Ketogenic diets: Yay or Nay?
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warmxintentions wrote: »I have seen a few a people lose weight on ketogenic diets such as atkins...has anyone had success with this, and if you did, any tips?
they lose weight because they are in a caloric deficit. you still have to have a deficit even eating keto.if not its like any other way of eating,eat too much you gain,eat the same as you burn you maintain.5 -
So glad I found this thread. I have been on Keto for 3 years and only lost 35 pounds. I say 'only' because some of the people that I have connected with have lost upwards of 100 pounds in a relatively short period of time. I'm 58 years old and started with insulin resistance. Last week I had just about had it. I was not enjoying the diet anymore, got sick of eating bacon and eggs every day for breakfast but most of all, I got sick of worrying about every little carb that was in anything I wanted to eat - that plus figuring out what has more protein that I need, what has not enough fiber and what has too much fat. It just got stressful. As one of the other posters above noted, there are definitely good things about the diet but there are bad things too. Some of my relatives have used MFP for calorie counting and exercise and lost weight - lots of weight. CICO is the way to go for me. I am incorporating some of keto into this diet and that is to not restrict fat yet staying within 1500 calories a day. If I like something that has fat in it, I will eat it but not junk food. Junk food is out! Just good wholesome foods like real butter and cream. These things are very satiating for me, after all, I have over 120 pounds to lose... So, wish me luck, I'm about to embark on a new journey and once again so glad I found this thread!!
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willnorton wrote: »all that fat is not good for you.... I have been on low carb/ketogenic diets for many years because its an easy diet and you can eat some fatty yummy foods..... but i ended up with medical problems from it.... type 2 got worse.... I have been on plantbased diet for several months now and am healthier than i ever have been... blood sugar normal, blood pressure normal... off 2 different bp meds.... lost about 30 pounds...... sleep better.... your body might be able to handle all that fat.. and a real keto diet is about 80% fat.... feel free to holler at me anytime you want...... think real hard about it....
keto works for many people,you cant say all that fat is not good. there is no proof that its not. I dont do keto due to health issues so I have to eat low fat, a real keto diet is not about 80% fat, some eat lower fat percentages and still are able to be in ketosis. also losing weight will help with blood sugar and blood pressure issues in some people as well,some it may not. I say if someone wants to try it and can do it,then more power to them. its just another way of eating for some it will be sustainable for others it wont.5 -
common sense question??? will you be healthier eating cheese mayo bacon fatty burgers..eggs.. cream... meat meat and more meat... ad butter butter and coconut oil.. olive oil.... and motor oil......or... lots of fruits, vegetables... more fruits.. beans... seeds... nuts (little)...... common sense would tell you the whole foods consisting of fruits and veggies and beans will be so much better for you... and your heart... i have done every diet known to man... and the plantbased by far is the most healthiest.... there is no doubt you can lose weight on teh keto but it is just not healthy for you over a long period of time........ just sayin....
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The whole "fat is bad" mantra that dietitians espoused for many years was based on a couple bad studies and has been repeatedly proven to be wrong, in literal hundreds of studies since. Hell they were even wrong about dietary cholesterol, it really doesn't have hardly any impact on your blood cholesterol, humorously enough, turns out... carbs do, lol.
I will say if you're diabetic, ketogenic diets are especially nice. a1c of 9.5 and fasting blood sugar of over 200 and now i'm in the "non-diabetic" range now *all* the time and off all my diabetic meds. If you're diabetic you should read Dr Bernsteins Diabetes Solution: https://www.amazon.com/Dr-Bernsteins-Diabetes-Solution-Achieving/dp/0316182699
The best diet is the one you can stick with. For some people that's keto, for others its cico, for others south beach, or atkins, or whatever... its all about finding what you can make into a life change vs a diet. If its not a life change, you won't stick with it and you will regain the weight and associated health conditions.
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CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »willnorton wrote: »all that fat is not good for you.... I have been on low carb/ketogenic diets for many years because its an easy diet and you can eat some fatty yummy foods..... but i ended up with medical problems from it.... type 2 got worse.... I have been on plantbased diet for several months now and am healthier than i ever have been... blood sugar normal, blood pressure normal... off 2 different bp meds.... lost about 30 pounds...... sleep better.... your body might be able to handle all that fat.. and a real keto diet is about 80% fat.... feel free to holler at me anytime you want...... think real hard about it....
keto works for many people,you cant say all that fat is not good. there is no proof that its not. I dont do keto due to health issues so I have to eat low fat, a real keto diet is not about 80% fat, some eat lower fat percentages and still are able to be in ketosis. also losing weight will help with blood sugar and blood pressure issues in some people as well,some it may not. I say if someone wants to try it and can do it,then more power to them. its just another way of eating for some it will be sustainable for others it wont.
charlie, I guess we have read different articles about keto.... may i suggest you watching some videos by Dr. Michael Greger or goto his web site www.nutritionalfacts.org ( i think thats the address)... i have watched hundreds of hours of both sides of the fense... our bodies are all different and different things work for different people.... my personal opinion is that all the fat is not good for us and that doctor and that site will give you specific studies and factualy information that is science backed.. not just someones opinion..... life goes on..0 -
The whole "fat is bad" mantra that dietitians espoused for many years was based on a couple bad studies and has been repeatedly proven to be wrong, in literal hundreds of studies since. Hell they were even wrong about dietary cholesterol, it really doesn't have hardly any impact on your blood cholesterol, humorously enough, turns out... carbs do, lol.
I will say if you're diabetic, ketogenic diets are especially nice. a1c of 9.5 and fasting blood sugar of over 200 and now i'm in the "non-diabetic" range now *all* the time.
The best diet is the one you can stick with. For some people that's keto, for others its cico, for others south beach, or atkins, or whatever... its all about finding what you can make into a life change vs a diet. If its not a life change, you won't stick with it and you will regain the weight and associated health conditions.
I would love to have that conversation with you sometime... would be interested how you got that A1c down.... im still having trouble with that.... hope we can talk some....
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willnorton wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »willnorton wrote: »all that fat is not good for you.... I have been on low carb/ketogenic diets for many years because its an easy diet and you can eat some fatty yummy foods..... but i ended up with medical problems from it.... type 2 got worse.... I have been on plantbased diet for several months now and am healthier than i ever have been... blood sugar normal, blood pressure normal... off 2 different bp meds.... lost about 30 pounds...... sleep better.... your body might be able to handle all that fat.. and a real keto diet is about 80% fat.... feel free to holler at me anytime you want...... think real hard about it....
keto works for many people,you cant say all that fat is not good. there is no proof that its not. I dont do keto due to health issues so I have to eat low fat, a real keto diet is not about 80% fat, some eat lower fat percentages and still are able to be in ketosis. also losing weight will help with blood sugar and blood pressure issues in some people as well,some it may not. I say if someone wants to try it and can do it,then more power to them. its just another way of eating for some it will be sustainable for others it wont.
charlie, I guess we have read different articles about keto.... may i suggest you watching some videos by Dr. Michael Greger or goto his web site www.nutritionalfacts.org ( i think thats the address)... i have watched hundreds of hours of both sides of the fense... our bodies are all different and different things work for different people.... my personal opinion is that all the fat is not good for us and that doctor and that site will give you specific studies and factualy information that is science backed.. not just someones opinion..... life goes on..
while everyone IS different and our bodies are different,studies have proven that high fat and cholesterol dont have an impact like once thought on people who dont have certain health issue . for people like me who have familial hypercholesterolemia,we cannot process fats and cholesterol so high fats/cholesterol in foods for us,does have an impact on our health.
keto has been around for a long time. and for many people it has improved their health markers, keto was originally for people who have seizure disorders and they found that it helps most people with diabetes,insulin resistance,pcos and other health issue. so what if he is a dr? drs go through very little training when it comes to diet and nutrition. he was featured on dr oz so to me that cuts his credibility right there.
Im not going by opinion either, I am going by scientific studies proving that high fat for a lot of people causes no issues. even healthy people who are vegan/vegetarian can have health issues including heart attack,stroke,etc.
while plant based worked the best for you. doesnt mean that it will for others,or that you wont have health issues crop up someday,you may or may not. there are also no proven studies that I know of that plant based diets are superior to any other type of diet.6 -
CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »willnorton wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »willnorton wrote: »all that fat is not good for you.... I have been on low carb/ketogenic diets for many years because its an easy diet and you can eat some fatty yummy foods..... but i ended up with medical problems from it.... type 2 got worse.... I have been on plantbased diet for several months now and am healthier than i ever have been... blood sugar normal, blood pressure normal... off 2 different bp meds.... lost about 30 pounds...... sleep better.... your body might be able to handle all that fat.. and a real keto diet is about 80% fat.... feel free to holler at me anytime you want...... think real hard about it....
keto works for many people,you cant say all that fat is not good. there is no proof that its not. I dont do keto due to health issues so I have to eat low fat, a real keto diet is not about 80% fat, some eat lower fat percentages and still are able to be in ketosis. also losing weight will help with blood sugar and blood pressure issues in some people as well,some it may not. I say if someone wants to try it and can do it,then more power to them. its just another way of eating for some it will be sustainable for others it wont.
charlie, I guess we have read different articles about keto.... may i suggest you watching some videos by Dr. Michael Greger or goto his web site www.nutritionalfacts.org ( i think thats the address)... i have watched hundreds of hours of both sides of the fense... our bodies are all different and different things work for different people.... my personal opinion is that all the fat is not good for us and that doctor and that site will give you specific studies and factualy information that is science backed.. not just someones opinion..... life goes on..
while everyone IS different and our bodies are different,studies have proven that high fat and cholesterol dont have an impact like once thought on people who dont have certain health issue . for people like me who have familial hypercholesterolemia,we cannot process fats and cholesterol so high fats/cholesterol in foods for us,does have an impact on our health.
keto has been around for a long time. and for many people it has improved their health markers, keto was originally for people who have seizure disorders and they found that it helps most people with diabetes,insulin resistance,pcos and other health issue. so what if he is a dr? drs go through very little training when it comes to diet and nutrition. he was featured on dr oz so to me that cuts his credibility right there.
Im not going by opinion either, I am going by scientific studies proving that high fat for a lot of people causes no issues. even healthy people who are vegan/vegetarian can have health issues including heart attack,stroke,etc.
while plant based worked the best for you. doesnt mean that it will for others,or that you wont have health issues crop up someday,you may or may not. there are also no proven studies that I know of that plant based diets are superior to any other type of diet.
im telling you that the study based science based information is on that site.... I have done both diets... and i know what works for me... that is what i always try to get across to people I always say it several times in my words.. i think.... its all in what works for you.... i agree there.... heck I might have that crap you got... all that fat just about killed me...... and im old... (64) and our bodies change over the years..i did the keto, well back then it was called Atkins..... it worked wonders for me... but now my old body just cant handle the fat.... so i eat all that beautiful, colorful food and feel great and my doctor is amazed i have got off all the meds I have stopped taking....life is a great ride!0 -
I've been in ketosis since March and have lost 24lbs so far. It's high fat at the start to help with satiation but now that i'm fat adapted I don't need to maintain the high fat levels because I don't feel hungry that often. I eat when I'm hungry and stop when I'm full. I used to be a carb junkie and at the beginning I craved carbs but that quickly disappeared and now I love this way of eating. I'm a definite 'yay'!5
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vikinglander wrote: »First, Atkins is not a ketogenic diet. Just sayin'...
Atkins induction is going to put you in ketosis.Do some research before jumping in. Take a look at Whole30.com. It's technically not keto, but it's close.
It allows unlimited sweet potatoes, fruit, any amount of vegetables including carrots, parsnips, winter veg, and onions and the rest of their family (which can be surprisingly high sugar). Also nuts. I think the new version even permits potatoes although the old one did not. I'd never be in ketosis on W30. (I'm trying to get into ketosis eating unlimited non starchy veg, plus some nuts and dairy most days, and I'm still higher than usually recommended for that (or than Atkins induction) -- add in fruit and tubers, and I wouldn't be even close to low enough carb.)3 -
willnorton wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »willnorton wrote: »CharlieBeansmomTracey wrote: »willnorton wrote: »all that fat is not good for you.... I have been on low carb/ketogenic diets for many years because its an easy diet and you can eat some fatty yummy foods..... but i ended up with medical problems from it.... type 2 got worse.... I have been on plantbased diet for several months now and am healthier than i ever have been... blood sugar normal, blood pressure normal... off 2 different bp meds.... lost about 30 pounds...... sleep better.... your body might be able to handle all that fat.. and a real keto diet is about 80% fat.... feel free to holler at me anytime you want...... think real hard about it....
keto works for many people,you cant say all that fat is not good. there is no proof that its not. I dont do keto due to health issues so I have to eat low fat, a real keto diet is not about 80% fat, some eat lower fat percentages and still are able to be in ketosis. also losing weight will help with blood sugar and blood pressure issues in some people as well,some it may not. I say if someone wants to try it and can do it,then more power to them. its just another way of eating for some it will be sustainable for others it wont.
charlie, I guess we have read different articles about keto.... may i suggest you watching some videos by Dr. Michael Greger or goto his web site www.nutritionalfacts.org ( i think thats the address)... i have watched hundreds of hours of both sides of the fense... our bodies are all different and different things work for different people.... my personal opinion is that all the fat is not good for us and that doctor and that site will give you specific studies and factualy information that is science backed.. not just someones opinion..... life goes on..
while everyone IS different and our bodies are different,studies have proven that high fat and cholesterol dont have an impact like once thought on people who dont have certain health issue . for people like me who have familial hypercholesterolemia,we cannot process fats and cholesterol so high fats/cholesterol in foods for us,does have an impact on our health.
keto has been around for a long time. and for many people it has improved their health markers, keto was originally for people who have seizure disorders and they found that it helps most people with diabetes,insulin resistance,pcos and other health issue. so what if he is a dr? drs go through very little training when it comes to diet and nutrition. he was featured on dr oz so to me that cuts his credibility right there.
Im not going by opinion either, I am going by scientific studies proving that high fat for a lot of people causes no issues. even healthy people who are vegan/vegetarian can have health issues including heart attack,stroke,etc.
while plant based worked the best for you. doesnt mean that it will for others,or that you wont have health issues crop up someday,you may or may not. there are also no proven studies that I know of that plant based diets are superior to any other type of diet.
im telling you that the study based science based information is on that site.... I have done both diets... and i know what works for me... that is what i always try to get across to people I always say it several times in my words.. i think.... its all in what works for you.... i agree there.... heck I might have that crap you got... all that fat just about killed me...... and im old... (64) and our bodies change over the years..i did the keto, well back then it was called Atkins..... it worked wonders for me... but now my old body just cant handle the fat.... so i eat all that beautiful, colorful food and feel great and my doctor is amazed i have got off all the meds I have stopped taking....life is a great ride!
if you have cholesterol issues that are genetic or liver issues then its possible the high fat is what made your health worse. but hey if plant based worked/works for you then that is all that matters.4 -
I had to break my carb addiction before I could do Keto. That's no easy thing for an addict in denial .0
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lemurcat12 wrote: »vikinglander wrote: »First, Atkins is not a ketogenic diet. Just sayin'...
Atkins induction is going to put you in ketosis.Do some research before jumping in. Take a look at Whole30.com. It's technically not keto, but it's close.
It allows unlimited sweet potatoes, fruit, any amount of vegetables including carrots, parsnips, winter veg, and onions and the rest of their family (which can be surprisingly high sugar). Also nuts. I think the new version even permits potatoes although the old one did not. I'd never be in ketosis on W30. (I'm trying to get into ketosis eating unlimited non starchy veg, plus some nuts and dairy most days, and I'm still higher than usually recommended for that (or than Atkins induction) -- add in fruit and tubers, and I wouldn't be even close to low enough carb.)
you are bad wrong if you are talking about ATKINS... never has fruit been on it..... do a little research... cmon man0 -
A high fat diet is not bad for you, unless most of those fats are saturated. If the majority of your fat comes from animal products you still run the risk of high colerstrol and heart disease. Incorporate plenty of monosaturated and polysaturated fats into your diet and these health issues are no longer a concern.1
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For me, i am on month 3 of this. i was doing keto/low carb (whichever one i could do in a day). month 2 weight stalled. since last week i upped my carbs to 100 total, and added fruits, and doc told me its basically i will lose weight counting calories and keeping carbs 100 or less to reverse pre-diabetes. i lost more weight this week doing that than the 20 carbs a day keto! but it was good to get rid of my carb addiction, to do the severe keto 20 carbs a day. i have my appetite under control and cravings under control.1
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I've answered similar threads before but I'll chime in...I loved that on keto I didn't have much of an appetite, but I went into a serious depression each time I tried it. I was told to "tough it out" by the groups I was in but at least twice in recent history that I recall trying it (I think two years ago?) I literally was thinking, well, fatal thoughts, if you will. Just no. Couldn't tough that out.
I switched to moderate carb, calorie restriction and that's worked well for me...60 lbs. so far.
I just think it's worth watching out for - I have heard of others having the drastic reaction I had (the depression). This reaction must surely be a minority, but it can happen, so...there you go.
As I said, I did love the appetite suppression. And I liked that I dropped a ton of water weight and just looked leaner from top to toe because of that.1 -
willnorton wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »vikinglander wrote: »First, Atkins is not a ketogenic diet. Just sayin'...
Atkins induction is going to put you in ketosis.Do some research before jumping in. Take a look at Whole30.com. It's technically not keto, but it's close.
It allows unlimited sweet potatoes, fruit, any amount of vegetables including carrots, parsnips, winter veg, and onions and the rest of their family (which can be surprisingly high sugar). Also nuts. I think the new version even permits potatoes although the old one did not. I'd never be in ketosis on W30. (I'm trying to get into ketosis eating unlimited non starchy veg, plus some nuts and dairy most days, and I'm still higher than usually recommended for that (or than Atkins induction) -- add in fruit and tubers, and I wouldn't be even close to low enough carb.)
you are bad wrong if you are talking about ATKINS... never has fruit been on it..... do a little research... cmon man
Ummm... pretty certain you need to do a little research before you call someone else bad wrong. Or am I hallucinating this list of phase 3 acceptable fruits on the Atkins website? I mean, it could be my imagination.
https://atkins.com/how-it-works/atkins-20/phase-3/acceptable-foods-atkins-20-phase-33 -
willnorton wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »vikinglander wrote: »First, Atkins is not a ketogenic diet. Just sayin'...
Atkins induction is going to put you in ketosis.Do some research before jumping in. Take a look at Whole30.com. It's technically not keto, but it's close.
It allows unlimited sweet potatoes, fruit, any amount of vegetables including carrots, parsnips, winter veg, and onions and the rest of their family (which can be surprisingly high sugar). Also nuts. I think the new version even permits potatoes although the old one did not. I'd never be in ketosis on W30. (I'm trying to get into ketosis eating unlimited non starchy veg, plus some nuts and dairy most days, and I'm still higher than usually recommended for that (or than Atkins induction) -- add in fruit and tubers, and I wouldn't be even close to low enough carb.)
you are bad wrong if you are talking about ATKINS... never has fruit been on it..... do a little research... cmon man
Atkins has ALWAYS had fruit included at a certain point if one can "tolerate" it or what-have-you. It's one of those "tiers" (I think they're called?) - when you add in one type of food + 5 grams of carbs per week to see if your appetite comes back and/or if your weight stops going down. At that point you're supposed to take away that food group and/or go back down by 5 grams and that's supposed to be where you stay for the time being in order to continue to lose weight. (Or rather, this was the way it went for years, actually I think for decades; it may be slightly different now, with "phases" or whatever.)
I remember fruits - I think he said to start with berries - in the 1970s version of the book that my mom read in the early 80s. Fruit's always been in the "plan."
I'm not defending Atkins, I don't do this or another carb-controlled and/or keto plan, but...YOU need to be educated before correcting the next person. 1 -
willnorton wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »vikinglander wrote: »First, Atkins is not a ketogenic diet. Just sayin'...
Atkins induction is going to put you in ketosis.Do some research before jumping in. Take a look at Whole30.com. It's technically not keto, but it's close.
It allows unlimited sweet potatoes, fruit, any amount of vegetables including carrots, parsnips, winter veg, and onions and the rest of their family (which can be surprisingly high sugar). Also nuts. I think the new version even permits potatoes although the old one did not. I'd never be in ketosis on W30. (I'm trying to get into ketosis eating unlimited non starchy veg, plus some nuts and dairy most days, and I'm still higher than usually recommended for that (or than Atkins induction) -- add in fruit and tubers, and I wouldn't be even close to low enough carb.)
you are bad wrong if you are talking about ATKINS... never has fruit been on it..... do a little research... cmon man
Atkins has ALWAYS had fruit included at a certain point if one can "tolerate" it or what-have-you. It's one of those "tiers" (I think they're called?) - when you add in one type of food + 5 grams of carbs per week to see if your appetite comes back and/or if your weight stops going down. At that point you're supposed to take away that food group and/or go back down by 5 grams and that's supposed to be where you stay for the time being in order to continue to lose weight. (Or rather, this was the way it went for years, actually I think for decades; it may be slightly different now, with "phases" or whatever.)
I remember fruits - I think he said to start with berries - in the 1970s version of the book that my mom read in the early 80s. Fruit's always been in the "plan."
I'm not defending Atkins, I don't do this or another carb-controlled and/or keto plan, but...YOU need to be educated before correcting the next person.
fruit has not always been on the induction phase... i never got out of the induction phase... it wasnt called that back in the 70's
i think all yall are wrong. and can have my own opinion.. this is AMERICA
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