yet another plateau post
Replies
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diannethegeek wrote: »8. If you weigh yourself frequently, consider using a program like trendweight to even out the fluctuations. You could be losing weight but just don't see it because of the daily ups and downs.
9. Some people just burn fewer calories than the calculators predict. If you continue to have problems after 4-6 weeks, then it might be worth a trip to the doctor or a registered dietitian who can give you more specific advice.
I think I will look at that trendweight thing.
How can you work out an accurate exercise figure though if the calculators are wrong?
Honestly, the only way to figure out if the calculators are wrong is to see if you don't lose weight at the rate you're expecting.
Doing a little math can help here.
Go back and look through your diary and see what your total weekly calories were for the week for several weeks during your loss. Then look at total calories expended. Expended - consumed will give you your deficit. Take that number and divide by 3500 (the approximate # of calories needed to lose a pound).
Then compare your expected (calculated weight loss) and compare to your actual rate of loss. It helps to look at least 6-8 weeks worth of data because weight loss isn't constant. If you're losing at the rate you expect, the calculators probably are pretty accurate for you. If you're losing weight slower than you expect, the calculators are overestimating your burn. If you're losing faster than expected, the calculators may be underestimating your burn.3 -
Maybe I should have started by saying 'thoughts other than the food scale'. I don't think i'm a special snowflake, but people always just say 'it's the food scale' 'it's your measurements' 'you're logging wrong.' I've already ruled that out. I wouldn't have asked if I thought it was that. I had therapy for years over an eating disorder, I know how to log food, I know how to measure food, I had a doctor berate me constantly over my inaccuracies. I know how incredibly disappointing it is when it turns out that 80grams of something is actually just nothing on a plate but there isn't room for anything more.
I worry that this is all just heading to piling weight back on. Every day is just another dead stop of a day, with a goal nowhere nearer, and just a heavy ugly body that looks disgusting. It's just disappointment at thinking I can never just eat something anymore, it's all got negative consequences.
I don't understand what this message board is for to be honest if everyone posts the same advice with the same graph and then gets annoyed if you say that you've already heard that advice. It's depressing to get criticism over not being more 'yes thank you that's amazing advice i've never seen that graph before' when you already feel like you do everything wrong.
I don't know why everyone posts the same responses continuously, either.
I also don't understand why so many ask total strangers "why am I not losing weight?"
What do you expect the responses to be? Medical advice?
Perhaps you just want commiseration?8 -
[/quote]
Honestly, the only way to figure out if the calculators are wrong is to see if you don't lose weight at the rate you're expecting.
Doing a little math can help here.
Go back and look through your diary and see what your total weekly calories were for the week for several weeks during your loss. Then look at total calories expended. Expended - consumed will give you your deficit. Take that number and divide by 3500 (the approximate # of calories needed to lose a pound).
Then compare your expected (calculated weight loss) and compare to your actual rate of loss. It helps to look at least 6-8 weeks worth of data because weight loss isn't constant. If you're losing at the rate you expect, the calculators probably are pretty accurate for you. If you're losing weight slower than you expect, the calculators are overestimating your burn. If you're losing faster than expected, the calculators may be underestimating your burn.[/quote]
not sure i understand the formula here.0 -
Im currently at a plateu. The 4th plateu this year.
Every time I shed a lot of weight and then stall - its a sign for me to change things. And I ignore what the doctors, nutritionist and gurus say online. I find what works for me, and take whatever science based arguments as - advisory.
I shed the first 59 lbs (or so) without any exercise - all pure diet. Over 9 months, that started with intermittent fasting - eat anything you want but nothing after 2pm. It ruffled a few feathers, but that was my first 9 kgs. I swapped sugary foods for fruits - saw that wasn't working and now I eat salads.
At this point in the journey, its about whatever lever I can pull to leverage that number to drop. I'll find ways to cut net calories until I'm at my goal. Now its time to start long distance running: I find that some days my legs are sore beyond belief. But I will run my feet into the ground until I'm there - and I'll thank myself for it.
On a side note, this MFP community is a gift - don't abuse it by being snarky: because their support can be inspiring on the days you can't carry your weight loss ambitions.4 -
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Whenever I plateau, I just consume my maintenance calories; for a couple of weeks. Losing weight is work & sometimes it's just necessary, to relax!2
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People seem to always jump to the food scale as a problem. I know how to count. I know how to measure. I don't think it's stalled because this or that might have been 5 grams more than what I counted. I'm trying to lose weight, not develop an eating disorder. And if something tells you it's x for the whole packet, then you would just cut that in half.
Or do you think I'm a fool because I don't measure out the exact half of a pie that I'm splitting with someone?
I'm determining the calorie intake as accurately as a person can, without knowing the exact science for working out calorie contentI can only use the info provided on the packaging, or this site.
Wait...you measure your food with cups and spoons?
This is the exact thing that caused me to maintain my weight instead of losing it. I like you didn't think errors here and there were holding me back. Guess what? They were. Once I got a new food scale, I started losing weight again. If I don't weigh my food, I won't lose weight. And yes, I have to weigh peanut butter, oils and butter as those are easy to overdo and easy to rack up an extra 300 calories.
I only use cups/spoons for actual liquids now.
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diannethegeek wrote: »8. If you weigh yourself frequently, consider using a program like trendweight to even out the fluctuations. You could be losing weight but just don't see it because of the daily ups and downs.
9. Some people just burn fewer calories than the calculators predict. If you continue to have problems after 4-6 weeks, then it might be worth a trip to the doctor or a registered dietitian who can give you more specific advice.
I think I will look at that trendweight thing.
How can you work out an accurate exercise figure though if the calculators are wrong?
Use your actual results to calculate your TDEE. If you are 100% sure that your logging is accurate, then your actual losses compared to your calorie intake (over a sufficient period of time to avoid normal fluctuations) should allow you to calculate your TDEE.0 -
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Honestly, the only way to figure out if the calculators are wrong is to see if you don't lose weight at the rate you're expecting.
Doing a little math can help here.
Go back and look through your diary and see what your total weekly calories were for the week for several weeks during your loss. Then look at total calories expended. Expended - consumed will give you your deficit. Take that number and divide by 3500 (the approximate # of calories needed to lose a pound).
Then compare your expected (calculated weight loss) and compare to your actual rate of loss. It helps to look at least 6-8 weeks worth of data because weight loss isn't constant. If you're losing at the rate you expect, the calculators probably are pretty accurate for you. If you're losing weight slower than you expect, the calculators are overestimating your burn. If you're losing faster than expected, the calculators may be underestimating your burn.
not sure i understand the formula here.
Total weekly calories = total calories consumed over the week
Total deficit = total calories spent - total consumed
If you don't track total calories spent, look at what MFP tells you your deficit is each day including exercise (so, if you have it set to 1lb per week loss, that's 3500 base calories and then subtract any days you were over or add any calories you were under).
Say your goal is to lose 1lb per week. And this is your over/under total calorie goal numbers:
M -235 (under by 235)
T +115
W -20
T +45
F 0 (at goal)
S -180
S +76
For the week, you burned 199 calories more than your goal, giving you 3699 calories total. In theory, you would lose 1.05lbs that week in a perfect world. Look at 8 weeks of that data. Are you losing consistently? Are you losing half a pound when your math says you should be losing 2lbs? You're eating too much (aka, the calculators are wrong).
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not sure i understand the formula here.
To add to what auddii said:
Take the last month or two (period of the plateau, if possible). Add up all the calories you ate. If you have skipped days, you can't do this, though, so I am assuming you logged everything. If you have unlogged cheat days, estimate or use a month where you didn't have them. After you add up all the calories (putting them in a spreadsheet makes this easier), divide by the number of days. If this IS a period where there was no gain or loss, that's your TDEE.
Then go back to the most recent period where you were losing and do the same, but also add in 3500 calories extra for every lb (2.2 kg) you lost during that period before dividing by the number of days. That's your TDEE then. Better to use a period of at least a month or two, as weekly fluctuates too much.
Figuring out these numbers can be helpful.1 -
diannethegeek wrote: »8. If you weigh yourself frequently, consider using a program like trendweight to even out the fluctuations. You could be losing weight but just don't see it because of the daily ups and downs.
9. Some people just burn fewer calories than the calculators predict. If you continue to have problems after 4-6 weeks, then it might be worth a trip to the doctor or a registered dietitian who can give you more specific advice.
I think I will look at that trendweight thing.
How can you work out an accurate exercise figure though if the calculators are wrong?
Honestly, trial and error. And you may not want to hear this part, but it's most effective when you're dead on with your calories in. If your calories in varies from day to day, then you may very well struggle with the calories out part. It's be like solving an equation with too many variables.
I use a trendwright program (HappyScale) and it's been really helpful in getting me to not dread the scale because I understand my fluctuations better. So, for me it's more like Less-Unhappy-Scale, but I'm getting there.
I wear a fitness tracker. It helps me, though it does underestimate (or the translation from the tracker app to MFP) the calories for plain old steps. For calories burned during cardio when I'm wearing the HRM, it's exact. For yoga, I used spark people and for the 90 minute class I enter between 70-80 minutes depending on how slow we start and finish (educated guess). It has worked well for me. I'm in maintenance, though, and have a little more leeway. I did not when I was at 1200 calories a day.
From the way you talk about yourself and your body, it seems you may be holding onto a lot of self-loathing. Can you talk to someone about that? You're the only you you've got! Please take care of yourself (and not just physically)!0 -
OP, there are so key questions you've been asked that you haven't answered.
How long has it been since you've lost? How much weight did you lose before that? Over what period of time? Age and height? This is all relevant.
Also is how you know you aren't making logging mistakes. Among other things, there are wrong entries in the database, and surely not everything you eat is packaged. (You also have to double check packaged stuff, although I personally don't weigh single serve packaged stuff. I do weigh other things that come in a package, like smoked salmon or greek yogurt from a multiserving container or nuts or cheese, etc., and I'd certainly weigh nut butter if I ate it.
But that aside, I'm noticing something else that's worth responding to, even if you are certain your calories are 100% accurate.I had therapy for years over an eating disorder, I know how to log food, I know how to measure food, I had a doctor berate me constantly over my inaccuracies. I know how incredibly disappointing it is when it turns out that 80grams of something is actually just nothing on a plate but there isn't room for anything more.
Because it could be relevant (ignore this if you want -- your business, not ours, if you don't want to share), what kind of ED did you have where you were encouraged to weigh and "berated" (I also wonder if that was perception) for inaccuracies? How were the inaccuracies discovered? I do see how this would make you sensitive about others second-guessing your counting/logging, but the fact is that most people who don't lose over a significant period of time aren't logging well. (This includes me, although I know this so haven't asked why I'm not losing.)
But anyway, this next bit is what I mostly wanted to address:I worry that this is all just heading to piling weight back on. Every day is just another dead stop of a day, with a goal nowhere nearer, and just a heavy ugly body that looks disgusting. It's just disappointment at thinking I can never just eat something anymore, it's all got negative consequences.
What has helped me is NOT focusing on weight so much or at least taking a break. Working on the negative thoughts about your body often helps make losing easier, not harder, and focusing on fitting into clothes or -- better still -- things you can control like eating really well (from a nutrition POV -- this does NOT mean no treats or even no cheese, which I ate even when I was doing 1250, just in small amounts or more rarely) and being as fit as possible (focusing on exercise or achievement goals, like training for a race or C25K or strength goals or being able to complete a hike or video you can't now, etc.). If there are positive improvements you want to make to things that you can see keeping during maintenance, that's also helpful to focus on -- meal planning, cooking, eating vegetables, whatever it is. Reframe your idea of success to things you can control and stop beating yourself up over the rate you are losing or the number on the scale.
Frankly, after changing focus for a while I tend to find that I do lose anyway, but that's not really the point -- the point is that if you live a healthy life and eat a sensible number of calories you can be extremely healthy and fit, no matter what the scale says. And you will probably start to feel better about yourself independent of the scale.
To the extent there's an issue like an occasional off plan day logged or not or underlogging, I think moving the focus from the scale (or sometimes increasing from an overly low calorie goal) can help with that, but again, not really the point, just sometimes a positive side effect, even if people can't see why.
Stressing less could help too. Worth a try.4 -
I was in a plateau all summer long, and I was incredibly frustrated. I thought I was eating well, and I was going to the gym six days a week and having an active rest day. I mean, I may have gone to a couple of beer fests and ate some BBQ that I didn't track, but I thought that wouldn't matter. My boyfriend is the cook in the household and he follows the healthy recipes I find online or in my Skinnytaste cookbook. One night a few weeks ago, he put some roasted potatoes on my plate and as I started to eat, I asked him, "How much does this weigh?" And he didn't know. We hadn't been weighing our food all summer long. I was weighing out my lunch, but I wasn't weighing my dinner (which he prepared).
Now he's 100% on board and is crazy accurate with the food scale now.
I cut out bagels in the morning and took up a protein shake and hardboiled eggs.
I re-calculated my TDEE based on my activity level and calculated macros that make sense for my lifestyle.
I changed out my workout routine that I had been doing for 2-3 months (aka the whole summer) for a new workout program.
I finally busted through my plateau and I am at my lowest weight as an adult. I was in denial because I thought I was eating well, but not accurately logging, not weighing my food, and not changing up my exercise routine led to my plateau.
I hope this helps you, because many of the things I changed, I learned from the wise words of the MFP community. Without them, I probably would not be halfway to my goal today.6 -
I like this graph better:I don't understand what this message board is for to be honest if everyone posts the same advice with the same graph and then gets annoyed if you say that you've already heard that advice. It's depressing to get criticism over not being more 'yes thank you that's amazing advice i've never seen that graph before' when you already feel like you do everything wrong.
Stealing this!!0 -
I know you doubt the food scale, but I wanted to add my 2 cents. My grocery sells 6 oz servings of salmon for X dollars. They are already sliced up in the seafood case. So I took it for granted that they WERE 6 oz. I started weighing them and no, they mean AROUND 6 oz. Sometimes it's 5.5 and sometimes it's closer to 7. So now, even though they SAY it's 6 oz, I always weigh.
With salmon, probably not that big of a difference calorie wise, but AHA, they also do steaks that way. 8 oz rib-eyes for X dollars. Guess what? Sometimes 7.5 and sometimes almost 9 oz. So you really can't be too careful.0 -
same with a protein bar I had it said 88g for the whole bar. I weighed it without the packaging and it was 100g. even had I cut what the package calories said for half the bar I would have still been over by 6g per half. it does add up. I learned the hard way when I was using measuring cups. I lost weight in the beginning but then I started gaining some of it back. bought a scale and weighed and lost that weight I gained and then some.packaged food is allowed to be off by 20% or more. what I thought was a half cup of oatmeal(40g) was more like 1 cup or even 1.25 cups when using the measuring cup.even after 4 years I still cannot eyeball the portion sizes,I get close though.if you dont want to weigh anything then I would say cut your portions a bit more and go from there. but for me the scale was the best investment I made
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This is why I don't do 1200 calories.. there is really no where to go from there. I read on here long ago..many women who lose on 1200 are stuck at super low calories at maintenance and it is hard to live life that way.
You need to find your way.. decide to either increase your calories and exercise so you can eat more. .perhaps that would get things moving. Or eat more calories two days a week and then keep it 1200 the rest and see if that works. Good luck.. i can see why you feel discouraged.0 -
elisa123gal wrote: »This is why I don't do 1200 calories.. there is really no where to go from there. I read on here long ago..many women who lose on 1200 are stuck at super low calories at maintenance and it is hard to live life that way.
You need to find your way.. decide to either increase your calories and exercise so you can eat more. .perhaps that would get things moving. Or eat more calories two days a week and then keep it 1200 the rest and see if that works. Good luck.. i can see why you feel discouraged.
No, if she's not losing weight she does not eat more, she needs to eat less. There are clearly miscalculations somewhere if she's maintaining when she wants to lose.3 -
So your weight has stayed the same for 6 weeks or more with doing everything exactly the same? If not, it's not a plateau. If you're stalled, then you're body is adapting to the amount of calories you're taking in. Homeostasis. So walk faster first.
No, she has not.so I got down to 86.7 kilos, but since then nothing has happened for a month, it's crept back up seems to be stuck around 87.7 kilos.
i thought maybe it was because august was a bit erratic, but there's still nothing doing. sigh. it was so much easier to keep to 1200 calories when it was producing results, but when it's not, you just feel like a fat person who isn't having all that much to eat. i'd hoped i'd be further along with losing weight, but instead i get people going 'are you still doing that diet then?'
She states that August was erratic and also implies is that she is probably not keeping to 1200 because she feels discouraged.
OP, not trying to diss you in any way. Just pointing out the cause of the plateau, which is not really a plateau because it does not meet the definition of no change in weight for 6 weeks while doing everything else EXACTLY the same. I often don't see a change in the scale for 2-3 weeks. It's not a plateau, it's a normal fluctuation. Furthermore, pay no attention to the unhelpful comments from your friends.
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Start weight training1
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Maybe I should have started by saying 'thoughts other than the food scale'. I don't think i'm a special snowflake, but people always just say 'it's the food scale' 'it's your measurements' 'you're logging wrong.' I've already ruled that out. I wouldn't have asked if I thought it was that. I had therapy for years over an eating disorder, I know how to log food, I know how to measure food, I had a doctor berate me constantly over my inaccuracies. I know how incredibly disappointing it is when it turns out that 80grams of something is actually just nothing on a plate but there isn't room for anything more.
I worry that this is all just heading to piling weight back on. Every day is just another dead stop of a day, with a goal nowhere nearer, and just a heavy ugly body that looks disgusting. It's just disappointment at thinking I can never just eat something anymore, it's all got negative consequences.
I don't understand what this message board is for to be honest if everyone posts the same advice with the same graph and then gets annoyed if you say that you've already heard that advice. It's depressing to get criticism over not being more 'yes thank you that's amazing advice i've never seen that graph before' when you already feel like you do everything wrong.
Well, sounds like you've got it all figured out then. If you think we're all so clueless, then why ask at all? How did you "rule out" the food scale if you're obviously not using it?
You're taking this too personally. You're not getting any advice that anyone else wouldn't get asking the same question without any additional info. If you're at 1200 calories and you're not losing weight, then you're not eating 1200 calories. What else is there to say? If you don't want to use the food scale then okay, just cut down your portion sizes. Don't want to worry about being accurate with calories? Then overestimate everything. Food scale =/= eating disorder.
I'm sorry that you're having difficulties, but you should take a good look at Dianne's advice...all of it..and take it to heart. She's not posting to attack or berate anyone, it was posted to help.9 -
How tall are you?
There are mistakes that people commonly make that cause them to not lose weight that we might be able to spot if you change your Diary Sharing settings to Public: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/account/diary_settings0 -
First point, 1200 calories leaves a person no where to go and I would think that obviously a person will bottom out hense plateau or reach a point where to body is adapting to low calories.
Second point, to reach the point of a true plateau, a person absolutely has to be 100% on point with calories in and calories out, in short know that their data is 100% accurate. In this case a food scale is not being used and with this variable alone, one can assume that the 1200 calories intake is much more than reported.
However, to break a true plateau or stall (again everything has to be on point for one to determine true stall) is to increase calories by reverse dieting and perhaps alter their NEAT (non exercise activity thermogenesis) or EAT (exercise activity thermogenesis), in short move more..
There is clearly options or a strategy that can be followed that does not include reducing caloric intake. A reset is needed to break the homeostasis point where the body has reached its potential for losing weight at such low calories.
If a woman on this thread has not seen Lyle McDonald's podcast Women and Fat Loss, I encourage you to watch it. You can find it by searching Lyle McDonald Nails It in the MFP forums, or just request here and I will attach it.
All of you have provided OP with great advice as I can see a lot of you (including my self in the past) have reached this before and in many cases more than once.1 -
First point, 1200 calories leaves a person no where to go and I would think that obviously a person will bottom out hense plateau or reach a point where to body is adapting to low calories.
No, that is not what's happening here. She's miscalculation somewhere and needs to figure that out.There is clearly options or a strategy that can be followed that does not include reducing caloric intake. A reset is needed to break the homeostasis point where the body has reached its potential for losing weight at such low calories.
No, OP needs to figure out where her errors are. There is no need to reset anything.
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MissusMoon wrote: »You know, the 5 grams you mention... 5 grams of cooking oil extra is 45 calories. If you have 10 items of food on a day and they all were off by just 5 grams then that's 200-450 calories you didn't account for.
This. So much this.
When you're close to goal as a woman you have very little margin of error in order to lose. Using my food scale has saved me over 150 calories per day on packaged foods alone. I would NEVER guess on meat or cheese again after seeing the difference. Hundreds of calories per day there as well.
If you call not stalling because I am accurately counting my calories an eating disorder, I can live that.
I pretty much gave up on cheese right at the start because it's 100 calories a bite essentially. Even though cheese is like the only thing I ever want to eat. sigh. and not much of what i eat uses cooking oil.
Have you tried changing your macros? I was eating 50% carb, high protein, and very little fat before coming to MFP. Then I started playing around with macros. My body seemed to respond to low carb/high fat in a positive way and I lost some weight after a very, very long plateau. Then after I lost some weight I went on intentional maintenance to keep the new weight loss off. My body seems to really like having the cheese, healthy oils, oily fish, etc. Don't give up. I hope you find what you need to get satiety and well being. I couldn't get to keto level and do like starchy vegetables. However I have cut out wheat and sugar in general which those two specifically seemed to turn on cravings, aches and pains, and hunger for me. I'm not saying that this will work for you, but you can experiment with it to see. The first week was difficult but the body adjusts fairly quickly. I am pain free and have more energy now. My outlook is positive for continuing on the fitness path long term.0 -
First point, 1200 calories leaves a person no where to go and I would think that obviously a person will bottom out hense plateau or reach a point where to body is adapting to low calories.
No, that is not what's happening here. She's miscalculation somewhere and needs to figure that out.There is clearly options or a strategy that can be followed that does not include reducing caloric intake. A reset is needed to break the homeostasis point where the body has reached its potential for losing weight at such low calories.
No, OP needs to figure out where her errors are. There is no need to reset anything.
I am in complete agreement that this NOT OP. I made that statement because 1200 calories is really the lowest a person can go and that if one is eating like this on such low calories and for a long period of time this can happen.. It was merely for context and so was the rest.
My next sentence says she cannot be 100% on point with food intake and its accuracy hense she is not using the variable or tool if you will to help her achieve the accuracy,, the food scale.
She just needs to reevaluate period. I hope she got enough information from the entire thread to help her move with the next step.
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First point, 1200 calories leaves a person no where to go and I would think that obviously a person will bottom out hense plateau or reach a point where to body is adapting to low calories.
Second point, to reach the point of a true plateau, a person absolutely has to be 100% on point with calories in and calories out, in short know that their data is 100% accurate. In this case a food scale is not being used and with this variable alone, one can assume that the 1200 calories intake is much more than reported.
However, to break a true plateau or stall (again everything has to be on point for one to determine true stall) is to increase calories by reverse dieting and perhaps alter their NEAT (non exercise activity thermogenesis) or EAT (exercise activity thermogenesis), in short move more..
There is clearly options or a strategy that can be followed that does not include reducing caloric intake. A reset is needed to break the homeostasis point where the body has reached its potential for losing weight at such low calories.
If a woman on this thread has not seen Lyle McDonald's podcast Women and Fat Loss, I encourage you to watch it. You can find it by searching Lyle McDonald Nails It in the MFP forums, or just request here and I will attach it.
All of you have provided OP with great advice as I can see a lot of you (including my self in the past) have reached this before and in many cases more than once.
Great video! It's long - I watched it while stretching over a few sessions:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6846ZTBu08k&index=4&list=PLUXvX9BaxgqG9yO5XWB3gA_QshvrrcjVr 0 -
It's not all about calories in vs calories out. It's about insulin. Do yourself a favor and go on youtube and look up insulin resistance.0
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