Fat Loss vs Scale Weight Loss
AZackery
Posts: 2,035 Member
I want to share some information that might can help someone. I will speak for myself. I'm on the healthy and fat loss journey. I'm not trying to lose scale weight. I'm aiming to lose 100% body fat percentage/pounds of fat and inches.
I tend to make a statement that I truly believe in: "Fat loss and scale weight loss aren't the same thing."
A person can lose 5 pounds of scale weight in 5 hours, but they can't lose 5 pounds of fat in 5 hours.
I try to encourage people to track their body fat percentage and work the formula to see what they are losing or gaining. A loss can be lean body mass. A gain can be fat.
____
What is scale weight? In my own words: Scale weight is the combined pounds of fat and pounds of lean body mass that you are carrying.
Example: Jane Doe weighs 250lbs with a 40% body fat percentage.
Here's the formula to use, to determine how much of your scale weight is from fat and how much is from lean body mass.
Weight x body fat percentage = Pounds of fat
Weight - Pounds of fat = Pounds of lean body mass
Jane Doe's formula results:
250 x 40% (0.40) = 100 pounds of fat
250 - 100 = 150 pounds of lean body mass
Jane Doe's results shown a different way:
Weight: 250lbs
BF% = 40%
Pounds of fat= 100
Pounds of lean body mass = 150
A lot of people look at their scale weight, to determine how much weight they want/need to lose.
I'm going to tell you something that's going to surprise a lot of people. Your scale weight doesn't determine how much pounds of fat you need to lose, your body percentage does. Note: I've said pounds of fat, instead of weight/scale weight. There's a difference.
I will show you what I'm talking about. But, first I want to make two more important notes:
1. Your pounds of lean body mass is the requirement for your body. You want to do your best to maintain that number. Increasing it will never hurt.
2. Your pounds of body fat is not the amount of fat you need to lose nor is it the amount of scale weight you need to lose. You don't want to even lose close to that number.
Let me share the body fat percentage information. I'm breaking up the genders information. You can see the original body fat chart on this website. http://weightlossbase.org/wp-content/uploads/Body_Fat_Percentage.jpg
I want to note that the essential fat percentage is the body's requirement for the different genders. I also want to note that it's not required for a gender to get down to his or her essential fat body fat percentage. Everyone should aim for their healthy body fat percentage. When you start going below your healthy body fat percentage, you are losing lean body mass.
Classification: Women:
Essential Fat 10-12%
Athletes 14-20%
Fitness 21-24%
Acceptable 25-31%
At Risk 32% plus
Classification: Men
Essential Fat 2-4%
Athletes 6-13%
Fitness 14-17%
Acceptable 18-25%
At Risk 26% plus
(I've changed the At Risk from 25% to 26% for men. On the original chart, you will see it states 25% plus for men. If you look up body fat percentage charts online, you will basically see the 25% for At Risk for men, but to me, it doesn't make sense that a man can be both acceptable and at risk with a 25% body fat percentage. )
Now, lets look at fat loss vs scale weight loss:
Say Jane Doe looks at her 250lbs scale weight and says she wants to lose 100 pounds. Will that be healthy and realistic? Lets see.
I know the answer will be no, it's not healthy or realistic. But, I want to show why. Above, I've stated that a person's pounds of fat is not the amount they need to lose. And Jane Doe's pounds of fat is 100 and she wants to lose 100 pounds of scale weight.
Here's the way to figure out if your weight loss goal is healthy and realistic.
Formula:
A.) Initial weight - weight loss goal = future weight
B.) Future weight - Initial pounds of lean body mass = future pounds of fat (Keep in mind that your initial lean body mass is the requirement for your body)
C.) Future pounds of fat / future weight = future body fat percentage
Jane Doe's results: If she loses 100 pounds of fat.
A.) 250 (Initial weight) - 100 (weight loss goal) = 150 (Future weight)
B.) 150 (Future weight) - 150 (Initial pounds lean body mass) = 0 (Future pounds of fat)
C.) 0 (Future pounds of fat) /150 (Future weight) = 0 (Future body fat percentage)
Every body requires fat.
Let me show you a shortcut, to finding out how much pounds of fat you need to lose to get to a healthy body fat percentage and healthy scale weight. Some people may disagree with a healthy scale weight and body fat percentage result. They might think the numbers are too high.
Note: The key is to get your future pounds of fat to equal your current body fat percentage. If your body fat percentage falls under your future body fat percentage, then you will be losing lean body mass.
Formula:
A.) Initial body fat percentage number written as a number (Example: 40% would be 40)/ Initial weight = Future body fat percentage
B.) Initial weight x Future body fat percentage = Future pounds of weight
C.) Initial Lean body mass + Future pounds fat = Future healthy weight
D.) Initial pounds of fat- Future pounds of fat = Fat loss
E. Initial weight - Future pounds of weight = Scale weight loss (Same as the Fat loss number)
Red light!!!!! I know that I have said that fat loss and scale weight loss aren't the same thing. So, does this mean that I'm saying they are the same thing now in step D and E? The answer is no. When you lose 100% pounds of fat, you will lose 100% pounds of scale weight in the same amount. The 100% loss will make the numbers match.
Lets look at Jane Doe's results, using the formula above.
A. )40 (Jane's original body fat percentage number) / 250 (Jane's initial weight) = 16 (Jane's Future body fat percentage)
B.) 250 (Jane's initial weight) x 16% (Jane's Future body fat percentage) = 40 (Future pounds of fat)
C.) 150 (Jane's initial lean body mass) + 40 (Future pounds of fat) = 190 (Future healthy weight)
D.) 100 (Jane's initial pounds of fat) - 40 (Future pounds of fat) = 60 pounds of fat loss
E.) 250 (Jane's inital weight) - 190 (Jane's Future healthy weight) = 60 pounds of scale weight loss
Although, Jane weighs 250lbs, it doesn't mean that she has to lose 100lbs of scale weight. She can lose 100% of 60 pounds of fat and get down to 190 pounds of scale weight and have a lean look.
Losing 24% body fat percentage ( 40% - 24% = 16% body fat percentage) and getting down to a healthy scale weight of 190lbs will give Jane the lean look. To a lot of people, 190 pounds equals fat and that's not true.
I want to show another example of fat loss vs scale weight loss.
I'm using Jane Doe again with her initial reading. 250lbs with a 40% body fat percentage:
Say Jane Doe is a person that weighs herself every week and on 08-21-11 she weighs 250lbs with a 40% bodyfat percentage and on 08-28-11her results are 235lbs with a 39% body fat percentage. In 7 days, she has lost 15 pounds of scale weight, but lets see if she has lost 15 pounds of fat.
08-21-11 Results:
Weight: 250lbs
BF% = 40%
Pounds of fat = 100
Pounds of lean body mass = 150
08-28-11 Results:
Weight: 235lbs
BF% = 39%
Pounds of fat = 91.65
Pounds of lean body mass = 143.35
Jane lost 15 pounds of scale weight. Lets compare her results.
08-11-11 results minus 08-28-11 results:
Weight: 250 - 235 = 15 pounds
Body fat percentage: 40% - 39% = 1%
Pounds of Fat: 100 - 91.65 = 8.35 pounds of fat
Pounds of lean body mass: 150 - 143.35 = 6.65 pounds of lean body mass
Out of the 15 pounds of scale weight that Jane Doe has lost, she lost 8.35 pounds of fat and 6.65 pounds of lean body mass.
A lot of people don't track their body fat percentage. They go by what their scale weight says. When they see a lost, they link that to being (a number) fat loss. But, the example above shows that a scale weight loss doesn't always equal to a 100% fat loss. So that means that a person can't say they have lost 25 pounds of fat, without knowing if their 25 pounds of scale weight loss is 100% fat loss.
I can't tell a person what to do, but if I can advise anyone that's on the healthy road, I would advise them to start tracking their body fat percentage and working the formula to see what's going on with their body.
Here's a list of things you can use to test your body fat percentage. Keep in mind that all these devices can have up to a (-/+) 5% margin error. The only test that's said to be 100% accurate is an autopsy. Stick with a device that will show you the changes your body is doing. Just like different scales can give different readings, different body fat percentage devices can give a different reading.
1. Body fat scale: I have a body fat scale that I had for 6 years. My sister have one of those new body fat scales. I don't know the brand. Last month, my scale and her scale have given me a difference of 1% body fat percentage reading.
2. Body fat handheld monitor
3. Caliper. It's said that a person should let a professional that has a high sucess rate of testing people, test your body fat with calipers. Please note that a person can get 5 different people to test them and get five different reading.
4. Dunk Test
5. Bodpod Test
I know how much body fat percentage and pounds of fat I need to lose, in order to get to my future healthy body fat percentage and scale weight. It may take me a year or so to get there and I'm okay with that.
Can I lose some lean body mass on my journey? The answer is yes.
Can I gain some pounds of fat on my journey? The answer is yes.
These things are normal. But, I will never give up. I'm going to reach my goal.
I know that I have said a lot, but I hope that I have helped someone.
I tend to make a statement that I truly believe in: "Fat loss and scale weight loss aren't the same thing."
A person can lose 5 pounds of scale weight in 5 hours, but they can't lose 5 pounds of fat in 5 hours.
I try to encourage people to track their body fat percentage and work the formula to see what they are losing or gaining. A loss can be lean body mass. A gain can be fat.
____
What is scale weight? In my own words: Scale weight is the combined pounds of fat and pounds of lean body mass that you are carrying.
Example: Jane Doe weighs 250lbs with a 40% body fat percentage.
Here's the formula to use, to determine how much of your scale weight is from fat and how much is from lean body mass.
Weight x body fat percentage = Pounds of fat
Weight - Pounds of fat = Pounds of lean body mass
Jane Doe's formula results:
250 x 40% (0.40) = 100 pounds of fat
250 - 100 = 150 pounds of lean body mass
Jane Doe's results shown a different way:
Weight: 250lbs
BF% = 40%
Pounds of fat= 100
Pounds of lean body mass = 150
A lot of people look at their scale weight, to determine how much weight they want/need to lose.
I'm going to tell you something that's going to surprise a lot of people. Your scale weight doesn't determine how much pounds of fat you need to lose, your body percentage does. Note: I've said pounds of fat, instead of weight/scale weight. There's a difference.
I will show you what I'm talking about. But, first I want to make two more important notes:
1. Your pounds of lean body mass is the requirement for your body. You want to do your best to maintain that number. Increasing it will never hurt.
2. Your pounds of body fat is not the amount of fat you need to lose nor is it the amount of scale weight you need to lose. You don't want to even lose close to that number.
Let me share the body fat percentage information. I'm breaking up the genders information. You can see the original body fat chart on this website. http://weightlossbase.org/wp-content/uploads/Body_Fat_Percentage.jpg
I want to note that the essential fat percentage is the body's requirement for the different genders. I also want to note that it's not required for a gender to get down to his or her essential fat body fat percentage. Everyone should aim for their healthy body fat percentage. When you start going below your healthy body fat percentage, you are losing lean body mass.
Classification: Women:
Essential Fat 10-12%
Athletes 14-20%
Fitness 21-24%
Acceptable 25-31%
At Risk 32% plus
Classification: Men
Essential Fat 2-4%
Athletes 6-13%
Fitness 14-17%
Acceptable 18-25%
At Risk 26% plus
(I've changed the At Risk from 25% to 26% for men. On the original chart, you will see it states 25% plus for men. If you look up body fat percentage charts online, you will basically see the 25% for At Risk for men, but to me, it doesn't make sense that a man can be both acceptable and at risk with a 25% body fat percentage. )
Now, lets look at fat loss vs scale weight loss:
Say Jane Doe looks at her 250lbs scale weight and says she wants to lose 100 pounds. Will that be healthy and realistic? Lets see.
I know the answer will be no, it's not healthy or realistic. But, I want to show why. Above, I've stated that a person's pounds of fat is not the amount they need to lose. And Jane Doe's pounds of fat is 100 and she wants to lose 100 pounds of scale weight.
Here's the way to figure out if your weight loss goal is healthy and realistic.
Formula:
A.) Initial weight - weight loss goal = future weight
B.) Future weight - Initial pounds of lean body mass = future pounds of fat (Keep in mind that your initial lean body mass is the requirement for your body)
C.) Future pounds of fat / future weight = future body fat percentage
Jane Doe's results: If she loses 100 pounds of fat.
A.) 250 (Initial weight) - 100 (weight loss goal) = 150 (Future weight)
B.) 150 (Future weight) - 150 (Initial pounds lean body mass) = 0 (Future pounds of fat)
C.) 0 (Future pounds of fat) /150 (Future weight) = 0 (Future body fat percentage)
Every body requires fat.
Let me show you a shortcut, to finding out how much pounds of fat you need to lose to get to a healthy body fat percentage and healthy scale weight. Some people may disagree with a healthy scale weight and body fat percentage result. They might think the numbers are too high.
Note: The key is to get your future pounds of fat to equal your current body fat percentage. If your body fat percentage falls under your future body fat percentage, then you will be losing lean body mass.
Formula:
A.) Initial body fat percentage number written as a number (Example: 40% would be 40)/ Initial weight = Future body fat percentage
B.) Initial weight x Future body fat percentage = Future pounds of weight
C.) Initial Lean body mass + Future pounds fat = Future healthy weight
D.) Initial pounds of fat- Future pounds of fat = Fat loss
E. Initial weight - Future pounds of weight = Scale weight loss (Same as the Fat loss number)
Red light!!!!! I know that I have said that fat loss and scale weight loss aren't the same thing. So, does this mean that I'm saying they are the same thing now in step D and E? The answer is no. When you lose 100% pounds of fat, you will lose 100% pounds of scale weight in the same amount. The 100% loss will make the numbers match.
Lets look at Jane Doe's results, using the formula above.
A. )40 (Jane's original body fat percentage number) / 250 (Jane's initial weight) = 16 (Jane's Future body fat percentage)
B.) 250 (Jane's initial weight) x 16% (Jane's Future body fat percentage) = 40 (Future pounds of fat)
C.) 150 (Jane's initial lean body mass) + 40 (Future pounds of fat) = 190 (Future healthy weight)
D.) 100 (Jane's initial pounds of fat) - 40 (Future pounds of fat) = 60 pounds of fat loss
E.) 250 (Jane's inital weight) - 190 (Jane's Future healthy weight) = 60 pounds of scale weight loss
Although, Jane weighs 250lbs, it doesn't mean that she has to lose 100lbs of scale weight. She can lose 100% of 60 pounds of fat and get down to 190 pounds of scale weight and have a lean look.
Losing 24% body fat percentage ( 40% - 24% = 16% body fat percentage) and getting down to a healthy scale weight of 190lbs will give Jane the lean look. To a lot of people, 190 pounds equals fat and that's not true.
I want to show another example of fat loss vs scale weight loss.
I'm using Jane Doe again with her initial reading. 250lbs with a 40% body fat percentage:
Say Jane Doe is a person that weighs herself every week and on 08-21-11 she weighs 250lbs with a 40% bodyfat percentage and on 08-28-11her results are 235lbs with a 39% body fat percentage. In 7 days, she has lost 15 pounds of scale weight, but lets see if she has lost 15 pounds of fat.
08-21-11 Results:
Weight: 250lbs
BF% = 40%
Pounds of fat = 100
Pounds of lean body mass = 150
08-28-11 Results:
Weight: 235lbs
BF% = 39%
Pounds of fat = 91.65
Pounds of lean body mass = 143.35
Jane lost 15 pounds of scale weight. Lets compare her results.
08-11-11 results minus 08-28-11 results:
Weight: 250 - 235 = 15 pounds
Body fat percentage: 40% - 39% = 1%
Pounds of Fat: 100 - 91.65 = 8.35 pounds of fat
Pounds of lean body mass: 150 - 143.35 = 6.65 pounds of lean body mass
Out of the 15 pounds of scale weight that Jane Doe has lost, she lost 8.35 pounds of fat and 6.65 pounds of lean body mass.
A lot of people don't track their body fat percentage. They go by what their scale weight says. When they see a lost, they link that to being (a number) fat loss. But, the example above shows that a scale weight loss doesn't always equal to a 100% fat loss. So that means that a person can't say they have lost 25 pounds of fat, without knowing if their 25 pounds of scale weight loss is 100% fat loss.
I can't tell a person what to do, but if I can advise anyone that's on the healthy road, I would advise them to start tracking their body fat percentage and working the formula to see what's going on with their body.
Here's a list of things you can use to test your body fat percentage. Keep in mind that all these devices can have up to a (-/+) 5% margin error. The only test that's said to be 100% accurate is an autopsy. Stick with a device that will show you the changes your body is doing. Just like different scales can give different readings, different body fat percentage devices can give a different reading.
1. Body fat scale: I have a body fat scale that I had for 6 years. My sister have one of those new body fat scales. I don't know the brand. Last month, my scale and her scale have given me a difference of 1% body fat percentage reading.
2. Body fat handheld monitor
3. Caliper. It's said that a person should let a professional that has a high sucess rate of testing people, test your body fat with calipers. Please note that a person can get 5 different people to test them and get five different reading.
4. Dunk Test
5. Bodpod Test
I know how much body fat percentage and pounds of fat I need to lose, in order to get to my future healthy body fat percentage and scale weight. It may take me a year or so to get there and I'm okay with that.
Can I lose some lean body mass on my journey? The answer is yes.
Can I gain some pounds of fat on my journey? The answer is yes.
These things are normal. But, I will never give up. I'm going to reach my goal.
I know that I have said a lot, but I hope that I have helped someone.
1
Replies
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"Here's the way to figure out if your weight loss goal is healthy and realistic.
Formula:
A.) Initial weight - weight loss goal = future weight
B.) Future weight - Initial pounds of lean body mass = future pounds of fat (Keep in mind that your initial lean body mass is the requirement for your body)
C.) Future pounds of fat / future weight = future body fat percentage"
Hi AZ,
First, thank you for such a detailed and informative post. I agree with your philosophy, and I'm on a similar path. I use a body fat % scale right now that gives me my total body weight, water % and fat %. I then plug all of that into a spreadsheet I created to get my number of pounds of body fat, body water, lean body mass. I too am most concerned about body fat - I've lost 38 pounds of body fat since March, but my overall body weight shows a loss of 34 pounds. And I still have forty more to lose.
One thing that struck me in your post is the above on making sure your weight loss goal is realistic is the formula you gave above. While I had a general number in mind that I knew was ok, I used your formula above to give my goal more clarity. I think this is a great idea! Good luck with your journey and thanks for sharing!0 -
You are welcome FitForties. I'm a detailed person. I like to explain things. I'm happy that my post have helped you.
I also log my results in a spreadsheet that I have created in Excel. I do my weigh in and measurements monthly. I log my gains and loses as well.0 -
reading your post with interest, confused about how I find out my true fat % tho, I have been done with calipers, but it says there if 5 different people did the test I would get 5 different readins, body fat % scales are a waste of money ( IMO )
so I do I get a 100% true reading ??
Stu0 -
thanks for sharing0
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Thanks
0 -
reading your post with interest, confused about how I find out my true fat % tho, I have been done with calipers, but it says there if 5 different people did the test I would get 5 different readins, body fat % scales are a waste of money ( IMO )
so I do I get a 100% true reading ??
Stu
Papastu, how many professional have done a caliper test on you and how many sites were tested?
I'm going to go edit what I have said about calipers, to state that it's possible that a person can get 5 different caliper readings from 5 different professionals and come out with results. I'm also going to note this in my post. Every professional doesn't test the same amount of areas. Some might test 3 areas, some 4, and some more. Another thing that can give a different reading is if a person isn't being tested in the same spots. Say someone is testing themselves. They might not be pinching the same amount of skin each time or even placing the caliper in the same exact place each time.
As for scales. I don't think they are a waste of money. Why? Because if a scale can give me a scale weight, why can't it give me a body fat percentage. If my body fat percentage is off, can that mean that my weight is off as well?
It's stated that 100% body fat reading would be an autopsy.
I advise everyone to stick to body fat testing they feel comfortable with them. It doesn't have to be 100% accurate. They should use it to watch their progress.
A lot of the devices I have listed in my original post can give the same reading or be very close.
I can't edit my original post. So, therefore what I have said about the calipers in here, explains why there could be different readings.0 -
thanks for sharing
Krstal02, you are welcome.0 -
Thanks
THCAMEL, you are welcome.0 -
fair point, I will stick to the same way and keep an eye on it, Good Reply + Thanks
Stu0 -
fair point, I will stick to the same way and keep an eye on it, Good Reply + Thanks
Stu
You are welcome Papastu0 -
Nice post. A lot of people don't realize how important it is to track bf%. There are so many skinny fat people and they wonder why they don't have the lean look. I would like to share that in order to get your lean body mass to go up is to lift weights. Muscle burns fat and this will help speed up the fat loss journey. Muscle is denser than fat and will take up less room than fat.
I use a caliper and regardless if it's accurate or not at least you have a number to follow.
A good sign that you are reaching your bf goal is the definition in your body. Especially in your abs.0 -
Thank you so much for a great post, I've just spent ages getting my head around all the formulas and working out my results. I now have a much better way of working out my weekly weigh ins.
I was disappointed this morning when I weighed in and had put on 1.75lbs, but working it all out, I've only put on 0.155lb of body fat, the rest is lean body mass, which I'm not so disappointed about. Just got to work out the best way to get my body fat down now.0 -
Excellent. Thanks so much. I had a weight loss goal in mind too and the formula clarified and confirmed what I was thinking. The regular scale makes sense now because in terms of pounds of 'fat' I am within the heathly range but 17lbs from the overall weight number I had in my head. This means that to get to that number I need to loose 17lbs of body fat which would then put me in the 'athletic range'. I wasn't aiming for that just to be at the higher end of the healthy range. My point is we (or I) get this magic number in our heads without realising what in means for our bodies. I'm not sure that a percentage of 19% body fat - athletic - is what I was aiming for so my orginal weight loss goal can be adjusted downwards. It means that I should really be getting more calories using the MFP formula since I am closer to my ideal weight in terms of lean body mass to fat ratio than I thought and I expend a lot of calories per day on additional exercise.
Sorry for such a long post but everything is clear now.
Thanks for taking the time to do this for us.
You're a star!! 0 -
Nice post. A lot of people don't realize how important it is to track bf%. There are so many skinny fat people and they wonder why they don't have the lean look. I would like to share that in order to get your lean body mass to go up is to lift weights. Muscle burns fat and this will help speed up the fat loss journey. Muscle is denser than fat and will take up less room than fat.
I use a caliper and regardless if it's accurate or not at least you have a number to follow.
A good sign that you are reaching your bf goal is the definition in your body. Especially in your abs.
Thanks Princesschic. Yes, there are so many skinny fat people. I was just talking to my sister the other day about skinny fat people and telling her what that means.
Yes, to get your lean body mass up, you will have to lift weights and that's something that I do. I believe in strength training. Increase in lean body mass means muscle gain and increase in scale weight, right?0 -
Excellent. Thanks so much. I had a weight loss goal in mind too and the formula clarified and confirmed what I was thinking. The regular scale makes sense now because in terms of pounds of 'fat' I am within the heathly range but 17lbs from the overall weight number I had in my head. This means that to get to that number I need to loose 17lbs of body fat which would then put me in the 'athletic range'. I wasn't aiming for that just to be at the higher end of the healthy range. My point is we (or I) get this magic number in our heads without realising what in means for our bodies. I'm not sure that a percentage of 19% body fat - athletic - is what I was aiming for so my orginal weight loss goal can be adjusted downwards. It means that I should really be getting more calories using the MFP formula since I am closer to my ideal weight in terms of lean body mass to fat ratio than I thought and I expend a lot of calories per day on additional exercise.
Sorry for such a long post but everything is clear now.
Thanks for taking the time to do this for us.
You're a star!!
You are welcome Frannswaz. I'm glad that my post was able to help you.0 -
Thank you so much for a great post, I've just spent ages getting my head around all the formulas and working out my results. I now have a much better way of working out my weekly weigh ins.
I was disappointed this morning when I weighed in and had put on 1.75lbs, but working it all out, I've only put on 0.155lb of body fat, the rest is lean body mass, which I'm not so disappointed about. Just got to work out the best way to get my body fat down now.
You are welcome Repeattofade. I'm glad that my post was able to help you.0 -
Nice post. A lot of people don't realize how important it is to track bf%. There are so many skinny fat people and they wonder why they don't have the lean look. I would like to share that in order to get your lean body mass to go up is to lift weights. Muscle burns fat and this will help speed up the fat loss journey. Muscle is denser than fat and will take up less room than fat.
I use a caliper and regardless if it's accurate or not at least you have a number to follow.
A good sign that you are reaching your bf goal is the definition in your body. Especially in your abs.
Thanks Princesschic. Yes, there are so many skinny fat people. I was just talking to my sister the other day about skinny fat people and telling her what that means.
Yes, to get your lean body mass up, you will have to lift weights and that's something that I do. I believe in strength training. Increase in lean body mass means muscle gain and increase in scale weight, right?
There's a big debate about muscle vs. fat. One pound of muscle weighs the same as one pound of fat or one pound of feathers. Muscle doesn't take up as much room. So I'm really not sure that there would necessarily be a huge change in body weight.0 -
To the OP. Thank you for your extensive information. I have used your figures and found that my future Body Fat % will be 16% like your example. According to your other information this will make me an Athlete. I am so pleased that I'm going to become an Athlete. I'm investing in some new running shoes to celebrate.0
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So how does one lose 100% body fat, given that to be healthy even as a bodybuilder your fat should be 10%-12%?1
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Okay this post has piqued my curiosity. By the very logic of the op, my body is made up of fat and lean muscle mass and nothing more. This makes absolutely no sense to me at all. What about bone, skin, fluids, waste, essential organs, etc.?
Also, I guarantee that a person CAN indeed lose 5lbs of fat in 5 hours. It's called liposuction.
I apologize if I appear more dense than I am in reality.0 -
I don't have time to engage in more dribble right now, so bumping for later....1
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Bump!0
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Calipers are mostly accurate, body fat scales are very inaccurate, studies have shown that they tend to over or underestimate by about 10%. I have a body fat scale and it's number is about 15% over where my own caliper test, online calculators, and my doctor's caliper tests all are. He and I both agreed the scale was a waste of money.
The only way to be 100% accurate with body fat is through hydrostatic weighing. Since that's relatively unavailable and prohibitively expensive, calipers are your best bet, although the YMCA body fat formula gets really close also.0 -
OK..tracking body fat is good, (I dont but may get measured by a trainer today because we are really slow- i work at a gym) and I may start. But I have been very healthy and fit before and know what a good weight/dress sizeis for me. Tracking body fat and using that as your guide for realistic weight loss goals is great for someone who has always been over weight as they have no other frame of reference.
Having said that, I have seen you also post two inaccuarate and potentially dangerous things on this thread. First, you begin by saying you want to lose 100% body fat. As a woman (this explains why we need more essential body fat) you have fat through your midsection that actually holds your essential organs in place. If you lose that fat, your organs will shift position causing very serious damage. Rework your goal so you aren't going for something unrealistic or dangerously unhealthy.
Second, you mentioned "scale gain" as a result of muscle gain. I have found that people allow themselves to believe this and it keeps them from discovering the real cause of weight gain and resolving it. If you are lifting reguarly and effectively, you will gain muscle. But, if you will aqlso be losing fat in the process. With a substantial amount of fat to lose and little muscle to speak of initially, your muscle gain will not outweigh your fat loss- especially in a short amount of time like a few days or a week. If you are properly mixing cardio, strength training, and healthy eating, you will lose weight while building muscle. It will not be until you near your goal that you will notice the "scale weight" getting stagnant while you continue to slim down. If you are gaining "scale weight" initially or while you still have a lot of fat to lose, do not plame the weight lifting. It is something else.0 -
Calipers are mostly accurate, body fat scales are very inaccurate, studies have shown that they tend to over or underestimate by about 10%. I have a body fat scale and it's number is about 15% over where my own caliper test, online calculators, and my doctor's caliper tests all are. He and I both agreed the scale was a waste of money.
The only way to be 100% accurate with body fat is through hydrostatic weighing. Since that's relatively unavailable and prohibitively expensive, calipers are your best bet, although the YMCA body fat formula gets really close also.
Calipers can be off as well. Another thing about calipers, they weren't designed to take measurements on obese people. So, how would someone that's 350 pounds with a high body fat percentage get tested with a caliper?
I know that the Accu-Measure caliper shows one site to test yourself and get a body fat percentage and that's not right.
Hydrostatic testing can be off as well. The results a person gets depends on how much air they expel.0 -
You wrote:
"Say Jane Doe looks at her 250lbs scale weight and says she wants to lose 100 pounds. Will that be healthy and realistic? Lets see.
I know the answer will be no, it's not healthy or realistic. But, I want to show why. Above, I've stated that a person's pounds of fat is not the amount they need to lose. And Jane Doe's pounds of fat is 100 and she wants to lose 100 pounds of scale weight."
Ummm YES it is healthy and realistic. She obviously won't lose only fat. When someone is really obese, they usually also have more muscle than someone of their height and bone structure need, it's just hidden under the fat so you can't tell. It's not ALWAYS a bad thing to lose some muscle, unless you're already near or at a normal weight. Plus don't forget all the water the person in your example can lose.
Í'd just like to add that 5lbs of fingers is not heavier than 5lbs of feathers. I know, I'm an English teacher AND a scientist.0 -
Ok it sounds like you are really trying to inform and help people, but it also seems like you are just finding information online someplace or piecing together what you hear from different threads and trying to explain it in your own words. If you are providing your oppinion or your understanding of something, you should probably express it this way. I am not sure that you fully understand some of the things that you are explaining and giving advice for. You seem to be going back and forth on your thoughts and suggestions and adding your own outragious numbers or incorrect words where they may cause misunderstanding for others. If you found a good article or a good website that explains what you are trying to say, please include that if you want it to be taken seriously. You demand explanations for qeustions that you ask, but then tell people to go look things up. It would be nice to have a place where you found your information as a starting place to look things up. Just trying to understand where you are coming from and getting your information from. I dont want to read your information and pass on incorrect information to others or believe it myself. Thank you for the time you are taking to try to inform others of the information you have come accross and may use yourself.0
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Having said that, I have seen you also post two inaccuarate and potentially dangerous things on this thread. First, you begin by saying you want to lose 100% body fat. As a woman (this explains why we need more essential body fat) you have fat through your midsection that actually holds your essential organs in place. If you lose that fat, your organs will shift position causing very serious damage. Rework your goal so you aren't going for something unrealistic or dangerously unhealthy.
ItsMeTime, I can see that you have came on here with the intention to be messy and haven't taken out the time to understand what I was saying, if you did, you wouldn't be saying that I was implying that I want to lose all the fat in my body. I've made it clear that the essential fat for both genders are a requirement. I've also shown what I was talking about, when it came down to losing 100% pounds of body fat. Reread my post and get an understanding, instead of trying to come on here and start a fight with me, because you didn't like what I have said muscle vs fat on the other thread you were on. I know that you all have created a second thread, so why are you here?Second, you mentioned "scale gain" as a result of muscle gain. I have found that people allow themselves to believe this and it keeps them from discovering the real cause of weight gain and resolving it. If you are lifting reguarly and effectively, you will gain muscle. But, if you will aqlso be losing fat in the process. With a substantial amount of fat to lose and little muscle to speak of initially, your muscle gain will not outweigh your fat loss- especially in a short amount of time like a few days or a week. If you are properly mixing cardio, strength training, and healthy eating, you will lose weight while building muscle. It will not be until you near your goal that you will notice the "scale weight" getting stagnant while you continue to slim down. If you are gaining "scale weight" initially or while you still have a lot of fat to lose, do not plame the weight lifting. It is something else.
My advise to you is to go back and read my post again to understand what I'm talking about. Better yet, feel free to search the internet or get with a personal trainer that's educated about body fat percentage and pounds of fat to see if what I have stated in my original post is right. I'm not going to fight with you.1 -
Calipers are mostly accurate, body fat scales are very inaccurate, studies have shown that they tend to over or underestimate by about 10%. I have a body fat scale and it's number is about 15% over where my own caliper test, online calculators, and my doctor's caliper tests all are. He and I both agreed the scale was a waste of money.
The only way to be 100% accurate with body fat is through hydrostatic weighing. Since that's relatively unavailable and prohibitively expensive, calipers are your best bet, although the YMCA body fat formula gets really close also.
Yes and no. Calipers can be a good choice with the right body and in the hands of an experienced operator. I find the most of the people I measure today are too big to accurately measure with calipers. Individuals with a lot of visceral fat and atypical body types also cannot be accurately measured with calipers.
At our fitness center, we have a Tanita commercial body fat scale. As someone who has done thousands of skinfold caliper measurements over the past 28 years, I was initially very skeptical. It has its issues, but overall, it has proven to be useful and as accurate as could be expected under the circumstances.
When I first started, I double-checked some of the members I tested using calipers (those under 35% body fat). Out of 12 people, 11 were within 0.1 or 0.2% agreement with the Tanita scale. While comparing tests over time is where you mostly run into problems with bioimpedance, I have noticed that more often that not, we see pretty consistent numbers there as well.
So while I still would never use bioimpedance as a first choice, a quality instrument can serve a useful purpose. And, again, given the fact that increasing numbers of people cannot be measured with calipers, the methodology cannot be dismissed out of hand.0 -
Calipers are mostly accurate, body fat scales are very inaccurate, studies have shown that they tend to over or underestimate by about 10%. I have a body fat scale and it's number is about 15% over where my own caliper test, online calculators, and my doctor's caliper tests all are. He and I both agreed the scale was a waste of money.
The only way to be 100% accurate with body fat is through hydrostatic weighing. Since that's relatively unavailable and prohibitively expensive, calipers are your best bet, although the YMCA body fat formula gets really close also.
Yes and no. Calipers can be a good choice with the right body and in the hands of an experienced operator. I find the most of the people I measure today are too big to accurately measure with calipers. Individuals with a lot of visceral fat and atypical body types also cannot be accurately measured with calipers.
At our fitness center, we have a Tanita commercial body fat scale. As someone who has done thousands of skinfold caliper measurements over the past 28 years, I was initially very skeptical. It has its issues, but overall, it has proven to be useful and as accurate as could be expected under the circumstances.
When I first started, I double-checked some of the members I tested using calipers (those under 35% body fat). Out of 12 people, 11 were within 0.1 or 0.2% agreement with the Tanita scale. While comparing tests over time is where you mostly run into problems with bioimpedance, I have noticed that more often that not, we see pretty consistent numbers there as well.
So while I still would never use bioimpedance as a first choice, a quality instrument can serve a useful purpose. And, again, given the fact that increasing numbers of people cannot be measured with calipers, the methodology cannot be dismissed out of hand.
Thank you Azdak.0
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