Consistency is underrated.. anti cheat reasoning
bunny_347
Posts: 10 Member
Ok so here i've been trying to loose weight for 2 years, i panic, diet at 1100-1200 calories for a week then binge on 4000 calories a day over the weekend, panic diet e.t.c Anyways i'd always asumed the dieting cancelled out the binging as i was dieting severely 70% of the time. Whoha I was soo wrong. I mapped out my calories at 1700 as a rough plan and calculated my weight loss then i screwed up and binged on 2 days for 4000-5000 calories per day. In order to get back on track with my weight loss timeline (without doing something stupid like not eat for the day e.t.c) I'd need to cut my calories to 1270 rather than the allowed 1700 for 11 whole days. Strictly. I'm going to try and do this (eating lots of fruits, minimising processed food e.t.c before going back to my usual 1700). I need to keep to the timeline as I am soon training for a marathon, im far to far above my race weight and dont want to risk putting to much pressure on my joints but know its really hard to loose during active training (im now a good few months out so have time). So ive a few questions
1) What keeps you consistent
2) How do you stop a binge
3) Does anyone do this whole numbers excel spreadsheets, averages and weight loss thing or am i just a little O.C.D
4) What would be your advice for motivation to keep on track; im open to journaling, book advice, sleep nail painting advice, exercise advice, anything that will help really!!
1) What keeps you consistent
2) How do you stop a binge
3) Does anyone do this whole numbers excel spreadsheets, averages and weight loss thing or am i just a little O.C.D
4) What would be your advice for motivation to keep on track; im open to journaling, book advice, sleep nail painting advice, exercise advice, anything that will help really!!
2
Replies
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1) Eating enough to fuel my body and support my exercise program. That means I don't cut back to extremes.
2) See 1) If I do that, I don't end up starving myself so much that I feel compelled to binge.
3) No, too much work.
4) Make it easy on yourself. Eat foods you enjoy. Just less of them.10 -
The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.3 -
I never cut too hard too fast and have never gone extremely low. I exercise, eating too little and exercising is a recipe for an epic binge.
I ate the things I've always enjoyed, just in moderated portions. I often bank calories so I can eat higher for one meal/day a week. I look at my weekly averages in the nutrition tab on here.2 -
Oh and I also don't stress if I eat up to or a little over maintenance for a day or two. Sometimes I need the psychological break.
And I think of this as what I'll be doing for life so motivation isn't even a factor, it's developing long term habits.8 -
Ok so here i've been trying to loose weight for 2 years, i panic, diet at 1100-1200 calories for a week then binge on 4000 calories a day over the weekend, panic diet e.t.c Anyways i'd always asumed the dieting cancelled out the binging as i was dieting severely 70% of the time. Whoha I was soo wrong. I mapped out my calories at 1700 as a rough plan and calculated my weight loss then i screwed up and binged on 2 days for 4000-5000 calories per day. In order to get back on track with my weight loss timeline (without doing something stupid like not eat for the day e.t.c) I'd need to cut my calories to 1270 rather than the allowed 1700 for 11 whole days. Strictly. I'm going to try and do this (eating lots of fruits, minimising processed food e.t.c before going back to my usual 1700). I need to keep to the timeline as I am soon training for a marathon, im far to far above my race weight and dont want to risk putting to much pressure on my joints but know its really hard to loose during active training (im now a good few months out so have time). So ive a few questions
1) What keeps you consistent
2) How do you stop a binge
3) Does anyone do this whole numbers excel spreadsheets, averages and weight loss thing or am i just a little O.C.D
4) What would be your advice for motivation to keep on track; im open to journaling, book advice, sleep nail painting advice, exercise advice, anything that will help really!!
1) I'm kind of a nutrition geek and fitness junkie...when I cut, I don't go to extremes...I cut very slowly.
2) Can't help you there...this has never really been an issue for me
3) I just track my weight on an app that shows a trend line
4) If you're going to run a marathon in the near future, I'd suggest running as exercise goes.2 -
Thanks for your replies, unfortunately i live with 4 wonderful housemates who no matter how many times i tell them love to bring cakes/chocolate/treats like bread home to share (they really thing they are being generous and dont understand the temptation issue thing even though we've discussed it as none of them are interested in dieting!) I have to admit it is a pain in the •••• to keep seeing easter eggs already when i open my fridge to get out grapes. As to cutting MFP gives me 1330 for my "active" lifestyle (about 14000 steps daily). I do really enjoy healthy food like fruit, often if i binge it is not on things i really like which is a bit odd i know! @cwolfman13 haha lolling at no 4. yes was planning on doing some running haha but im 28 weeks out so no pressure (or long runs) yet! im actually an outdoor swimming fanatic but in the city its a no go.0
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Thanks for your replies, unfortunately i live with 4 wonderful housemates who no matter how many times i tell them love to bring cakes/chocolate/treats like bread home to share (they really thing they are being generous and dont understand the temptation issue thing even though we've discussed it as none of them are interested in dieting!) I have to admit it is a pain in the •••• to keep seeing easter eggs already when i open my fridge to get out grapes. As to cutting MFP gives me 1330 for my "active" lifestyle (about 14000 steps daily). I do really enjoy healthy food like fruit, often if i binge it is not on things i really like which is a bit odd i know! @cwolfman13 haha lolling at no 4. yes was planning on doing some running haha but im 28 weeks out so no pressure (or long runs) yet! im actually an outdoor swimming fanatic but in the city its a no go.
If you're only getting 1330 calories for very active I'm assuming you picked the 2lb per week loss goal? Switch it to one. You can indulge in some Easter Egg and still lose. And you won't binge from over restricting.8 -
annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
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1. Over-restricting leads to binging for me. I cannot cut calories too low.
2. I suggest The Beck Diet Solution along with removing foods that make it easy to binge
3. Nah, I have a Fitbit and MFP and the scale. That's enough data geekery for me.
4. If you're going to be training for a marathon, I wouldn't go for a very drastic calorie deficit. You've seen the results of doing that yourself. Your calories were too low and that's likely what led to the binge behavior in the first place. I know you want your weight lower for your marathon, but worry more about fueling your activity. If you don't, you'll just keep binging. Keep your deficit modest.4 -
Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.4
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prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
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Seriously, though, it's true. You won't binge on perfectly ripe mango, but you will overeat potato chips. Super palatable food is designed to override your cues and encourages you to overeat.endlessfall16 wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
So don't start, and you don't need magic willpower to stop.
4 -
endlessfall16 wrote: »prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
Depends on the person, and, most critically, on how close they are to goal. I'm just approaching the boundary between obese and overweight and considering switching from 1lb a week - which has been fine thus far - to 0.5lb. At some point 1lb will become unsustainable.
The key to stopping binging, for many people, is to stop over-restricting. You cannot really control the binges that much, they are a compulsive behaviour, but you can control the restriction, which is just the other side of the same cycle.
Feed yourself regularly, adequately and well, making sure you are getting the nutrients you need plus some treats to keep you satisfied. If this does not make the binges ease off, you will have to look more deeply into what triggers them.
For me, part of the problem is defining some foods as "forbidden", which just makes them irresistible and a binge magnet.3 -
annacole94 wrote: »
Seriously, though, it's true. You won't binge on perfectly ripe mango, but you will overeat potato chips. Super palatable food is designed to override your cues and encourages you to overeat.endlessfall16 wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
So don't start, and you don't need magic willpower to stop.
I know what you are talking about. It was your wording earlier that was funny if not confusing.
Lots of people don't seem to understand when I said of the concept of "diet foods" and of the fact that we shouldn't always be looking for great tasty food which is a contradiction to our effort. We wouldn't want to struggle with moderation or cut back. "Diet food" is the one that helps you cut back effortlessly. Ie the goldilock food that I alluded to. LOL. But lots of people proudly claim that they make tasty meals everyday (more power to them) and you also get as many people struggling to eat at deficit to lose mere 1 lb.0 -
CattOfTheGarage wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
Depends on the person, and, most critically, on how close they are to goal. I'm just approaching the boundary between obese and overweight and considering switching from 1lb a week - which has been fine thus far - to 0.5lb. At some point 1lb will become unsustainable.
The key to stopping binging, for many people, is to stop over-restricting. You cannot really control the binges that much, they are a compulsive behaviour, but you can control the restriction, which is just the other side of the same cycle.
Feed yourself regularly, adequately and well, making sure you are getting the nutrients you need plus some treats to keep you satisfied. If this does not make the binges ease off, you will have to look more deeply into what triggers them.
For me, part of the problem is defining some foods as "forbidden", which just makes them irresistible and a binge magnet.
It surely depends on the individual.
To me, it has little to do with the size of the loss (1 vs .5lb, etc.) It has much more to do with one's understanding of calorie (energy) management.
I don't feed myself regularly. I handle bingeing fine. It's well within my plan; and as said in my previous post I do categorize foods into different groups. One to be cautious with, don't abuse as you are playing with fire and the other (the diet food) I couldn't care less. It's a fact that, like anything else, foods aren't equal. Most people struggle with moderating chocolate, pizza, alcoholic drink and nobody is known to binge or have become overweight on celery and cucumber.
I don't mean to contradict you, but things have to make sense. I built my approach around these logics and understanding.
Back to the size of loss, which I don't think is the cause of bingeing. It comes down to one's effectiveness of calorie management. Biologically the body cannot tell the difference between .5 and 1lb deficits. If the body can gain 1-2 lbs a week, it can safely shed more or less the same amount. It's just a matter of one's efffectiveness in the approach. This has much to do with observing, understanding the body reactions, and work on conditioning.1 -
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endlessfall16 wrote: »CattOfTheGarage wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
Depends on the person, and, most critically, on how close they are to goal. I'm just approaching the boundary between obese and overweight and considering switching from 1lb a week - which has been fine thus far - to 0.5lb. At some point 1lb will become unsustainable.
The key to stopping binging, for many people, is to stop over-restricting. You cannot really control the binges that much, they are a compulsive behaviour, but you can control the restriction, which is just the other side of the same cycle.
Feed yourself regularly, adequately and well, making sure you are getting the nutrients you need plus some treats to keep you satisfied. If this does not make the binges ease off, you will have to look more deeply into what triggers them.
For me, part of the problem is defining some foods as "forbidden", which just makes them irresistible and a binge magnet.
It surely depends on the individual.
To me, it has little to do with the size of the loss (1 vs .5lb, etc.) It has much more to do with one's understanding of calorie (energy) management.
I don't feed myself regularly. I handle bingeing fine. It's well within my plan; and as said in my previous post I do categorize foods into different groups. One to be cautious with, don't abuse as you are playing with fire and the other (the diet food) I couldn't care less. It's a fact that, like anything else, foods aren't equal. Most people struggle with moderating chocolate, pizza, alcoholic drink and nobody is known to binge or have become overweight on celery and cucumber.
I don't mean to contradict you, but things have to make sense. I built my approach around these logics and understanding.
Back to the size of loss, which I don't think is the cause of bingeing. It comes down to one's effectiveness of calorie management. Biologically the body cannot tell the difference between .5 and 1lb deficits. If the body can gain 1-2 lbs a week, it can safely shed more or less the same amount. It's just a matter of one's efffectiveness in the approach. This has much to do with observing, understanding the body reactions, and work on conditioning.
It does depend on the individual, which is why I started my post with "depends on the person".
I don't agree that the body doesn't know the difference between different sizes of deficits. The bigger the deficit, the less you eat, therefore the hungrier you will be.
Sure, there are other factors in hunger management, as you say, but the basic fact of how much you eat is always going to matter, and is always the first place I look if I find myself binging. "Am I eating enough?" is the first thing to rule out.2 -
endlessfall16 wrote: »CattOfTheGarage wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
Depends on the person, and, most critically, on how close they are to goal. I'm just approaching the boundary between obese and overweight and considering switching from 1lb a week - which has been fine thus far - to 0.5lb. At some point 1lb will become unsustainable.
The key to stopping binging, for many people, is to stop over-restricting. You cannot really control the binges that much, they are a compulsive behaviour, but you can control the restriction, which is just the other side of the same cycle.
Feed yourself regularly, adequately and well, making sure you are getting the nutrients you need plus some treats to keep you satisfied. If this does not make the binges ease off, you will have to look more deeply into what triggers them.
For me, part of the problem is defining some foods as "forbidden", which just makes them irresistible and a binge magnet.
It surely depends on the individual.
To me, it has little to do with the size of the loss (1 vs .5lb, etc.) It has much more to do with one's understanding of calorie (energy) management.
I don't feed myself regularly. I handle bingeing fine. It's well within my plan; and as said in my previous post I do categorize foods into different groups. One to be cautious with, don't abuse as you are playing with fire and the other (the diet food) I couldn't care less. It's a fact that, like anything else, foods aren't equal. Most people struggle with moderating chocolate, pizza, alcoholic drink and nobody is known to binge or have become overweight on celery and cucumber.
I don't mean to contradict you, but things have to make sense. I built my approach around these logics and understanding.
Back to the size of loss, which I don't think is the cause of bingeing. It comes down to one's effectiveness of calorie management. Biologically the body cannot tell the difference between .5 and 1lb deficits. If the body can gain 1-2 lbs a week, it can safely shed more or less the same amount. It's just a matter of one's efffectiveness in the approach. This has much to do with observing, understanding the body reactions, and work on conditioning.
An aggressive deficit can set the hormonal stage for binging. Dieting is hard on a lot of hormones that ultimately affect appetite and hunger signaling. Dieting hard is even harder on those hormones.
This isn't just a dry matter of "effectiveness of calorie management". It's important to remember that dieting is essentially a starvation state. That's not to be negative or hyperbolic, but there's something to be said for controlling the degree to which that state is taken.
Obviously, the proof is in the pudding. If a person is motivated by quick losses and doesn't experience bounce back binge behavior from severe caloric restriction? Carry on.
However, different personality types exist among individuals and I don't think a convincing argument can be made that it's going to be okay across the board for everyone to be just fine to cut calories drastically simply because they can gain weight drastically too.
There are studies that show that binging is most definitely tied to over-restriction. It's not a bad idea to pay heed to them if it seems to be a problem for any given individual.3 -
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annacole94 wrote: »
Seriously, though, it's true. You won't binge on perfectly ripe mango, but you will overeat potato chips. Super palatable food is designed to override your cues and encourages you to overeat.endlessfall16 wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
So don't start, and you don't need magic willpower to stop.
I can binge on shredded wheat.0 -
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CattOfTheGarage wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »
Seriously, though, it's true. You won't binge on perfectly ripe mango, but you will overeat potato chips. Super palatable food is designed to override your cues and encourages you to overeat.endlessfall16 wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
So don't start, and you don't need magic willpower to stop.
I can binge on shredded wheat.
Me too. Also toast and Cheerios.0 -
CattOfTheGarage wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »
Seriously, though, it's true. You won't binge on perfectly ripe mango, but you will overeat potato chips. Super palatable food is designed to override your cues and encourages you to overeat.endlessfall16 wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
So don't start, and you don't need magic willpower to stop.
I can binge on shredded wheat.
I can't eat that even if I'm super hungry.
Regardless, if you have trouble with control of unappealing food, you're probably better off not owning Cheetos.0 -
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annacole94 wrote: »CattOfTheGarage wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »
Seriously, though, it's true. You won't binge on perfectly ripe mango, but you will overeat potato chips. Super palatable food is designed to override your cues and encourages you to overeat.endlessfall16 wrote: »annacole94 wrote: »The MFP app has a weekly summary of net calories. That's all I use, other than my daily diary. It's under nutrition>calories>net calories, and then you switch from daily to weekly.
I avoid eating things I don't want to eat by not bringing them home. It's also easier to stick to the plan if the plan includes food you enjoy, but stays away from foods you know you will over eat. I can't buy a candy bar or a bag of chips without planning to eat it all. So I either don't buy it, or I plan to eat it all.
The Goldilock food? Not unenjoyable, but enjoyable enough, but not too enjoyable? LOL.
So don't start, and you don't need magic willpower to stop.
I can binge on shredded wheat.
I can't eat that even if I'm super hungry.
Regardless, if you have trouble with control of unappealing food, you're probably better off not owning Cheetos.
Unappealing? Shredded wheat and Cheerios are tasty as kitten. But then, I'm a man of simple tastes.3 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »CattOfTheGarage wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
Depends on the person, and, most critically, on how close they are to goal. I'm just approaching the boundary between obese and overweight and considering switching from 1lb a week - which has been fine thus far - to 0.5lb. At some point 1lb will become unsustainable.
The key to stopping binging, for many people, is to stop over-restricting. You cannot really control the binges that much, they are a compulsive behaviour, but you can control the restriction, which is just the other side of the same cycle.
Feed yourself regularly, adequately and well, making sure you are getting the nutrients you need plus some treats to keep you satisfied. If this does not make the binges ease off, you will have to look more deeply into what triggers them.
For me, part of the problem is defining some foods as "forbidden", which just makes them irresistible and a binge magnet.
It surely depends on the individual.
To me, it has little to do with the size of the loss (1 vs .5lb, etc.) It has much more to do with one's understanding of calorie (energy) management.
I don't feed myself regularly. I handle bingeing fine. It's well within my plan; and as said in my previous post I do categorize foods into different groups. One to be cautious with, don't abuse as you are playing with fire and the other (the diet food) I couldn't care less. It's a fact that, like anything else, foods aren't equal. Most people struggle with moderating chocolate, pizza, alcoholic drink and nobody is known to binge or have become overweight on celery and cucumber.
I don't mean to contradict you, but things have to make sense. I built my approach around these logics and understanding.
Back to the size of loss, which I don't think is the cause of bingeing. It comes down to one's effectiveness of calorie management. Biologically the body cannot tell the difference between .5 and 1lb deficits. If the body can gain 1-2 lbs a week, it can safely shed more or less the same amount. It's just a matter of one's efffectiveness in the approach. This has much to do with observing, understanding the body reactions, and work on conditioning.
An aggressive deficit can set the hormonal stage for binging. Dieting is hard on a lot of hormones that ultimately affect appetite and hunger signaling. Dieting hard is even harder on those hormones.
This isn't just a dry matter of "effectiveness of calorie management". It's important to remember that dieting is essentially a starvation state. That's not to be negative or hyperbolic, but there's something to be said for controlling the degree to which that state is taken.
Obviously, the proof is in the pudding. If a person is motivated by quick losses and doesn't experience bounce back binge behavior from severe caloric restriction? Carry on.
However, different personality types exist among individuals and I don't think a convincing argument can be made that it's going to be okay across the board for everyone to be just fine to cut calories drastically simply because they can gain weight drastically too.
There are studies that show that binging is most definitely tied to over-restriction. It's not a bad idea to pay heed to them if it seems to be a problem for any given individual.
(bolded part) That's because many do not understand or fearful when a little feeling of hunger creeps up. I stand by my statement that if the body is capable of gaining a lb or two in a period, it's also perfectly fine to drop more or less the same amount in the same period.
For example, if you visited a buffet and ate 3000, 4000 calorie, you'd be perfectly fine virtually skipping next day's meals and even only eat an average sandwich on the following day (2 days after the buffet meal) But many people here wouldn't be convinced, would be fearful of "starvation" or whatever and always prefer to eat at least 1200 each day.
I'm not advocating aggressive deficit. Not seeing anyone is. The example pattern described above is not aggressive to me.
Effectiveness is to stop eating or cut back when you don't need to eat. Whatever the deficit, 200, 700, provided that you are not feeling dizzy or any ailments. This created deficit should be able to cover the next binge attack.
Binging can be tied to a severe drought of calories but it also can be a conditioning or a lack of discipline. It can happens to the best of us. There's nothing to debate here. The point I want to make is one can manage his/her calories better to cover or lessen the impact of bingeing.0 -
CattOfTheGarage wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »CattOfTheGarage wrote: »endlessfall16 wrote: »prattiger65 wrote: »Its a good question and I see this behavior over and over on MFP. People will cut calories drastically.....binge....cut....binge...cut...you get the point. They seem to do this because they want to lose fast. After 6 months they have lost no weight, are frustrated, say calorie counting doesn't work etc. Now if those same people would have set a very modest goal of .5 pounds per week, they would have lost 15 pounds in those same six months. Op, set a modest goal, eat foods you like with an eye toward less calories dense food options and maybe peek at macros once in a while...maybe. Get a little exercise, it will make you feel better.
So .5 is the magic number? Binge-proof point?
Depends on the person, and, most critically, on how close they are to goal. I'm just approaching the boundary between obese and overweight and considering switching from 1lb a week - which has been fine thus far - to 0.5lb. At some point 1lb will become unsustainable.
The key to stopping binging, for many people, is to stop over-restricting. You cannot really control the binges that much, they are a compulsive behaviour, but you can control the restriction, which is just the other side of the same cycle.
Feed yourself regularly, adequately and well, making sure you are getting the nutrients you need plus some treats to keep you satisfied. If this does not make the binges ease off, you will have to look more deeply into what triggers them.
For me, part of the problem is defining some foods as "forbidden", which just makes them irresistible and a binge magnet.
It surely depends on the individual.
To me, it has little to do with the size of the loss (1 vs .5lb, etc.) It has much more to do with one's understanding of calorie (energy) management.
I don't feed myself regularly. I handle bingeing fine. It's well within my plan; and as said in my previous post I do categorize foods into different groups. One to be cautious with, don't abuse as you are playing with fire and the other (the diet food) I couldn't care less. It's a fact that, like anything else, foods aren't equal. Most people struggle with moderating chocolate, pizza, alcoholic drink and nobody is known to binge or have become overweight on celery and cucumber.
I don't mean to contradict you, but things have to make sense. I built my approach around these logics and understanding.
Back to the size of loss, which I don't think is the cause of bingeing. It comes down to one's effectiveness of calorie management. Biologically the body cannot tell the difference between .5 and 1lb deficits. If the body can gain 1-2 lbs a week, it can safely shed more or less the same amount. It's just a matter of one's efffectiveness in the approach. This has much to do with observing, understanding the body reactions, and work on conditioning.
It does depend on the individual, which is why I started my post with "depends on the person".
I don't agree that the body doesn't know the difference between different sizes of deficits. The bigger the deficit, the less you eat, therefore the hungrier you will be.
Barring a big enough deficit, if the body could tell (between 100, 200 calorie difference?), all the advices about using more protein, about satiety, would be invalid.
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Look_Its_Kriss wrote: »I think the body would know the difference between different deficits from a energy stand point.
If the body needs fat, protein and carbs to run and you are barely fueling it the things it needs its not going to operate effectively.
I would think for it to start to know, the deficit would have to get over 1000 calories or something. I doubt it could tell at 200, 500.
I like analogies but your car analogy is really crappy here.
Gasoline cars require the readily existence of gasoline. The human body is much more efficient than car with the process of storage and whatnot. It's more like a checking account with very good overdrawn protection. The more you overdraw, the negative impact grows significantly more.
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From the OP tone, I'm guessing they stop logging when binging.
IMHO, logging your binging is essential in creating real awareness about what you are doing, which is what leads to changes in the future. Start by setting an achievable goal, then log everything. Don't tighten down the screws until you have a solid rhythm to work with.
I started with a goal of ~2100 and now am down to ~1650. I would have likely quit if I started with my current goal.5 -
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