Intense workouts to outrun the fork

jackalita · May 2019

I have heard forever you “can’t outrun the fork”

However... I know there are a few people that DO!

So those that either have maintained or some how lost weight- while still splurging on weekends- can you tell me your general caloric intake and what you did to offset weekend splurges?

I’m talking like a night out with pizza and 1-2 beers. 1-2 x a week or even at home but like a home made pot pie with dessert lol.

I don’t want to hear from those that say it’s not possible. I know it’s RARE but I am curious how MUCH exercise is needed. And if any people do intense workouts that don’t include actual running too....

JeromeBarry1 · May 2019

Weigh and log your food honestly and accurately.

What kind of exercises are you willing to do? The "how much" depends upon the MET value of the work you do and the time you have available to spend doing it.

goldthistime · May 2019

I have interpreted “You can’t outrun the fork” to mean that your appetite generally increases with exercise so you won’t lose weight (assumes you aren’t counting calories). As to working off weekend indulgences, as long as you enter them in MFP you can see exactly how many calories you need to burn to compensate.

I’m more likely to compensate by reducing calories during the weekdays rather than try to exercise away those calories. I prefer to reduce calories AFTER the indulgence, many people here like to “save up” towards it. If those weekend indulgences don’t happen often, I may take no compensatory action at all.

SCoil123 · May 2019

I think a lot of people enjoy nights out with things like pizza, drinks, and dessert and still lose weight. As long as you consume less than you burn that’s all that matters.

I personally work out 5-6 days a week. I lift weights, take Jazzercize classes, boxing, and trail running. I also have a desk job during the day and enjoy eating whatever I want. I log my calories honestly and focus on my weekly calorie average more than any one day. Some days I’m over, some under, but as long as the week averages out one day doesn’t matter.

pierinifitness · May 2019

I had a successful “career” a decade ago outrunning the fork. Lots of daily exercise volume and double workout days including running, karate and high rep volume body weight exercises. Works great until you taper the workouts and discover the appetite doesn’t taper proportionately.

Recommend you do as others suggest and manage your CICO by the week making room for your big night out.

sardelsa · May 2019

I suppose this could describe my situation. I maintain at a decent calorie intake, I don't know the exact numbers but when I was much lighter it was around 2800 cals. Probably more now since I'm heavier and more active generally.

I don't spend too much time in the gym, lifting 4x per week, a little cardio 2x per week. But I am very active so my NEAT is pretty high.

In a deficit I calorie cycle or bank my calories during the week so I'm able to eat a lot on weekends, I don't have to track my calories and can essentially eat "whatever I want" those days. I do restrict a bit during the week to save. But to be honest it's not bad considering how I don't have to slave away in the gym doing crazy cardio.

rheddmobile · May 2019

I can run enough to get quite a bit of leeway, but very few people are fit enough or have time enough to outrun a real blowout on the regular. The most I can run is about 2000 calories at one go, and that’s a weekend long run taking a couple of hours. It is very possible to suck down 2k calories without pausing to take a deep breath when eating calorie dense foods and drinking calories. So even when having a blowout you may want to put limits on portions. Just larger limits.

Do the math and see what it looks like for you! Add up your proposed splurge and add up your proposed exercise and see how it balances.

MichelleSilverleaf · May 2019

Everyone is different. Whether they could 'outrun the fork' depends on their age, stats, fitness level, current calorie intake, etc. And unless you're with a person 24/7, you have no idea what they're doing the rest of the week. Maybe they're banking calories and it's not so much a splurge as a plan.

aokoye · May 2019

When I was erging 3-4 times a week and rowing on the water once a week it was totally doable. That said, those workouts frequently involved burning over 600 calories.

Regardless, I have never and probably will never cut out things like cake, burgers, and [hard] cider from my diet. At least not for weight related reasons. I count calories and fit things in. Sometimes it's easier to do that than others in large part because sometimes I'll simply have more calories to eat back than other times.

I don't "splurge on the weekends" either mind you. Yesterday is maybe the closest I've come to that in a while as I had a (pre) birthday dinner, but even then I banked calorie and by my fairly unexact estimates came in slightly under my calorie allotment for the day.

emmamcgarity · May 2019

Knowledge is power. Learn your maintenance calories so that you can make appropriate choices in your food.

I am short, over 50, and I have a sedentary desk job. I wear a step tracker to track my activity and I often will work extra steps into my day. I walk just about every evening even if only indoors while waiting for dinner to finish in the oven. I do not always eat all the extra calories from walking back if I am not hungry. I have recently started running but most of my extra calories come from my walking. Running is just something I am doing because I am really enjoying it. Tracking activity has resulted in be very mindful about extra movement.

I do have pizza with my grandson. I do have wine with a friend. I do have margaritas and Mexican food. And sometimes i don’t. Sometimes I say no. I track it all (as best I can) and I make the conscious decision about when I choose to go over my calorie target. Knowing my maintenance calories also helps me know if I am at or above maintenance that day. I find the weekly view of calories to be very helpful in guiding me in my choices.

Danp · May 2019

The phrase is often misunderstood as "exercise can't help you lose weight", when it's more intended to mean that exercise can't undo the damage done by a poor diet. It comes down to two things:

1. The amount of calories burned by exercise usually isn't enough to overcome poor eating habits.
Say your maintenance is 2100cals per day but you're not watching what you're eating so you're probably eating closer to 2600cals per day (500cal surplus and that's probably conservative). In order to achieve a 1lb per week weight loss just with exercise you'd need to create a daily deficit of 1000cal. Every day. So you'd need to run at a fast 8mph (7.5 min mile) pace for 60-90 minutes Every. Day. But you need rest days so you bring that down to exercising 4 days a week so now you need to burn 1750cal for each exercise session so you're running intensely for closer to 2.5 hours 4 days a week.

2. Exercising will burn calories but will also cause an increase in appetite to fuel the activities.
So a gym session that burns 300cal can easily lead to an extra 500cal being consumed (after gym snack + slightly larger dinner for example) if calories in are not monitored. Leading to a calorie surplus that wouldn't have been there if no exercise had been done.

So combine them. You're having to do an insane amount of exercise in order to overcome the excess calories consumed and create the calorie deficit needed to lose weight. On top of that you have to do these insane workouts and not give in to the inevitable appetite/hunger that they will no doubt cause.

The idea is that it's WAY easier to achieve a calorie deficit via intake than it is to burn it off. For example
- Switching 2 cans of Coke per day (322cal) to 2 cans of Coke Zero (2cal) vs spending an hour in the gym cardio section
- Having 3 slices of thin crust pizza (630cal) instead of pan (915cal) vs lifting weight for an hour and a half
- Having 200g of Halo Top Vanilla Ice Cream (220cal) instead of B&J Vanilla (470cal) vs going for a 1 hour walk.

helene4 · May 2019

The only people I know personally who can out running a bad diet are college football athletes
The one I’m thinking of ...
He ate so much! Burgers, Mac and cheese, candy, etc... (and honestly I think some inflammatory foods (sugar, fried foods) set people up for a heart attack later in life regardless of their weight and how much they exercise)

Anyway, dude had a six pack maybe 6% body fat
he worked out with the team twice a day - 2-3 hours starting at 5am - lifting incredibly heavy weights and other stuff. In the afternoon the team would do cardio, sprints, whatever they do to prep for games and that was probably 6-7days a week.

The toll it took: halfway through the season he would get sick and just not feel well bc I think the body can’t take so much exersion for extended periods of time (months/years)
They were performing consistently on a very high level

I’ve seen some of those athletes go up and down 10-20lbs in a day from water weight and such intense exercise
It probably was not healthy

Keto_Vampire · May 2019

Well, you really can't out exercise a bad diet, but there are ways to maximize volume of food consumed whilst still hitting caloric goals by choosing low kcal high volume foods (0% greek yogurt, egg whites, lean meat, potatoes, greens, etc.)

NorthCascades · May 2019

Easy peasy. Thru-hike the PCT. I guarantee you'll lose more than 20 pounds no matter what or how much you eat. You'll be walking about 30 tough miles a day, and you'll have the opportunity to buy food every week or so. Having to carry everything you'll eat cuts down on your weight in a big way.

NorthCascades · May 2019

Danp wrote: »

Say your maintenance is 2100cals per day but you're not watching what you're eating so you're probably eating closer to 2600cals per day (500cal surplus and that's probably conservative). In order to achieve a 1lb per week weight loss just with exercise you'd need to create a daily deficit of 1000cal. Every day. So you'd need to run at a fast 8mph (7.5 min mile) pace for 60-90 minutes Every. Day.

This is factually not true.

Nobody has to run at any pace to exercise.

For example, I burn about 100,000 extra calories per year riding a bike. (Measured with a power meter, so BMR is not included in that number.)

Also, you don't have to exercise every day.

To go with your sample numbers, I burned 950 kcals on the bike today. I can take tomorrow off and burn 1,500 cals Tuesday. Burning calories on a bike is fun and easy. You can do it sitting down!

Finally, exercise keeps you away from all the temptations in the kitchen. Lots of exercise tends to get people to improve their diet.

I'm not saying this to be pedantic, I'm saying it because I feel you painted a misleadingly bleak picture.

NorthCascades · May 2019

Danp wrote: »

Say your maintenance is 2100cals per day but you're not watching what you're eating so you're probably eating closer to 2600cals per day (500cal surplus and that's probably conservative). In order to achieve a 1lb per week weight loss just with exercise you'd need to create a daily deficit of 1000cal. Every day. So you'd need to run at a fast 8mph (7.5 min mile) pace for 60-90 minutes Every. Day.

This is factually not true.

Nobody has to run at any pace to exercise.

For example, I burn about 100,000 extra calories per year riding a bike. (Measured with a power meter, so BMR is not included in that number.)

Also, you don't have to exercise every day.

To go with your sample numbers, I burned 950 kcals on the bike today. I can take tomorrow off and burn 1,500 cals Tuesday. Burning calories on a bike is fun and easy. You can do it sitting down!

Finally, exercise keeps you away from all the temptations in the kitchen. Lots of exercise tends to get people to improve their diet.

I'm not saying this to be pedantic, I'm saying it because I feel you painted a misleadingly bleak picture.

Danp · May 2019

Of course everyone's different so you have to use rough numbers and give examples to illustrate the point.

To overcome a 500cal/d surplus introduced by a poor diet, and introduce the 500cal/d deficit required to achieve a 1lb per week loss would require exercising off 1000cal/d which would be roughly a 1-1.5hour run per day as an example.

But as you said (and I also said in my post) you won't want to exercise like that everyday without recovery so if you drop it down to 4 days a week that compresses the weekly calorie burn requirement to 1750cal/d which makes those 4 run (or swim or cycling) sessions closer to a 2-2.5 hours.

So, how long (time wise) was that 950cal ride? How long will the 1500cal ride be? An hour and an hour and a half? So roughly 1000cals per hour as I suggested (only cycling instead of running)?
When are you going to do the rides to make up the other 4550cals to achieve the 7000 calorie burn required in this scenario?
Are you really saying you completed these rides without any additional fuelling? That you're eating the same amount of food as you would if you didn't ride at all? Didn't fuel on the bike? Didn't have extra food before or after the ride? I cycle too and I'm sorry, I don't buy that for a minute.

WickedddMelon · May 2019

Just put the effin fork down. Smh.

Danp · May 2019

Oh and in addition, burning 100,000cal per year is equivalent of approx 2000cals per week which is easily achievable.

In order to exercise your way out of a 500cal/d surplus and achieve a 1lb per week loss would require burning 364,000 calories per year. 3.5x the activity you're currently undertaking.

#perspective

paperpudding · May 2019

melmoldy wrote: »

Just put the effin fork down. Smh.

That doesn't really make sense - if people want to enjoy treats, splurges within weekly allowance, special events, social occasions etc then they need to figure out how to achieve that and still lose/ maintain weight.

Which really boils down to 2 options - eat less on other days during the week or excercise more to burn off the calories.

Or not having social occasions, treats etc - but that doesn't seem very sustainable or enjoyable strategy to me - hence nobody else suggested it.

sijomial · May 2019

Don't really understand why people conflate a big diet with a bad diet.....
It's far easier to meet your nutritional goals with a lot more food and far less dietary restrictions - there's no necessity to make a big diet a poor diet. Or to binge, or to splurge, or to "earn" your calories on the day you eat more....

If you seriously want to use exercise to significantly increase your TDEE then you would be better to look at longer duration not higher intensity.
e.g. a gentle cycle ride enjoying the countryside is about 500cals/hr for me. A brisk paced ride about 600, flat out about 700. It's a damn sight easier on your body to do two hours at 500 rather than one at 700 and be exhausted.

It's helpful if your exercise doesn't beat you up and you actually enjoy it, otherwise it's not sounding a healthy mindset.

Personally I love my cycling, as I'm retired I have plenty of time to enjoy my hobby and I also enjoy good food. Just my more serious cycling (meaning excluding using a bike for local transport) gives me about 180,000 calories a year or just under 500 cals a day. Not quite as clear cut as that as multi hour rides need fuelling and that might well not be coming from foods/drinks I really enjoy.

Overall I'm far healthier with a lot of exercise and happier with a higher calorie allowance and weight maintenance is easier - seems like a win/win/win to me. That of course would not be the same for everyone and it's not an appropriate (or possible) strategy for everyone.

Intense workouts to outrun the fork

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