was absolutely not my intention, quite the opposite in fact.
ETA: I hated math when i was in school, and i dislike it to this day, and i'm not ashamed to admit it, it is what it is! I do well in other things, and have gotten through life just fine
I'm sorry that I misinterpreted. It seems to be very common (in the U.S. anyway) to treat basic arithmetic as something too hard for ordinary folks to do (and, by extension, to mock anyone who can do basic arithmetic as a number-swotting geek). That in turn discourages students from putting any effort into math classes, and it's no wonder we don't have enough people trained for jobs in STEM fields, or the ability to deal with numbers in non-STEM jobs or in their daily lives.0 -
I do not exercise every day so I do not have the extra calories everyday. But, when I do have the extra calories I can have a little extra food or I can eat out. At times, I have at least 200 calories unused each day. I need to do a graph on this...0
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seekingdaintiness wrote: »Just 1500. I don't know why people on here think they should eat back their exercise calories when even the mfp dietician says you shouldn't. And people on here wonder why they have a hard time losing weight, jeez...
http://blog.myfitnesspal.com/ask-the-dietitian-should-i-eat-back-my-exercise-calories/
That doesn't say what you seem to think it says:For the average exerciser trying to lose or maintain weight (i.e. someone who burns an additional 200-500 calories a few times per week), exercise calories don’t make up a significant portion of overall calorie burn, generally in the 1500-2200 per day range. Unless you’re exercising at a moderate to high intensity for an hour or more, several times a week, or are actively trying to gain weight, you most likely don’t need to be worried about eating all of those calories back.
The main reason is this: It’s easy, and fairly common to overestimate calorie burn (both from everyday activity and from exercise) and underestimate calorie consumption. By going out of your way to eat back every calorie you expend during exercise, you may unintentionally undermine your efforts to lose or maintain your weight. Additionally, you could be overriding your body’s hunger cues if you don’t feel particularly keen for those exercise calories but eat (or drink) them back them anyway. your body isn’t telling you it needs fuel, it’s best to save your exercise calories for when you want them–say, for an unexpected hunger pang or a weekend treat meal with friends.
Now if you’re trying to lose weight, chances are you’ll be on the hungry side even without exercising since MyFitnessPal’s weight loss calorie goals are calculated independent of exercise. The upside to this is that those exercise calories become a “bonus”–so if your workout leaves you feeling a bit hungry afterwards, by all means you should enjoy the bump in calories and eat something. [emphasis added]
So, to sum up, don't go out of your way to eat all your exercise calories back, especially if you're only doing a moderate amount of exercise. If you're not hungry, save them for when you are hungry or when you want a treat that doesn't fit your regular calorie goal. If you are hungry after your workout, go ahead and eat.
Not exactly "the mfp dietician says you shouldn't" eat back your exercise calories.0
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