Why do people say weight loss is 70-80% diet and 20-30% exercise?
Replies
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Birddog6424 wrote: »I don't know many people who can exercise 2 to 3 hours a day.
I can't even think of anyone who trains that much. Tour de France riders don't train that much. Marathoners don't train that much. Pro bodybuilders lift for about an hour, maybe longer I'd they are running Test cycles. There has to be recovery time or the body just gets run down.
Being a long time marathoner, I'm amazed anyone can accomplish it without chemical enhancement. I can run 26 miles in that time. But there is no way in hell I could do it every day. I wouldn't even run 10 miles every day.
High level competitive swimming comes to mind. Based on a former friend who was working on breaking into the elite ranks, they don't do it every day (but nearly). They spend more than just a couple of hours on the days they do. She was usually at practice from 5am-noon. A lot of that time is working on technique or endurance with brief bouts of speed work.0 -
elisa123gal wrote: »Its a bunch of crap. It comes down to the person. You can lose weight with just diet or with exercise .. or combo of both.
nope it's not...it comes down to what you can sustain.
What if comes into play...
What if you can't exercise for 6 weeks due to injury
what if you decide not to exercise
what if you can't exercise
what if you are in a wheel chair..
what if you don't have time
what if
what if
what if...
you can lose weight with just exercise or just diet or both but more often than not the exercise gets old or isn't done anymore etc and people don't get how to control the weight gain without exercise...0 -
For me diet has been 100% the solution. I have lost 100 pounds in 8 months just be changing my eating. I am not starving, have no cravings and have NOT exercised at all1
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Relaxingmind wrote: »Ok thanks for explaining it, guys
I get the idea now. As for the possible injury, I think I'll be ok. If not, lowering my intake shouldn't be a problem as my appetite has lowered dramatically since switching to an active lifestyle and my past history which ill mention shortly. It would probably take a while to switch back if I were to go temporarily sedentary from injury. Today I hit the weights with a mix of cardio and was at only 1,200 calories at 10:00pm despite burning around 2,500 according to fitbit. I just now force fed myself around 500 more. Question... Is starvation mode real or a myth? I'm currently under the impression it's real, which is why I often force feed to reach my previous/sedentary TDEE. If it's not real, I'll just stop the force feeding and stick with a 800-1,000 deficit. There was a time in my life 2 years ago where I was anorexic so I'm wondering if that has something to do with my small appetite. I'm trying to build muscle and get lean because I used to be underweight. I'm but somewhat skinny-fat. I've been told that my muscle is underneath the fat and I have to eat at a small-medium deficit so it will go away and my muscle will be visible. Maybe I've been misinformed. Idk... I'm still kinda new to weight lifting. Used to be a complete cardio junky.
Wait...
You have a history of anorexia, you're doing 2-3 hours of primarily cardio a day, and some days you need to force-feed yourself to get over 1200 calories. That's not a healthy situation.
Starvation mode is a myth in the way you're talking about it; eating less won't make you magically store fat. However, malnourishment and gradually sliding back into under-eating are very real.
Anorexics and people who have gotten down to low body weights without doing things to protect their muscles (like lifting and eating enough protein) lose muscle and bone density along with the fat they lose. It's possible that you do need to gain back some muscle mass (and you won't see much muscle even after losing more fat if it's not under there), but we don't know if that's the case for you. If it were me, I would eat at maintenance, stop doing the cardio and just lift for 6 months. I'd let my body weight stabilize and work on developing some muscle, and then reevaluate after 6 months.
Basically, 2 years ago is when I was anorexic. The good thing is I've been doing exercise again (mainly cardio with a bit of light weights) and trained myself to eat more than I used to. But I'm still "fat" despite being thin. And I was told the only way to get rid of fat is a calorie deficit, which is why I'm doing a lot of exercise (without eating calories back, which is easy with my low appetite). But at the same time, I want to get lean. It's like a catch 22...
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Like someone said above, if you are not actually over weight, you don't need to eat at a deficit. There is no benefit to over training. Excess cardio in a very large deficit will lead to fat and muscle loss. Remember, your heart is a muscle and you can damage it by chronically under-eating and over-exercising. (And you risk losing hair, brittle nails, hormonal disruption...) Your best bet would be to find your maintenance calories and start a lifting routine. You did say your goal was to build muscle, correct? Also, you can still lose fat at maintenance while lifting, it just takes longer.2
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DancingMoosie wrote: »Like someone said above, if you are not actually over wight, you don't need to eat at a deficit. There is no benefit to over training. Excess cardio in a very large deficit will lead to fat and muscle loss. Your best bet would be to find your maintenance calories and start a lifting routine. You did say your goal was to build muscle, correct?
Yes, I want to gain muscle but get rid of this fat I have. I'm a size zero actually but if I had to guess, my body fat is probably in the mid-high 20's. I have a little belly pudge, tiny love handles, squishy bottom, soft thighs, and so on. Before I was anorexic, I was overweight. I DID lose a lot of weight but am unhappy with the results
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What this saying actually means is that you cannot out-train a bad diet. Basically if you are going to do one or the other, diet or exercise, it is best (for weight loss) to start with diet as you could train all day and still not lose weight if you aren't eating less. You are doing the same as me, I eat my sedentary TDEE and then workout and use that as my deficit. However, just one suggestion, 2-3 hours is a lot of exercise to do, just remember that your body adapts very easily to what you do, the more you do, the more your body will get used to this and you will have to continue this during maintenance, so just be careful how much you do. Great job! 0
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Relaxingmind wrote: »DancingMoosie wrote: »Like someone said above, if you are not actually over wight, you don't need to eat at a deficit. There is no benefit to over training. Excess cardio in a very large deficit will lead to fat and muscle loss. Your best bet would be to find your maintenance calories and start a lifting routine. You did say your goal was to build muscle, correct?
Yes, I want to gain muscle but get rid of this fat I have. I'm a size zero actually but if I had to guess, my body fat is probably in the mid-high 20's. I have a little belly pudge, tiny love handles, squishy bottom, soft thighs, and so on. Before I was anorexic, I was overweight. I DID lose a lot of weight but am unhappy with the results
Well, that's exactly what I was saying, but you seemed to miss the second half of my post. Find your maintenance calories and start a lifting routine. Its called a recomp...build muscle, lose fat while maintaining your weight.0 -
DancingMoosie wrote: »Relaxingmind wrote: »DancingMoosie wrote: »Like someone said above, if you are not actually over wight, you don't need to eat at a deficit. There is no benefit to over training. Excess cardio in a very large deficit will lead to fat and muscle loss. Your best bet would be to find your maintenance calories and start a lifting routine. You did say your goal was to build muscle, correct?
Yes, I want to gain muscle but get rid of this fat I have. I'm a size zero actually but if I had to guess, my body fat is probably in the mid-high 20's. I have a little belly pudge, tiny love handles, squishy bottom, soft thighs, and so on. Before I was anorexic, I was overweight. I DID lose a lot of weight but am unhappy with the results
Well, that's exactly what I was saying, but you seemed to miss the second half of my post. Find your maintenance calories and start a lifting routine. Its called a recomp...build muscle, lose fat while maintaining your weight.
Ok thanks! Do you have any links that give further details, including suggested amount of protein fat and carbs etc?1 -
To build muscle (except in newbie gains) you need to be in a surplus. Also if you have been anorexic, depending on how long for) you will have very little muscle mass. You also need to be EXTREMELY careful overdoing cardio as anorexia also reduces your heart muscle (again, depending on how long you suffered) and too much cardio (like anything) is not a good thing, you could potentially have a heart attack. Just be careful, nourish your body, and seek professional advice from a doctor that is fully informed of your past eating disorder. Now may be the time to lift weights and eat healthy food in a small - medium surplus - this would increase you muscle mass and bone density (both of which can be severely damaged during anorexia). But of course this is just a suggestion.0
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There is no way you have body fat in the mid to high 20s if you are a size zero, seriously. This is in your head. I agree with the others that weights will help you - but there has to be nutrition as well. This is a matter of distorted thinking.
Do you have a therapist?2 -
Also starvation mode is not a myth - if you do not eat, for a long enough period of time, the hormones that promote fat loss decrease. Also when you finally eat again your body is more likely to store fat due to your metabolism being sooo low. This happened to me. I have a personal history with anorexia and when I resumed a "normal" diet, I gained weight extremely fast. This was due to my metabolism being very damaged and my hormones also damaged. Obviously "starvation mode" in the sense that you can't lose weight if you don't eat is a myth, as all people with restrictive eating disorders have proven, you will lose weight until you die. However, the body's ability and potential to gain fat back after an eating disorder is very real, as well as the metabolic and adrenal damage that goes along with it.1
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beckygammon wrote: »Also starvation mode is not a myth - if you do not eat, for a long enough period of time, the hormones that promote fat loss decrease. Also when you finally eat again your body is more likely to store fat due to your metabolism being sooo low. This happened to me. I have a personal history with anorexia and when I resumed a "normal" diet, I gained weight extremely fast. This was due to my metabolism being very damaged and my hormones also damaged. Obviously "starvation mode" in the sense that you can't lose weight if you don't eat is a myth, as all people with restrictive eating disorders have proven, you will lose weight until you die. However, the body's ability and potential to gain fat back after an eating disorder is very real, as well as the metabolic and adrenal damage that goes along with it.
While I agree that this is a factor, from personal experience I found that with time the hormone balance is restored and the alleged metabolic slowdown is reversed. I think it's a healing process the body goes through and it takes time. In my case the difference was about 150 calories (after losing 70+ pounds.) I wasn't able to eat the amount the calculators suggested right after my weight loss - I had to stay artificially low, but it did change in time. It took about a year I would guess for my body to recover from the weight loss process and "reset." I'm now able to eat even more than the calculators would suggest and I did not go on a muscle-gaining program, merely gave it time and regular moderate exercise AND proper nutrition. Being mindful to provide my body the nutrition it needs helps it perform at maximum efficiency.
I don't think the body turns on a dime. I think any changes we make externally take a while for the body to see it as the norm or as expected behavior or consistent nutrition and the body adapts beautifully. It's really quite a remarkable machine. In my N=1 experience, the "damaged" metabolism ( I don't like that phrase, but whatever ) does repair itself. Slowly, like all body changes.
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I had the same question. My trainer told me it's not just a matter of it being much more difficult and time-consuming to lose fat through exercise alone, it's also about taming and leveling out insulin levels throughout the day. I completed a questionnaire designed to determine my physiological reaction to food, and my diet, surprisingly to me, targets me at 50 percent complex low GCI carbohydrates. I now eat six times a day (three meals and three snacks) and I never feel hungry. And yet I'm at a 1000 calorie per day deficit because of cardio and resistance training. So, according to my trainer it's not just how much I eat but what I eat and how often. I'm just two weeks into it and I can see (and feel) some results. She tells me to be patient, follow the diet (80%), work out faithfully (20%) and I will see amazing changes over the next 12 weeks.0
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cmriverside wrote: »There is no way you have body fat in the mid to high 20s if you are a size zero, seriously. This is in your head. I agree with the others that weights will help you - but there has to be nutrition as well. This is a matter of distorted thinking.
Do you have a therapist?
No I haven't seen a therapist but the main reason I'm guessing that my bf% is somewhat high is because I'm not really lean and have a lot of "softness" I need to get rid of.0 -
Relaxingmind wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »There is no way you have body fat in the mid to high 20s if you are a size zero, seriously. This is in your head. I agree with the others that weights will help you - but there has to be nutrition as well. This is a matter of distorted thinking.
Do you have a therapist?
No I haven't seen a therapist but the main reason I'm guessing that my bf% is somewhat high is because I'm not really lean and have a lot of "softness" I need to get rid of.
Do a search for body recomposition. You eat at maintenance and do progressive heavy lifting...I'm sure your issue is that you lost too much muscle due to your anorexia and you need to rebuild it to lose the "softness".
You could also start a thread in the fitness section, I'm sure there are plenty of people there that will be happy to help you figure it out.0 -
Relaxingmind wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »There is no way you have body fat in the mid to high 20s if you are a size zero, seriously. This is in your head. I agree with the others that weights will help you - but there has to be nutrition as well. This is a matter of distorted thinking.
Do you have a therapist?
No I haven't seen a therapist but the main reason I'm guessing that my bf% is somewhat high is because I'm not really lean and have a lot of "softness" I need to get rid of.
Do a search for body recomposition. You eat at maintenance and do progressive heavy lifting...I'm sure your issue is that you lost too much muscle due to your anorexia and you need to rebuild it to lose the "softness".
You could also start a thread in the fitness section, I'm sure there are plenty of people there that will be happy to help you figure it out.
Alright, thanks!
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It has to do with effect size. For example I ran a 5k this morning in about half an hour. I burned maybe 300 calories. Then I went to the bakery and cancelled it all out in less than 5 minutes. That was intentional so no big deal. But it illustrates how much more efficient you can be at trimming your intake as opposed to increasing your output.
ETA: that might have been confusing. Let's say all things being equal I want to cut 300 calories today. I can do half an hour of exercise or I can eat 300 calories less food which takes zero time.1 -
elisa123gal wrote: »Its a bunch of crap. It comes down to the person. You can lose weight with just diet or with exercise .. or combo of both.
nope it's not...it comes down to what you can sustain.
What if comes into play...
What if you can't exercise for 6 weeks due to injury
what if you decide not to exercise
what if you can't exercise
what if you are in a wheel chair..
what if you don't have time
what if
what if
what if...
you can lose weight with just exercise or just diet or both but more often than not the exercise gets old or isn't done anymore etc and people don't get how to control the weight gain without exercise...
It's individual. For me I live in the mountains and spend my days off hiking. I like workinh out and do Insanity 5-6 days a week. When I was injured and couldnt walk I did seated cardio and hand weights to stay active. For some people adding activity is much easier than tracking food. It always has been for me.
This time around Im older and finding a combination of logging cals and working out best for where Im at but I don't plan on counting calories forever and do plan on remaining as active as possible.
I can sustain finding ways to stay active a lot easier than constantly tracking what I eat. Just offering a different perspective.1 -
Relaxingmind wrote: »
Basically, 2 years ago is when I was anorexic. The good thing is I've been doing exercise again (mainly cardio with a bit of light weights) and trained myself to eat more than I used to. But I'm still "fat" despite being thin. And I was told the only way to get rid of fat is a calorie deficit, which is why I'm doing a lot of exercise (without eating calories back, which is easy with my low appetite). But at the same time, I want to get lean. It's like a catch 22...
Whoever told you this didn't know what they were talking about. A calorie deficit alone, or a calorie deficit with large amounts of cardio will burn fat and muscle and will basically constantly maintain that "skinny fat" look you're trying to get rid of. The only way to get where you want to go from here is to severely cut back on the cardio, lift more and eat at maintenance. (Not to mention it'd probably be a lot healthier for you considering your history.)
Here's a great thread on recomposition to get you started. http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat/p1
Macros don't really matter that much, as long as you're getting a decent amount of protein. Everything else is just down to preference and what you like to eat.1 -
Relaxingmind wrote: »Ok thanks for explaining it, guys I get the idea now. As for the possible injury, I think I'll be ok. If not, lowering my intake shouldn't be a problem as my appetite has lowered dramatically since switching to an active lifestyle and my past history which ill mention shortly. It would probably take a while to switch back if I were to go temporarily sedentary from injury. Today I hit the weights with a mix of cardio and was at only 1,200 calories at 10:00pm despite burning around 2,500 according to fitbit. I just now force fed myself around 500 more. Question... Is starvation mode real or a myth? I'm currently under the impression it's real, which is why I often force feed to reach my previous/sedentary TDEE. If it's not real, I'll just stop the force feeding and stick with a 800-1,000 deficit. There was a time in my life 2 years ago where I was anorexic so I'm wondering if that has something to do with my small appetite. I'm trying to build muscle and get lean because I used to be underweight. I'm but somewhat skinny-fat. I've been told that my muscle is underneath the fat and I have to eat at a small-medium deficit so it will go away and my muscle will be visible. Maybe I've been misinformed. Idk... I'm still kinda new to weight lifting. Used to be a complete cardio junky.
Depends on what you think happens with the name, which has been so loaded with myths most just say it's junk - but the real effects behind the name have been shown for years in studies, and perhaps called a better term now to reflect those realities.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2i_cmltmQ6A
And if skinny fat right now, which means healthy weight - then stop the diet and do what creates muscle - strength training.
Eat at maintenance, do progressive weight lifting, and you build muscle slowly while losing fat.
Called recomposition.
Because 800-1000 cal deficit is no where near a small-medium deficit.
Edit to add - post right above gave the needed link - several others stated the remedy too.1 -
Alright, thank you everyone 0
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