16 hour fast with ketogenic diet works!!!!!!!!!!! Great combo

2

Replies

  • TeaBea
    TeaBea Posts: 14,517 Member
    erickirb wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    That isn't what the evidence shows (maybe you are eating less than you think) That said you will prob lose more at first due to depleted glycogen which retains water. so the big loss up front isn't fat loss, it is water weight.

    So the 27 lbs I lost in the first 2 months was just water weight?

    No, I think you missed the point.......big initial losses are water weight, especially low carb (glycogen stores). If she is continuing to see losses (some fat loss for sure) then she IS eating at a deficit.
  • HellYeahItsKriss
    HellYeahItsKriss Posts: 906 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    Hop aboard the Woo-Woo Train! TOOT TOOT. :tongue:
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,360 Member
    edited December 2017
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    If you're continuing to lose, you're not eating in excess of your TDEE every day. You're incorrectly measuring either your calorie intake or your calorie expenditure. Simple as that. Keto is not magic and it does not defy the laws of energy.
  • acorsaut89
    acorsaut89 Posts: 1,147 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    CICO is a thing of life, full stop. Regardless of which "diet" or way of eating you follow, you have to consume less than you burn in order to lose -- that's how weight loss works. There's no way you're going over your TDEE and still losing unless 1) you're eating less than you think or 2) you're burning more than you think. You are correct that with adequate protein consumption you won't burn your muscle mass, but you can't lose if you're eating more than you burn. It's that simple.
  • CharlieBeansmomTracey
    CharlieBeansmomTracey Posts: 7,702 Member
    Hello everyone I originally started out at 330lbs I downloaded this app when I got to 315lbs now I am at 276lbs I fast for 16hours a day 12pm to 8pm is my eating window my goal is 1900 calories a day but I stay around 1500 calories not sure if that’s healthy but I have been losing weight fast and I feel great keto I believe had a big part of it too and with that I don’t eat no more then 20 to 50 grams of carbs.

    That's awesome! Many people incorporate IF with keto for results like you're seeing. We eat when we're hungry; you'll find that your appetite ebbs and flows. I'm also keto, but haven't incorporated intermittent fasting. Contrary to what some have said, I still lose weight and I go over my calories every day. Our bodies burn fat for fuel since we limit the carbohydrates. I'm sure you're getting a mix of the benefits of keto, as well as the lower calorie intake. Keep doing what you're doing. If at any point you feel like you're hungry, eat more. What the CICO folks don't get about keto is that our appetite is so reduced because we don't have the highs and lows of blood sugar to contend with. Do your thing and all the best to you!!

    fat is lost in a caloric deficit. the fat your body is using for fuel is DIETARY fat. your body no longer uses carbs for fuel which is why in keto the majority of your calories comes from fat. protein can also be turned into energy if its needed. protein can also spike blood sugar and a spike in blood sugar is a normal bodily response. just people who are diabetic have to watch or even prevent those spikes.since calories are a unit of energy I believe,if your body burns more energy(calories) than you take in you lose weight,if you take in the same as you burn,you maintain. and if you take in more than you burn you gain weight. all of that is CICO.

    also for some keto may help with appetite but not everyone that does keto will be satiated eating high fat. keto is not for everyone and it wont work for everyone either. its not a special way of losing weight. if it were no one would lose weight doing other ways of eating. I lost over 40 lbs and a lot of fat and inches, just eating less than I burn. I have a metabolic disorder as well.I also eat a lot of carbs and cant do high fat due to a health issue.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,054 MFP Moderator
    acorsaut89 wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    CICO is a thing of life, full stop. Regardless of which "diet" or way of eating you follow, you have to consume less than you burn in order to lose -- that's how weight loss works. There's no way you're going over your TDEE and still losing unless 1) you're eating less than you think or 2) you're burning more than you think. You are correct that with adequate protein consumption you won't burn your muscle mass, but you can't lose if you're eating more than you burn. It's that simple.

    Perhaps that is true but long term calorie restriction day in and day out may not work for everyone, in fact since most people re-gain weight on the traditional daily calorie deficit if fasting helps make it more comfortable and manageable I do not see the problem. It was not until recently that we had a serious obesity problem, and it was not until recently that people were constantly surrounded by food and told they had to eat all the time, coincidence? Feast then famine is how we adapted. Most of the naturally thin people I know eat then they are hungry, not when they are supposed to, and thus intermittent fast all the time without even trying. Fasting can help you get control of your hunger signals and realize that you aren't going to die if you don't eat. It turns on genes that promote cellular repair and longevity so the benefits are not just weight loss.

    Fasting has different effects on different people. I tried 16:8 fasting for several months. I was always starving and struggled to control urges. I do much better eating 3 large meals a day.

    Regardless of the dietary method or diet you follow, 80 to 90% will regain the weight. It's just how it works.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,054 MFP Moderator
    edited December 2017
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    Sorry, but you are completely wrong and do not have an understanding of what CICO is. CICO refers to the energy balance equation. The single most important aspect on weight loss, maintenance and gain. If you want to understand the scientific mechanisms behind it, I'd recommend the below. We all obey by these rules. If you do not believe in CICO, I'd challenge you to eat 5000 calories over an extend period of time to see what happens when your body weight.

    http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/95/4/989

    Keto works for some people, because it does a few things: 1. people will inherently increase protein consumption ad libitum, 2. ketones may have a suppression effect on an individual, or 3. it may address medical conditions (IR, Diabetes, etc..) which will enable greater compliance.

    Also, if you don't want to lose muscle, than you need adequate protein, which is roughly 1.5 - 2.2g/kg of weight and incorporate resistance training. And that might be higher on keto since carbs are muscle sparring.

    http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/pdf/10.1139/apnm-2015-0549

  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,360 Member
    edited December 2017
    psuLemon wrote: »
    acorsaut89 wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    CICO is a thing of life, full stop. Regardless of which "diet" or way of eating you follow, you have to consume less than you burn in order to lose -- that's how weight loss works. There's no way you're going over your TDEE and still losing unless 1) you're eating less than you think or 2) you're burning more than you think. You are correct that with adequate protein consumption you won't burn your muscle mass, but you can't lose if you're eating more than you burn. It's that simple.

    Perhaps that is true but long term calorie restriction day in and day out may not work for everyone, in fact since most people re-gain weight on the traditional daily calorie deficit if fasting helps make it more comfortable and manageable I do not see the problem. It was not until recently that we had a serious obesity problem, and it was not until recently that people were constantly surrounded by food and told they had to eat all the time, coincidence? Feast then famine is how we adapted. Most of the naturally thin people I know eat then they are hungry, not when they are supposed to, and thus intermittent fast all the time without even trying. Fasting can help you get control of your hunger signals and realize that you aren't going to die if you don't eat. It turns on genes that promote cellular repair and longevity so the benefits are not just weight loss.

    Fasting has different effects on different people. I tried 16:8 fasting for several months. I was always starving and struggled to control urges. I do much better eating 3 large meals a day.

    Regardless of the dietary method or diet you follow, 80 to 90% will regain the weight. It's just how it works.

    I like 16:8, it fits well with the way I like to eat. I'm not usually that hungry in the mornings and I enjoy big dinners. There's nothing magical about it as far as weight loss and I don't make Herculean efforts to strictly adhere to it, but most of the time it works great for me as far as satiety/adherence. I don't attribute any other magick or wizardry to it, you still need a caloric deficit to lose weight.

    5:2 is a complete non-starter for me - no way I'm eating 500 calories a day twice a week. Especially since there are no scientifically proven benefits to it. Perhaps it works for some people and they can deal with the 500 calorie days, but I'm not one of them.
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,027 Member
    acorsaut89 wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    manleyr14 wrote: »
    The keto diet is more about insulin control than calories. (See The Obesity Code by Dr. Jason Fung) I have been eating within 100 calories of my TDEE and lose 1 -2 lbs a week. It seems the body fat disappears at a quicker rate than the numbers on the scale.

    No you haven't. Your TDEE is the total number of calories you burn in a day. If you are losing 1 to 2 lbs a week, then you are eating within 500 to 1000 calories short of your TDEE.

    OP, I'd be cautious about eating that low calories, especially long term. If you value your muscles, you don't want to go overly aggressive in your diet and make sure you have adequate protein and resistance training to support those goals.

    Actually, this isn't true. I am NOT eating 500-1000 calories short of my TDEE and I lose 1-3# a week on keto. CICO is not a thing on the ketogenic diet. I go over my TDEE every single day and continue to lose. We don't begin burning our muscles if we keep our protein moderate and fat high.

    CICO is a thing of life, full stop. Regardless of which "diet" or way of eating you follow, you have to consume less than you burn in order to lose -- that's how weight loss works. There's no way you're going over your TDEE and still losing unless 1) you're eating less than you think or 2) you're burning more than you think. You are correct that with adequate protein consumption you won't burn your muscle mass, but you can't lose if you're eating more than you burn. It's that simple.

    Perhaps that is true but long term calorie restriction day in and day out may not work for everyone, in fact since most people re-gain weight on the traditional daily calorie deficit if fasting helps make it more comfortable and manageable I do not see the problem. It was not until recently that we had a serious obesity problem, and it was not until recently that people were constantly surrounded by food and told they had to eat all the time, coincidence? Feast then famine is how we adapted. Most of the naturally thin people I know eat then they are hungry, not when they are supposed to, and thus intermittent fast all the time without even trying. Fasting can help you get control of your hunger signals and realize that you aren't going to die if you don't eat. It turns on genes that promote cellular repair and longevity so the benefits are not just weight loss.

    No one in this thread is saying IF doesn't work or is a problem. They are just saying it's not magic and doesn't have the same affect on everyone. You still need to be in a calorie deficit, whether you are eating Keto or IF or both or neither. For some people, eating Keto or IF will make it easier for them to stay at the right calorie level, possibly without even trying. If that applies to you, then that's great.

    The reply you quoted was responding to someone who said they were losing weight while eating over their TDEE, which would mean they were defying the laws of physics and should be studied in a lab. She wasn't arguing with IF or Keto being useful for some people.
  • dimaslopes
    dimaslopes Posts: 36 Member
    welcome aboard the keto train, for those saying about cico and such it is true that calorie deficit is what matters to lose weight BUT the keto diet greatest advantage is the hunger control: being on keto and being consistent with calorie intake is much more easier than eating carbs and fats gets you satiated easily.
    Of course down the line is much better to refeed and break the diet once in a while.
  • Momepro
    Momepro Posts: 1,509 Member
    If it's easier to stay within calories by skipping breakfast and a late night snack, theres no reason to argue about it. Quibbling about whether he lost it because of the fasting or because he was eating less is just silly.

    Yay for losing the weight and sticking with your plan!!!
    Just be careful about eating to little. It can easily backfire by making you feel sick, and then trying to gain back calories by taking energy from organs and muscles instead of fat.

  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,027 Member
    dimaslopes wrote: »
    welcome aboard the keto train, for those saying about cico and such it is true that calorie deficit is what matters to lose weight BUT the keto diet greatest advantage is the hunger control: being on keto and being consistent with calorie intake is much more easier than eating carbs and fats gets you satiated easily.
    Of course down the line is much better to refeed and break the diet once in a while.

    For some people.

    I am not satiated by fats. The foods I easily overeat are nuts, cheese, roasted chicken with the skin, full fat dairy. I have no trouble eating a reasonable serving of oatmeal, or rice, or even chocolate, and tend to find carbs with a bit of protein really filling. Trying to do low carb was a nightmare for me, I was constantly hungry.

    For people who are more satiated by fats, yes doing keto or less restrictive low carb will enjoy better hunger control.
  • CharlieBeansmomTracey
    CharlieBeansmomTracey Posts: 7,702 Member
    dimaslopes wrote: »
    welcome aboard the keto train, for those saying about cico and such it is true that calorie deficit is what matters to lose weight BUT the keto diet greatest advantage is the hunger control: being on keto and being consistent with calorie intake is much more easier than eating carbs and fats gets you satiated easily.
    Of course down the line is much better to refeed and break the diet once in a while.

    the hunger control on keto works for YOU. it doesnt work that way for everyone and trust me I have tried it. its easier for me to eat carbs and protein to be satiated. Im not satiated on fat and cant do high fat because my body doesnt process it properly the same way it does in others.
  • BabybabesT88
    BabybabesT88 Posts: 12 Member
    I'm happy you've found the way that works for you. Cheers to your weight loss. X