Sticking to 10-15% fat for total calories

ConwayJosh
ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
in Health and Weight Loss
I'm posting to add more incentive to stay on task with my diet. Through good resources I've heard of diets that keep fat percentages relatively low to help fuel training both energy from carbs and protein for building muscle. I'm curious if anyone else has tried this % on here and thoughts or advice on the matter?
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Replies

  • kommodevaran
    kommodevaran Posts: 17,890 Member
    edited February 2018
    It sounds unhealthy, unless your total calorie requirement is so high that 10-15% equals a decent amount of fat.

    A good diet should make you feel good, support your athlethic goals and be easy to stick to. No diet can perform miracles.
  • jflongo
    jflongo Posts: 289 Member
    You don't want to go that low. Healthy fats are good for you, try and be around 20 - 25%
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    My current caloric intake is roughly 2450 maintenance calories are roughly 3400
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 34,163 Member
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    Maybe, maybe not. It depends on what kind of calorie goal you're talking relative to your size.

    In my understanding, you need a minimum of around 0.35-0.45g fat daily per pound of healthy goal weight. For me, I usually shoot for about 60g, so at the higher end of that range. That's almost 30% of my current net calorie goal. For someone with more body fat or a very active job giving them a higher calorie goal at the same body size, it'd be a smaller percent.

    For me (and lots of others), 10% of calories from fat would be crazy low.

    It's the math.
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    You're conflating bodyfat percentage with dietary intake of fat. Two different things.

    The video referenced above should help clarify my point but no I do understand the difference between bodyfat and daily requirements of fat for health
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member

    VintageFeline wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    You're conflating bodyfat percentage with dietary intake of fat. Two different things.

    This.

    Also, you don't get brownie points for protein above your needs and carbs in excess of keeping glycogen stores sufficient. Eat the fat, it's good for you and for fuel.

    I don't need or want brownie points, and since I'm in a deficit it's unlikely that my intake of carbs and protein is excessive.
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    erickirb wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    You're conflating bodyfat percentage with dietary intake of fat. Two different things.

    The video referenced above should help clarify my point but no I do understand the difference between bodyfat and daily requirements of fat for health

    Also, minimum amount, does not mean ideal amount!!! we should be shooting for as close to ideal macros as we can, not just minimums.

    10% is the minimum necessary for health, what is the advantage to consuming more? I know there's added benefits to higher intake for protein to help make sure I'm building as much muscle as possible. Carbs are the single best resource for energy especially for training. What advantage or benefit is there to consuming more and how much is that?
  • jflongo
    jflongo Posts: 289 Member
    Please explain when you say you want more protein and carbs for muscle building? How many grams are you trying to get?
  • not_a_runner
    not_a_runner Posts: 1,343 Member
    He does state in the video that as long as you're getting 10% of your daily calories from each macro nutrient that you should be fine...

    I know that Dr Mike/the RP program diet templates largely manipulates calories via fats. Deeper into their cut templates fats can get pretty low, but only for a short period of time, which they say is fine.

    Dr Mike has also been trying out super low fat massing and seems to be seeing good results.
    He discusses this in depth on a Revive Stronger Podcast, touches on how low of fat he personally can handle before he starts to have issues. (Again, this is only for his massing phase and not an indefinite period of time. He also mentions that he has weekly cheat meals that typically contain higher fat.)

    I wasn't able to find that specific video from a search, but here is one with Broderick Chavez discussing the low fat/high carb massing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbutiVOebro

    Not saying I am an expert on the subject, but I have also heard of this and OP isn't nuts.
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    jflongo wrote: »
    Please explain when you say you want more protein and carbs for muscle building? How many grams are you trying to get?
    Roughly 1 gram per pound or slightly less since I'm in a deficit, or 30-45 g per meal to help protein synthetic response. Carbs are where I put the rest of the calories. 248g protein daily and I believe 310 ish grams of carbs.
  • erickirb
    erickirb Posts: 12,294 Member
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    erickirb wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    You're conflating bodyfat percentage with dietary intake of fat. Two different things.

    The video referenced above should help clarify my point but no I do understand the difference between bodyfat and daily requirements of fat for health

    Also, minimum amount, does not mean ideal amount!!! we should be shooting for as close to ideal macros as we can, not just minimums.

    10% is the minimum necessary for health, what is the advantage to consuming more? I know there's added benefits to higher intake for protein to help make sure I'm building as much muscle as possible. Carbs are the single best resource for energy especially for training. What advantage or benefit is there to consuming more and how much is that?

    For bulking, eating above maintenance carbs are king, protein helps rebuild so should actually be higher when in a deficit so you don't lose muscle.

    this was on guy simplifying things, I am sure that 10% is different for each macro under different scenarios (training for endurance event vs. cutting fat (deficit), vs building muscle (surplus).

    advantage for fat being above 10% required for "general health" again % are not the best way to breakdown macro requimrents, but how about less constipation, strong nails, shinny hair.
  • jflongo
    jflongo Posts: 289 Member
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    jflongo wrote: »
    Please explain when you say you want more protein and carbs for muscle building? How many grams are you trying to get?
    Roughly 1 gram per pound or slightly less since I'm in a deficit, or 30-45 g per meal to help protein synthetic response. Carbs are where I put the rest of the calories. 248g protein daily and I believe 310 ish grams of carbs.

    Personally, I would still up healthy fats a little to 15 - 20%, but up to you. I'm set to 35% carbs, 40% protein, 25% fat, and I'm losing a little of weight and gaining muscles and strength.

    So you are 248 lbs is what you are saying?
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    not_a_runner wrote: »
    He does state in the video that as long as you're getting 10% of your daily calories from each macro nutrient that you should be fine...

    I know that Dr Mike/the RP program diet templates largely manipulates calories via fats. Deeper into their cut templates fats can get pretty low, but only for a short period of time, which they say is fine.

    Dr Mike has also been trying out super low fat massing and seems to be seeing good results.
    He discusses this in depth on a Revive Stronger Podcast, touches on how low of fat he personally can handle before he starts to have issues. (Again, this is only for his massing phase and not an indefinite period of time. He also mentions that he has weekly cheat meals that typically contain higher fat.)

    I wasn't able to find that specific video from a search, but here is one with Broderick Chavez discussing the low fat/high carb massing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbutiVOebro

    Not saying I am an expert on the subject, but I have also heard of this and OP isn't nuts.

    That's exactly where I got the idea, from this and from ted talks because he specifically referenced health in that one versus the podcast where they talk mostly on massing with higher carb and lower fat.
  • erickirb
    erickirb Posts: 12,294 Member
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    VintageFeline wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    You're conflating bodyfat percentage with dietary intake of fat. Two different things.

    This.

    Also, you don't get brownie points for protein above your needs and carbs in excess of keeping glycogen stores sufficient. Eat the fat, it's good for you and for fuel.

    I don't need or want brownie points, and since I'm in a deficit it's unlikely that my intake of carbs and protein is excessive.

    Well in a deficit you will most likely not be building muscle anyway (unless you are overfat, a newbie, or returning to training after time away), in a deficit protein is there to help retain muscle, and carbs are the only macro not required, which is why most people on a cut lower carbs. The differnce in my diet from a cut to a bulk is the amount of carbs.
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    jflongo wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    jflongo wrote: »
    Please explain when you say you want more protein and carbs for muscle building? How many grams are you trying to get?
    Roughly 1 gram per pound or slightly less since I'm in a deficit, or 30-45 g per meal to help protein synthetic response. Carbs are where I put the rest of the calories. 248g protein daily and I believe 310 ish grams of carbs.

    Personally, I would still up healthy fats a little to 15 - 20%, but up to you. I'm set to 35% carbs, 40% protein, 25% fat, and I'm losing a little of weight and gaining muscles and strength.

    So you are 248 lbs is what you are saying?
    I'm 256 so it is slightly less but considering my bf% I'm sure it's ok lol
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    erickirb wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    VintageFeline wrote: »
    AnvilHead wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    I'm aware that fat is essential but the minimum amount necessary for bodily function is less than 10%.

    You're conflating bodyfat percentage with dietary intake of fat. Two different things.

    This.

    Also, you don't get brownie points for protein above your needs and carbs in excess of keeping glycogen stores sufficient. Eat the fat, it's good for you and for fuel.

    I don't need or want brownie points, and since I'm in a deficit it's unlikely that my intake of carbs and protein is excessive.

    Well in a deficit you will most likely not be building muscle anyway (unless you are overfat, a newbie, or returning to training after time away), in a deficit protein is there to help retain muscle, and carbs are the only macro not required, which is why most people on a cut lower carbs. The differnce in my diet from a cut to a bulk is the amount of carbs.

    I'm a deficit granted it's not optimal for building muscle but it's still happening just to smaller degree I believe it's Dr. Shoenfeld and colleagues have done studies to prove you can build muscle while in a deficit.
  • jflongo
    jflongo Posts: 289 Member
    You could easily up your fat % a little to 15 - 20% and still get more than enough protein for muscle building. Are you trying to lose a lot of weight and gain muscle at the same time?
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    jflongo wrote: »
    You could easily up your fat % a little to 15 - 20% and still get more than enough protein for muscle building. Are you trying to lose a lot of weight and gain muscle at the same time?

    I'm trying to build muscle as much as possible while in a deficit I'm not opposed to going up if necessary, if I start having issues or cravings I could always bump up to 15-20
  • jjpptt2
    jjpptt2 Posts: 5,650 Member
    edited February 2018
    How long are you planning to go low fat? Over shorter periods of time, I don't think there's anything to be concerned about on paper.

    If I'm reading it right... 10% of your cals from a 2500 calorie diet would be about 28g of fat.
  • jjpptt2
    jjpptt2 Posts: 5,650 Member
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    jflongo wrote: »
    You could easily up your fat % a little to 15 - 20% and still get more than enough protein for muscle building. Are you trying to lose a lot of weight and gain muscle at the same time?

    I'm trying to build muscle as much as possible while in a deficit I'm not opposed to going up if necessary, if I start having issues or cravings I could always bump up to 15-20

    Any consideration to recomping? You'll likely have better success keeping/building muscle, though the fat loss will take longer (all other things held constant).
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    jjpptt2 wrote: »
    How long are you planning to go low fat? Over shorter periods of time, I don't think there's anything to be concerned about on paper.

    If I'm reading it right... 10% of your cals from a 2500 calorie diet would be about 28g of fat.

    28g is right and 4-8 weeks largely depends on how the diet goes I'd like to get down to 240-245 before I bring calories back up for maintenance for 4-8 weeks
  • ConwayJosh
    ConwayJosh Posts: 36 Member
    jjpptt2 wrote: »
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    jflongo wrote: »
    You could easily up your fat % a little to 15 - 20% and still get more than enough protein for muscle building. Are you trying to lose a lot of weight and gain muscle at the same time?

    I'm trying to build muscle as much as possible while in a deficit I'm not opposed to going up if necessary, if I start having issues or cravings I could always bump up to 15-20

    Any consideration to recomping? You'll likely have better success keeping/building muscle, though the fat loss will take longer (all other things held constant).

    Yes I plan on only cutting for 4-8 weeks before I bring calories back up for that exact reason.
  • jjpptt2
    jjpptt2 Posts: 5,650 Member
    ConwayJosh wrote: »
    jjpptt2 wrote: »
    How long are you planning to go low fat? Over shorter periods of time, I don't think there's anything to be concerned about on paper.

    If I'm reading it right... 10% of your cals from a 2500 calorie diet would be about 28g of fat.

    28g is right and 4-8 weeks largely depends on how the diet goes I'd like to get down to 240-245 before I bring calories back up for maintenance for 4-8 weeks

    Assuming you're otherwise healthy and assuming an otherwise reasonable diet, I don't think 8 weeks is going to kill you. I have a hard time believing it's ideal, but you're operating in a world I'm only read on, not actually experienced in... so WTF do I know, lol.

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