Out running a bad diet
potatowhoruns
Posts: 87 Member
I have seen it said a number of times that you can’t outrun a bad diet, or that weight loss is 80% diet, but if it is as simple as CICO then I don’t understand.
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
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Replies
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For some people, it is true. For instance, some people are happy with the vegetables they consume as it provides them a feeling of fullness. That's the fiber and water, and also the carbs that predominate in vegetables. Other people are most satisfied with fat and protein, such as are found in bacon and all the other meats, as well as avocados, beans, and soy products. Each subset of people seem to discover that giving close attention to the details of their macro distribution matters most as they get closer to their weight goal.
I got close to my goal, then failed to stay close, and am again trying to reverse course toward my goal. Whether this sort of macro detail attention is something that helps me, I don't know.1 -
This is actually a good question. I think it's due down to the exercise making you more hungry and which can lead to over eating in some people. But will be interesting to see what other people's thoughts are.0
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It really is as simple as CICO. Yes some foods are calorie dense and unsatisfying so its learning to keep them to a minimum so we eat either at deficit or at TDEE if we're at maintenance. I need a mix of protein/fibre and fat to keep my hunger at bay.1
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All it means is that it doesn't matter if you run a marathon every day if you eat more calories than you burn that day... you'll still gain weight.
That has nothing to do with how filling foods are.18 -
potatowhoruns wrote: »I have seen it said a number of times that you can’t outrun a bad diet, or that weight loss is 80% diet, but if it is as simple as CICO then I don’t understand.
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
Pretty much. You have to find the right balance of food that keeps you satisfied and able to stay within your calorie limits without being hungry, hangry, fatigued, and/or sad.
For me I find I do the best when I make sure each meal has at least 20 grams of protein, if not more. I also need to make sure I have enough carbs and fat. In the past when I did Weight Watchers, following their points system (a complex calorie counting system made simple, if that makes sense) I was focusing on filling up on low or zero points foods so I could have VOLUME - eat lots and lots and lots - mostly veggies - and making sure I had points left over for stupid stuff like Skittles...but I was lagging, tired, fatigued and sad. LOL. I needed protein and fat!
You can eat whatever you want whenever you want, but you will find your best success is in choosing foods that are more nutrient dense and less likely to be empty calories. Sometimes though you just want a donut. Or some candy, or potato chips.
And it's OK - just make it work, or know that if you go over your calories for it, it's just for that day, and at the very most ( unless you totally binge ) you will have less of a calorie deficit that day. Just don't make it a regular habit of going very far over your daily calories or you'll be continually stalled. Make sense?2 -
I think it is more about advising people to focus on their foods to create a deficit rather than thinking you can eat what you want and the exercise will cancel it out.
For people as described above who enjoy vegetables and find they leave them satisfied then out running their diet might be possible, but if your diet is heavy on high calorie foods then probably less so.
If you eat 3000 calories, and burn 2000 going about your daily life then you would need to burn 1000 calories through exercise just to maintain your weight. Most people are not going to be able to sustain that level of exercise to cancel out their high calorie diet. That's why people say you can't out run a poor diet.
You would be much better figuring out how much you burn and then consciously eating fewer calories than that to lose weight.5 -
I also meant to say for a few years there I kept on upping my steps, aimed for 21k+ a day, I ate more because I was more hungry and even saw weight creep happen.
Then I had to dial back my exercise because of joint issues and less time to workout each day, I knew I'd have to cut my calories. The interesting thing was I don't even do a third of the activity I did before, yet its now easier to eat less calories - I even went on to lose a further 7lbs since then. So its all about taking in less than we burn if we want to lose..3 -
Basically you cant burn calories as fast as you can eat them. When you have an uncontrolled caloric diet MANY people dont realize they are eating 3000-4000 calories a day while their goal should be around 2k. For someone that ate 4k calories they would have to go for a 4 hour run depending on weight and speed just to land back at maintenance.
While there might be some that do, a very small portion will actually go for a 4 hour run every single day to balance out that diet level.
4k calories sounds like a lot right? Keep in mind that a foot long sub sandwich, a juice and cookie is probably 1800 calories.5 -
potatowhoruns wrote: »I have seen it said a number of times that you can’t outrun a bad diet, or that weight loss is 80% diet, but if it is as simple as CICO then I don’t understand.
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
It's mostly said because people over estimate the amount of calories they burn working out, and then feel they can compensate and eat anything they want (typically lots of calorie dense foods). But it can be done though, I have done it. During my 20's and early 30's I ate a ridiculous amount of food, fast food,junk food, you name it I ate it. And I still walked around with slightly visible abs.
When I am in a marathon training cycle, I have to force myself to eat calorie dense foods or I'll lose too much weight.1 -
I think it is more about advising people to focus on their foods to create a deficit rather than thinking you can eat what you want and the exercise will cancel it out.
For people as described above who enjoy vegetables and find they leave them satisfied then out running their diet might be possible, but if your diet is heavy on high calorie foods then probably less so.
If you eat 3000 calories, and burn 2000 going about your daily life then you would need to burn 1000 calories through exercise just to maintain your weight. Most people are not going to be able to sustain that level of exercise to cancel out their high calorie diet. That's why people say you can't out run a poor diet.
You would be much better figuring out how much you burn and then consciously eating fewer calories than that to lose weight.
This.0 -
potatowhoruns wrote: »I have seen it said a number of times that you can’t outrun a bad diet, or that weight loss is 80% diet, but if it is as simple as CICO then I don’t understand.
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
It's mostly said because people over estimate the amount of calories they burn working out, and then feel they can compensate and eat anything they want (typically lots of calorie dense foods). But it can be done though, I have done it. During my 20's and early 30's I ate a ridiculous amount of food, fast food,junk food, you name it I ate it. And I still walked around with slightly visible abs.
When I am in a marathon training cycle, I have to force myself to eat calorie dense foods or I'll lose too much weight.
This is great advice and context.
It's possible to out train a moderately poor diet, but it's not going to happen walking 1.5 miles in 30 minutes and eating a Supersized fast food meal with full calorie soda.
it can happen if you're training 2-3 hours a day and eating large nutrient dense lunch and dinner.1 -
I have lost over 70 lbs since Dec 2016 with very little exercise. My doctor put me on a diet, which helped me realize that eating protein and fat helped keep me full while keeping carbs under 100g per day cut a lot of calories. I lost weight based on a calorie deficit coupled with eating foods that filled me up so it was "easy" to stay under my calorie goal. I do try to get exercise to help retain muscle (Body Electric) and keep my blood pressure in check (brisk walking). However, exercise is not a focus and I'm not consistent with it. I've read other posters who need a high carb diet to keep them feeling full. You need to experiment to find out which nutrient dense foods work for you. Oh, I also eat chocolate most days: I fit it in my calorie budget. Hope this information helps you. Best wishes with your weight loss journey!2
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Thanks for all your comments, it really has helped put it into context.
My diet isn’t great, but I exercise frequently so I guess as long as it works for me then I can continue doing what I am doing.
I have never really paid attention to the macro breakdown, I only really look at calories so if I plateau or start to feel unsatisfied then I might start to look more closely at that.
Also, I can be flexible with my exercise and nutrition as long as I burn more than I eat.2 -
All it means is that it doesn't matter if you run a marathon every day if you eat more calories than you burn that day... you'll still gain weight.
That has nothing to do with how filling foods are.
Definitely this. Also, with exercise, your body becomes more efficient over time. So, if you begin a 45 minute per day running habit, you are initially able to eat X amount of calories and lose weight. But, as your body becomes more fit, and thus more efficient at doing that routine, you burn fewer calories doing it. Now if you continue to eat X amount of calories, you will no longer lose weight. You must either increase your calorie burn by upping time/intensity of exercise, or decrease overall calorie intake. So, ultimately, it still comes back to calories in versus calories out. But, in my humble opinion, calorie intake is much more controllable/knowable number than calorie burn because it can vary so much over time, and even HRMs to measure that can be inaccurate.
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QFT.
You would be much better figuring out how much you burn and then consciously eating fewer calories than that to lose weight.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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All it means is that it doesn't matter if you run a marathon every day if you eat more calories than you burn that day... you'll still gain weight.
That has nothing to do with how filling foods are.
This! The saying is about it being quite easy for most people to overeat even though they do a lot of exercise. It's easier to eat 1000 extra calories than to burn it off.1 -
potatowhoruns wrote: »Thanks for all your comments, it really has helped put it into context.
My diet isn’t great, but I exercise frequently so I guess as long as it works for me then I can continue doing what I am doing.
I have never really paid attention to the macro breakdown, I only really look at calories so if I plateau or start to feel unsatisfied then I might start to look more closely at that.
Also, I can be flexible with my exercise and nutrition as long as I burn more than I eat.
Yeah, whatever works for you is always going to be the best bet. Weight loss isn’t about nutrition or exercise, it’s simply about burning more than you eat. Eating a “healthy diet” can help keep your calories low, but not necessarily. Exercise can help keep your burn high, but as others noted, relying on exercise alone to lose weight has its pitfalls. That said, if you’re losing weight then you’re clearly doing okay.2 -
Graphic example: I once ran a long foot race that burned 3500 calories (I wore a HRM).
On another occasion, I ate a single serving of a dessert (in the United States, lol) that was 3200 calories.
Ain't nobody running 30 miles after they eat that dessert, by and large.0 -
brendanwhite84 wrote: »Graphic example: I once ran a long foot race that burned 3500 calories (I wore a HRM).
On another occasion, I ate a single serving of a dessert (in the United States, lol) that was 3200 calories.
Ain't nobody running 30 miles after they eat that dessert, by and large.
Desserts can make me so sad sometimes. Delicious as all hell i bet though
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brendanwhite84 wrote: »Graphic example: I once ran a long foot race that burned 3500 calories (I wore a HRM).
On another occasion, I ate a single serving of a dessert (in the United States, lol) that was 3200 calories.
Ain't nobody running 30 miles after they eat that dessert, by and large.
Wow, I'm curious to know what sort of dessert is that calorie dense! The fact the cheesecake factory cheesecakes are over 1k calories in a slice kills me....3k though!?1 -
etherealanwar wrote: »brendanwhite84 wrote: »Graphic example: I once ran a long foot race that burned 3500 calories (I wore a HRM).
On another occasion, I ate a single serving of a dessert (in the United States, lol) that was 3200 calories.
Ain't nobody running 30 miles after they eat that dessert, by and large.
Wow, I'm curious to know what sort of dessert is that calorie dense! The fact the cheesecake factory cheesecakes are over 1k calories in a slice kills me....3k though!?
This guy is 1560 - I could see some crazy giant desert special being twice that. https://www.applebees.com/en/menu/desserts/blue-ribbon-brownie0 -
etherealanwar wrote: »brendanwhite84 wrote: »Graphic example: I once ran a long foot race that burned 3500 calories (I wore a HRM).
On another occasion, I ate a single serving of a dessert (in the United States, lol) that was 3200 calories.
Ain't nobody running 30 miles after they eat that dessert, by and large.
Wow, I'm curious to know what sort of dessert is that calorie dense! The fact the cheesecake factory cheesecakes are over 1k calories in a slice kills me....3k though!?
It was some kind of apple pie blossom thing a la mode I ate at a Cracker Barrel in Michigan. I cycled several hours that day so it still fit in my calorie budget, but my jaw almost fell off my face when I logged the calories after getting back to my motel.
I wouldn't be surprised if people tended to split it between partners, but on the other hand, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if people had it all to themselves. I did - although I was a little queasy after.
God bless distance cycling!0 -
Another thing to consider is time:
How long does it take to burn 500 calories?
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How long does it take to not eat/be mindful of 500 extra calories?3 -
I use the calorie burn calculation as a guide but let the scale be the final judge. Without changing my eating habits much I have found that if I run 25+ miles a week I lose weight, 15 to 25 I maintain and fewer than 10 I gain. Which is why I have put twenty five pounds on.0
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i had the tiniest wimp of a chocolate cake "slice" that i split....it was 1500 calories. Was pathetic0
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potatowhoruns wrote: »I have seen it said a number of times that you can’t outrun a bad diet, or that weight loss is 80% diet, but if it is as simple as CICO then I don’t understand.
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
Yes.0 -
potatowhoruns wrote: »I have seen it said a number of times that you can’t outrun a bad diet, or that weight loss is 80% diet, but if it is as simple as CICO then I don’t understand.
Is it just that certain foods are less likely to keep you satisfied and therefore will make it harder to maintain eating at a deficit, especially when nearing your goal weight?
It simply means that, for many people they need to look at their diet as while exercise can help create a deficit, and of course is good for health, it isn't usually the magical key to weightloss that people can think it is. Not on it's own anyway.
As an example, I would have had to to do a hell of a lot of exercise to out run some of the daily diet choices I was previously making and the portion sizes I was having. It is far more realistic and sustainable, for me, to alter that and see exercise as about improving my fitness, and with the added bonus of creating more of a deficit while I am at it. Rather than continuing my previous food habits and hoping to burn off enough to make up for it which in my case was never going to happen.1
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