Was just told that Keto burns 230% more fat than plain CICO....
anewell28
Posts: 79 Member
My sister likes to research on the vast wide internet. She knows that I like the normal balanced CICO to lose weight where I eat all three macros without limiting one in particular.
She told me that she read that the Keto Diet burns more fat than the CICO diet. I would like to assume, (but don’t actually know) that the study (if it was one) had both groups of people eat in the same calorie deficit.
Anyway, i hope you see what I’m getting at and my question is, is this true?
To me, I don’t see how the make up of the diet besides the calories matter. The body can “burn” fat in a low calorie diet that consists of mainly carbs and protein? So why do people on the Keto diet think not eating carbs makes their fat burning so much better/amazing?
I know this topic is heated and I’m sure I do not know all the facts and could be wrong. Please help me understand the science and learn some more. Thank you!
She told me that she read that the Keto Diet burns more fat than the CICO diet. I would like to assume, (but don’t actually know) that the study (if it was one) had both groups of people eat in the same calorie deficit.
Anyway, i hope you see what I’m getting at and my question is, is this true?
To me, I don’t see how the make up of the diet besides the calories matter. The body can “burn” fat in a low calorie diet that consists of mainly carbs and protein? So why do people on the Keto diet think not eating carbs makes their fat burning so much better/amazing?
I know this topic is heated and I’m sure I do not know all the facts and could be wrong. Please help me understand the science and learn some more. Thank you!
6
Replies
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You eat various, you burn various, because that's what your recent energy INTAKE consists off
You eat fat, you burn fat, because that's what your recent energy INTAKE consists off.
In all cases you burn STORED energy (hopefully mostly fat) according to your effective caloric deficit.
Your body weight trend changes based on STORED energy. The rest are daily fluctuations.14 -
Not true, also scientifically impossible.12
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Easier to blame the evil carbs than take responsibility for poor choices. For the average person Keto is basically just swapping out diabetes for heart disease. Fats contain twice as many calories as carbs and high-fat diets often lead to muscle loss (and in turn, decreased metabolism).
Unless keto is a medical necessity, a balanced CICO diet is the most effective approach to weight loss.26 -
way too much fat consumption in KETO diet. you are better off just following a balanced diet. Much healthier and sustainable long term. I cut carbs to around 50-75 g when I started but now consume 125 g on average.12
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My sister likes to research on the vast wide internet. She knows that I like the normal balanced CICO to lose weight where I eat all three macros without limiting one in particular.
She told me that she read that the Keto Diet burns more fat than the CICO diet. I would like to assume, (but don’t actually know) that the study (if it was one) had both groups of people eat in the same calorie deficit.
Anyway, i hope you see what I’m getting at and my question is, is this true?
To me, I don’t see how the make up of the diet besides the calories matter. The body can “burn” fat in a low calorie diet that consists of mainly carbs and protein? So why do people on the Keto diet think not eating carbs makes their fat burning so much better/amazing?
I know this topic is heated and I’m sure I do not know all the facts and could be wrong. Please help me understand the science and learn some more. Thank you!
Ask her for a citation to the actual study.
Cuz anyone can put anything on the internet. Look:
16 -
My sister likes to research on the vast wide internet. She knows that I like the normal balanced CICO to lose weight where I eat all three macros without limiting one in particular.
She told me that she read that the Keto Diet burns more fat than the CICO diet. I would like to assume, (but don’t actually know) that the study (if it was one) had both groups of people eat in the same calorie deficit.
Anyway, i hope you see what I’m getting at and my question is, is this true?
To me, I don’t see how the make up of the diet besides the calories matter. The body can “burn” fat in a low calorie diet that consists of mainly carbs and protein? So why do people on the Keto diet think not eating carbs makes their fat burning so much better/amazing?
I know this topic is heated and I’m sure I do not know all the facts and could be wrong. Please help me understand the science and learn some more. Thank you!
Of course keto burns more fat than non keto (likely not 230% more if cals are equal), but that's a silly and irrelevant claim.
Someone eats 1600 cals not keto and burns 2100 (maintenance).
At 50-25-25, that means the person eats about 200 g carbs (800 cal), 100 g protein (400 cal), 44.5 g fat (400 cal), they burn 400 cal of fat eaten plus 500 cal of body fat for 900 cal. They also burn the other cals they eat.
Someone eats 1600 cals at keto and burns 2100.
At 5% carbs, 20% protein, and 75% fat, they eat about 20 g carbs (80 cal), 80 g protein (320 cal), and about 133.3 g fat (or 1200). They burn (among other things 1200 cals of fat consumed plus 500 cal of body fat for 1700).
Weight loss for both, 1 lb. Fat loss for both, 1 lb.
But keto burnt nearly 2x as much fat in this example.
I hope that demonstrates what an irrelevant claim was made. Basically your body burns the fat (and other cals) consumed plus the amount of fat equating to the deficit (varying based on having a reasonable deficit, weight training, protein -- studies have shown that muscle instead of fat is more likely to be burnt on keto unless protein is increased, in fact). It also burns the fat you consume. So if you eat a lot more fat you burn a lot more fat, but that means 0 about weight loss.37 -
Studies have consistently shown that over the long term, low carb and non low carb diets lose about the same amount of weight. Keto can work, but there is no need for anyone to do it to lose weight. It's not any better than calorie counting, and it operates the on the same principle of CICO. A person only loses weight on Keto if they are in a deficit.14
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The long term health studies into various diets are more interested to me than wild weight loss claims.2
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Some people like to ignore that when you eat keto your body burns more fat, because it's burning all the fat you're eating.
All the studies I've seen show no advantage in amount of weight loss or ability to maintain loss for any one way of eating over another.15 -
Atkins cratered and people said "Thank god. We don't have to hear about this fanatical and medically irresponsible extreme low carb stuff anymore."
Then came Keto.
What's next, the 100 % fat diet? You just dunk your face into a bucket of lard, but the cool thing is you can do it as many times as you want per day and never gain weight, because your body goes into Oxyplasmocolitinitusicalsificationitis, where it causes the liver, kidneys, and pancreas to automatically use only stored fat for energy, at 14 times the normal fat-burning rate. Plus, it gives you six pack abs and a thigh gap.
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There are two different things "burns fat" could mean.
1 - makes you less fat. That's everybody's goal ultimately.
2 - releases energy in fat tissue. This is unimportant to dieters, only of interest to people who do hours of continuous cardio. You can also release energy from stored carbs.
Low carb diets will achieve #2, not that doesn't help you lose weight.3 -
I am on the Keto diet and, after years of trying all sorts of other diets, including Weight Watchers, the Keto way of eating has been most effective for me, as well as the most easily sustainable
The goal is to cut carbs to a bare minimum (carbs I use to indulge in which use to give me a false sense of fuel/energy). Back in the day, my body would store (as body fat) the over abundance of carbs that weren't burned off. It was a never ending vicious cycle to a no win situation.
Today, I get my energy from the healthy fats I eat and, since my body only takes in these healthy fats, I get my fuel/energy from my own body fat. You literally burn it off. I'm down 16 lbs in 2 months and my blood pressure and all other readings from my lab work are perfect.
There is nothing wrong with the Keto way. I swear by it, and so do many others who are on the same journey. The best thing is... as mentioned above, it is easily sustainable.
(For the record, I don't work out. Just light activity day to day)48 -
From a study at Stanfor Univerity:
Despite this difference in consumption levels, at the end of the 12 months, results showed that it didn't matter at all whether people were focusing on their fat intake or their carb intake. On average, both groups consumed about the same number of calories each day and, even though some individuals gained or lost more weight than others, both groups lost about the same amount of weight.
No matter which group they were in, participants saw about the same improvements in measurements like:
BMI numbers
Body-fat percentage
Waistline measurement
Blood pressure
Fasting insulin
Blood glucose levels
There were some differences, though. For instance, the low-fat group saw a bigger drop in "bad" cholesterol (LDL). And while LDL levels rose more in the low-carb group, so did levels of "good" cholesterol (HDL).13 -
The reason you get fat is because you eat an 'overabundance of carbs'. If you ate an 'overabundance of fats' you would get just as fat.23
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vickysanimalrescue wrote: »I am on the Keto diet and, after years of trying all sorts of other diets, including Weight Watchers, the Keto way of eating has been most effective for me, as well as the most easily sustainable
The goal is to cut carbs to a bare minimum (carbs I use to indulge in which use to give me a false sense of fuel/energy). Back in the day, my body would store (as body fat) the over abundance of carbs that weren't burned off. It was a never ending vicious cycle to a no win situation.
Today, I get my energy from the healthy fats I eat and, since my body only takes in these healthy fats, I get my fuel/energy from my own body fat. You literally burn it off. I'm down 16 lbs in 2 months and my blood pressure and all other readings from my lab work are perfect.
There is nothing wrong with the Keto way. I swear by it, and so do many others who are on the same journey. The best thing is... as mentioned above, it is easily sustainable.
(For the record, I don't work out. Just light activity day to day)
I agree - there is nothing wrong with the keto way - for those who like this style of eating.
There is nothing wrong with the non keto way for those who dont either.
Of course that could be said for any reasonably sensible way of eating - vegetarianism, mediteranean diet, Atkins diet etc
What is sustainable or a vicious circle is subjective though - I do not eat anywhere near low carb and my way of eating is sustainable for me.
So sustainable that I have maintianed my weight on it for nearly 6 years now.
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Pipsqueak1965 wrote: »The reason you get fat is because you eat an 'overabundance of carbs'. If you ate an 'overabundance of fats' you would get just as fat.
Indeed. And usually when people claim they ate "an overabundance of carbs" it turns out not to be foods that are mostly just carbs (like fruit), but mixed carbs and fat, like french fries, most dessert foods, mac and cheese, or even mixed carbs, fat, and protein, like pizza, most high cal pasta dishes, restaurant burgers, fried chicken.
When they cut out those foods because low carb, they eat fewer cals and the lower cals cause weight loss.
But as you point out, a high fat diet with excess cals would obviously also cause weight gain, no matter how many carbs are eaten.7 -
People regularly confuse fat oxidation with fat loss. Its absolutely true that high fat diets burn more fat (fat oxidation) but they also store more fat, which is the component that isn't discussed.12
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vickysanimalrescue wrote: »I am on the Keto diet and, after years of trying all sorts of other diets, including Weight Watchers, the Keto way of eating has been most effective for me, as well as the most easily sustainable
The goal is to cut carbs to a bare minimum (carbs I use to indulge in which use to give me a false sense of fuel/energy). Back in the day, my body would store (as body fat) the over abundance of carbs that weren't burned off. It was a never ending vicious cycle to a no win situation.
Today, I get my energy from the healthy fats I eat and, since my body only takes in these healthy fats, I get my fuel/energy from my own body fat. You literally burn it off. I'm down 16 lbs in 2 months and my blood pressure and all other readings from my lab work are perfect.
There is nothing wrong with the Keto way. I swear by it, and so do many others who are on the same journey. The best thing is... as mentioned above, it is easily sustainable.
(For the record, I don't work out. Just light activity day to day)
Have you only been doing it for 2 months or have you lost 16 pounds in the last 2 months? If you have only been doing it for 2 months and you are excited I am glad for you but I am also concerned that your definition of 'sustainable' may be premature.
Carbs do not give a false sense of fuel or energy. They do provide fuel and energy. All macros can contribute to fat storage but fat is converted to body fat the easiest by your body not carbs.
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vickysanimalrescue wrote: »I am on the Keto diet and, after years of trying all sorts of other diets, including Weight Watchers, the Keto way of eating has been most effective for me, as well as the most easily sustainable
The goal is to cut carbs to a bare minimum (carbs I use to indulge in which use to give me a false sense of fuel/energy). Back in the day, my body would store (as body fat) the over abundance of carbs that weren't burned off. It was a never ending vicious cycle to a no win situation.
Today, I get my energy from the healthy fats I eat and, since my body only takes in these healthy fats, I get my fuel/energy from my own body fat. You literally burn it off. I'm down 16 lbs in 2 months and my blood pressure and all other readings from my lab work are perfect.
There is nothing wrong with the Keto way. I swear by it, and so do many others who are on the same journey. The best thing is... as mentioned above, it is easily sustainable.
(For the record, I don't work out. Just light activity day to day)
In terms of semantics, your body doesn't care if something is healthy or not, it will breakdown and store/use nutrients. You can certainly gain just as much fat on a keto diet as you can on a SAD diet. Why? Because for some people keto isn't sustainable or satiating. For me, i can sustain keto in the summers based on travel and my love for fruit. But i certainly plan to get back on it in the fall/winter because i don't have the same cravings as i do in summer.
Ultimately, i am glad you are liking keto. Its refreshing when you start to see something work for you when other things fail in the past. But 2 months is not a long period, and what you find sustainable today, may change later. I lost 50 lbs calorie counting 9 years ago. I love it... It was effortless and mathematically made sense. Today, it is cumbersome and impossible for me to do anymore. It was starting to teach me to eat even when wasn't hungry because i had calories left over.8 -
Hi, I've been on and off Keto for the last few years it's the only thing that has ever worked for me to lose weight and for it to stay off.
Here's a good video explaining the science about why it works and people's fear about the negative effects.
https://youtu.be/Dan8qtgQRi8
I first heard of it when I used to work at a hospital years ago. It's what doctors put newly diagnosed diabetic patients on in the UK, the hope is, if they can stick to it their meds can be lowered or possibly even removed once the pancreas has had a chance to recover. It's not a new diet for humans, we've been eating like it for hundreds of thousands of years. The only option during winter until 8000 years ago when will switched to farming crops.
The reason why people say you lose more weight on a keto diet is because you don't have an any spikes in insulin. Insulin is the fat storage hormone, so whenever you have carbs, insulin spikes high and produces glucose that fuels you for whatever you are doing right then, and any excess gets turned into fat.
While you have insulin spiking in your blood it is impossible to lose fat, once insulin goes back down glucagon starts being produced which is the hormone that converts fat back into energy. The body can't release both at the same time, it's either one or the other. By eating keto meals you can have a much faster weight loss as a result.
I've always inadvertently slipped into intermittent fasting (only eating during a 6 hour window during the day, more info here
https://youtu.be/mK0Ct2wJvhw ) while on keto because the fat turns off ghrelin production which is the hormone that makes you hungry. Though you can put on weight with any diet if you over eat, it is incredibly difficult on the keto diet because you feel full so much quicker.
There is also dirty keto Vs clean keto. Bacon, butter, sausages Vs chicken breast, nuts, avocados... Etc... The fat in clean keto produces a type of good cholesterol. LDL cholesterol is sticky little bits that cause plaques that clog arteries Vs HDL fluffy light cholesterol that cleans out LDL. I eat a mixture of clean and dirty keto, bacon is just too tempting.
The best advantage though is unlike cico, the weight stays off without much effort one you stop eating keto diet. When you lower your calories significantly with cico your your metabolic rate slows, when you start to eat normally again, your metabolic rate stays at that new slow level which means you put the weight back on very quickly (the contestants from the biggest loser weight loss programme were badly affected by this, and that is why you never see a reunion programme of them because they all put the weight back on).
In keto the metabolic rate doesn't slow (or at least no where near as much) so it means once you stop eating keto unless you start binge eating it should stay off. With the exception of water weight which goes back on due to the low salt nature of the keto diet, salt/sodium being the water retention electrolyte.
Personal biggest problem to why I can't stick to it permanently is because I like meals with my friends and family and eating out far too much. Inconveniencing friends who are cooking for you to your diet in keto very difficult on them, also if my mum has cooked a roast when I visit, there is no way I'm turning down her roast potatoes. So it ebbs and flows, the food in my house is keto, but if eating with friends or family I consider those cheat reward meals.
The cheats do kick you out of ketosis and it does take in my case 1 to 2 weeks for full ketosis to be restored. But it's worth it for those roast potatoes. Get some keto strips to monitor your keto levels from Amazon if you're not sure if your in ketosis or not.
If you want to learn more on the science Dr Jason Fung has loads of YouTube videos explaining it https://www.youtube.com/embed/tIuj-oMN-Fk?list=PLPm8HQCPkqGjFoj1-WKpuZx7yAhSqBlbR
Wow, ok, that was way longer then I intended it to be, sorry for the waffle.
Bex45 -
ArtemisArtist wrote: »Hi, I've been on and off Keto for the last few years it's the only thing that has ever worked for me to lose weight and for it to stay off.
Here's a good video explaining the science about why it works and people's fear about the negative effects.https://youtu.be/Dan8qtgQRi8
I first heard of it when I used to work at a hospital years ago. It's what doctors put newly diagnosed diabetic patients on in the UK, the hope is, if they can stick to it their meds can be lowered or possibly even removed once the pancreas has had a chance to recover. It's not a new diet for humans, we've been eating like it for hundreds of thousands of years. The only option during winter until 8000 years ago when will switched to farming crops.
The reason why people say you lose more weight on a keto diet is because you don't have an any spikes in insulin. Insulin is the fat storage hormone, so whenever you have carbs, insulin spikes high and produces glucose that fuels you for whatever you are doing right then, and any excess gets turned into fat.
While you have insulin spiking in your blood it is impossible to lose fat, once insulin goes back down glucagon starts being produced which is the hormone that converts fat back into energy. The body can't release both at the same time, it's either one or the other. By eating keto meals you can have a much faster weight loss as a result.
I've always inadvertently slipped into intermittent fasting (only eating during a 6 hour window during the day, more info herehttps://youtu.be/mK0Ct2wJvhw ) while on keto because the fat turns off ghrelin production which is the hormone that makes you hungry. Though you can put on weight with any diet if you over eat, it is incredibly difficult on the keto diet because you feel full so much quicker.
There is also dirty keto Vs clean keto. Bacon, butter, sausages Vs chicken breast, nuts, avocados... Etc... The fat in clean keto produces a type of good cholesterol. LDL cholesterol is sticky little bits that cause plaques that clog arteries Vs HDL fluffy light cholesterol that cleans out LDL. I eat a mixture of clean and dirty keto, bacon is just too tempting.
The best advantage though is unlike cico, the weight stays off without much effort one you stop eating keto diet. When you lower your calories significantly with cico your your metabolic rate slows, when you start to eat normally again, your metabolic rate stays at that new slow level which means you put the weight back on very quickly (the contestants from the biggest loser weight loss programme were badly affected by this, and that is why you never see a reunion programme of them because they all put the weight back on).
In keto the metabolic rate doesn't slow (or at least no where near as much) so it means once you stop eating keto unless you start binge eating it should stay off. With the exception of water weight which goes back on due to the low salt nature of the keto diet, salt/sodium being the water retention electrolyte.
Personal biggest problem to why I can't stick to it permanently is because I like meals with my friends and family and eating out far too much. Inconveniencing friends who are cooking for you to your diet in keto very difficult on them, also if my mum has cooked a roast when I visit, there is no way I'm turning down her roast potatoes. So it ebbs and flows, the food in my house is keto, but if eating with friends or family I consider those cheat reward meals.
The cheats do kick you out of ketosis and it does take in my case 1 to 2 weeks for full ketosis to be restored. But it's worth it for those roast potatoes. Get some keto strips to monitor your keto levels from Amazon if you're not sure if your in ketosis or not.
If you want to learn more on the science Dr Jason Fung has loads of YouTube videos explaining it https://www.youtube.com/embed/tIuj-oMN-Fk?list=PLPm8HQCPkqGjFoj1-WKpuZx7yAhSqBlbR
Wow, ok, that was way longer then I intended it to be, sorry for the waffle.
Bex
Anything by Fung is utter nonsense. Stop getting your info from YouTubers who are not doctors in nutritional related science and have ZERO peer reviewed published studies. Yea. Zero19 -
ArtemisArtist wrote: »Hi, I've been on and off Keto for the last few years it's the only thing that has ever worked for me to lose weight and for it to stay off.
Here's a good video explaining the science about why it works and people's fear about the negative effects.https://youtu.be/Dan8qtgQRi8
I first heard of it when I used to work at a hospital years ago. It's what doctors put newly diagnosed diabetic patients on in the UK, the hope is, if they can stick to it their meds can be lowered or possibly even removed once the pancreas has had a chance to recover. It's not a new diet for humans, we've been eating like it for hundreds of thousands of years. The only option during winter until 8000 years ago when will switched to farming crops.
The reason why people say you lose more weight on a keto diet is because you don't have an any spikes in insulin. Insulin is the fat storage hormone, so whenever you have carbs, insulin spikes high and produces glucose that fuels you for whatever you are doing right then, and any excess gets turned into fat.
While you have insulin spiking in your blood it is impossible to lose fat, once insulin goes back down glucagon starts being produced which is the hormone that converts fat back into energy. The body can't release both at the same time, it's either one or the other. By eating keto meals you can have a much faster weight loss as a result.
I've always inadvertently slipped into intermittent fasting (only eating during a 6 hour window during the day, more info herehttps://youtu.be/mK0Ct2wJvhw ) while on keto because the fat turns off ghrelin production which is the hormone that makes you hungry. Though you can put on weight with any diet if you over eat, it is incredibly difficult on the keto diet because you feel full so much quicker.
There is also dirty keto Vs clean keto. Bacon, butter, sausages Vs chicken breast, nuts, avocados... Etc... The fat in clean keto produces a type of good cholesterol. LDL cholesterol is sticky little bits that cause plaques that clog arteries Vs HDL fluffy light cholesterol that cleans out LDL. I eat a mixture of clean and dirty keto, bacon is just too tempting.
The best advantage though is unlike cico, the weight stays off without much effort one you stop eating keto diet. When you lower your calories significantly with cico your your metabolic rate slows, when you start to eat normally again, your metabolic rate stays at that new slow level which means you put the weight back on very quickly (the contestants from the biggest loser weight loss programme were badly affected by this, and that is why you never see a reunion programme of them because they all put the weight back on).
In keto the metabolic rate doesn't slow (or at least no where near as much) so it means once you stop eating keto unless you start binge eating it should stay off. With the exception of water weight which goes back on due to the low salt nature of the keto diet, salt/sodium being the water retention electrolyte.
Personal biggest problem to why I can't stick to it permanently is because I like meals with my friends and family and eating out far too much. Inconveniencing friends who are cooking for you to your diet in keto very difficult on them, also if my mum has cooked a roast when I visit, there is no way I'm turning down her roast potatoes. So it ebbs and flows, the food in my house is keto, but if eating with friends or family I consider those cheat reward meals.
The cheats do kick you out of ketosis and it does take in my case 1 to 2 weeks for full ketosis to be restored. But it's worth it for those roast potatoes. Get some keto strips to monitor your keto levels from Amazon if you're not sure if your in ketosis or not.
If you want to learn more on the science Dr Jason Fung has loads of YouTube videos explaining it https://www.youtube.com/embed/tIuj-oMN-Fk?list=PLPm8HQCPkqGjFoj1-WKpuZx7yAhSqBlbR
Wow, ok, that was way longer then I intended it to be, sorry for the waffle.
Bex
A couple of things.
1. Metabolic and long term studies on keto do not support the claim that you lose more fat faster on keto vs high carb. It does demonstrate a short term advantage due to glycogen/water weight depletion.
2. Insulin doesn't stop fat burning... It inhibits it. You still burn fat, but not at normal rates. It is why having insulin resistance is an issue as it over produces insulin which inhibits lipolysis.
3. Overall, in a calorie deficit insulin will be reduced.
4. Dietary fat stores as fat easier than any other nutrient. It doesn't need insulin to be stored in adipose.
5. This one is very important and cannot be stressed enough, but your body has a plethora of hormones to allow for nutrient storage. If it didn't, the human race would have never survived. Acylation Stimulating Protein and Glucose Dependent Insulintropic Peptide play significant roles. These hormones suppress Hormone Sensitive Lipase (the fat burning hormone). These are activate after you eat, regardless of the composition of the foods you eat. So if you are eating a ton of fat, glucagon will not be activated.20 -
ArtemisArtist wrote: »Hi, I've been on and off Keto for the last few years it's the only thing that has ever worked for me to lose weight and for it to stay off.
Here's a good video explaining the science about why it works and people's fear about the negative effects.https://youtu.be/Dan8qtgQRi8
I first heard of it when I used to work at a hospital years ago. It's what doctors put newly diagnosed diabetic patients on in the UK, the hope is, if they can stick to it their meds can be lowered or possibly even removed once the pancreas has had a chance to recover. It's not a new diet for humans, we've been eating like it for hundreds of thousands of years. The only option during winter until 8000 years ago when will switched to farming crops.
The reason why people say you lose more weight on a keto diet is because you don't have an any spikes in insulin. Insulin is the fat storage hormone, so whenever you have carbs, insulin spikes high and produces glucose that fuels you for whatever you are doing right then, and any excess gets turned into fat.
While you have insulin spiking in your blood it is impossible to lose fat, once insulin goes back down glucagon starts being produced which is the hormone that converts fat back into energy. The body can't release both at the same time, it's either one or the other. By eating keto meals you can have a much faster weight loss as a result.
I've always inadvertently slipped into intermittent fasting (only eating during a 6 hour window during the day, more info herehttps://youtu.be/mK0Ct2wJvhw ) while on keto because the fat turns off ghrelin production which is the hormone that makes you hungry. Though you can put on weight with any diet if you over eat, it is incredibly difficult on the keto diet because you feel full so much quicker.
There is also dirty keto Vs clean keto. Bacon, butter, sausages Vs chicken breast, nuts, avocados... Etc... The fat in clean keto produces a type of good cholesterol. LDL cholesterol is sticky little bits that cause plaques that clog arteries Vs HDL fluffy light cholesterol that cleans out LDL. I eat a mixture of clean and dirty keto, bacon is just too tempting.
The best advantage though is unlike cico, the weight stays off without much effort one you stop eating keto diet. When you lower your calories significantly with cico your your metabolic rate slows, when you start to eat normally again, your metabolic rate stays at that new slow level which means you put the weight back on very quickly (the contestants from the biggest loser weight loss programme were badly affected by this, and that is why you never see a reunion programme of them because they all put the weight back on).
In keto the metabolic rate doesn't slow (or at least no where near as much) so it means once you stop eating keto unless you start binge eating it should stay off. With the exception of water weight which goes back on due to the low salt nature of the keto diet, salt/sodium being the water retention electrolyte.
Personal biggest problem to why I can't stick to it permanently is because I like meals with my friends and family and eating out far too much. Inconveniencing friends who are cooking for you to your diet in keto very difficult on them, also if my mum has cooked a roast when I visit, there is no way I'm turning down her roast potatoes. So it ebbs and flows, the food in my house is keto, but if eating with friends or family I consider those cheat reward meals.
The cheats do kick you out of ketosis and it does take in my case 1 to 2 weeks for full ketosis to be restored. But it's worth it for those roast potatoes. Get some keto strips to monitor your keto levels from Amazon if you're not sure if your in ketosis or not.
If you want to learn more on the science Dr Jason Fung has loads of YouTube videos explaining it https://www.youtube.com/embed/tIuj-oMN-Fk?list=PLPm8HQCPkqGjFoj1-WKpuZx7yAhSqBlbR
Wow, ok, that was way longer then I intended it to be, sorry for the waffle.
Bex
Keto
IF
Jason Fung
The Holy Trinity of The First Church of Woo
28 -
ArtemisArtist wrote: »Hi, I've been on and off Keto for the last few years it's the only thing that has ever worked for me to lose weight and for it to stay off.
Here's a good video explaining the science about why it works and people's fear about the negative effects.https://youtu.be/Dan8qtgQRi8
I first heard of it when I used to work at a hospital years ago. It's what doctors put newly diagnosed diabetic patients on in the UK, the hope is, if they can stick to it their meds can be lowered or possibly even removed once the pancreas has had a chance to recover. It's not a new diet for humans, we've been eating like it for hundreds of thousands of years. The only option during winter until 8000 years ago when will switched to farming crops.
The reason why people say you lose more weight on a keto diet is because you don't have an any spikes in insulin. Insulin is the fat storage hormone, so whenever you have carbs, insulin spikes high and produces glucose that fuels you for whatever you are doing right then, and any excess gets turned into fat.
While you have insulin spiking in your blood it is impossible to lose fat, once insulin goes back down glucagon starts being produced which is the hormone that converts fat back into energy. The body can't release both at the same time, it's either one or the other. By eating keto meals you can have a much faster weight loss as a result.
I've always inadvertently slipped into intermittent fasting (only eating during a 6 hour window during the day, more info herehttps://youtu.be/mK0Ct2wJvhw ) while on keto because the fat turns off ghrelin production which is the hormone that makes you hungry. Though you can put on weight with any diet if you over eat, it is incredibly difficult on the keto diet because you feel full so much quicker.
There is also dirty keto Vs clean keto. Bacon, butter, sausages Vs chicken breast, nuts, avocados... Etc... The fat in clean keto produces a type of good cholesterol. LDL cholesterol is sticky little bits that cause plaques that clog arteries Vs HDL fluffy light cholesterol that cleans out LDL. I eat a mixture of clean and dirty keto, bacon is just too tempting.
The best advantage though is unlike cico, the weight stays off without much effort one you stop eating keto diet. When you lower your calories significantly with cico your your metabolic rate slows, when you start to eat normally again, your metabolic rate stays at that new slow level which means you put the weight back on very quickly (the contestants from the biggest loser weight loss programme were badly affected by this, and that is why you never see a reunion programme of them because they all put the weight back on).
In keto the metabolic rate doesn't slow (or at least no where near as much) so it means once you stop eating keto unless you start binge eating it should stay off. With the exception of water weight which goes back on due to the low salt nature of the keto diet, salt/sodium being the water retention electrolyte.
Personal biggest problem to why I can't stick to it permanently is because I like meals with my friends and family and eating out far too much. Inconveniencing friends who are cooking for you to your diet in keto very difficult on them, also if my mum has cooked a roast when I visit, there is no way I'm turning down her roast potatoes. So it ebbs and flows, the food in my house is keto, but if eating with friends or family I consider those cheat reward meals.
The cheats do kick you out of ketosis and it does take in my case 1 to 2 weeks for full ketosis to be restored. But it's worth it for those roast potatoes. Get some keto strips to monitor your keto levels from Amazon if you're not sure if your in ketosis or not.
If you want to learn more on the science Dr Jason Fung has loads of YouTube videos explaining it https://www.youtube.com/embed/tIuj-oMN-Fk?list=PLPm8HQCPkqGjFoj1-WKpuZx7yAhSqBlbR
Wow, ok, that was way longer then I intended it to be, sorry for the waffle.
Bex
Fung has been de-bunked over and over and over again.
Clearly, keto doesn't work for you because you can't stay on it long term, you say yourself you can't stick to it permanently, therefore, it isn't sustainable.13 -
Well, I toughed it out and watched the whole Fung video. He's got some interesting ideas, and is funny.
The problem is that his whole philosophy is based on the idea that calorie-based dieting doesn't work because as you lose weight "your metabolism slows down", as evidenced by your TDEE getting lower--so you'll immediately gain the weight back because you'll be eating at your pre-diet caloric level, but now with a much slower metabolism.
But every calorie-based dieter already knows that as you lose weight, you need to eat less. Any two-bit TDEE calculator on the web will show that you get about 4-5 calories less to eat for every pound you lose. For that same reason MFP will give you more calories to eat if you weigh more. Fat people burn more calories. As you get thinner, you burn less of them, so you have to eat less of them too. Duh. This is not "metabolism slowing down" but much more simply, and sensibly, the smaller you are, the less calories you get.22 -
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Dietary.
Just like if you were on a high carb diet, than fat oxidation would be lower and carb oxidation would increase.9 -
Dietary.
Just like if you were on a high carb diet, than fat oxidation would be lower and carb oxidation would increase.
Exactly. That makes sense. Some folks out there see "burn more fat" and wrongly interpret (wishful thinking?) it as body fat.5 -
Dietary.
Just like if you were on a high carb diet, than fat oxidation would be lower and carb oxidation would increase.
Exactly. That makes sense. Some folks out there see "burn more fat" and wrongly interpret (wishful thinking?) it as body fat.
Its why i mentioned people mixing up fat oxidation (using stored or available fat for energy) and fat loss.
Just like with carbs, if you eat fat (without carbs) your body will breakdown the fatty acids. Some will be oxidized for immediate energy, some will be stored in the muscle and the remainder in adipose.The main difference is fats, generally, take longer to break down. The exception is a medium chain triglyceride (MCT), which breaks down in the liver (similar to fructose) and used for energy quickly.
As an aside, if one is on keto there are a few techniques to maximize performance output. First, would be to consume pure glucose (gummy bears, swedish fish, etc...) 30 min prior to a workout and/or consuming MCT oil. Both metabolize within 30 minutes providing energy. This technique is the foundation of a Targeted Ketogenic Diet (TKD). Some would ask why not consume fruit since its much healthier and its pure carbs. There are two main reasons to not due it. First is fiber will slow the absorption and second the fruit is roughly half glucose and half fructose. Since fructose is metabolized in the liver (just like ketones), it would blunt ketone production (main energy source on Keto).9
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