BF Estimate and Suggestion
dpr73
Posts: 495 Member
Is there anyone who might accept a DM with pictures to estimate body fat and give me suggestions for next steps? I feel like personally my body is in a weird, possibly skinny fat, gray zone and I don’t want to commit to the wrong goal.
Stats- 5’7/134/Male/25 (weightlift 6 days a week consistently for 6 years now)
Lifts (5x5): Squat 215/Bench 145/Deadlift 220
Stats- 5’7/134/Male/25 (weightlift 6 days a week consistently for 6 years now)
Lifts (5x5): Squat 215/Bench 145/Deadlift 220
1
Replies
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I'm not sure if offering DMs are within the guidelines of MFP. I'm pretty sure I got a warning once to help a person out through a DM as a more efficient conduit.
If it's within guideline go ahead and if not just post here.
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Thanks. I have attached photos here0
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Have you been running well-established, progressive, lifting plans for that six year time period? Have you been tracking your nutrition for that time period, particularly your protein intake?2
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Have you been running well-established, progressive, lifting plans for that six year time period? Have you been tracking your nutrition for that time period, particularly your protein intake?
I don’t usually do progressive programs when I’m maintaining. I just have kind of kept the routine the same to maintain weight. But when I have attempted bulls I have started training with progressive overload. I just quit before I make any gains because I fear getting out of shape.
I have counted in the past (for about 5 years). Currently I am not tracking calories because I have actually found that it heightens my anxiety about building and works against me. I tend to undereat so just not counting and eating a bit more than I think has gotten me into a nice rate of gain so far (about a month of experience so far).1 -
You look like you have good muscle definition, just not a ton of muscle.
If you do not want to do the bulk/cut cycle, you can always recomp and do your progressive lifting while eating at maintenance. It's slower, but it means skipping the bit of chubbiness that typically comes from a bulk cycle.1 -
tcunbeliever wrote: »You look like you have good muscle definition, just not a ton of muscle.
If you do not want to do the bulk/cut cycle, you can always recomp and do your progressive lifting while eating at maintenance. It's slower, but it means skipping the bit of chubbiness that typically comes from a bulk cycle.
If I bulk slow and mindfully will I really get very chubby though? I don’t mind a slow bulk to about 150 so long as I don’t get fat looking
What would you do in my position? Again, considering that I don’t want to get unattractive on a bulk1 -
tcunbeliever wrote: »You look like you have good muscle definition, just not a ton of muscle.
If you do not want to do the bulk/cut cycle, you can always recomp and do your progressive lifting while eating at maintenance. It's slower, but it means skipping the bit of chubbiness that typically comes from a bulk cycle.
If I bulk slow and mindfully will I really get very chubby though? I don’t mind a slow bulk to about 150 so long as I don’t get fat looking
What would you do in my position? Again, considering that I don’t want to get unattractive on a bulk
What is your goal? Physique? More Muscle? You're 137lbs at 5'7"? That's pretty lean.
I'm 5'8", 190lbs. My body fat is around 13%-15%. You're probably around the same body fat (maybe more a little more or less....)
If you want to put on muscle... you're going to need to eat... a lot.
If you're really putting in the work in the gym (3-5 Days per week) and getting cardio in (2-3 Days per Week).... You're young enough that it's going to be hard to eat TOO much because your metabolism combined with exercise is likely to put around 3,500-4,000 calories per day (maybe more)... just for maintenance.
Like I said... need to know what you want to do... that'll guide to a path forward.1 -
Scotty2HotPie wrote: »tcunbeliever wrote: »You look like you have good muscle definition, just not a ton of muscle.
If you do not want to do the bulk/cut cycle, you can always recomp and do your progressive lifting while eating at maintenance. It's slower, but it means skipping the bit of chubbiness that typically comes from a bulk cycle.
If I bulk slow and mindfully will I really get very chubby though? I don’t mind a slow bulk to about 150 so long as I don’t get fat looking
What would you do in my position? Again, considering that I don’t want to get unattractive on a bulk
What is your goal? Physique? More Muscle? You're 137lbs at 5'7"? That's pretty lean.
I'm 5'8", 190lbs. My body fat is around 13%-15%. You're probably around the same body fat (maybe more a little more or less....)
If you want to put on muscle... you're going to need to eat... a lot.
If you're really putting in the work in the gym (3-5 Days per week) and getting cardio in (2-3 Days per Week).... You're young enough that it's going to be hard to eat TOO much because your metabolism combined with exercise is likely to put around 3,500-4,000 calories per day (maybe more)... just for maintenance.
Like I said... need to know what you want to do... that'll guide to a path forward.
How did you come by those maintenance figures. I’m same weight as OP and an inch taller. My maintenance cals are 2300. I do resistance training 5 times a week and cardio about 2 to 3 hours (spin)0 -
tcunbeliever wrote: »You look like you have good muscle definition, just not a ton of muscle.
If you do not want to do the bulk/cut cycle, you can always recomp and do your progressive lifting while eating at maintenance. It's slower, but it means skipping the bit of chubbiness that typically comes from a bulk cycle.
If I bulk slow and mindfully will I really get very chubby though? I don’t mind a slow bulk to about 150 so long as I don’t get fat looking
What would you do in my position? Again, considering that I don’t want to get unattractive on a bulk
What are your goals? Do you want to be around the same size with a bit more definition? Do you want to be bigger and more muscular ? If you want more muscle definition you will have to put on muscle, recomp could work but since you are already fairly lean you could have limited results. It really depends on the look you are going for. If you want to gain you need to not be scared of getting fat. You will not get fat if you do it properly.
What kind of progress have you made in the 6 years? If you are happy where you are and with your results then that's great keep doing what you are doing. If on the other hand you are not happy and not reaching your goals something had to change. And sometimes change can be uncomfortable.1 -
cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »Scotty2HotPie wrote: »tcunbeliever wrote: »You look like you have good muscle definition, just not a ton of muscle.
If you do not want to do the bulk/cut cycle, you can always recomp and do your progressive lifting while eating at maintenance. It's slower, but it means skipping the bit of chubbiness that typically comes from a bulk cycle.
If I bulk slow and mindfully will I really get very chubby though? I don’t mind a slow bulk to about 150 so long as I don’t get fat looking
What would you do in my position? Again, considering that I don’t want to get unattractive on a bulk
What is your goal? Physique? More Muscle? You're 137lbs at 5'7"? That's pretty lean.
I'm 5'8", 190lbs. My body fat is around 13%-15%. You're probably around the same body fat (maybe more a little more or less....)
If you want to put on muscle... you're going to need to eat... a lot.
If you're really putting in the work in the gym (3-5 Days per week) and getting cardio in (2-3 Days per Week).... You're young enough that it's going to be hard to eat TOO much because your metabolism combined with exercise is likely to put around 3,500-4,000 calories per day (maybe more)... just for maintenance.
Like I said... need to know what you want to do... that'll guide to a path forward.
How did you come by those maintenance figures. I’m same weight as OP and an inch taller. My maintenance cals are 2300. I do resistance training 5 times a week and cardio about 2 to 3 hours (spin)
He's only 25 and looks to be in decent shape. I may be high by 500 calories or so. But you don't really know your own BMR until you start tracking your exercise and diet.
If he's really been lifting for 6 days per week for the last 6 years, his lifts really should be higher than that.
Without more info, I'm thinking this
- Program needs some adjustment
- Need to eat a lot more... a lot more (good food though)3 -
Bf 15-20%
Judging by the pictures I find it hard to believe that’s 6 years of training,even with
A bad diet and no set training you should still see some newbie gains.6 -
To give a perspective from someone only seriously lifting for 2 years, I've learned that you have to seriously commit to your specific goal. If you want to bulk up, you have to eat and lift and not be scared to put on some body fat in the process. If you operate based on appearance, I feel you will be shortchanging yourself.4
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Bf 15-20%
Judging by the pictures I find it hard to believe that’s 6 years of training,even with
A bad diet and no set training you should still see some newbie gains.
You’re right I’m totally lying to you. I have been lifting 6 year but started obese and lost 70lbs when I first started.2 -
I want to not be called skinny all the time! I personally think my body looks ok (these pics are not great representations but I wasn’t going to pose to look better for these) but people call me very skinny a lot0
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Hey man I understand that. Last summer I was 138lbs at 5ft 8 and I really felt too thin also.
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15-20% is way too high to bulk anyways isn’t it? That’s not a healthy percentage especially for someone who lifts daily for years now.1
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I also lost a lot of weight to get to that picture but as you can see, I wasn't really defined either. Bf% aside, if you don't have the muscle you're not going to have that look. You're already very light, you can't really lose much more weight. Being young, I think you should put your focus on building muscle.4
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I would get on a progressive lifting program as others have mentioned. It sounds like you have not been pushing yourself, which is why you aren’t seeing much change happening. While I don’t believe there are any set amounts a person “should” lift, I would expect a young man such as yourself with lots of testosterone to be pulling WAY higher numbers after 6 years of training. Whether you try a slow bulk or a recomp, you are going to need to really push yourself and your muscles to grow.
BTW - if YOU like the way you look at this weight then just tell anyone that calls you skinny that you are happy with your appearance and leave it at that. You don’t want to be chasing physique goals based on other people’s opinions.4 -
mom23mangos wrote: »I would get on a progressive lifting program as others have mentioned. It sounds like you have not been pushing yourself, which is why you aren’t seeing much change happening. While I don’t believe there are any set amounts a person “should” lift, I would expect a young man such as yourself with lots of testosterone to be pulling WAY higher numbers after 6 years of training. Whether you try a slow bulk or a recomp, you are going to need to really push yourself and your muscles to grow.
BTW - if YOU like the way you look at this weight then just tell anyone that calls you skinny that you are happy with your appearance and leave it at that. You don’t want to be chasing physique goals based on other people’s opinions.
Yes. I agree. I don’t push myself at the gym. I just lift the same to maintain my weight and stay fit. But when I have tried for short periods to build I do progressive overload. But then I quit very shortly after imitating due to fear of fat gain.
I really want to be more muscular and this is truly the look I want to achieve, but I just can’t get over the fat thing.1 -
mom23mangos wrote: »I would get on a progressive lifting program as others have mentioned. It sounds like you have not been pushing yourself, which is why you aren’t seeing much change happening. While I don’t believe there are any set amounts a person “should” lift, I would expect a young man such as yourself with lots of testosterone to be pulling WAY higher numbers after 6 years of training. Whether you try a slow bulk or a recomp, you are going to need to really push yourself and your muscles to grow.
BTW - if YOU like the way you look at this weight then just tell anyone that calls you skinny that you are happy with your appearance and leave it at that. You don’t want to be chasing physique goals based on other people’s opinions.
Yes. I agree. I don’t push myself at the gym. I just lift the same to maintain my weight and stay fit. But when I have tried for short periods to build I do progressive overload. But then I quit very shortly after imitating due to fear of fat gain.
I really want to be more muscular and this is truly the look I want to achieve, but I just can’t get over the fat thing.
Totally understand your feeling. After working hard to lose weight it's hard to see the scale move the other way, but if you put yourself in a moderate surplus and start a progressive program, you WILL gain muscle too. Beyond that, I don't know what else to suggest.1 -
Paging @Mr_Healthy_Habits. He's been in your shoes (lost even more weight) and has been able to bulk up successfully without much fat gain. It's pretty amazing what he's been able to achieve. I think you could learn a lot from him.2
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mom23mangos wrote: »I would get on a progressive lifting program as others have mentioned. It sounds like you have not been pushing yourself, which is why you aren’t seeing much change happening. While I don’t believe there are any set amounts a person “should” lift, I would expect a young man such as yourself with lots of testosterone to be pulling WAY higher numbers after 6 years of training. Whether you try a slow bulk or a recomp, you are going to need to really push yourself and your muscles to grow.
BTW - if YOU like the way you look at this weight then just tell anyone that calls you skinny that you are happy with your appearance and leave it at that. You don’t want to be chasing physique goals based on other people’s opinions.
Yes. I agree. I don’t push myself at the gym. I just lift the same to maintain my weight and stay fit. But when I have tried for short periods to build I do progressive overload. But then I quit very shortly after imitating due to fear of fat gain.
I really want to be more muscular and this is truly the look I want to achieve, but I just can’t get over the fat thing.
Can you give a summary of your weekly weight workout (Splits / Sets / Reps... etc).
FYI - I see ton's of new guys in the gym flailing around with iso-exercises and/or lifting extremely light weights for ton's of reps. They're just spinning their wheels and not really progressing.
I SOO much want to reach out to them and give them tips... but it's really not my place to do so. Plus I don't want to insult them. My number one word of advice would be to keep things simple and focusing the basic compound lifts and get strong in those first.
General strength goals (These aren't definitely set in stone... and you definitely want to keep going once your reach them...)
Your approx current goal in ()
Bench - 1.5xBW - (~200 LBS)
Deadlift - 2.5xBW - (~335 LBS)
Squat - 2.0xBW - (~275 LBS)
I get the fat thing.. I'm paranoid of it myself. I lost about 60 lbs a couple years back and I start freaking when the love handles start coming back... which they always threaten to do...
The 5x5 program is a great place to start. But you haven't said how long you've been doing it. You should be going up in weight each week... even if you're just adding 2.5lbs-5lbs. The goal of that program is to build a strength foundation, not to indefinitely do the four big lifts... That would get boring after several months and you're likely to stall out too.1 -
If I understand you correct...
You don't count calories but are adding a bit more food by eye and your weight is moving up slowly.
This is perfectly reasonable for the gaining aspect. I myself as well as many other utilize this strategy. As long as your gain is .25-.5 lbs per week you are in the ball park. When the scale stops moving we eat a tad more until it moves.
Of course we also need sufficient stimulus to achieve a hypertrophic response. This will have a lot to do with how you respond to training, your volume, along with sufficient protein and EAAs.
I generally recommend 2.3-3.1/kg/day for daily protein intake. You can probably aim towards the lower end since your goal is hypertrophy and your a young male.
If you don't know your protein intake, I suggest you utilize MFP logging just for that aspect or you can keep a separate log until you get a good eye for it.
There are many ways to achieve overload your stimulus enough to produce a adaptation. Though I think most people fall I to a trap thinking their gains needs to be linear which is far from true.2 -
mom23mangos wrote: »Paging @Mr_Healthy_Habits. He's been in your shoes (lost even more weight) and has been able to bulk up successfully without much fat gain. It's pretty amazing what he's been able to achieve. I think you could learn a lot from him.
@mom23mangos
Hey thank you... Means a lot that you thought of me and I appreciate the kind words...
To the OP...
Wow so much to say on this topic, first of as far as body fat percentage goes, I wouldn't even really worry about it at this point...
What I've been doing these days is just focusing on increasing strength by pushing myself to add reps and weight to my workouts each week and using the tape measure and the mirror...
There unfortunately just isn't a reliable way to measure your body fat percentage, you can't trust scales, nor calipers, and in many cases not even an expensive dexa scan...
Fortunately however it's not too difficult to tell if you are gaining or losing fat... The best way I've found is by measuring your waist, and neck circ, I also have a cheap pair of calipers I got from Amazon and I use 2 pinches, my abs near my belly button and my suprailiac crest (Google)...
Using these measurements I've got a pretty good idea if I'm adding fat or not... If these markers increase, you are adding fat, if they stay the same and your weight increases... Congratulations, you're adding muscle...
With your waist and neck measurements... You can look up the navy body fat test method and get a rough idea of your percentage but don't focus on the number but rather the trend... If you gain a 0.25" in your waist but add 0.75" to your neck... You've actually lowered your body fat percentage while adding muscle, again congrats! Lol...
It's also important as well to track things like your shoulder circ, chest circ etc... These numbers week to week will tell you if you are gaining muscle as well, but if you are increasing the weight on the bar every week, trust that you likely are...
Jefit is a great app that you can use to track all these measurements! Best of luck!0 -
from my perspective, i think that you look thin/slender. i can see the bones in your elbows, scapula and collar. there is nothing wrong with that it is just what i think i can see. i do wonder if you have low hormone levels due to undereating and overexercising/spinning your wheels if it were. i can see from a previous post that you are frightened of putting on weight and quite careful with controlling your weight/eating. from my perspective it would be attractive to see a bit of weight on you, even if that did include a bit of body fat along with muscle. i suggest seeing a personal trainer and/or doing a bit of slow reverse dieting, very slow. focus on the positive changes to your body. ps congratulations on losing 70lb0
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OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.
Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.
In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.
You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.1 -
cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.
Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.
In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.
You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.
I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.1 -
from my perspective, i think that you look thin/slender. i can see the bones in your elbows, scapula and collar. there is nothing wrong with that it is just what i think i can see. i do wonder if you have low hormone levels due to undereating and overexercising/spinning your wheels if it were. i can see from a previous post that you are frightened of putting on weight and quite careful with controlling your weight/eating. from my perspective it would be attractive to see a bit of weight on you, even if that did include a bit of body fat along with muscle. i suggest seeing a personal trainer and/or doing a bit of slow reverse dieting, very slow. focus on the positive changes to your body. ps congratulations on losing 70lb
Yes you do see my collar bones and my scapula for sure. My shoulder region is extremely bony, as is my butt (though it’s not as apparent). I don’t like that feeling at all, but have struggled for the past 5 or so years with the idea of building muscle. It’s been a journey that I hope I can finally succeed with this time around honestly0 -
cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.
Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.
In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.
You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.
I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.
That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.
Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.
Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.3 -
cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »cupcakesandproteinshakes wrote: »OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.
Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.
In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.
You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.
I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.
That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.
Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.
Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.
I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).0
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