Welcome to Debate Club! Please be aware that this is a space for respectful debate, and that your ideas will be challenged here. Please remember to critique the argument, not the author.
"Clean" eater critical of Low Carb
Replies
-
leanjogreen18 wrote: »The term "Clean Eating" does not mean healthy and doesn't mean much else to me anymore when everyone uses it regardless of which diet they choose. I really don't have an answer for you because I'm not just going to tell you what you want to hear.
What matters most to me is what type of processed foods I eat that are unhealthy and damaging, rather than healing, my system and proven to promote our leading causes of disease. We all eat processed foods that contain alcohols, chemicals, hormones, antibiotics, gmo's, etc and those should be the exception and not the rule. It doesn't matter if someone thinks their diet is "cleaner and healthier". I let the diets speak for themselves. What kind of ailments does the person have? What diseases? What deficiencies? Is it Sustainable? Is the person always sick and tired? I mean, the questions can go on and on and on and on but no one will divulge the truth about their health problems so arguments over these things are pointless when you don't have all the facts. I do find out from my real friends and family what they are doing and going through from the grapevine and it's normally not good news about the side effects of their diets and ongoing health problems....
Challenges are a great way to motivate others and get in shape so my only advice to you is to not take it personal and use whatever diets you are doing to experiment on yourself, evaluate and track your progress and more importantly, go get a complete blood test before and after to make sure you are getting adequate nutrients and lowering cholesterol and are not promoting diseases. Losing weight does not determine how healthy you are on the inside...
I just challenged my brother to a year long contest because he's trying another diet and I'm 99% certain he is not going to be able to sustain another calorie restrictive diet that includes all the food and alcohol he refuses to give up long term and is always going with that other catch phrase "Everything in Moderation".
"Everything in Moderation" is another prime example of most people just teeter tottering back and forth and never really changing their bad eating habits. It's "mostly" just an "advertisement" for consumers to support the unhealthy food industry. They want nothing more than for all of us to subscribe and convince ourselves and others how it's ok to just moderate our health problems so we can live it up!
Instead of Moderation, I have adopted a different approach to evolve more and more towards healthy eating and stop going back as much every time I move forward! That for me is eating a majority of my diet from plant based whole foods that are actually proven to help fight disease and heal us. We really need to start analyzing our own health and listen to our bodies and rethink our beliefs, traditions and change those habits that are getting us no where. Keep moving in this direction ->->->-> Plant Based
Restrictive dieting led me to overeat on said restrictive foods. When off Atkins I overate potatos, when off no white I overate potatos when off juice fasting I overate on everything.
Moderation has taken the power away from food and back in my control. I eat potatos now maybe once a week if that.
people don't only overeat on "junk" unless you call a potato junk.
Can't really overeat on potatoes if you don't throw cheese, bacon bits, butter and sour cream on them. I do not restrict healthier food and will chow down on as many potatoes as I want until I'm completely stuff for dinner and top them with lots of seasoning and dressings that are low fat plant based. Everyone overeats but it's not the potato that is the culprit here. What is really going on is that people are putting a considerable amount of meat and dairy products on them. If you are Moderating and Restricting the healthiest food on your plate in order to eat more of the unhealthy part, then yes, you have to incorporate portion control and count calories and blame yourself for not having willpower for cheating.
Now keep in mind, I have 40 years of doing what everyone supports, but for me, it was always a short term diet solution and not sustainable. After going plant based, I'd rather eat more of an abundance of healthier food and there are literally thousands of options available so it's odd that people concentrate on saying it's restrictive when it comes to food selection but always ignore the fact that most people have weight and health issues from overeating on higher fat and processed foods and meat and dairy products. Keep in mind, I do have 40 years experience eating meat and dairy and trying every diet out there before switching and I only see going plant based for anyone that wants to is the learning curve, but it's good to know where our food comes from, read labels, learn recipes and change our habits but just like everything we do, it becomes a habit, but a good one and eliminating all the junk causes something miraculous to happen with our brain. We actually stop craving all of the junk and feel what it's like to change and enhance our taste buds.
What people tend to overeat is highly individual. A claim that no one can overeat plain potatoes is no more valid than a claim that everyone must overeat Oreos if they have even one.
Granted, plain foods fall in the category of 'not usually overeaten' more often that more flavorful ones.
Personally, I'm a fan of baked potatoes with salt and nothing else, especially if it's one of my flavored salts. I'd have no problem overeating those.3 -
my muscles are not built on chicken alone! red meat , pork , chicken , dairy, fish..0
-
While I can easily down 300-400g or more of potatoes because I love me some potatoes, I can definitely eat my weight in many other plant based foods, especially quinoa, most fruits and many rices/breads. It's much harder for me to overeat on chicken, turkey, lean steaks and fish.3
-
leanjogreen18 wrote: »The term "Clean Eating" does not mean healthy and doesn't mean much else to me anymore when everyone uses it regardless of which diet they choose. I really don't have an answer for you because I'm not just going to tell you what you want to hear.
What matters most to me is what type of processed foods I eat that are unhealthy and damaging, rather than healing, my system and proven to promote our leading causes of disease. We all eat processed foods that contain alcohols, chemicals, hormones, antibiotics, gmo's, etc and those should be the exception and not the rule. It doesn't matter if someone thinks their diet is "cleaner and healthier". I let the diets speak for themselves. What kind of ailments does the person have? What diseases? What deficiencies? Is it Sustainable? Is the person always sick and tired? I mean, the questions can go on and on and on and on but no one will divulge the truth about their health problems so arguments over these things are pointless when you don't have all the facts. I do find out from my real friends and family what they are doing and going through from the grapevine and it's normally not good news about the side effects of their diets and ongoing health problems....
Challenges are a great way to motivate others and get in shape so my only advice to you is to not take it personal and use whatever diets you are doing to experiment on yourself, evaluate and track your progress and more importantly, go get a complete blood test before and after to make sure you are getting adequate nutrients and lowering cholesterol and are not promoting diseases. Losing weight does not determine how healthy you are on the inside...
I just challenged my brother to a year long contest because he's trying another diet and I'm 99% certain he is not going to be able to sustain another calorie restrictive diet that includes all the food and alcohol he refuses to give up long term and is always going with that other catch phrase "Everything in Moderation".
"Everything in Moderation" is another prime example of most people just teeter tottering back and forth and never really changing their bad eating habits. It's "mostly" just an "advertisement" for consumers to support the unhealthy food industry. They want nothing more than for all of us to subscribe and convince ourselves and others how it's ok to just moderate our health problems so we can live it up!
Instead of Moderation, I have adopted a different approach to evolve more and more towards healthy eating and stop going back as much every time I move forward! That for me is eating a majority of my diet from plant based whole foods that are actually proven to help fight disease and heal us. We really need to start analyzing our own health and listen to our bodies and rethink our beliefs, traditions and change those habits that are getting us no where. Keep moving in this direction ->->->-> Plant Based
Restrictive dieting led me to overeat on said restrictive foods. When off Atkins I overate potatos, when off no white I overate potatos when off juice fasting I overate on everything.
Moderation has taken the power away from food and back in my control. I eat potatos now maybe once a week if that.
people don't only overeat on "junk" unless you call a potato junk.
Can't really overeat on potatoes if you don't throw cheese, bacon bits, butter and sour cream on them. I do not restrict healthier food and will chow down on as many potatoes as I want until I'm completely stuff for dinner and top them with lots of seasoning and dressings that are low fat plant based. Everyone overeats but it's not the potato that is the culprit here. What is really going on is that people are putting a considerable amount of meat and dairy products on them. If you are Moderating and Restricting the healthiest food on your plate in order to eat more of the unhealthy part, then yes, you have to incorporate portion control and count calories and blame yourself for not having willpower for cheating.
Now keep in mind, I have 40 years of doing what everyone supports, but for me, it was always a short term diet solution and not sustainable. After going plant based, I'd rather eat more of an abundance of healthier food and there are literally thousands of options available so it's odd that people concentrate on saying it's restrictive when it comes to food selection but always ignore the fact that most people have weight and health issues from overeating on higher fat and processed foods and meat and dairy products. Keep in mind, I do have 40 years experience eating meat and dairy and trying every diet out there before switching and I only see going plant based for anyone that wants to is the learning curve, but it's good to know where our food comes from, read labels, learn recipes and change our habits but just like everything we do, it becomes a habit, but a good one and eliminating all the junk causes something miraculous to happen with our brain. We actually stop craving all of the junk and feel what it's like to change and enhance our taste buds.
I'm a vegan who can overeat potatoes (even when they're plain). People can gain weight on just about any type of diet and what's true for you may not be true for others.2 -
http://peaceloveandlowcarb.com/top-11-biggest-lies-of-mainstream-nutrition/
Send him this link and type suck it in the subject line.0 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
This. So let me re-iterate, I went vegan for a year. I gained a ton of weight. While I was vegan, I was eating whole foods, no meat or dairy. I wasn't putting any cheese or sour cream on my potatoes, and aside from some very occasional vegan cheese or boca burger and frequent tofu, very little of what I ate was processed other than being dried (grains and beans) or processed in a food processor. Still felt like I couldn't get enough to eat and gained a ton.
I tried vegetarian when I totally failed at being vegan thinking my body just needed more protein (added eggs back in), same result. Plant-based alone is just not for me. And, the assertion that it's not the potato's fault but what a person puts on the potato is an inaccurate broad generalization.3 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.0 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
What I overate most when I was morbidly obese was 100% plant based and overwhelmingly not ultra-processed. Granted it was higher fat, yes, but it was the naturally occurring fat in foods like olives, nuts, hummus...etc, but also things that are calorie dense without being high in fat like 6-7 pieces of fruit in one setting or 3 cups of rice/grain. Not everyone overeats due to hunger. In fact I'm willing to bet that most people who have weight issues overeat because they like eating and hunger has little to do with it. I introduced more animal products when I started dieting for the protein and I do not tend to overeat them. I'm way more likely to overeat walnuts than I am tuna.5 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
Why does it always have to be two wild comparisons? How about comparing a potato vs nuts or avocado? All plant based... only one satiates me, which is the potato. I can eat a crap ton of nuts and avocado. Hell, if I compared chicken vs nuts or an avocado, I could eat significantly less chicken. The difference isn't if it's plant based, the difference is satiety are driven by macros. Proteins and fiber are fairly universal, but fats and carbs are not. Trust me, I know a lot of plant based eaters that are over weight and I am not talking junk food vegans either. I know a lot of people who aren't filled up by whole grain breads, oats, rice or similar foods. So making universal comments because you can't fathom it occurring is a bit short sighted.7 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
But I don't have to eat 10 potatoes in order to overeat them (defining "overeat" as an amount that puts me over my calorie goals to maintain).
Ten potatoes is a somewhat ridiculous amount, but I don't find it at all difficult to eat an amount of whole grains, vegetables, beans, and fruits that puts me outside of my desired calorie goal. That's why I count calories -- because I know from experience that I gain weight while eating plants (yes, even when doing low fat) if I don't monitor my intake.
It's awesome that you have found something that works for you, but you're asserting that it will work for everyone and . . . no. My actual lived experience is otherwise.3 -
janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
But I don't have to eat 10 potatoes in order to overeat them (defining "overeat" as an amount that puts me over my calorie goals to maintain).
Ten potatoes is a somewhat ridiculous amount, but I don't find it at all difficult to eat an amount of whole grains, vegetables, beans, and fruits that puts me outside of my desired calorie goal. That's why I count calories -- because I know from experience that I gain weight while eating plants (yes, even when doing low fat) if I don't monitor my intake.
It's awesome that you have found something that works for you, but you're asserting that it will work for everyone and . . . no. My actual lived experience is otherwise.
And it's even more ironic, the OP shares your same experience when she was a vegan. Probably a lifestyle that made her condition worse.
And interestingly enough, I had a friend that recently had to convert from plant based back to LCHF because she gained crazy amounts of weight (like 50 lbs in less than 2 years) because it was messing with her diabetes and it was difficult as she is also celiac.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
But I don't have to eat 10 potatoes in order to overeat them (defining "overeat" as an amount that puts me over my calorie goals to maintain).
Ten potatoes is a somewhat ridiculous amount, but I don't find it at all difficult to eat an amount of whole grains, vegetables, beans, and fruits that puts me outside of my desired calorie goal. That's why I count calories -- because I know from experience that I gain weight while eating plants (yes, even when doing low fat) if I don't monitor my intake.
It's awesome that you have found something that works for you, but you're asserting that it will work for everyone and . . . no. My actual lived experience is otherwise.
And it's even more ironic, the OP shares your same experience when she was a vegan. Probably a lifestyle that made her condition worse.
And interestingly enough, I had a friend that recently had to convert from plant based back to LCHF because she gained crazy amounts of weight (like 50 lbs in less than 2 years) because it was messing with her diabetes and it was difficult as she is also celiac.
Yeah, I don't know much about being vegan while diabetic. I know some people who manage to make it work, but I would never assume that it could work for everyone just because it works for some people.
There's a big difference between giving advice on veganism to someone who has no underlying medical issues/food intolerances and giving it to people who do. I wish people generally could be more thoughtful about this because insisting that everyone can just go vegan and it will fix all their problems has the potential to seriously hurt someone.6 -
And, is it just me or is a certain someone totally ignoring my comments (especially the ones with relevant past experience) and just using my thread as a soap box?5
-
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
But I don't have to eat 10 potatoes in order to overeat them (defining "overeat" as an amount that puts me over my calorie goals to maintain).
Ten potatoes is a somewhat ridiculous amount, but I don't find it at all difficult to eat an amount of whole grains, vegetables, beans, and fruits that puts me outside of my desired calorie goal. That's why I count calories -- because I know from experience that I gain weight while eating plants (yes, even when doing low fat) if I don't monitor my intake.
It's awesome that you have found something that works for you, but you're asserting that it will work for everyone and . . . no. My actual lived experience is otherwise.
And it's even more ironic, the OP shares your same experience when she was a vegan. Probably a lifestyle that made her condition worse.
And interestingly enough, I had a friend that recently had to convert from plant based back to LCHF because she gained crazy amounts of weight (like 50 lbs in less than 2 years) because it was messing with her diabetes and it was difficult as she is also celiac.
Yeah, I don't know much about being vegan while diabetic. I know some people who manage to make it work, but I would never assume that it could work for everyone just because it works for some people.
There's a big difference between giving advice on veganism to someone who has no underlying medical issues/food intolerances and giving it to people who do. I wish people generally could be more thoughtful about this because insisting that everyone can just go vegan and it will fix all their problems has the potentially to seriously hurt someone.
This is generally my biggest issue with overzealous followers of specific diets. No one universal diet is going to benefit all and many diets can be harmful to those with medical concerns or based on their personality. Plant based would make me binge and I could never follow it. I just can't do restrictive diets (outside of personal restriction). I did paleo long enough to know that.6 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.3 -
-
I
your lunch. Thinking of having that myself for dinner! 0 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
This. So let me re-iterate, I went vegan for a year. I gained a ton of weight. While I was vegan, I was eating whole foods, no meat or dairy. I wasn't putting any cheese or sour cream on my potatoes, and aside from some very occasional vegan cheese or boca burger and frequent tofu, very little of what I ate was processed other than being dried (grains and beans) or processed in a food processor. Still felt like I couldn't get enough to eat and gained a ton.
I tried vegetarian when I totally failed at being vegan thinking my body just needed more protein (added eggs back in), same result. Plant-based alone is just not for me. And, the assertion that it's not the potato's fault but what a person puts on the potato is an inaccurate broad generalization.
Let me get this straight, are you claiming that "most" of your calories came from "low fat" plant based whole foods and you gained a ton of weight? That is very very very unlikely because anyone who follows mostly low fat plant based would have the opposite problem eating enough calories. Those extra calories most likely came from the processed food (vegan or not) with cooking oils and calories from refined sugars and fats.
It really does matter what people put on a potato but people blame the carbs instead. People just can't help loading them up with butter, cheese, sour cream, bacon bits, salt and turn it into a highly processed high fat high calorie vegetable...poor potato
0 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
This. So let me re-iterate, I went vegan for a year. I gained a ton of weight. While I was vegan, I was eating whole foods, no meat or dairy. I wasn't putting any cheese or sour cream on my potatoes, and aside from some very occasional vegan cheese or boca burger and frequent tofu, very little of what I ate was processed other than being dried (grains and beans) or processed in a food processor. Still felt like I couldn't get enough to eat and gained a ton.
I tried vegetarian when I totally failed at being vegan thinking my body just needed more protein (added eggs back in), same result. Plant-based alone is just not for me. And, the assertion that it's not the potato's fault but what a person puts on the potato is an inaccurate broad generalization.
Let me get this straight, are you claiming that "most" of your calories came from "low fat" plant based whole foods and you gained a ton of weight? That is very very very unlikely because anyone who follows mostly low fat plant based would have the opposite problem eating enough calories. Those extra calories most likely came from the processed food (vegan or not) with cooking oils and calories from refined sugars and fats.
It really does matter what people put on a potato but people blame the carbs instead. People just can't help loading them up with butter, cheese, sour cream, bacon bits, salt and turn it into a highly processed high fat high calorie vegetable...poor potato
I think it shows a lot of presumption to assume you better understand what OP was eating than OP. Beans and grains have calories, plant food has calories. Depending on circumstances, it's completely possible for someone to consume more than than need on this type of diet -- especially if they are someone whose satiety is tied more to fat. I'm one of those people -- when I try to do a low fat diet, I feel hungrier and have more cravings, even when I do stick to whole foods.
And if you're saying that it's a problem for someone to get sufficient calories on a low fat plant-based whole foods diet, it seems like it would be a poor choice for anyone seeking to add muscle or anyone who is still growing, two groups of people who need to consume extra calories. Is that your argument? Or is it possible that someone could consume surplus calories even on this type of diet?3 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.
Seriously! You use MFP and think 10 potatos are 3500 calories. No, you wouldn't get sick. You ever hear of the potato diet? There really are people eating mainly potatoes and losing weight and clearing up health problems. Turns out, a potato gives them all the nutrition and protein they need! It would make for a very bland diet but that was never my point. My point is, the potato is not the problem or reason people overeat.
0 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.
Seriously! You use MFP and think 10 potatos are 3500 calories. No, you wouldn't get sick. You ever hear of the potato diet? There really are people eating mainly potatoes and losing weight and clearing up health problems. Turns out, a potato gives them all the nutrition and protein they need! It would make for a very bland diet but that was never my point. My point is, the potato is not the problem or reason people overeat.
You seem to be using the typical weight of a medium Russet potato -- it's possible the person you're responding to was thinking of the larger potatoes you see sold alongside them, probably closer to 8-10 ounces.1 -
And, is it just me or is a certain someone totally ignoring my comments (especially the ones with relevant past experience) and just using my thread as a soap box?
If you are referring to me, no, you didn't stump me. I haven't been back because I have so many other things I do everyday like work, bike to the gym, and meal prep to help others who have diabetes, heart disease and more caused from their meat and dairy based diet.
You have to understand I'm totally outnumbered here but I'm sure there are more like me that just don't speak up because of that. I am just limiting how much time and energy I invest in these forums. These threads can go on forever so don't take me not responding as some sort of victory. I know people think they win a debate that way but I'm here to share my experience, research, and hopefully it will help others who are willing to change because low fat plant based has so many benefits compared to any other diet. That should be our primary source of food and I can say, since I'm the minority now, the majority of people on meat based diets have health problems and I wonder what percentage that is on MFP...0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.
Seriously! You use MFP and think 10 potatos are 3500 calories. No, you wouldn't get sick. You ever hear of the potato diet? There really are people eating mainly potatoes and losing weight and clearing up health problems. Turns out, a potato gives them all the nutrition and protein they need! It would make for a very bland diet but that was never my point. My point is, the potato is not the problem or reason people overeat.
You seem to be using the typical weight of a medium Russet potato -- it's possible the person you're responding to was thinking of the larger potatoes you see sold alongside them, probably closer to 8-10 ounces.
Who eats a potato that is 150g, that is real small? Mine are always 300 to 400 which is what i typical see at restaurants too.2 -
janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.
Seriously! You use MFP and think 10 potatos are 3500 calories. No, you wouldn't get sick. You ever hear of the potato diet? There really are people eating mainly potatoes and losing weight and clearing up health problems. Turns out, a potato gives them all the nutrition and protein they need! It would make for a very bland diet but that was never my point. My point is, the potato is not the problem or reason people overeat.
You seem to be using the typical weight of a medium Russet potato -- it's possible the person you're responding to was thinking of the larger potatoes you see sold alongside them, probably closer to 8-10 ounces.
Of course because I'm comparing it to 1 can of pringles. Doesn't matter if it's 1 watermelon size potato = 10 pringles or 10 medium sized potatos = 1 can of pringles.
It's really not that confusing for most people to understand but if it is...they are probably the ones in eating more pringles...0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.
Seriously! You use MFP and think 10 potatos are 3500 calories. No, you wouldn't get sick. You ever hear of the potato diet? There really are people eating mainly potatoes and losing weight and clearing up health problems. Turns out, a potato gives them all the nutrition and protein they need! It would make for a very bland diet but that was never my point. My point is, the potato is not the problem or reason people overeat.
You seem to be using the typical weight of a medium Russet potato -- it's possible the person you're responding to was thinking of the larger potatoes you see sold alongside them, probably closer to 8-10 ounces.
Who eats a potato that is 150g, that is real small? Mine are always 300 to 400 which is what i typical see at restaurants too.
I think they tend to put the smaller ones in the big bags they sell. When I buy a big bag, I tend to get smaller potatoes. When I buy them individually, they're always much bigger.0 -
And, is it just me or is a certain someone totally ignoring my comments (especially the ones with relevant past experience) and just using my thread as a soap box?
Soapbox? I think he put a gun to its head, delivered a manifesto, shouted out a lot of gibberish, and is flying this baby to Mexico! Hopefully this puts your clean eater in perspective.
Also, anyone can feel free to talk to me about the immense amount of damage that can be done to one's protein and calorie goals with simple hash browns and Frank's hot sauce, or Hanukkah latkes and applesauce...combined with the magic of a hot frying pan and olive oil. DAYUM I can eat me some taters...regrettably they don't count for the 800g a day veg challenge.5 -
And, is it just me or is a certain someone totally ignoring my comments (especially the ones with relevant past experience) and just using my thread as a soap box?
If you are referring to me, no, you didn't stump me. I haven't been back because I have so many other things I do everyday like work, bike to the gym, and meal prep to help others who have diabetes, heart disease and more caused from their meat and dairy based diet.
You have to understand I'm totally outnumbered here but I'm sure there are more like me that just don't speak up because of that. I am just limiting how much time and energy I invest in these forums. These threads can go on forever so don't take me not responding as some sort of victory. I know people think they win a debate that way but I'm here to share my experience, research, and hopefully it will help others who are willing to change because low fat plant based has so many benefits compared to any other diet. That should be our primary source of food and I can say, since I'm the minority now, the majority of people on meat based diets have health problems and I wonder what percentage that is on MFP...
Interestingly, no organization recognizes your assertion.
https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/diabetes/overview/symptoms-causes
http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/diabetes/basics/causes/con-20033091
https://www.diabetesresearch.org/what-is-type-two-diabetes
http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/myths/
And this doesn't even address those with insulin resistanace, which the OP has.3 -
janejellyroll wrote: »LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
I don't think you realize how difficult it would be to eat 10 whole potatoes compared to say 1 can of pringles or even just 2 potatoes that are saturated with oil, cheese, sour cream, butter, bacon bits, and whatever else people add to make it so unhealthy. I don't think everyone is that different or we wouldn't have so many people following the same exact diets at all. The vast majority of people really would find it rather difficult to overeat their caloric requirement on a low fat plant based diet compared to a high fat high protein meat and dairy based diet. The volume of food would just be too daunting.
If you have trouble overeating because you are still hungry, just add more whole foods like veggies or grains or fruit without all the extra fat condiments. Just season them up without added salt and sugar and I'm sure you'll be full. My taste buds have gone back to what I consider our natural state and now I can easily enjoy and detect the true flavor of food we take for granted after eliminating most of the processed foods.
*Blink*
~900 cals in one can of Pringles.
~3000-3500 cals in 10 typically-sized russet potatoes at my grocery.
I can eat the can of Pringles and still have 700 cals left if I'm maintaining.
I'm on track to gain 2-3 lbs per week if I eat the 10 potatoes in a day. Oh, and I'll eventually get mighty sick if I don't add any fats or proteins to those potatoes.
Something tells me this is not any kind of reasonable comparison.
Seriously! You use MFP and think 10 potatos are 3500 calories. No, you wouldn't get sick. You ever hear of the potato diet? There really are people eating mainly potatoes and losing weight and clearing up health problems. Turns out, a potato gives them all the nutrition and protein they need! It would make for a very bland diet but that was never my point. My point is, the potato is not the problem or reason people overeat.
You seem to be using the typical weight of a medium Russet potato -- it's possible the person you're responding to was thinking of the larger potatoes you see sold alongside them, probably closer to 8-10 ounces.
Who eats a potato that is 150g, that is real small? Mine are always 300 to 400 which is what i typical see at restaurants too.
I think this discussion is silly and agree you can get fat on any diet, but I typically eat potatoes even smaller than that. I tend to roast fingerlings or the little brown or purple or red ones. Don't really go for the huge russets.
(I do buy the huge sweet potatoes, but usually only have 100 g or less at a time.)
I am pretty sure I'd lose weight on the all potato diet (which I think is goofy and not really healthy), but that assumes I could stick to it, and I am reasonably certain I could not, so it's moot.0 -
LowCarb4Me2016 wrote: »I can overeat potatoes without thinking about it, regardless of what is on it. Throw the cheese and sour cream on cauliflower and I stay within range. Everyone is different in how their bodies respond to different foods.
This. So let me re-iterate, I went vegan for a year. I gained a ton of weight. While I was vegan, I was eating whole foods, no meat or dairy. I wasn't putting any cheese or sour cream on my potatoes, and aside from some very occasional vegan cheese or boca burger and frequent tofu, very little of what I ate was processed other than being dried (grains and beans) or processed in a food processor. Still felt like I couldn't get enough to eat and gained a ton.
I tried vegetarian when I totally failed at being vegan thinking my body just needed more protein (added eggs back in), same result. Plant-based alone is just not for me. And, the assertion that it's not the potato's fault but what a person puts on the potato is an inaccurate broad generalization.
Let me get this straight, are you claiming that "most" of your calories came from "low fat" plant based whole foods and you gained a ton of weight? That is very very very unlikely because anyone who follows mostly low fat plant based would have the opposite problem eating enough calories. Those extra calories most likely came from the processed food (vegan or not) with cooking oils and calories from refined sugars and fats.
It really does matter what people put on a potato but people blame the carbs instead. People just can't help loading them up with butter, cheese, sour cream, bacon bits, salt and turn it into a highly processed high fat high calorie vegetable...poor potato
Well, thanks for basically calling me a liar. When I said "most", I was referring to the "whole, unprocessed" part of that statement. One can't be "mostly" vegan. It's an all or nothing type of word. Remember I also clarified that I did eat "on occasion" boca burger (plant based), tofu (plant based), and vegan cheese (plant based). Those are all processed foods that I used in moderation with certain recipes. But, I ate 100% vegan. I cook. I love to cook. So, I made awesome vegan stuffed peppers, vegan lasagna, quinoa pilaf, etc., but it was ALL VEGAN. So, I don't appreciate your presumption that I added butter (not vegan), cheese (not vegan), sour cream (not vegan) or bacon (definitely as far from vegan as humanly possible) to my food. In fact, I ate very little potato while on the vegan diet. Instead, I ate a lot of whole grains. And I gained a TON OF WEIGHT. You clearly are going to believe whatever you choose to believe. But, I lived it. And, I could put away a lot of grub if I wanted to at each sitting. Now, research INSULIN RESISTANCE, and once you understand what happens to someone with IR with the blood sugar spikes and crashes, you might begin to understand how someone who can put away a lot of food paired with IR can result in gaining tons of weight, even on a plant based diet.
I still don't eat PORK and various unclean (Biblically speaking) foods, for religious reasons. But, rawroy, you probably think I'm lying about that too. Whatever.
Now, you have a wonderful life, sir.7 -
And, is it just me or is a certain someone totally ignoring my comments (especially the ones with relevant past experience) and just using my thread as a soap box?
If you are referring to me, no, you didn't stump me. I haven't been back because I have so many other things I do everyday like work, bike to the gym, and meal prep to help others who have diabetes, heart disease and more caused from their meat and dairy based diet.
You have to understand I'm totally outnumbered here but I'm sure there are more like me that just don't speak up because of that. I am just limiting how much time and energy I invest in these forums. These threads can go on forever so don't take me not responding as some sort of victory. I know people think they win a debate that way but I'm here to share my experience, research, and hopefully it will help others who are willing to change because low fat plant based has so many benefits compared to any other diet. That should be our primary source of food and I can say, since I'm the minority now, the majority of people on meat based diets have health problems and I wonder what percentage that is on MFP...
I only just noticed this was directed at me. So, again, you make a lot of assumptions based on what? Never said I stumped you. Never implied victory in this debate. I also never said my diet is meat and dairy based. You, sir, are just like "clean eater", the original subject of this debate, in that you have made assumptions about what my low carb diet consists of. Did you actually read the original post where I list what I ate that day? There is no winning a debate with someone who simply discounts your personal anecdotal evidence as lies and is quite self convinced that everyone but he must load up a potato with meat, cheese, and butter at every meal because, according to you, "they just can't help themselves". At any rate, your input in this debate is irrelevant as the debate compared my way of eating to that of "clean eater" who also happens to eat meat. So even he can't meet your perfect standards.5
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 393.4K Introduce Yourself
- 43.8K Getting Started
- 260.2K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.9K Food and Nutrition
- 47.4K Recipes
- 232.5K Fitness and Exercise
- 427 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153K Motivation and Support
- 8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.7K MyFitnessPal Information
- 24 News and Announcements
- 1.1K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.6K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions