Diet vs. exercise
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missysippy930 wrote: »*sigh*
You don't have to EAT in a calorie deficit to lose weight. You have to END UP in a calorie deficit to lose weight. Yes, most people will have better success long term if they focus on diet than if they focus on exercise. But it doesn't have to be (and probably should be) an either/or scenario.
Are you more apt to grow your savings account if you have a well paying job, or if you're disciplined with your spending? It depends how well paying your job is and how disciplined you are with your spending... but both is probably the best answer, right?
What is the difference?
In the end, it is eating less calories than you burn for weight loss.
Is it eating more cals than you burn, or burning more cals than you eat?
semantics, it is the same thing. no difference.2 -
missysippy930 wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »*sigh*
You don't have to EAT in a calorie deficit to lose weight. You have to END UP in a calorie deficit to lose weight. Yes, most people will have better success long term if they focus on diet than if they focus on exercise. But it doesn't have to be (and probably should be) an either/or scenario.
Are you more apt to grow your savings account if you have a well paying job, or if you're disciplined with your spending? It depends how well paying your job is and how disciplined you are with your spending... but both is probably the best answer, right?
What is the difference?
In the end, it is eating less calories than you burn for weight loss.
Is it eating more cals than you burn, or burning more cals than you eat?
semantics, it is the same thing. no difference.
Agree and disagree.
It is semantics, but semantics do matter.1 -
It's simple: CICO, bit there are two sides to the equation, through watching what you eat you manage the calories in, and through every you can increase the calories out. However, it's easier to manage calories in, as that is under your direct control. The calories out may be used to create or increase a deficit, bit it's harder that way, firstly it takes more exercise than most people realise to burn calories, also it is hard to measure the level of calories burned even with heart monitors as they will be estimates (plus as you do more and your body gets used to it, it will learn how to work more efficiently, burning fewer calories). Ideally, both are good
Why the woo?1 -
There is no versus on these two points. They work in tandem together to great effect, or you do one or the other. The only way "diet" works against (hence, versus) exercise is if the diet consists of too much food that you don't need.0
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jasondjulian wrote: »There is no versus on these two points. They work in tandem together to great effect, or you do one or the other. The only way "diet" works against (hence, versus) exercise is if the diet consists of too much food that you don't need.
I had not stated one verses the other, I had said there are two sides to the equation, calories in and calories out.i had not said, or implied, diet works against exercise.0 -
jasondjulian wrote: »There is no versus on these two points. They work in tandem together to great effect, or you do one or the other. The only way "diet" works against (hence, versus) exercise is if the diet consists of too much food that you don't need.
I had not stated one verses the other, I had said there are two sides to the equation, calories in and calories out.i had not said, or implied, diet works against exercise.
I don't think that comment was in response to you - I think it was a general response to OP's question. I suspect you got woo'd because someone doesn't know what the woo button is for.4 -
It's simple: CICO, bit there are two sides to the equation, through watching what you eat you manage the calories in, and through every you can increase the calories out. However, it's easier to manage calories in, as that is under your direct control. The calories out may be used to create or increase a deficit, bit it's harder that way, firstly it takes more exercise than most people realise to burn calories, also it is hard to measure the level of calories burned even with heart monitors as they will be estimates (plus as you do more and your body gets used to it, it will learn how to work more efficiently, burning fewer calories). Ideally, both are good
Why the woo?
I didn't woo you, but the change in calorie burn from increased efficiency/adaptation is pretty trivial. The change in HRM calorie estimate can be more significant as fitness/conditioning improves and the same work causes less stress, but the same work at the same body size burns about the same number of calories. Heart rate is a proxy for calorie burn, not a measurement of it.
Or somebody thought "woo" was positive.
Edited: Originally typed "estimate" where I meant "measurement" . . . bad brain thingie2 -
jasondjulian wrote: »There is no versus on these two points. They work in tandem together to great effect, or you do one or the other. The only way "diet" works against (hence, versus) exercise is if the diet consists of too much food that you don't need.
Totally agree! I mean versus in regards to others' personal preferences0 -
It's simple: CICO, bit there are two sides to the equation, through watching what you eat you manage the calories in, and through every you can increase the calories out. However, it's easier to manage calories in, as that is under your direct control. The calories out may be used to create or increase a deficit, bit it's harder that way, firstly it takes more exercise than most people realise to burn calories, also it is hard to measure the level of calories burned even with heart monitors as they will be estimates (plus as you do more and your body gets used to it, it will learn how to work more efficiently, burning fewer calories). Ideally, both are good
Why the woo?
I didn't woo you, but the change in calorie burn from increased efficiency/adaptation is pretty trivial. The change in HRM calorie estimate can be more significant as fitness/conditioning improves and the same work causes less stress, but the same work at the same body size burns about the same number of calories. Heart rate is a proxy for calorie burn, not an estimate of it.
Or somebody thought "woo" was positive.
I didn't "woo" either... but can I just ask, what does it actually mean!? I'm guessing it's negative!? 0 -
I lost my first 50lbs without meaningful exercise. Now? I still CAN lose if I don't, but it's much harder. I find that when I work out in the morning, especially, I'm more inclined to make better choices during the day and feel better overall.1
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First time I've ever posted on here (looooong time lurker - it's amazing how much this forum keeps me going!) but this is the first time I feel I could chip in a little...
I've done a mixture of both with various results.. Last year I followed MFP religiously but I was in the gym EVERY day for month - my boyfriend was a PT at the time and so I did all his spin classes as well as walking there to and from home (2miles each way) and did a multitude of lifting.
After 3/4mths of this I was exhausted and permanently hungry. I'd gone from 69.5kg to 66.9kg and had deficits of calories that were extremely unhealthy. I then relaxed on food, gym etc - still going to the gym but I'd lost my zest for logging and ended up putting on the weight and then some up to 70.3kg... so 5 weeks ago I decided to relax my gym approach and instead focus on my diet using MFP and again weighing everything to nth degree.
For the first time in years I wasn't doing 10 spin classes a week and huge amounts of cardio and instead I'd walk to the gym after work and then do some lifting with my boyfriend for around 60-90mins 3/4 times a week. In those 5 weeks I've gone down to 65.6kg and down a dress size.
This was a huge shock to me as I was obsessively weighing everything last year when I was going hell for leather at the gym and didn't have the same results. In these last 5 weeks I've also been able to have some chocolate each day, a few takeaways and still enjoy food! My target is 62kg but to see the results of not going crazy at the gym appear more swiftly has changed my outlook on it all.
I appreciate it's completely personal but I would say not to beat yourself up if you aren't going to the gym or exercising constantly - you'd be surprised what you can achieve with diet alone :-)15 -
For me exercise was more important.2
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It's simple: CICO, bit there are two sides to the equation, through watching what you eat you manage the calories in, and through every you can increase the calories out. However, it's easier to manage calories in, as that is under your direct control. The calories out may be used to create or increase a deficit, bit it's harder that way, firstly it takes more exercise than most people realise to burn calories, also it is hard to measure the level of calories burned even with heart monitors as they will be estimates (plus as you do more and your body gets used to it, it will learn how to work more efficiently, burning fewer calories). Ideally, both are good
Why the woo?
I didn't woo you, but the change in calorie burn from increased efficiency/adaptation is pretty trivial. The change in HRM calorie estimate can be more significant as fitness/conditioning improves and the same work causes less stress, but the same work at the same body size burns about the same number of calories. Heart rate is a proxy for calorie burn, not an estimate of it.
Or somebody thought "woo" was positive.
I didn't "woo" either... but can I just ask, what does it actually mean!? I'm guessing it's negative!?
It is negative... basically a way to indicate a nonsensical post.1 -
RossiCristina wrote: »First time I've ever posted on here (looooong time lurker - it's amazing how much this forum keeps me going!) but this is the first time I feel I could chip in a little...
I've done a mixture of both with various results.. Last year I followed MFP religiously but I was in the gym EVERY day for month - my boyfriend was a PT at the time and so I did all his spin classes as well as walking there to and from home (2miles each way) and did a multitude of lifting.
After 3/4mths of this I was exhausted and permanently hungry. I'd gone from 69.5kg to 66.9kg and had deficits of calories that were extremely unhealthy. I then relaxed on food, gym etc - still going to the gym but I'd lost my zest for logging and ended up putting on the weight and then some up to 70.3kg... so 5 weeks ago I decided to relax my gym approach and instead focus on my diet using MFP and again weighing everything to nth degree.
For the first time in years I wasn't doing 10 spin classes a week and huge amounts of cardio and instead I'd walk to the gym after work and then do some lifting with my boyfriend for around 60-90mins 3/4 times a week. In those 5 weeks I've gone down to 65.6kg and down a dress size.
This was a huge shock to me as I was obsessively weighing everything last year when I was going hell for leather at the gym and didn't have the same results. In these last 5 weeks I've also been able to have some chocolate each day, a few takeaways and still enjoy food! My target is 62kg but to see the results of not going crazy at the gym appear more swiftly has changed my outlook on it all.
I appreciate it's completely personal but I would say not to beat yourself up if you aren't going to the gym or exercising constantly - you'd be surprised what you can achieve with diet alone :-)
That's brilliant!! Well done to you!
A few people have said that weight training is better than cardio. I mainly use an exercise bike around 4 times a week but started with weights over the weekend too.1 -
RossiCristina wrote: »First time I've ever posted on here (looooong time lurker - it's amazing how much this forum keeps me going!) but this is the first time I feel I could chip in a little...
I've done a mixture of both with various results.. Last year I followed MFP religiously but I was in the gym EVERY day for month - my boyfriend was a PT at the time and so I did all his spin classes as well as walking there to and from home (2miles each way) and did a multitude of lifting.
After 3/4mths of this I was exhausted and permanently hungry. I'd gone from 69.5kg to 66.9kg and had deficits of calories that were extremely unhealthy. I then relaxed on food, gym etc - still going to the gym but I'd lost my zest for logging and ended up putting on the weight and then some up to 70.3kg... so 5 weeks ago I decided to relax my gym approach and instead focus on my diet using MFP and again weighing everything to nth degree.
For the first time in years I wasn't doing 10 spin classes a week and huge amounts of cardio and instead I'd walk to the gym after work and then do some lifting with my boyfriend for around 60-90mins 3/4 times a week. In those 5 weeks I've gone down to 65.6kg and down a dress size.
This was a huge shock to me as I was obsessively weighing everything last year when I was going hell for leather at the gym and didn't have the same results. In these last 5 weeks I've also been able to have some chocolate each day, a few takeaways and still enjoy food! My target is 62kg but to see the results of not going crazy at the gym appear more swiftly has changed my outlook on it all.
I appreciate it's completely personal but I would say not to beat yourself up if you aren't going to the gym or exercising constantly - you'd be surprised what you can achieve with diet alone :-)
That's brilliant!! Well done to you!
A few people have said that weight training is better than cardio. I mainly use an exercise bike around 4 times a week but started with weights over the weekend too.
Not necessarily better, just different.
Cardio typically burns more calories, and improves cardiovascular fitness. Strength training makes you stronger, and can improve body composition. They're both good, they both help appearance, they both potentially help weight loss.8 -
RossiCristina wrote: »First time I've ever posted on here (looooong time lurker - it's amazing how much this forum keeps me going!) but this is the first time I feel I could chip in a little...
I've done a mixture of both with various results.. Last year I followed MFP religiously but I was in the gym EVERY day for month - my boyfriend was a PT at the time and so I did all his spin classes as well as walking there to and from home (2miles each way) and did a multitude of lifting.
After 3/4mths of this I was exhausted and permanently hungry. I'd gone from 69.5kg to 66.9kg and had deficits of calories that were extremely unhealthy. I then relaxed on food, gym etc - still going to the gym but I'd lost my zest for logging and ended up putting on the weight and then some up to 70.3kg... so 5 weeks ago I decided to relax my gym approach and instead focus on my diet using MFP and again weighing everything to nth degree.
For the first time in years I wasn't doing 10 spin classes a week and huge amounts of cardio and instead I'd walk to the gym after work and then do some lifting with my boyfriend for around 60-90mins 3/4 times a week. In those 5 weeks I've gone down to 65.6kg and down a dress size.
This was a huge shock to me as I was obsessively weighing everything last year when I was going hell for leather at the gym and didn't have the same results. In these last 5 weeks I've also been able to have some chocolate each day, a few takeaways and still enjoy food! My target is 62kg but to see the results of not going crazy at the gym appear more swiftly has changed my outlook on it all.
I appreciate it's completely personal but I would say not to beat yourself up if you aren't going to the gym or exercising constantly - you'd be surprised what you can achieve with diet alone :-)
^^^^ Enters the forum, calls her shot, puts one over the wall. Colossal first post.
That said, as many posters have mentioned it's not really a "vs." question. Diet is the easiest to control. I believe there are diminishing returns from cardio in terms of weight loss. Not saying cardio is bad. Certainly there are many advantages to being aerobically fit and able to perform athletically in things that require it.5 -
The physics are clear, it's CICO. But, I find that exercise has lots of intangibles that help in your overall struggle. Time at the gym or on the road is less time in the pantry. Fitness helps with self-esteem and your emotional resilience. Working out gives you an excuse to buy fitness wear and look fabulous ;-) In my experience, running provides the best short-cut to rapid weight loss but it's not easy or even advisable when your BMI is in the high twenties or above--pretty hard on the joints. Also, weight training is best for overall body composition and long-term mobility (everyone wants buns of steel). I don't think I've said anything new here other than acknowledging the fringe benefits of exercise.4
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missysippy930 wrote: »There are LOTS and LOTS of people everyday in the gym that exercise and see no body fat loss. And that's cause they don't EAT in a calorie deficit.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
^Exactly this
You can exercise, but unless you are at a calorie deficit, you will not lose weight.
And you can even gain weight. Been there, done that. Went to the gym every day for 2 years and I gained 10 pounds over that time.
I feel super hungry eating to lose 2 lbs a week when I am not exercising. I am able to eat above my bmr when i exercise and dont feel as hungry and weak. I dont like when people discourage exercisr because it can make dieting so much more doable especially when you are big and need a big deficit.1 -
Added benefit of exercise is that it will increase your metabolism as well so you will burn more calories throughout the day as well as what you burnt exercising.
In order for this to be significantly true, the type of exercise your doing is strength training to build muscle mass.
Exercise (with the correct intensity and resistance) will tear down your body to cause a stimulus. You then need the rest and provide the nutrition necessary to your body in order for it to recover as to stimulate muscle hypertrophy. The more muscle mass you have, the more calories your body burns by doing nothing extra (increase metabolism).
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I know that the general consensus is that diet is more important when trying to lose weight, however, I have found that since exercising 4 times a week the lbs are dropping off at a much higher speed. I don't know if this is because of the exercise (increasing cal deficit) or because I am being more conscious about my diet because of the exercise...
What's everybody else's views/experiences? Is diet more important than exercise or is exercise equally important in terms of losing weight?
I don't really think the general consensus is that diet is more important, I think the general consensus is that calorie restriction is important. There are two sides to that coin, the amount you intake and the amount you expend. Establishing a caloric deficit through diet or through exercise are both equally valid approaches.
Now that said that is just the math of it and everyone has their own opinon and means of approaching that. Personally I think you end up overall healthier if you include an increase in activity level as a means of losing weight versus only doing diet. I also feel it is easier to establish a deficit while still getting to eat a satiating amount of food if you increase your activity level (and thus the total amount of calories you need to eat). But that is personal opinion and I do not claim it is a one-size-fits-all sort of statement that I would claim to be the "best" for everyone.
Now if the goal is to be healthier and not just lighter then I'd say exercise is pretty vital to that.4
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