Really???
Replies
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Absolutely. You can eat whatever you want and lose weight as long as you eat less calories than you are burning. You have to experiment and do what is right and works for you.
My friend joined Medi-Fast. They encourage you to not eat fruit or bread (among other things). My friend lost 50 pounds and inspired me to try to lose weight. I certainly didn't want to spend that kind of money. I found MFP and cut out sweets, fruit, bread, etc. and lost weight. As I began reading the postings on MFP, I discovered that you don't need to cut out anything if you don't want to. I began eating anything I wanted to, stuck to my calorie deficit, and guess what. I still lost weight. There is no magic to losing weight, it is just eating less calories than your body burns.
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I'm not sure what's confusing about telling people that if dessert fits their calories, they can enjoy it and still lose? Not scorning at all. Just genuinely curious where the confusion is.16
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stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
I honestly never understand the idea that people who say you can eat anything are "gloating". And it this instance it certainly wasn't presented that way!
I struggled for years to lose weight because I believed I had to eat all healthy foods to lose weight, and my willpower just couldn't do it. So I would go from feeling deprived to feeling guilty to giving up. Over and over again. When I came here and saw all these people say I could eat whatever I wanted and lose, it was like this huge weight was lifted off my shoulders. I could have a little ice cream after dinner and still lose! I could go to McDonald's with my nephew and not ruin my diet!
I know so many people who think they are hopeless because they can't stick to a "healthy" diet. They don't even try anymore. And if you spend a few weeks or months reading around the forums, you'll find we get tons of people who honestly believe if they eat a piece of cake at a birthday party they will not be able to lose weight.
No one here is saying you should eat all donuts. Just that you can eat a donut every once and awhile and still lose weight if you stick to your calorie goal. To me that's the opposite of confusing. Confusing is trying to keep straight which foods are good and which foods are bad and whether I'm eating "healthy" enough or not.
And it is the honest truth, that weight loss comes down to calories. How you get there and how difficult it is is personal, and no one here is saying otherwise. I'm no special person, not all that active, not a paragon of willpower, and I find the message empowering and hopeful.22 -
stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
see already I've upset the disciples, get over it. you have found nirvana, the rest of us aren't sure
it has nothing to do with being 'so sure'. it has to do with science and i dont make the science, i only know what it is.
ive lost 100+ pounds. dont you dare say it was easy, it was one of the hardest things ive ever done. i earned every lost pound!
i eat whatever i want - as long as it fits in my calories. if i had tried to stick to a diet of boiled chicken and broccoli, id have failed at day 2.
So, i learned how to properly weight my food. i counted calories for 3 years straight. i ate cake and pizza and burgers and beer and ate out (frequently). i made. it. fit. i worked out more if i needed more wiggle room. i went on vacations and to parties and spent half a summer drunk on my neighbors back deck every weekend when I was leaving a bad marriage.
so please, since you know oh so much, tell me where i failed.
cause science isn't real, right?
by the way, i maintain without logging because i learned how to eat, and portion sizes and mentally tally the crap in my head and spot check and log on occasion and when i think about it, or sometimes simply to plan out my week, and just to make sure im still doing it right ....17 -
stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
see already I've upset the disciples, get over it. you have found nirvana, the rest of us aren't sure
I'm now goading you nah sayers, push that woo button. Sick and tired of the I've done it what's wrong with you, looser attitude. Get a grip on your approach, this isn't a religion or what ever likewise, no one hopefully gets killed - I really hope the conscious is we achieve our goals, no prizes.
Well, I was looking for something worthwhile-ish for my 4,000th post
Your previous posts up-thread show that you're getting it. This one not so much.
It is NOT confusing, or insulting, to be told that you have to experiment and find a way to eat both food that is healthy and food that you crave, or is convenient, within the context of your goals, in order to succeed.
It IS confusing AND insulting to hand you blanket suggestions telling you "don't eat junk to lose", "don't eat after 5pm", "don't eat whites only eat browns", "intermittent fasting", "keto", "low fat", or whatever else is fashionable, or profitable.
To borrow your OWN analogy we are discussing the open road and potholes as opposed to a specific track.
How the **kittens** is that insulting or putting you down?
Think about it.
And while you're doing so try to remember that a smaller and more flexible deficit over a longer period of time may make things easier than a larger more strict deficit that makes adherence too stressful and hard!27 -
stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
see already I've upset the disciples, get over it. you have found nirvana, the rest of us aren't sure
I'm now goading you nah sayers, push that woo button. Sick and tired of the I've done it what's wrong with you, looser attitude. Get a grip on your approach, this isn't a religion or what ever likewise, no one hopefully gets killed - I really hope the conscious is we achieve our goals, no prizes.
Well that escalated quickly. I’m really not sure what you’re disputing or debating since it’s buried amidst so much animosity that seems a little misplaced given the trial and error recommendations of your first post in this thread.14 -
catherineroberts87 wrote: »Chill peeps I was referring to the ops question of why slimming world don’t allow takeaways...probably because they’re trying to promote healthy lifestyle /proper nutrition as well as weight loss. To those who don’t think takeaways are unhealthy...I don’t understand why you would think that.
Because I get bloodwork done twice a year and all my health markers are excellent, while still eating takeaway food on a regular basis (2-3 times a week). I've also been maintaing a largish weight loss for years now, and keep my bmi in the 20-21 range while eating takeaway food, no problem. I focus first on keeping within my calorie targets, and then eating a varied diet of all the foods I enjoy. Nothing is off limits and this has made the whole process sustainable long term for me11 -
I'm confused, too.
Sooo . . . I'm gathering it's "religious" and prescriptive to say that calorie counting can work for weight loss, and that you can eat what you want within calories, but you may need it to tweak your eating for satiation or nutrition (because nutrition is important), and it's OK to fit in treats once the nutrition boxes are checked. It's also maybe high-handed and elitist to say it's OK to eat at McDonald's sometimes?
But it's not "religious" to say that you should always eat "good" foods, and eschew "bad" foods, because "bad" foods will doom you to a living h**l of fatness and ill health?
Yeah, I know I'm exaggerating . . . but it seems like this undercurrent is in here to a certain extent.
WT actual foo-foo?!?12 -
stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
see already I've upset the disciples, get over it. you have found nirvana, the rest of us aren't sure
I'm now goading you nah sayers, push that woo button. Sick and tired of the I've done it what's wrong with you, looser attitude. Get a grip on your approach, this isn't a religion or what ever likewise, no one hopefully gets killed - I really hope the conscious is we achieve our goals, no prizes.
What the...? Why so angry?
You went from posting a thoughtful reply earlier in this thread to this bizarre tantrum replying to a poster who was absolutely NOT gloating.
And btw....she's right.16 -
Yip, I've made progress but not enough. My initial comment here seems to have to have hit a mark, but subsequent have not garened me, more woo's, expected I guess. That was not my intention.
I will take this offline - the discussion has vered so far from the original - little wonder why so many of these well intended posts end up unresolved in the bin with so may negative reactions.
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LifeWithPie wrote: »[
What the...? Why so angry?
You went from posting a thoughtful reply earlier in this thread to this bizarre tantrum replying to a poster who was absolutely NOT gloating.
And btw....she's right.
Fair enough on the last point. I'll stick with my original post and retract anything I said post that. I have learn't my lesson not to question in certain parts of this site, however I cannot stand by and see people forcing their will -OK- provocative language.
What starts out to be a valid question on the site, turns into an irritation for some with valid responses whilst some side snides which escalate out of hand. oh dear I've lost the plot, but spare a thought, the OP hasn't commented either. this, I believe is far too toxic for an honest response, If I may, take it offline .
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I'm team butter. I bloody love butter me5
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Seriously though OP. I also work nights but have lost 4 stone 9lb in less than 3 years with only 8 lb to my goal weight. It does get easier and I've found that reading the posts on the community here teaches you a lot about what works when it comes to losing weight. I quite often have takeaways and I'm a bugger for crisps, I love them (more of a salt lover than sweet). Believe me you can lose weight eating what you want as long as you put the effort in by weighing and scanning everything you eat. Good luck to you.7
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stevephi01 wrote: »LifeWithPie wrote: »[
What the...? Why so angry?
You went from posting a thoughtful reply earlier in this thread to this bizarre tantrum replying to a poster who was absolutely NOT gloating.
And btw....she's right.
Fair enough on the last point. I'll stick with my original post and retract anything I said post that. I have learn't my lesson not to question in certain parts of this site, however I cannot stand by and see people forcing their will -OK- provocative language.
What starts out to be a valid question on the site, turns into an irritation for some with valid responses whilst some side snides which escalate out of hand. oh dear I've lost the plot, but spare a thought, the OP hasn't commented either. this, I believe is far too toxic for an honest response, If I may, take it offline .
Nor surprising you're confused, as it appears OP changed his or her user name during the course of this thread. OP has returned to comment several times -- although he or she may be spread thin keeping up with the several other "will I still lose weight if I stay under my calorie goal but eat X?" threads he or she has started recently.6 -
I’m sorry but what’s wrong with changing a username?? Iv been reading the comments, but the thread has literally gone from 0-100 so as I don’t really know what I’m talking about when it comes to weight loss, I thought I’d keep quiet. Oh and it’s a ‘she’6
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1000 calories of broccoli is EXACTLY the same as 1000 calories of chocolate. Excatly. Obviously the portion, nutrients and macros ect are different but the calories are the same.
Im a nurse, night shift ect, ive managed to lose 15kg using mfp. Using the calories in calories out equation. Ive browsed forums, meet many inspiring, committed, passionate and educated people. I wouldnt bother questioning the CICO formula here, disecting it. It has work for 1000's of us. Asking question and learning, actually taking in information and paying attention is a great tool here to help you on your way to learning about MFP and losing weight. Dont be discouraged by our passionate answers or retorts. Its taken me years to find something that works and when im questioned and dou ted constantly after physical proof of my weight loss on MFP it gets tired. Keep learning and lurking. Goodluck9 -
Just a small aside. @kq1981 funny you posted today. This morning you came to my mind and I was wondering how you were doing since I haven't seen much of you since Feb. Glad to see you're doing well.5
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amusedmonkey wrote: »Just a small aside. @kq1981 funny you posted today. This morning you came to my mind and I was wondering how you were doing since I haven't seen much of you since Feb. Glad to see you're doing well.
Oh my gosh!!! great minds! Lol i saw you post aswell and wondered how you were!!! Love your posts, always learning From you1 -
stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
see already I've upset the disciples, get over it. you have found nirvana, the rest of us aren't sure
I'm now goading you nah sayers, push that woo button. Sick and tired of the I've done it what's wrong with you, looser attitude. Get a grip on your approach, this isn't a religion or what ever likewise, no one hopefully gets killed - I really hope the conscious is we achieve our goals, no prizes.
The people that you are accusing of gloating because they have it easy and have reached "nirvana" have actually worked very hard to be where they are. They've learned much along the way and are passing it on--FOR FREE. You don't have to agree with everything they say, but these criticisims are a bit much. Sit back and learn---be a lurker for awhile.19 -
This thread has passed some free time for me this morning
I think the rule of thumb is to take advice from those who've been here for ages, have lost the weight and kept it off - noone gets that far without learning lots and like snowflake954 says, its those peeps who pass on their knowledge because they want to help others.12 -
Factors that influence CiCo:
http://www.shiftn.com/obesity/Full-Map.html
So ... lets keep it simple:
Yes you can reduce weight with chocolate-cake and soda, provided you don't go above your personal calorie-budget ... Thing is: chocolate-cake and soda have an extremely high caloric density therefore your stomach will be empty most of the day. Means: You will feel hungry most of the day ... which makes it extremely hard to stay below your budget ...
As a side-effect you will most likely die because of mal-nutrition.16 -
Rincewind_1965 wrote: »Factors that influence CiCo:
http://www.shiftn.com/obesity/Full-Map.html
So ... lets keep it simple:
Yes you can reduce weight with chocolate-cake and soda, provided you don't go above your personal calorie-budget ... Thing is: chocolate-cake and soda have an extremely high caloric density therefore your stomach will be empty most of the day. Means: You will feel hungry most of the day ... which makes it extremely hard to stay below your budget ...
As a side-effect you will most likely die because of mal-nutrition.
OP said she just wants to know if she can eat SOME McDonalds and cake, not ONLY McDonalds and cake.
Why do people always assume someone would eat a diet exclusively of junk when they ask a simple question, “can I still eat this and lose weight”.
Why jump to the most extreme scenario? Is that what you would want, to eat nothing but McDs and cake?20 -
Rincewind_1965 wrote: »Factors that influence CiCo:
http://www.shiftn.com/obesity/Full-Map.html
So ... lets keep it simple:
Yes you can reduce weight with chocolate-cake and soda, provided you don't go above your personal calorie-budget ... Thing is: chocolate-cake and soda have an extremely high caloric density therefore your stomach will be empty most of the day. Means: You will feel hungry most of the day ... which makes it extremely hard to stay below your budget ...
As a side-effect you will most likely die because of mal-nutrition.
Whoa. Death by Mal-nutrition from eating cake and soda is a little of a stretch. Ill take some calcium from my chocolate cake any day.
I find THIS simple. Log your foods, eventually start to weigh your food when youre in a good mind set with MFP, be honest, dont deprive, stick with it, learn from these forums, keep going no matter what. Even if you go over your calorie allowance, get back to it the next day. If weight loss is what you are after, eating at your deficit will help do this. Whether its butter smoothered broccoli, chocolate or cake. Just keep logging and learning.17 -
Rincewind_1965 wrote: »Factors that influence CiCo:
http://www.shiftn.com/obesity/Full-Map.html
So ... lets keep it simple:
Yes you can reduce weight with chocolate-cake and soda, provided you don't go above your personal calorie-budget ... Thing is: chocolate-cake and soda have an extremely high caloric density therefore your stomach will be empty most of the day. Means: You will feel hungry most of the day ... which makes it extremely hard to stay below your budget ...
As a side-effect you will most likely die because of mal-nutrition.
If you look at the map more closely, you'll see psychological and social factors listed. Learning to navigate both with the least amount of stress (one of the busiest nodes on the map) can go a long way towards reducing out of control demand for indulgence and compensation (another node), which in turn normalizes these foods and helps establish less damaging dietary habits (yet another node) not built on cycles of overindulgence and restriction out of guilt. Having chocolate cake sometimes without feeling guilty about it can be a good strategy to achieve this goal for many people.
Having nothing but chocolate cake and soda is a diet that only exists in the minds of those who think that's what people are advocating. Any person with a brain can recognize that hunger is unpleasant and minimizing it is pleasant. That doesn't make cake bad or forbidden, it only makes it a less suitable item to eat for the purpose of staving off hunger. If hunger isn't an issue, or if cake eating happens infrequently enough so that hunger is less of an issue, psychological needs are important too.14 -
Rincewind_1965 wrote: »Factors that influence CiCo:
http://www.shiftn.com/obesity/Full-Map.html
So ... lets keep it simple:
Yes you can reduce weight with chocolate-cake and soda, provided you don't go above your personal calorie-budget ... Thing is: chocolate-cake and soda have an extremely high caloric density therefore your stomach will be empty most of the day. Means: You will feel hungry most of the day ... which makes it extremely hard to stay below your budget ...
As a side-effect you will most likely die because of mal-nutrition.
At first I thought you were saying that if the average person had a piece of cake and some soda, their stomach would be empty so they'd be hungry. Which I thought was weird because a piece of cake will be like 300 cals and a soda is 150, so you can still eat like 1,000 cals of filling food and probably be fine.
But then you mentioned dying of malnutrition which means you are debating on the basis of someone eating nothing but chocolate cake and soda. All day, every day. Which literally no one is suggesting or even considering.
So I'm confused. I mean I'm going to assume you didn't read the whole thread, but even if all you read was the OP... I'm confused. Can you elaborate please?9 -
stevephi01 wrote: »callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »its all about CICO. whether its jelly donuts, broccoli or fast food, if you burn more than you eat, no, it does NOT matter- you will lose weight.
what is nutritious and filling, is an entirely different issue.
I'm sorry, but that is confusing to a person trying to get onto the weight loss ladder. Some may be able to eat what they wish, within certain limits, but others can't.
It is almost as though gaining that higher level is an allusive, non attainable feat but hey hoe some have.
The loss is easier for some than others, factors which those who find it easier are scorned - so you climbed the mountain and can gloat -please it isn't about that, I did it whats wrong with you. If there were a sure fire one size fits all answer, we wouldn't be here.
see already I've upset the disciples, get over it. you have found nirvana, the rest of us aren't sure
I'm now goading you nah sayers, push that woo button. Sick and tired of the I've done it what's wrong with you, looser attitude. Get a grip on your approach, this isn't a religion or what ever likewise, no one hopefully gets killed - I really hope the conscious is we achieve our goals, no prizes.
Where exactly was she gloating?6 -
I broke a cardinal rule of allowing myself to get upset and then hit the keyboard, I am neither proud nor happy what I did.
To those whom I made accusations, my sincerest apologies - I was not directing to any person, but that is beside the point.
I wish not to inflame the situation any more than what I've already done. Trying to rephrase my thoughts more succinctly, I believe will not resolve anything.
I will head snowflakes' advice and lurk.10 -
I don’t want to eat McDonald’s and cake everyday!!!! I just wanted to know if I could have them things that’s all! I struggle to loose weight as it is, as I take an antidepressant which makes me crave food *this is a side effect so no comments please*. I just needed educating!10
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I don’t want to eat McDonald’s and cake everyday!!!! I just wanted to know if I could have them things that’s all! I struggle to loose weight as it is, as I take an antidepressant which makes me crave food *this is a side effect so no comments please*. I just needed educating!
Unfortunately, the thread has wandered far from your OP, and sometimes posters don't read a post carefully before replying. If you stick around, you'll get used to it Some things I had to get used to in a public forum - Don't take anything personally, don't try to read tone into a typed post, and don't feel responsibility for where a thread may wander after you hit "Post"!10 -
stevephi01 wrote: »Hi @staceyuden. I'm straying into the lions den here and will no doubt be getting a lot of woos over my post Many of these knowledgeable folk have been here for awhile and understandably get tired of the same sorts of questions.
I've been in the same boat and was trying to find a starting point when what I thought was right stopped working, my tuppence worth - if it helps brilliant.
If I may take the discussion away from calories for a moment. Start by capturing absolutely everything in your diary, if you are not using the MFP app, I suggest you load it and scan everything. I have found the database is very good at every UK item I've thrown at it. The same applies to meals you prepare at home, create recipes of the meals, again every bar code I've scanned has worked, even the supermarket own branded products. Use a digital scale and weigh every item you add - I write it down and scan/capture later. It sounds a bind, but pretty quickly it becomes second nature. I'm forever reaching for my trusty Salter!
Then once you have that, you naturally will have the calories consumed, but don't stop there. MFP have a very good breakdown of carbs, protein, fat and nutrients.
You now have a good base from which to work.
Explore the reports and then look at each of the items available. You can see how you stack up against the 'RDA' for each and if one is too high, then you know which area to look at, likewise if one is low.
Now you can start to make adjustments based on fact. For me this is getting the balance right. If you fancy a McDo, put it in and you'll see what that does to your figures. You can try and experiment in your diary before you buy one and then decide.
OK, lets bring back the calories - it did seem like I was dismissing them, not at all - get the balance right and within your calorie allowance and I am pretty confident in no time at all you'll be having to go down the dress shop for something smaller
In my case, I was hell bent on the calorie deficit. I'd stay within my limit and burn a modest amount of cals walking and attacking my rowing machine, it worked for a while then stopped. I was feeling washed out, depressed and generally felt awful.
I hadn't paid attention to the nutrients and in my case found I was almost non existent in my potassium intake, fat was low and I was under in my protein. I've adjusted that and lost a bit overnight. I had been losing, but not that I could tell from the scale - I was retaining water.
Once through the maze it is so easy to look back and see the right path, whilst in it, well it's just a maze!
I wish you well and applaud what you do, my OH used to do that and know how stressful it is. You don't mention the reason for the lack of sleep, could be because you do nights, or it could be due to not being able to sleep. If the latter, possibly when you are in balance you'll find that becomes easier too.
Good luck
This is actually really solid, and how MFP is meant to work. Once in a while, a hater will come along and act like counting calories or macros on MFP is promoting a garbage diet. NO. Not if you really delve into all the features of the program. Calories are only the first piece of the puzzle to take it beyond just weight loss, and into the realm of an overall healthy and nutritionally balanced diet. You can start with said "garbage diet," get the hang of tracking and see some results without the shock of a sudden diet overhaul, and then make small tweaks as you go to get more of that balance between nutrition and satisfaction.2
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