Fat and carbs and trend weight
Options
Replies
-
GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
Because your version of "clean" is different from others and there is no medical consensus of what we should define "clean" for a diet. Your experience is your own as his is his own and mine is my own. However, should you have some "medically factual" information, whatever that means as far as personal experience goes, please share it and I'll certainly take a look.0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
Gale, what experience do you have with bulking? Have you seen an isocaloric/isomacronutrient study that alter foods? Do you realize how many people struggle to get enough calories because they put excessive limitations on the foods they eat? Do you understand the benfits of carbs during a bulk? Do you understand the requirements of bulking while on keto?
We all agree that one should eat nutrient dense foods but as Alan Aragon has stated, you dont get extra credit for more nutrients than your body needs. Diets are about contexta dn bulking is about calories. If you cant sustain a surplus, you will not bulk, you will miss your goals and you will be trying to figure out whats broken.Wheelhouse15 wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
Because your version of "clean" is different from others and there is no medical consensus of what we should define "clean" for a diet. Your experience is your own as his is his own and mine is my own. However, should you have some "medically factual" information, whatever that means as far as personal experience goes, please share it and I'll certainly take a look.
@GaleHawkins
what they said and I can't see your replies, because I care not to ...3 -
Ok, like the thousands of studies that show a link between processed carbs and cardiovascular disease, and how lowering carbs with moderate protein and higher fats did in fact lower blood preasure and LDL cholesterol better than any other diet. Triglycerides are shown to drop drastically as well as improve insulin sensitivity. I could go on and on.. Just read studies from Harvard, New England Journal of Medicine, British Medical Journal, studies done by Dr. Lydia A. Bazzano: Tulane University School of Public Health.
Dr. Eric C. Westman Duke University
and many more.. It's science dude not my opinions here. And I can show you before and after photos of myself, as well as blood work. I'll never tell anyone to stop eating something. I will however offer additional options for you to try out.3 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
There is no "medically factually in our experience". Something is either medical fact or it isn't. And science determines what is. If you have studies showing that, everything else being identical, whatever you define as clean food resulting in better results than something else, I'd love to see them.1 -
sbubenchik wrote: »Ok, like the thousands of studies that show a link between processed carbs and cardiovascular disease, and how lowering carbs with moderate protein and higher fats did in fact lower blood preasure and LDL cholesterol better than any other diet. Triglycerides are shown to drop drastically as well as improve insulin sensitivity. I could go on and on.. Just read studies from Harvard, New England Journal of Medicine, British Medical Journal, studies done by Dr. Lydia A. Bazzano: Tulane University School of Public Health.
Dr. Eric C. Westman Duke University
and many more.. It's science dude not my opinions here. And I can show you before and after photos of myself, as well as blood work. I'll never tell anyone to stop eating something. I will however offer additional options for you to try out.
There's a link between people walking outside with umbrellas and rain. What do you conclude from that?1 -
sbubenchik wrote: »Ok, like the thousands of studies that show a link between processed carbs and cardiovascular disease, and how lowering carbs with moderate protein and higher fats did in fact lower blood preasure and LDL cholesterol better than any other diet. Triglycerides are shown to drop drastically as well as improve insulin sensitivity. I could go on and on.. Just read studies from Harvard, New England Journal of Medicine, British Medical Journal, studies done by Dr. Lydia A. Bazzano: Tulane University School of Public Health.
Dr. Eric C. Westman Duke University
and many more.. It's science dude not my opinions here. And I can show you before and after photos of myself, as well as blood work. I'll never tell anyone to stop eating something. I will however offer additional options for you to try out.
So it compared low nutrient process carbs (which btw would generally also be high in fat) vs a nutrient dense lchf diet? I ask because that is how many of them.are structured. Also, how long did they run the experiment?
There are plenty of linkages between lowering cholesterol with high fibrous diets.0 -
sbubenchik wrote: »Ok, like the thousands of studies that show a link between processed carbs and cardiovascular disease, and how lowering carbs with moderate protein and higher fats did in fact lower blood preasure and LDL cholesterol better than any other diet. Triglycerides are shown to drop drastically as well as improve insulin sensitivity. I could go on and on.. Just read studies from Harvard, New England Journal of Medicine, British Medical Journal, studies done by Dr. Lydia A. Bazzano: Tulane University School of Public Health.
Dr. Eric C. Westman Duke University
and many more.. It's science dude not my opinions here. And I can show you before and after photos of myself, as well as blood work. I'll never tell anyone to stop eating something. I will however offer additional options for you to try out.
Link to the specific study that showed that please?
Weight loss on almost any diet will lower triglycerides and usually have a salutary effect on BP too.
In all fairness the OP is working to gain
0 -
sbubenchik wrote: »Just needed to try something different and found it just works best for my body. I did higher carb for years and the best results I got were how I eat now. I have way more energy with the way I eat now, and I stay lean and built without working as hard as I did a few years back. Plus I started reading medical journals and took A&P from an MD when I was in school. The more I learned how the cells in the body work, the easier everything has been.
Interesting.... I could never go that low on carbs though! LOL! They definitely do leave me bloated, so I've always tried to moderate them regardless what I'm doing. Too many make me sluggish as well. Protein and veggies keep me lean and satiated, but I still need my carbs. Thanks for the input.I would not worry about the six pounds in three weeks. As others have said it is a combination of increased water weight through glycogen, muscle repair, etc. Keep doing what you are doing and if you are still gaining at same six pound rate in another three weeks then taper back. My guess is that at six weeks in your gain will even out to about where you want to be...
Ok.... Had to wipe a lil sweat off my brow at the thought of this pace keeping up, but I know what you're saying. I'll bite the bullet and keep going.
If you want to exceed your protein goals its fine. Excessive protein will convert to glucose. And there is no need to get a ton of carbs. Carbs just tend to make it easier. And the question i woulf have which foods make you feel bloated? I would question it being carbs themselve but rather a subset.
Absolutely. I love all things bread/pasta/rice but they make me feel really fluffy...sap my energy...and they don't leave me feeling full like meat and veggies, so I just stick to smaller amounts.
If it's mostly grains making you feel bloated, it could be another mechanism that is causing the issues. So, if that is the case, I would drop those and try different types of carbs to see if you can get that replacement, such as: lentils, legumes, quinoa, oats or just add more fruits.
If you are at a point, where you want to worry about timing (not overly necessary but may be a precaution) is eat some carbs pre - or post-workout with some protein. Not saying it will improve results, but worst case it won't hurt.
Ok. I'll play around with all of this and see what happens. Thank you!
0 -
Ok I feel like this all went a bit off topic of the original question.. Bottom line of gaining muscle are really just 2 simple steps. 1. Eat a healthy balanced diet that YOUR body thrives from. 2. Time under tension. I might just have good genetics to look like I do iduno...0
-
sbubenchik wrote: »Ok I feel like this all went a bit off topic of the original question.. Bottom line of gaining muscle are really just 2 simple steps. 1. Eat a healthy balanced diet that YOUR body thrives from. 2. Time under tension. I might just have good genetics to look like I do iduno...
I would agree that one should eat whole nutrient dense foods but largely an energy surplus is thr main thing to achieve good muscle gains (yes you can gain some muscle in a deficit or maintenance its just not as ideal). And then you need an adequate stimulus (progressive in nature). If that is what you mean by TUT i would agree. But when i hear TUT i generally thing programs like GVT.
On the dietary side though, one can eat dirty or clean and still see equivalent results.0 -
sbubenchik wrote: »Ok I feel like this all went a bit off topic of the original question.. Bottom line of gaining muscle are really just 2 simple steps. 1. Eat a healthy balanced diet that YOUR body thrives from. 2. Time under tension. I might just have good genetics to look like I do iduno...
I would agree that one should eat whole nutrient dense foods but largely an energy surplus is thr main thing to achieve good muscle gains (yes you can gain some muscle in a deficit or maintenance its just not as ideal). And then you need an adequate stimulus (progressive in nature). If that is what you mean by TUT i would agree. But when i hear TUT i generally thing programs like GVT.
On the dietary side though, one can eat dirty or clean and still see equivalent results.
Time under tension is the stimulus for all muscle growth, or rather time under high tension, but TUHT doesn't make a good acronym. The more tortured TUHPIT - Time under high progressively increasing tension - would probably be the more accurate still, but then you sound like your sneezing in German more than volume training in it.
Schoenfeld's done decent work showing you can get hypertrophy in a range of reps (as much as 30 reps), but essentially to get growth, the total volume / total stimulus has to keep increasing, and since 30 reps tends to be not just long but also leads to vomiting in the study, you generally are going to have to increase weight on the bar.
Or you can have saiyan DNA. Then all strength increase is guaranteed by surviving any defeat or serious injury.
He also published one study where he found that the best results for hypertrophy were from a powerlifting program (vice a hypertrophy oriented program) but required much more time (1.5 hrs vs .5 hours) and it was something that increased the risk of injury substantially to get that extra benefit. Seems the key is the volume first and the weight second for hypertrophy but for strength it's likely reversed.
Of course, for a saiyan you can just draw more energy to hit the next level, right?0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
Gale, what experience do you have with bulking? Have you seen an isocaloric/isomacronutrient study that alter foods? Do you realize how many people struggle to get enough calories because they put excessive limitations on the foods they eat? Do you understand the benfits of carbs during a bulk? Do you understand the requirements of bulking while on keto?
We all agree that one should eat nutrient dense foods but as Alan Aragon has stated, you dont get extra credit for more nutrients than your body needs. Diets are about contexta dn bulking is about calories. If you cant sustain a surplus, you will not bulk, you will miss your goals and you will be trying to figure out whats broken.
**This is the reply that I put in the wrong thread earlier.**
I do not bulk just to gain fat and muscle like some body builders do but I have bulked up some muscle wise relative to the past. After years of being racked in pain I had lost much muscle mass and was mostly fat. This time last year I had lost near 60 pounds being mostly fat so my legs and arms were very thin having been off sugar and all forms of grains to get good pain management the prior 9 months and as I still am today.
When I was at my peak weight of about 250 a little over two years ago I was so weak laying flat on a mat I could only clear my heals off the mat 3-4 inches and only do that 3 times in a roll. I could not set up and just get out of bed but pulled up using a trapeze like bar I had rigged up.
Over the last year walking a 1/4 mile daily down and back up a steep hill the calves of my legs are larger than when I was obese and the muscles are defined.
Some body builders know a lot about how to eat and I have listen to some great pod casts by some who have earned their doctorate degrees.
https://labrada.com/blog/lees-corner/how-to-use-a-low-carb-diet-to-burn-fat-without-losing-muscle/
bodybuilding.com/fun/ask-the-muscle-prof-is-bulking-really-necessary.html
I like both of these guys ideas. Cutting fat and adding muscle at the same time is my preference needlessly to say.
Clearly to get that non human look muscle wise that some shoot for a lot of carbs are required and perhaps an emotional need that I do not have but as you know living relative pain free living to be 110 walking and talking the whole way is what that drives my eating and moving goals.
The articles drive home the kinds of carbs and when they are eaten can determine where bulking adding mainly fat and/or muscle. Clearly the professional body builders have moved passed the false concept a calorie is a calorie when it comes to good health.
0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
Gale, what experience do you have with bulking? Have you seen an isocaloric/isomacronutrient study that alter foods? Do you realize how many people struggle to get enough calories because they put excessive limitations on the foods they eat? Do you understand the benfits of carbs during a bulk? Do you understand the requirements of bulking while on keto?
We all agree that one should eat nutrient dense foods but as Alan Aragon has stated, you dont get extra credit for more nutrients than your body needs. Diets are about contexta dn bulking is about calories. If you cant sustain a surplus, you will not bulk, you will miss your goals and you will be trying to figure out whats broken.
**This is the reply that I put in the wrong thread earlier.**
I do not bulk just to gain fat and muscle like some body builders do but I have bulked up some muscle wise relative to the past. After years of being racked in pain I had lost much muscle mass and was mostly fat. This time last year I had lost near 60 pounds being mostly fat so my legs and arms were very thin having been off sugar and all forms of grains to get good pain management the prior 9 months and as I still am today.
When I was at my peak weight of about 250 a little over two years ago I was so weak laying flat on a mat I could only clear my heals off the mat 3-4 inches and only do that 3 times in a roll. I could not set up and just get out of bed but pulled up using a trapeze like bar I had rigged up.
Over the last year walking a 1/4 mile daily down and back up a steep hill the calves of my legs are larger than when I was obese and the muscles are defined.
Some body builders know a lot about how to eat and I have listen to some great pod casts by some who have earned their doctorate degrees.
https://labrada.com/blog/lees-corner/how-to-use-a-low-carb-diet-to-burn-fat-without-losing-muscle/
bodybuilding.com/fun/ask-the-muscle-prof-is-bulking-really-necessary.html
I like both of these guys ideas. Cutting fat and adding muscle at the same time is my preference needlessly to say.
Clearly to get that non human look muscle wise that some shoot for a lot of carbs are required and perhaps an emotional need that I do not have but as you know living relative pain free living to be 110 walking and talking the whole way is what that drives my eating and moving goals.
The articles drive home the kinds of carbs and when they are eaten can determine where bulking adding mainly fat and/or muscle. Clearly the professional body builders have moved passed the false concept a calorie is a calorie when it comes to good health.
Body builders in general have self-promotional interests, i.e. sponsorships, and most have very little idea of what they are talking about having little to no background in the requisite science. You might want look at the only bodybuilder and powerlifter that I know of that actually has a PhD in nutritional science, and that is Dr. Layne Norton. The idea that there are "good" and "bad" carbs is not supported by science. As for good health, the point is not whether a calorie is a calorie but rather the proper nutrional intake, beyond that most of this differential calorie talk is junk science with no support in current nutrional research, which is why those who propose it are the fringe.
As always, I congratulate you on your return to health and wish you the best of luck in the future.0 -
Wheelhouse15 wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »sbubenchik wrote: »What are your goals and purpose? Are you new to strength training or just new to trying to add muscle? Personally to add muscle and to stay lean I eat about 60% fats and 10% carbs all from veggies, nothing processed. That's year round forever. All it takes to add the muscle is time under tension. 8-12 rep range and even 5-6 sets. High volume I know, but it's how muscle fibers work. 6lbs in 3 weeks sounds kind of high unless you're new to lifting. A lot if that is water from all the carbs. Feel free to add/message if you want options. I helped my wife and many other women.
Avoiding Processed food and/or clean eating has nothing to do with staying lean or adding mass...
ndj1979 why after two years are you still struggling with this subject? It may not apply in your personal case but many others have the personal experience to know what @sbubenchik is stating is medically factually in our experiences.
Gale, what experience do you have with bulking? Have you seen an isocaloric/isomacronutrient study that alter foods? Do you realize how many people struggle to get enough calories because they put excessive limitations on the foods they eat? Do you understand the benfits of carbs during a bulk? Do you understand the requirements of bulking while on keto?
We all agree that one should eat nutrient dense foods but as Alan Aragon has stated, you dont get extra credit for more nutrients than your body needs. Diets are about contexta dn bulking is about calories. If you cant sustain a surplus, you will not bulk, you will miss your goals and you will be trying to figure out whats broken.
**This is the reply that I put in the wrong thread earlier.**
I do not bulk just to gain fat and muscle like some body builders do but I have bulked up some muscle wise relative to the past. After years of being racked in pain I had lost much muscle mass and was mostly fat. This time last year I had lost near 60 pounds being mostly fat so my legs and arms were very thin having been off sugar and all forms of grains to get good pain management the prior 9 months and as I still am today.
When I was at my peak weight of about 250 a little over two years ago I was so weak laying flat on a mat I could only clear my heals off the mat 3-4 inches and only do that 3 times in a roll. I could not set up and just get out of bed but pulled up using a trapeze like bar I had rigged up.
Over the last year walking a 1/4 mile daily down and back up a steep hill the calves of my legs are larger than when I was obese and the muscles are defined.
Some body builders know a lot about how to eat and I have listen to some great pod casts by some who have earned their doctorate degrees.
https://labrada.com/blog/lees-corner/how-to-use-a-low-carb-diet-to-burn-fat-without-losing-muscle/
bodybuilding.com/fun/ask-the-muscle-prof-is-bulking-really-necessary.html
I like both of these guys ideas. Cutting fat and adding muscle at the same time is my preference needlessly to say.
Clearly to get that non human look muscle wise that some shoot for a lot of carbs are required and perhaps an emotional need that I do not have but as you know living relative pain free living to be 110 walking and talking the whole way is what that drives my eating and moving goals.
The articles drive home the kinds of carbs and when they are eaten can determine where bulking adding mainly fat and/or muscle. Clearly the professional body builders have moved passed the false concept a calorie is a calorie when it comes to good health.
Body builders in general have self-promotional interests, i.e. sponsorships, and most have very little idea of what they are talking about having little to no background in the requisite science. You might want look at the only bodybuilder and powerlifter that I know of that actually has a PhD in nutritional science, and that is Dr. Layne Norton. The idea that there are "good" and "bad" carbs is not supported by science. As for good health, the point is not whether a calorie is a calorie but rather the proper nutrional intake, beyond that most of this differential calorie talk is junk science with no support in current nutrional research, which is why those who propose it are the fringe.
As always, I congratulate you on your return to health and wish you the best of luck in the future.
Thanks0
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 391.7K Introduce Yourself
- 43.5K Getting Started
- 259.7K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.6K Food and Nutrition
- 47.3K Recipes
- 232.3K Fitness and Exercise
- 394 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.4K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 152.7K Motivation and Support
- 7.8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.3K MyFitnessPal Information
- 23 News and Announcements
- 941 Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.3K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions