Of refeeds and diet breaks
Replies
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Interesting. I have no idea what my TSH was during adolescence. I know I feel best corrected to pretty low levels, though.
I am starting to feel worn out, but that could be anything. I have a few autoimmune conditions, my migraine botox is wearing off so my daily migraine pain level is higher, my fibro isn't feeling great these days and my IBS is flaring. It could be all of that too.
Pinpointing why I'm fatigued is always difficult. It's such a generalized symptom.
In other news, the scale is finally moving. I did indeed have a whoosh. Yay!14 -
My endo had my TSH suppressed down to around 0.01 for about 2 years because of thryoid cancer. But my followups have been excellent, so she has started raising it back up to 0.5.
Even at the extremely low TSH, I never showed any of the symptoms of hyperthyroid - no racing heart, no shaking hands, no nervousness. The only thing I noticed was heat sensitivity, but I've had that for a long time - even when I was very hypothyroid. In fact, even at the very low TSH, I was still noticing hypothyroid symptoms, such as tiredness.
I wonder if raising the TSH back up has been part of why I'm been stalled for the last few months.....I came back off my diet break last week and got the expected 5 lb woosh, but this week I've gained back 4 lbs of water weight. Its so frustrating because I know its water weight - my hands and ankles are swelled this morning - but I am so very tired of the yoyo scale that I've been riding for the last 4 months.
I've been doing a lot of strenuous yard work, too on Monday and Tuesday - pushmowed my apprx 1/2 acre lawn, then I dug post poles for my new shed that we're building complete with using the 10 lb breaker bar to dig up rocks, and I was using my hand tiller to pull up sod for planting flowers, so I expected to see a water weight bump on Tuesday morning and even Wednesday morning - that's a lot of activity for someone who is usually sedentary, and I knew my muscles would be repairing themselves after the post hole digging at least. But I didn't do anything yesterday, as I was very tired and came home from work, took a nap, went to evening church services, then vegged in front of the computer until bedtime. so I figured I ought to see the scale starting downward this morning, but nope - it was up 2 more lbs! this 4 month stall is really, really frustrating me!7 -
Lurker coming out post-attempt 1 for diet break!
I can't really give exact stats, since I was doing a competition and in a fit of fancy decided to "lose" extra pounds at the end with dehydration/decreased intake run/fasting day at the end, but from what I can best reconstruct, I think I only gained about 1-2 fat pounds.
My advice for anyone new to this is to 1) read through at least the first 10-20 pages including taking in videos and podcasts (I read through everything), and 2) to be sure to preplan your break if you can, at least for the first week of it. It was a wild ride, and while I eventually was able to get the hang of things, I really struggled with "All. The. Things." moments since I didn't pre-structure.
It was a very good learning experience, even if there was a LOT more learning than I thought there would be.
I've commenced another 12-week deficit period, with the aim of doing 2-day refeeds at maintenance calories the first two days of each week. I have to admit that it's a bit overwhelming doing this with the aim of keeping things more nutritionally dense. I know I can add cereal and other sugary items into my diet to accomplish my macro goals, but do you guys have a resource or any advice for keeping things generally on the whole-foods side? I'm OK with having something special here or there, but find I'm operating a lot better by not doing too much on the "special" spectrum. It's a slippery slope that I struggle to navigate. I'm aiming for one meal a week where the special stuff can enter play. I'm getting a tad tired of potatoes and sweet potatoes, though, so I need to figure something out (never thought I'd say that!).5 -
Oh. I never get tired of potatoes!
I have the same issue with not really doing the "special" stuff for refeeds any more. I usually eat beans and rice. Just a lot of them. Then again, I'm a vegetarian, and this is something that's normally hard for me to fit in, but it works perfectly during refeeds.
Bean pasta is another food I use during refeeds... oh, and air popped popcorn! I spray it with olive oil and use Kernel Seasonings toppers on it for different flavors.4 -
MelodiousMermaid wrote: »Lurker coming out post-attempt 1 for diet break!
I can't really give exact stats, since I was doing a competition and in a fit of fancy decided to "lose" extra pounds at the end with dehydration/decreased intake run/fasting day at the end, but from what I can best reconstruct, I think I only gained about 1-2 fat pounds.
My advice for anyone new to this is to 1) read through at least the first 10-20 pages including taking in videos and podcasts (I read through everything), and 2) to be sure to preplan your break if you can, at least for the first week of it. It was a wild ride, and while I eventually was able to get the hang of things, I really struggled with "All. The. Things." moments since I didn't pre-structure.
It was a very good learning experience, even if there was a LOT more learning than I thought there would be.
I've commenced another 12-week deficit period, with the aim of doing 2-day refeeds at maintenance calories the first two days of each week. I have to admit that it's a bit overwhelming doing this with the aim of keeping things more nutritionally dense. I know I can add cereal and other sugary items into my diet to accomplish my macro goals, but do you guys have a resource or any advice for keeping things generally on the whole-foods side? I'm OK with having something special here or there, but find I'm operating a lot better by not doing too much on the "special" spectrum. It's a slippery slope that I struggle to navigate. I'm aiming for one meal a week where the special stuff can enter play. I'm getting a tad tired of potatoes and sweet potatoes, though, so I need to figure something out (never thought I'd say that!).
If using the refeeds to spike carbs for the leptin response, you want to focus on high starch food (not that you have to, but it just helps with gastric load), and basically you'd be looking toward the obvious potatoes, pumpkins, corn, pasta, bread, and rice. Fat free cookies and cake mixes are another option.
You could use this list for ideas: https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/glycemic-index-and-glycemic-load-for-100-foods
Which was found from one of Lyle's articles discussing GI loads: https://bodyrecomposition.com/nutrition/carbohydrates-part-4-the-glycemic-load.html/4 -
MelodiousMermaid wrote: »Lurker coming out post-attempt 1 for diet break!
I can't really give exact stats, since I was doing a competition and in a fit of fancy decided to "lose" extra pounds at the end with dehydration/decreased intake run/fasting day at the end, but from what I can best reconstruct, I think I only gained about 1-2 fat pounds.
My advice for anyone new to this is to 1) read through at least the first 10-20 pages including taking in videos and podcasts (I read through everything), and 2) to be sure to preplan your break if you can, at least for the first week of it. It was a wild ride, and while I eventually was able to get the hang of things, I really struggled with "All. The. Things." moments since I didn't pre-structure.
It was a very good learning experience, even if there was a LOT more learning than I thought there would be.
I've commenced another 12-week deficit period, with the aim of doing 2-day refeeds at maintenance calories the first two days of each week. I have to admit that it's a bit overwhelming doing this with the aim of keeping things more nutritionally dense. I know I can add cereal and other sugary items into my diet to accomplish my macro goals, but do you guys have a resource or any advice for keeping things generally on the whole-foods side? I'm OK with having something special here or there, but find I'm operating a lot better by not doing too much on the "special" spectrum. It's a slippery slope that I struggle to navigate. I'm aiming for one meal a week where the special stuff can enter play. I'm getting a tad tired of potatoes and sweet potatoes, though, so I need to figure something out (never thought I'd say that!).
If using the refeeds to spike carbs for the leptin response, you want to focus on high starch food (not that you have to, but it just helps with gastric load), and basically you'd be looking toward the obvious potatoes, pumpkins, corn, pasta, bread, and rice. Fat free cookies and cake mixes are another option.
You could use this list for ideas: https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/glycemic-index-and-glycemic-load-for-100-foods
Which was found from one of Lyle's articles discussing GI loads: https://bodyrecomposition.com/nutrition/carbohydrates-part-4-the-glycemic-load.html/
Thank you for chiming in so quickly! I must have somehow missed the starch reference for it being important versus other carb sources. Hopefully I will find my love for potatoes returning by the end of the week! I think it was honestly the whole "I-don't-have-enough-fat-macros-available-to-make-this-tasty" thing. I do find them tasty with salt and pepper, just not nearly as palatable as the lovely hyper-palatable trio, lol.
@GottaBurnEmAll Thanks for the R/B thought. I hadn't been doing much for that over the last several months, so they'd pretty well fallen off the radar (medically ordered grain-free/gluten-free/dairy-free trial diet). Mmmm... spanish rice. I know what I'm doing for part of my carbs next week!
ETA: starch reference statement clarification because I apparently can't brain tonight.2 -
I have celiac disease, so everything I do is gluten free!
To dress up your potatoes, look for different herbs. Chives are good, roasting them with smoked paprika then hitting them with a squirt of lemon juice is tasty too.1 -
MelodiousMermaid wrote: »MelodiousMermaid wrote: »Lurker coming out post-attempt 1 for diet break!
I can't really give exact stats, since I was doing a competition and in a fit of fancy decided to "lose" extra pounds at the end with dehydration/decreased intake run/fasting day at the end, but from what I can best reconstruct, I think I only gained about 1-2 fat pounds.
My advice for anyone new to this is to 1) read through at least the first 10-20 pages including taking in videos and podcasts (I read through everything), and 2) to be sure to preplan your break if you can, at least for the first week of it. It was a wild ride, and while I eventually was able to get the hang of things, I really struggled with "All. The. Things." moments since I didn't pre-structure.
It was a very good learning experience, even if there was a LOT more learning than I thought there would be.
I've commenced another 12-week deficit period, with the aim of doing 2-day refeeds at maintenance calories the first two days of each week. I have to admit that it's a bit overwhelming doing this with the aim of keeping things more nutritionally dense. I know I can add cereal and other sugary items into my diet to accomplish my macro goals, but do you guys have a resource or any advice for keeping things generally on the whole-foods side? I'm OK with having something special here or there, but find I'm operating a lot better by not doing too much on the "special" spectrum. It's a slippery slope that I struggle to navigate. I'm aiming for one meal a week where the special stuff can enter play. I'm getting a tad tired of potatoes and sweet potatoes, though, so I need to figure something out (never thought I'd say that!).
If using the refeeds to spike carbs for the leptin response, you want to focus on high starch food (not that you have to, but it just helps with gastric load), and basically you'd be looking toward the obvious potatoes, pumpkins, corn, pasta, bread, and rice. Fat free cookies and cake mixes are another option.
You could use this list for ideas: https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/glycemic-index-and-glycemic-load-for-100-foods
Which was found from one of Lyle's articles discussing GI loads: https://bodyrecomposition.com/nutrition/carbohydrates-part-4-the-glycemic-load.html/
Thank you for chiming in so quickly! I must have somehow missed the starch reference for it being important versus other carb sources. Hopefully I will find my love for potatoes returning by the end of the week! I think it was honestly the whole "I-don't-have-enough-fat-macros-available-to-make-this-tasty" thing. I do find them tasty with salt and pepper, just not nearly as palatable as the lovely hyper-palatable trio, lol.
@GottaBurnEmAll Thanks for the R/B thought. I hadn't been doing much for that over the last several months, so they'd pretty well fallen off the radar (medically ordered grain-free/gluten-free/dairy-free trial diet). Mmmm... spanish rice. I know what I'm doing for part of my carbs next week!
ETA: starch reference statement clarification because I apparently can't brain tonight.
No problem. The reason that the potato hack works really well for people who seemingly stall is because it's actually difficult to overeat them, especially if it's a mono-diet. Potatoes rate high on the satiety index of food, and without additional fat calories to dress them, it actually becomes a chore, so I completely understand getting tired of them.
Though, for a more reasonable diet that includes potatoes, you actually could roast them with a bit of olive oil, S&P, chives, or whatever herbs you like, have them with some protein source and it's actually very a pleasing meal that hits all 3 macros without feeling like you broke the calorie bank.
I actually do a stir fry of sweet potato with some ground bison, onions, garlic, seasoning, and throw in spinach at the last minute to cook them down in a non-stick pan.4 -
For potatoes that taste buttery but actually have 0 butter I use this method (but serve without the butter he serves with). Amazing! https://www.allrecipes.com/video/4494/chef-johns-syracuse-salt-potatoes/3
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I actually do a stir fry of sweet potato with some ground bison, onions, garlic, seasoning, and throw in spinach at the last minute to cook them down in a non-stick pan.
Almost had me going there until last item, actually, mouth is still watering. And I'm guessing that's not some small sprig like amount for the color.
;-)2 -
I actually do a stir fry of sweet potato with some ground bison, onions, garlic, seasoning, and throw in spinach at the last minute to cook them down in a non-stick pan.
Almost had me going there until last item, actually, mouth is still watering. And I'm guessing that's not some small sprig like amount for the color.
;-)
Lol. It's about 3 oz, which cooks down (read: wilts) to about 3 tbsp. I actually do add it to provide *some* color so that my plate isn't entirely orange and brown, and to round out any micronutrients that may be lacking. I also don't cook it down to a soggy pile of sadness, just enough for it to stir into everything else and soak up the flavors.3 -
Though, for a more reasonable diet that includes potatoes, you actually could roast them with a bit of olive oil, S&P, chives, or whatever herbs you like, have them with some protein source and it's actually very a pleasing meal that hits all 3 macros without feeling like you broke the calorie bank.
A second for that idea. It's always grilling season at Casa Steve. Potatoes cut in wedges - tossed with a bit of olive oil and your favorite spice mixture - place them in a wire basket. Cook them alongside some protein on the grill. Had cedar plank salmon and potato wedges last time. Easy nutritious meal.
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Potato au gratin and vegetarian shepherd's pie (beans in the filling, potto on top) were a couple of my go to evening meals for refeeds. It did mean saving at least half of my fat cals for dinner, but my other meals were low enough fat for that to work. Of course the thread regulars probably remember the somewhat insane serving sizes and that I usually had to take a couple of goes at getting through it all
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6-days of a caloric deficit, 1-day of caloric surplus (with 300+ carbs) equals long-term success. Our brain wants energy homeostasis and dieting is no different than famine to our brain. So, either we put it back in balance (with a caloric surplus over 12-24 hrs, with ample carbs) OR our brain will do it for us by slowing metabolism.9
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Russellb97 wrote: »6-days of a caloric deficit, 1-day of caloric surplus (with 300+ carbs) equals long-term success. Our brain wants energy homeostasis and dieting is no different than famine to our brain. So, either we put it back in balance (with a caloric surplus over 12-24 hrs, with ample carbs) OR our brain will do it for us by slowing metabolism.
Did you read all the excellent info/links/resources in the OP?6 -
I have but I've been doing this since 2003. I lost 100lbs in 11 months and another 35 lbs over the past several years, without much effort. When I told people about this in 2003, I was a crazy madman because there wasn't any research. Back then the only term was "starvation mode" and that made people angry. Today, metabolic adaptation and adaptive thermogenesis are both scientifically accepted.
It has everything to do with energy homeostasis and I do NOT believe in a set-weight theory. Weight is just a consequence of energy balance and it gets stuck because of that. Also, I think glycogen storage is an important factor in all of this, which is why carb refeeds are a must.
I am thrilled to see this post still going strong!6 -
Russellb97 wrote: »I have but I've been doing this since 2003. I lost 100lbs in 11 months and another 35 lbs over the past several years, without much effort. When I told people about this in 2003, I was a crazy madman because there wasn't any research. Back then the only term was "starvation mode" and that made people angry. Today, metabolic adaptation and adaptive thermogenesis are both scientifically accepted.
It has everything to do with energy homeostasis and I do NOT believe in a set-weight theory. Weight is just a consequence of energy balance and it gets stuck because of that. Also, I think glycogen storage is an important factor in all of this, which is why carb refeeds are a must.
I am thrilled to see this post still going strong!
Congrats...
Speaking of homeostasis, if the brain is going to slow metabolism without ample carbs, but adaptive thermogenesis are scientifically accepted, which one takes precedence in a running deficit, or famine? By what mechanism do carbs and glycogen offset imbalanced homeostasis? Is there another theory other than set-weight theory that dieters can look to for long-term success? What does the overweight population need to do differently in order to get their homeostatic conditions met to be lean? Are you still considered a crazy madman now that 15 years have passed since you told people?
Your posts are enlightening. Help some of the people who may be struggling or new to this.7 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »Potato au gratin and vegetarian shepherd's pie (beans in the filling, potto on top) were a couple of my go to evening meals for refeeds. It did mean saving at least half of my fat cals for dinner, but my other meals were low enough fat for that to work. Of course the thread regulars probably remember the somewhat insane serving sizes and that I usually had to take a couple of goes at getting through it all
There was plenty of room in that potato au gratin recipe for the fat to be cut too, because as you know, I made a lower fat version
Since Nony and I are both vegetarians, these protein/carb combo meals she mentioned were perfect for refeeds for us.7 -
Russellb97 wrote: »I have but I've been doing this since 2003. I lost 100lbs in 11 months and another 35 lbs over the past several years, without much effort. When I told people about this in 2003, I was a crazy madman because there wasn't any research. Back then the only term was "starvation mode" and that made people angry. Today, metabolic adaptation and adaptive thermogenesis are both scientifically accepted.
It has everything to do with energy homeostasis and I do NOT believe in a set-weight theory. Weight is just a consequence of energy balance and it gets stuck because of that. Also, I think glycogen storage is an important factor in all of this, which is why carb refeeds are a must.
I am thrilled to see this post still going strong!
Congrats...
Speaking of homeostasis, if the brain is going to slow metabolism without ample carbs, but adaptive thermogenesis are scientifically accepted, which one takes precedence in a running deficit, or famine? By what mechanism do carbs and glycogen offset imbalanced homeostasis? Is there another theory other than set-weight theory that dieters can look to for long-term success? What does the overweight population need to do differently in order to get their homeostatic conditions met to be lean? Are you still considered a crazy madman now that 15 years have passed since you told people?
Your posts are enlightening. Help some of the people who may be struggling or new to this.
These are amazing questions, I will get to them all tonight but I gotta fly. I don't have any research evidence that glycogen is the key but studies on overfeeding and leptin show that high fat doesn't give the same benefit as high-carb after calorie restriction.
Mind you, this is a correlation, just theory, and personal experience;
Calorie restriction whether high-carb or low-carb, will deplete glycogen at some point.
Calorie restriction after several days drops leptin and begins the MA process
Short-Term Overfeeding on fat doesn't restore glycogen and research shows it doesn't boost leptin either
High-Carb does boost leptin and glycogen
Also, it can take several days of caloric restriction to deplete glycogen but it can definitely be fully restored within 24 hours of 500-1000 carbs intake.
I'll get to the other questions asap.
Thank you
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Russellb97 wrote: »Russellb97 wrote: »I have but I've been doing this since 2003. I lost 100lbs in 11 months and another 35 lbs over the past several years, without much effort. When I told people about this in 2003, I was a crazy madman because there wasn't any research. Back then the only term was "starvation mode" and that made people angry. Today, metabolic adaptation and adaptive thermogenesis are both scientifically accepted.
It has everything to do with energy homeostasis and I do NOT believe in a set-weight theory. Weight is just a consequence of energy balance and it gets stuck because of that. Also, I think glycogen storage is an important factor in all of this, which is why carb refeeds are a must.
I am thrilled to see this post still going strong!
Congrats...
Speaking of homeostasis, if the brain is going to slow metabolism without ample carbs, but adaptive thermogenesis are scientifically accepted, which one takes precedence in a running deficit, or famine? By what mechanism do carbs and glycogen offset imbalanced homeostasis? Is there another theory other than set-weight theory that dieters can look to for long-term success? What does the overweight population need to do differently in order to get their homeostatic conditions met to be lean? Are you still considered a crazy madman now that 15 years have passed since you told people?
Your posts are enlightening. Help some of the people who may be struggling or new to this.
These are amazing questions, I will get to them all tonight but I gotta fly. I don't have any research evidence that glycogen is the key but studies on overfeeding and leptin show that high fat doesn't give the same benefit as high-carb after calorie restriction.
Mind you, this is a correlation, just theory, and personal experience;
Calorie restriction whether high-carb or low-carb, will deplete glycogen at some point.
Calorie restriction after several days drops leptin and begins the MA process
Short-Term Overfeeding on fat doesn't restore glycogen and research shows it doesn't boost leptin either
High-Carb does boost leptin and glycogen
Also, it can take several days of caloric restriction to deplete glycogen but it can definitely be fully restored within 24 hours of 500-1000 carbs intake.
I'll get to the other questions asap.
Thank you
I appreciate the answers. It seems that caloric restriction causes a lot of negative effects.
If so, what benefits would dieters gain from wanting to put themselves through that? If the set-weight theory is bunk, but being in a calorie deficit does cause weight loss, wouldn't putting them back on a higher carb day of ~2000-4000kcal be putting them in that set-weight category if the weekly average resulted in no deficit, or even a surplus? At what point would they burn fat if they super compensated carbs and were trying to avoid glycogen depletion?
On the other hand, if they did follow your suggested strategy of having a 6-day calorie deficit + 1-day carb refeed and their total weekly average resulted in a net calorie deficit, wouldn't metabolic adaptation still occur by definition of being in an overall deficit?3 -
"On the other hand, if they did follow your suggested strategy of having a 6-day calorie deficit + 1-day carb refeed and their total weekly average resulted in a net calorie deficit, wouldn't metabolic adaptation still occur by definition of being in an overall deficit?"
Overall yes it's a caloric deficit. But, this is the answer to the weight loss paradox, which is; we need a caloric deficit to lose weight but a deficit will cause metabolic adaptation which hinders the loss of weight.
Or, WL = CalsIN vs CalsOUT but CalsIN directly affects CalsOUT
6-days of a deficit and 1-day of a surplus gives an overall deficit in 7 days but it breaks the pattern of 24-caloric deficits that has been proven to drop leptin. Conversely, studies on overfeeding in 12 and 24 hrs have shown to push leptin levels to and above baseline. That means you can stop MA before it ever happens. This is one key to my unique level of success.
I believe It's either following glycogen storage or it's like an ON/OFF Switch that is tracking 24-hour levels of anabolic and catabolic hormones, specifically insulin and glucagon. Since these 2 hormones are Ying/Yang, both coming from the pancreas but cannot exist simultaneously there could easily be some sort of way our body tracks it. I also believe in the 24-body clock and sleep resetting and taking inventory of these hormone imbalances to keep us in homeostasis.
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Interesting.
If CI directly affects CO, then that would mean the less we eat, the less we burn, is what I'm understanding from that.. right? Does that still apply to people who struggle with eating disorders, like anorexia? Many of them seem to have achieved very low weight and seemingly eat very low calories consistently. Why wouldn't MA kick in and stop them from losing weight?
With glucagon and insulin, I wasn't aware that they couldn't exist simultaneously. There are people that talk about insulin resistance saying that they have high levels of insulin present, does that mean glucagon wouldn't be present due to the high insulin they already have? And regarding carb intake, would you still suggest high carb days for those people? What if they were type 2 diabetic and/or on insulin therapy? They technically already have metabolic problems and are not in homeostasis, would they be able to lose weight successfully? Meaning if they couldn't handle many carbs, then their glycogen stores would always be depleted and they would hit MA, which would hinder their weight loss, right?
I'm a very curious person.11 -
Interesting.
If CI directly affects CO, then that would mean the less we eat, the less we burn, is what I'm understanding from that.. right? Does that still apply to people who struggle with eating disorders, like anorexia? Many of them seem to have achieved very low weight and seemingly eat very low calories consistently. Why wouldn't MA kick in and stop them from losing weight?
With glucagon and insulin, I wasn't aware that they couldn't exist simultaneously. There are people that talk about insulin resistance saying that they have high levels of insulin present, does that mean glucagon wouldn't be present due to the high insulin they already have? And regarding carb intake, would you still suggest high carb days for those people? What if they were type 2 diabetic and/or on insulin therapy? They technically already have metabolic problems and are not in homeostasis, would they be able to lose weight successfully? Meaning if they couldn't handle many carbs, then their glycogen stores would always be depleted and they would hit MA, which would hinder their weight loss, right?
I'm a very curious person.
Yes, this is why when we become IR and leptin resistant losing weight becomes a nightmare. However, I personally believe I've been there and came back from that place without medical intervention.
Our bodies can make glucose without carbohydrates but it will struggle to do that while in a caloric deficit.
Anorexics would be dead quickly without MA. MA can't stop WL completely but it makes it difficult. You can always eat less and move more to continue weight-loss, but why? How can that be maintained?3 -
Russellb97 wrote: »Interesting.
If CI directly affects CO, then that would mean the less we eat, the less we burn, is what I'm understanding from that.. right? Does that still apply to people who struggle with eating disorders, like anorexia? Many of them seem to have achieved very low weight and seemingly eat very low calories consistently. Why wouldn't MA kick in and stop them from losing weight?
With glucagon and insulin, I wasn't aware that they couldn't exist simultaneously. There are people that talk about insulin resistance saying that they have high levels of insulin present, does that mean glucagon wouldn't be present due to the high insulin they already have? And regarding carb intake, would you still suggest high carb days for those people? What if they were type 2 diabetic and/or on insulin therapy? They technically already have metabolic problems and are not in homeostasis, would they be able to lose weight successfully? Meaning if they couldn't handle many carbs, then their glycogen stores would always be depleted and they would hit MA, which would hinder their weight loss, right?
I'm a very curious person.
Yes, this is why when we become IR and leptin resistant losing weight becomes a nightmare. However, I personally believe I've been there and came back from that place without medical intervention.
Our bodies can make glucose without carbohydrates but it will struggle to do that while in a caloric deficit.
Anorexics would be dead quickly without MA. MA can't stop WL completely but it makes it difficult. You can always eat less and move more to continue weight-loss, but why? How can that be maintained?
I agree that without adaptation, anorexics would be dead, though many of them die due to complications anyway, outside of metabolism. As far as maintaining the 'eat less, move more' apparently there are people that have done just that. I imagine they never stopped being active after achieving a lean enough frame to be in maintenance. How did you prevent your weight regain after losing the 100+ lbs?6 -
Thank you to @Nony_Mouse , @GottaBurnEmAll , and @anubis609 for the prep suggestions. That sweet potato stir fry sounds amazing. Might give the lower fat au gratin a try too! Is there a recipe post for the altered au gratin somewhere?3
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MelodiousMermaid wrote: »Thank you to @Nony_Mouse , @GottaBurnEmAll , and @anubis609 for the prep suggestions. That sweet potato stir fry sounds amazing. Might give the lower fat au gratin a try too! Is there a recipe post for the altered au gratin somewhere?
I'm heading to bed now, but I'll send it to you in the morning.3 -
MelodiousMermaid wrote: »Thank you to @Nony_Mouse , @GottaBurnEmAll , and @anubis609 for the prep suggestions. That sweet potato stir fry sounds amazing. Might give the lower fat au gratin a try too! Is there a recipe post for the altered au gratin somewhere?
Did I post my recipe at some point? I use cottage cheese in the sauce, with a bit of hard cheese for flavour. I think @GottaBurnEmAll subbed a low fat cheese from memory. You can also skip the butter in the roux for the sauce.
This is my original recipe:
793 g, Potatoes, White, Flesh and Skin, Raw
400 ml, Calci-trim Milk (Actual)
100 g, Tasty Cheese
20 g, Fielder's Cornflour
200 g, Cottage Cheese Traditional
144 gr, Onion Raw
20 g, Butter Nz
5 g, Hot English Mustard Powder
15 g, Original Hot English Mustard (prepared)
Salt and pepper
Randomness of order of how I entered it in the recipe builder...
Basically, in a large pot, make a white sauce with the butter, dry ingredients and milk, add cottage cheese (requires several minutes stirring to melt and not just be a big glob) and hard cheese (you could skip or reduce that to get fat down), and prepared mustard to taste.
Add finely sliced potato and onion to cheese sauce and stir. Pour into lightly greased shallow ovenproof dish. Cover with foil and bake at 350 F for 1 hour. Remove foil and bake a further 20-30 minutes.
Obviously, this is enough food to feed an entire island nation (well, four pretty damn decent servings if you're not a crazy person doing a refeed)
Nutrition Facts
Servings 2.0
Amount Per Serving
kilojoules 3549/cals 845
% Daily Value *
Total Fat 33 g 51 %
Saturated Fat 14 g 71 %
Sodium 810 mg 34 % (lies, I didn't measure my salt or put it in the recipe builder)
Potassium 1719 mg 49 %
Total Carbohydrate 98 g 33 %
Dietary Fiber 10 g 39 %
Sugars 20 g
Protein 46 g 93 %
Vitamin A 0 %
Vitamin C 131 %
Calcium 93 %
Iron 12 %
* just checked and I halved the butter for subsequent batches, but again, you can skip it entirely.3 -
I have a question on water weight gain after exercise, namely how much is expected reasonably?
I'm not normally very active. I have a desk job and spend most of my day behind a computer, by the time I get home I'm exhausted despite sitting all day, and with making dinner and getting house chores done, I struggle to get any regular activity going at all. Depression is not helping on that front.
But I do have some days, usually weekends, where I get more active, especially as spring is here. For example: last week, I was very active, pushing the lawn and my parents' camp, digging post holes, planting shrubs, weedeating - a lot of physical exertion. I had the previous week weighed in at 265 lbs, but after spending 3 days doing a lot of outside work, I weighed in at 270 lbs. I know it was a lot of water weight as I felt bloated and my hands were swelled, but it was very frustrating to see that gain!
This week, however, has been rainy all week, and my church has had revival services so I haven't had time to do any activity and have been very sedentary all week. And, as the week progressed, I watched the water weight slowly drop until I hit 266 lbs today.
I understand that when you are active, your muscles need to repair themselves, so this is where some of the water weight comes into play, but can that really be as much as 4 lbs? And why does it seem to take so long to lose that excess weight? Is that something that happens even for normally active people, or if you are active, does your body adapt at some point to the constant use?0 -
bmeadows380 wrote: »I have a question on water weight gain after exercise, namely how much is expected reasonably?
I'm not normally very active. I have a desk job and spend most of my day behind a computer, by the time I get home I'm exhausted despite sitting all day, and with making dinner and getting house chores done, I struggle to get any regular activity going at all. Depression is not helping on that front.
But I do have some days, usually weekends, where I get more active, especially as spring is here. For example: last week, I was very active, pushing the lawn and my parents' camp, digging post holes, planting shrubs, weedeating - a lot of physical exertion. I had the previous week weighed in at 265 lbs, but after spending 3 days doing a lot of outside work, I weighed in at 270 lbs. I know it was a lot of water weight as I felt bloated and my hands were swelled, but it was very frustrating to see that gain!
This week, however, has been rainy all week, and my church has had revival services so I haven't had time to do any activity and have been very sedentary all week. And, as the week progressed, I watched the water weight slowly drop until I hit 266 lbs today.
I understand that when you are active, your muscles need to repair themselves, so this is where some of the water weight comes into play, but can that really be as much as 4 lbs? And why does it seem to take so long to lose that excess weight? Is that something that happens even for normally active people, or if you are active, does your body adapt at some point to the constant use?
This is a great question that I've been wondering as well.0 -
bmeadows380 wrote: »I have a question on water weight gain after exercise, namely how much is expected reasonably?
I'm not normally very active. I have a desk job and spend most of my day behind a computer, by the time I get home I'm exhausted despite sitting all day, and with making dinner and getting house chores done, I struggle to get any regular activity going at all. Depression is not helping on that front.
But I do have some days, usually weekends, where I get more active, especially as spring is here. For example: last week, I was very active, pushing the lawn and my parents' camp, digging post holes, planting shrubs, weedeating - a lot of physical exertion. I had the previous week weighed in at 265 lbs, but after spending 3 days doing a lot of outside work, I weighed in at 270 lbs. I know it was a lot of water weight as I felt bloated and my hands were swelled, but it was very frustrating to see that gain!
This week, however, has been rainy all week, and my church has had revival services so I haven't had time to do any activity and have been very sedentary all week. And, as the week progressed, I watched the water weight slowly drop until I hit 266 lbs today.
I understand that when you are active, your muscles need to repair themselves, so this is where some of the water weight comes into play, but can that really be as much as 4 lbs? And why does it seem to take so long to lose that excess weight? Is that something that happens even for normally active people, or if you are active, does your body adapt at some point to the constant use?
At your weight, 4 pounds doesn't surprise me at all. I know I've calculated out my swings to be in the ballpark of 3 percent -- sometimes it's 2.5, and sometimes it's 3.05. And, when other people post their stats, and talk about their water fluctuations, the math seems to be the same there.
So to see less than 2 percent in you? Yup, that makes sense as a weight fluctuation.0
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