Advice- Sleep issues
Aint2Proud2Meg
Posts: 193 Member
Hi all, and thanks in advance. I'll try to be thorough but brief.
I used to sleep like crap. I had terrible sleep habits and I felt awful all the time. Most of the tasks I got done were motivated by absolute necessity. Anytime you saw me, I could have gone to bed for 8 hours and when I got up, I could have done it again.
My one bad habit I haven't kicked is falling asleep with my phone or tablet. I NEED the mindless droning of a show I've seen 100 times or a book I've worn out to doze off. I use a blue light filter and keep it dim, and I am not looking at the screen, just listening.
I decided to get my *kitten* together a few months ago and I've done great. Sleep improved and 6ish hours was enough to power me through Insanity 6 days a week with the rest of my days being active as well. I've lost 20 lbs and I am not stopping for any reason.
Now, for about 2 weeks, poor sleep again. I'm falling asleep faster but waking up after about 2 hours. I'm totally awake at this point and only falling back asleep an hour or 2 before I NEED to get up.
In all honesty, I'm functioning better on the 4 crappy hours now than I used to on 8 or more, I'm still working out and getting through my day. I'm just feeling kinda sleepy all day and it's giving me the munchies something fierce, which I was managing really well until now. Any questions, advice, whatever is welcome. I keep my diary open. There is coffee on there but that's very early in the day, sometimes I'll have another at like 2pm at the latest.
ETA: TMI fair warning! My TOM is late. I was supposed to "fall to the Communists" a few days ago. Unless something immaculate has happened, I'm not pregnant.
I used to sleep like crap. I had terrible sleep habits and I felt awful all the time. Most of the tasks I got done were motivated by absolute necessity. Anytime you saw me, I could have gone to bed for 8 hours and when I got up, I could have done it again.
My one bad habit I haven't kicked is falling asleep with my phone or tablet. I NEED the mindless droning of a show I've seen 100 times or a book I've worn out to doze off. I use a blue light filter and keep it dim, and I am not looking at the screen, just listening.
I decided to get my *kitten* together a few months ago and I've done great. Sleep improved and 6ish hours was enough to power me through Insanity 6 days a week with the rest of my days being active as well. I've lost 20 lbs and I am not stopping for any reason.
Now, for about 2 weeks, poor sleep again. I'm falling asleep faster but waking up after about 2 hours. I'm totally awake at this point and only falling back asleep an hour or 2 before I NEED to get up.
In all honesty, I'm functioning better on the 4 crappy hours now than I used to on 8 or more, I'm still working out and getting through my day. I'm just feeling kinda sleepy all day and it's giving me the munchies something fierce, which I was managing really well until now. Any questions, advice, whatever is welcome. I keep my diary open. There is coffee on there but that's very early in the day, sometimes I'll have another at like 2pm at the latest.
ETA: TMI fair warning! My TOM is late. I was supposed to "fall to the Communists" a few days ago. Unless something immaculate has happened, I'm not pregnant.
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Replies
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Looking at your diary, I notice you seem to have only started logging some supplements at the end of October/ November, are they new to your diet? The Cellucor has a fair bit of caffeine in and other things in that may be affecting your sleep pattern.2
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tinkerbellang83 wrote: »Looking at your diary, I notice you seem to have only started logging some supplements at the end of October/ November, are they new to your diet? The Cellucor has a fair bit of caffeine in and other things in that may be affecting your sleep pattern.
I was wondering about that too but I do my workout at like 7 am. I'm on my 7th week of insanity (when I started using the c4) and the sleep issues are more recent. Also, when I started using pre-workout I cut way back on the black coffee I drank throughout the day (I didn't used to log black coffee, I would only log anything I added to it)
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I had a similar issue with sleeping pattern being out of whack for months, I started doing yoga before bed and taking Magnesium supplements which helped me, others have also recommended Melatonin which depending on where you are in the world might be helpful if you're somewhere that it's darker in the evenings now and you're not getting as much daylight.
- Are you eating enough to fuel your insanity workouts? You could just be hungrier than normal.
- Have you changed your macro intake or meal timings? this might affect your digestive system and cause sleep issues.
- Are you stressed more than usual?
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Wow thank you for being so thorough. I really appreciate it!
I might need to make sure I'm taking a multivitamin daily. I think by nature of reducing calories I'm probably missing nutrients I was getting before (I'm one of those who got fat on too much healthy food. It does happen!)
I tried melatonin in the past and poo-pooed it because it didn't basically knock me out (which I know isn't how it works) and I should probably try it again. Since I've improved my other habits, it might make a more noticeable difference this time. It being dark here at like 4pm is probably affecting me too.
I'm using the mfp recommended macros, but my macros have so far been a distant priority to me compared to hitting my calorie goal. I do pay attention to protein.
Throughout my day I actually feel less stressed and more optimistic overall, though I've taken more on since I've decided to get busy livin'. When I woke up last night though, I felt overwhelmed; it was sudden and unpleasant. Basically a feeling of dread. I went to my desk and did a brainstorm to do list and I felt better knowing it was on paper for today. Sorry I keep writing essays
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Definitely a good idea to take a multi-vit if you don't think you're getting enough through your food, B vitamins are also very important for energy levels and sleep.
Your protein intake looks a little on the low side if you're losing weight and working out you want to be looking at about 0.8-1g per pound of bodyweight.1 -
Are your cals too low?
That can wake you up after a couple if hours.
I tried a VLCD a while ago & i always woke up after a couple if hours. Made me crazy.
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@tinkerbellang83 Ahhh I bet you're right about that too. It's one of those things I know for *other* people but forget to look at for myself. I really do want to keep as much muscle as I can too, so yeah I'll make that a bigger priority. It doesn't help that being sleepy=not as clear headed. I used to take a B12 but stopped when I started the c4 because it's like 400% daily value...0
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purplebobkat wrote: »Are your cals too low?
That can wake you up after a couple if hours.
I tried a VLCD a while ago & i always woke up after a couple if hours. Made me crazy.
I'm not certain, because I always hit my 1200 at least, more if I'm really hungry...
I do feel satiated when I go to bed. I decided with this weight loss journey that going to bed on an empty stomach is not happening. Every time I "failed" in the past and gave up it was because I was so hungry at night I couldn't sleep. Now I do IF because I'm not hungry for the first several hours of the day and I manage my cals better.
I might be making such a deficit with exercise and NEAT though that I'm cutting it close. Still, I feel fine except for sleep.0 -
What are your stats if you don't mind (Age, height, weight, goal weight), 1200 is not suitable for everyone and you may have set yourself to aggressive a goal? If you're doing insanity chances and only getting 1200 you are likely under-eating. I have another post that might be useful for you to understand how your calorie allowance is calculated http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10569458/why-eating-too-little-calories-is-a-bad-idea/p1
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31F 5'4" SW 222.5 CW 202 GW:150 (refine it from there based on body comp, after basic training years ago I was 149 and looked pretty good but still had visible fat to lose/ not that much muscle.) I have read the post before (it's excellent!) but I'm absolutely willing to hear what others think about what I'm doing. Totally appreciate honest feedback!
ETA: I was planning to slow my rate of loss to 1.5 or 1 when I hit about 1800 -
AintTooProudToMeg wrote: »purplebobkat wrote: »Are your cals too low?
That can wake you up after a couple if hours.
I tried a VLCD a while ago & i always woke up after a couple if hours. Made me crazy.
I'm not certain, because I always hit my 1200 at least, more if I'm really hungry...
I do feel satiated when I go to bed. I decided with this weight loss journey that going to bed on an empty stomach is not happening. Every time I "failed" in the past and gave up it was because I was so hungry at night I couldn't sleep. Now I do IF because I'm not hungry for the first several hours of the day and I manage my cals better.
I might be making such a deficit with exercise and NEAT though that I'm cutting it close. Still, I feel fine except for sleep.
When you say you always meet your 1200, you're including your exercise calories right?1 -
I ask because I notice that yesterday you had 1300 some odd calories leftover and 1500 some odd were earned exercise calories. Any reason you're not eating some of those back? Or is this an atypical example of a day for you. If it's not, I second the too few calories thing as having a serious effect in your sleep.1
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If it were me, I would drop your rate of loss down to 1-1.5lbs per week (assuming you have it set to 2lbs per week and it's defaulted to the lowest instead of giving you the full 1000 calorie deficit), make sure your activity level is set correctly for your NEAT, at sedentary that would put you at around 1300-1550 net calories, being sure to eat back some of your exercise calories (at least 50%) and adjust accordingly after 4 weeks if you're losing more/less than expected.
Eat some higher protein snacks to make up the difference to what you're eating now and see how it goes.1 -
@CoffeeNCardio Not usually but sometimes. I use a fitbit Alta hr and I just worry about it overcalculating my exercise cals. If I'm hungry I'm totally fine with eating some of those back and I'm glad they are there.
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Assuming your diary is accurate, you're dramatically undereating. You often have several hundred, and sometimes over a thousand, calories left over at the end of the day. You need to eat back your exercise calories. However, I think your sleep concerns aren't just because of undereating.
It sounds like this is an ongoing problem that temporarily got better, but hasn't gone away. You had it before you changed your diet and exercise, which makes me hesitant to say that it's entirely diet related. Are you able to see a doctor for referral to a sleep specialist?1 -
Just also seen your edit ref TOM, under-eating can massively affect your hormones and mess with your menstrual cycle/sleep pattern.2
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AintTooProudToMeg wrote: »@CoffeeNCardio Not usually but sometimes. I use a fitbit Alta hr and I just worry about it overcalculating my exercise cals. If I'm hungry I'm totally fine with eating some of those back and I'm glad they are there.
As tinker bell said, MFP is designed for you to eat back your exercise calories. Most people seem to stick to only eating back about 50-75%, especially fitbit users, but for your health and safety, you should be eating at least that back. Your deficit is wildly overdone and while it might feel like an accomplishment to be doing so we ll and not feel hungry, you're actually putting yourself in danger not doing that.
You don't have to eat them all back, Andi also have a fitbit, so I understand your concern about overcalculating burns, but even a crappy fitbit doesn't do that to the tune of 1500 calories.
If you don't feel hunger, maybe try for a calorie dense food just to get you into that 50-75% sweet spot. Like a potato or noodle product. Just enough to make sure you are properly fueled without making you feel like you're stuffing yourself.
The important thing is to try the method for a while, gauge how it's working for your loss and your health and feelings of wellness and then adjust accordingly.2 -
I really appreciate everyone who's trying to help and I will take advice. I'll up my protein and be less stingy with exercise cals. I'll plan to eat back at least half. I know my willpower is strong now but I'll lose it if I'm exhausted.
I am going to be a little difficult and wait til I get under 200 to change my rate of loss goal to 1.5/ wk. I know I am being one of those obnoxious folks that asks for advice and then doesn't take it, but it's like 2 more lbs, people!
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Its almost impossible to diagnosis sleep issues since they are so individual.
I have read all the comments here. Have you considered dropping the calorie deficit and taking a diet break and move to maintenance for a period of time? Dieting can cause stress on the body, hormones are greatly effected, side effects, sleep issues, etc etc etc.
This thread contains a wealth of good information.. maybe check it out
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10604863/of-refeeds-and-diet-breaks/p13 -
If you're concerned about your fitbit overcalculating, here's some tricks you can use to get as close to spot on as possible:
1. Lie to it. Wear the fitbit on your non-dominant hand, but tell the app that you're wearing it on the dominant hand. This reduces the number of miscounted steps from non-step movements.
2. Tell the app that you're 1 inch shorter than you actually are. Taller people burn more calories just existing, and one inch off can help to stifle overblown BMR calories estimated by the app.
3. Properly measure your stride length and input this information to reduce the number of miscounted steps that might contribute to an overcalculating of your TDEE and exercise.1 -
God you guys, I don't want to be under-eating. I truly don't want to harm myself. I'll fix it as of today. Honestly though, considering my rate of loss hasnt been anything extreme, I think my fitbit overestimates exercise cals by a fair amount.
I have talked with my doctor but I don't think she cares as she kind of shrugs it off bc I have kids. My kids don't really affect my sleep at their ages though. She's generally great and she's happy I'm losing weight but I feel like she's not hearing me about the sleep thing.
I was hoping to fix it by working on my self first, but if it isn't resolved soon I'll make more noise about it. She's my mom's doctor too and she knows us pretty well, and my mom has really bad sleep and anxiety issues and takes medication (though this has come with age and weight gain; which is why I'm trying to resolve it myself first if possible). My mom is also type II diabetic which I'm of course trying to avoid.1 -
Sleep issues can be really tricky to get a handle on. Google "sleep hygiene tips" on the web. There are a standard set of tips from the medical profession. Be sure you're following all of them. If your issues persist , see a doctor to check for anything serious like sleep apnea. It could be any of these or none of them.1
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Best of luck and remember even though we all want to be slim and fit like yesterday, it's a marathon not a sprint, you would do better to be eating/exercising in a way you can keep up for life and keeping the weight off long term than burning yourself out and re-gaining the weight.1
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AintTooProudToMeg wrote: »I really appreciate everyone who's trying to help and I will take advice. I'll up my protein and be less stingy with exercise cals. I'll plan to eat back at least half. I know my willpower is strong now but I'll lose it if I'm exhausted.
I am going to be a little difficult and wait til I get under 200 to change my rate of loss goal to 1.5/ wk. I know I am being one of those obnoxious folks that asks for advice and then doesn't take it, but it's like 2 more lbs, people!
You're trying to lose 2 lbs? If I read that right, your deficit should be no more than 250 calls per day or 0.5 lb per week, maybe less!0 -
AintTooProudToMeg wrote: »I really appreciate everyone who's trying to help and I will take advice. I'll up my protein and be less stingy with exercise cals. I'll plan to eat back at least half. I know my willpower is strong now but I'll lose it if I'm exhausted.
I am going to be a little difficult and wait til I get under 200 to change my rate of loss goal to 1.5/ wk. I know I am being one of those obnoxious folks that asks for advice and then doesn't take it, but it's like 2 more lbs, people!
You're trying to lose 2 lbs? If I read that right, your deficit should be no more than 250 calls per day or 0.5 lb per week, maybe less!
No she want's to get to 200lb before she drops the rate down. She has 52 to lose for goal.1 -
AintTooProudToMeg wrote: »I really appreciate everyone who's trying to help and I will take advice. I'll up my protein and be less stingy with exercise cals. I'll plan to eat back at least half. I know my willpower is strong now but I'll lose it if I'm exhausted.
I am going to be a little difficult and wait til I get under 200 to change my rate of loss goal to 1.5/ wk. I know I am being one of those obnoxious folks that asks for advice and then doesn't take it, but it's like 2 more lbs, people!
You're trying to lose 2 lbs? If I read that right, your deficit should be no more than 250 calls per day or 0.5 lb per week, maybe less!
Nah she's saying she is only 2 lbs loss away from getting under 200 scale.1 -
I am eager to get to certain mini goals, that is certain. However I'm mature enough to care more about health than a number on the scale.
I'm really still early on in this particular weight loss journey and even though I've done this before, I'm still sorting it all out. This is the first time I've been prepared to do this for the long haul and maintain from then on.
I will up my cals but if anyone's concerned I track my weight daily and Libra says I'm averaging about -1.67 lbs a week overall. So I haven't gone TOO crazy considering I started at 222lbs.2 -
CoffeeNCardio wrote: »AintTooProudToMeg wrote: »@CoffeeNCardio Not usually but sometimes. I use a fitbit Alta hr and I just worry about it overcalculating my exercise cals. If I'm hungry I'm totally fine with eating some of those back and I'm glad they are there.
As tinker bell said, MFP is designed for you to eat back your exercise calories. Most people seem to stick to only eating back about 50-75%, especially fitbit users, but for your health and safety, you should be eating at least that back. Your deficit is wildly overdone and while it might feel like an accomplishment to be doing so we ll and not feel hungry, you're actually putting yourself in danger not doing that.
You don't have to eat them all back, Andi also have a fitbit, so I understand your concern about overcalculating burns, but even a crappy fitbit doesn't do that to the tune of 1500 calories.
If you don't feel hunger, maybe try for a calorie dense food just to get you into that 50-75% sweet spot. Like a potato or noodle product. Just enough to make sure you are properly fueled without making you feel like you're stuffing yourself.
The important thing is to try the method for a while, gauge how it's working for your loss and your health and feelings of wellness and then adjust accordingly.
All of this is dead on. Thank you. Also if im undereating its not intentional. I'm going to eat a little more and just kind of watch the trends as far as sleep, how I feel, rate of loss, etc.1 -
I read something recently that resonated with me:
"Problems with sleep are most common during the prementrual phase."
I just so happened to be doing the same thing you are at the time I read it - going to sleep fine and then waking up in a couple of hours and not being able to go back to sleep. It just so happened to be right before my period. I started TOM and the waking up stopped.
I wonder if because you are late, you are having a longer bit of this. It could be hormonal and could settle down once you start.2 -
CoffeeNCardio wrote: »If you're concerned about your fitbit overcalculating, here's some tricks you can use to get as close to spot on as possible:
1. Lie to it. Wear the fitbit on your non-dominant hand, but tell the app that you're wearing it on the dominant hand. This reduces the number of miscounted steps from non-step movements.
2. Tell the app that you're 1 inch shorter than you actually are. Taller people burn more calories just existing, and one inch off can help to stifle overblown BMR calories estimated by the app.
3. Properly measure your stride length and input this information to reduce the number of miscounted steps that might contribute to an overcalculating of your TDEE and exercise.
I did do the thing with wearing it on my non dominant hand and say it's the dominant one. I just did it a couple days ago and can tell when I'm working out that it's not counting non step activity to the degree it was when I had it in there as non-dominant.1
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