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BF Estimate and Suggestion

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  • mom23mangosmom23mangos Member Posts: 3,026 Member Member Posts: 3,026 Member
    Paging @Mr_Healthy_Habits. He's been in your shoes (lost even more weight) and has been able to bulk up successfully without much fat gain. It's pretty amazing what he's been able to achieve. I think you could learn a lot from him.
  • Scotty2HotPieScotty2HotPie Member Posts: 135 Member Member Posts: 135 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    I would get on a progressive lifting program as others have mentioned. It sounds like you have not been pushing yourself, which is why you aren’t seeing much change happening. While I don’t believe there are any set amounts a person “should” lift, I would expect a young man such as yourself with lots of testosterone to be pulling WAY higher numbers after 6 years of training. Whether you try a slow bulk or a recomp, you are going to need to really push yourself and your muscles to grow.

    BTW - if YOU like the way you look at this weight then just tell anyone that calls you skinny that you are happy with your appearance and leave it at that. You don’t want to be chasing physique goals based on other people’s opinions.

    Yes. I agree. I don’t push myself at the gym. I just lift the same to maintain my weight and stay fit. But when I have tried for short periods to build I do progressive overload. But then I quit very shortly after imitating due to fear of fat gain.
    I really want to be more muscular and this is truly the look I want to achieve, but I just can’t get over the fat thing.

    Can you give a summary of your weekly weight workout (Splits / Sets / Reps... etc).

    FYI - I see ton's of new guys in the gym flailing around with iso-exercises and/or lifting extremely light weights for ton's of reps. They're just spinning their wheels and not really progressing.

    I SOO much want to reach out to them and give them tips... but it's really not my place to do so. Plus I don't want to insult them. My number one word of advice would be to keep things simple and focusing the basic compound lifts and get strong in those first.

    General strength goals (These aren't definitely set in stone... and you definitely want to keep going once your reach them...)

    Your approx current goal in ()
    Bench - 1.5xBW - (~200 LBS)
    Deadlift - 2.5xBW - (~335 LBS)
    Squat - 2.0xBW - (~275 LBS)

    I get the fat thing.. I'm paranoid of it myself. I lost about 60 lbs a couple years back and I start freaking when the love handles start coming back... which they always threaten to do...

    The 5x5 program is a great place to start. But you haven't said how long you've been doing it. You should be going up in weight each week... even if you're just adding 2.5lbs-5lbs. The goal of that program is to build a strength foundation, not to indefinitely do the four big lifts... That would get boring after several months and you're likely to stall out too.
  • ChieflrgChieflrg Member Posts: 8,638 Member Member Posts: 8,638 Member
    If I understand you correct...

    You don't count calories but are adding a bit more food by eye and your weight is moving up slowly.

    This is perfectly reasonable for the gaining aspect. I myself as well as many other utilize this strategy. As long as your gain is .25-.5 lbs per week you are in the ball park. When the scale stops moving we eat a tad more until it moves.

    Of course we also need sufficient stimulus to achieve a hypertrophic response. This will have a lot to do with how you respond to training, your volume, along with sufficient protein and EAAs.

    I generally recommend 2.3-3.1/kg/day for daily protein intake. You can probably aim towards the lower end since your goal is hypertrophy and your a young male.

    If you don't know your protein intake, I suggest you utilize MFP logging just for that aspect or you can keep a separate log until you get a good eye for it.

    There are many ways to achieve overload your stimulus enough to produce a adaptation. Though I think most people fall I to a trap thinking their gains needs to be linear which is far from true.
  • Mr_Healthy_HabitsMr_Healthy_Habits Member Posts: 11,629 Member Member Posts: 11,629 Member
    Paging @Mr_Healthy_Habits. He's been in your shoes (lost even more weight) and has been able to bulk up successfully without much fat gain. It's pretty amazing what he's been able to achieve. I think you could learn a lot from him.

    @mom23mangos
    Hey thank you... Means a lot that you thought of me and I appreciate the kind words...

    To the OP...

    Wow so much to say on this topic, first of as far as body fat percentage goes, I wouldn't even really worry about it at this point...

    What I've been doing these days is just focusing on increasing strength by pushing myself to add reps and weight to my workouts each week and using the tape measure and the mirror...

    There unfortunately just isn't a reliable way to measure your body fat percentage, you can't trust scales, nor calipers, and in many cases not even an expensive dexa scan...

    Fortunately however it's not too difficult to tell if you are gaining or losing fat... The best way I've found is by measuring your waist, and neck circ, I also have a cheap pair of calipers I got from Amazon and I use 2 pinches, my abs near my belly button and my suprailiac crest (Google)...

    Using these measurements I've got a pretty good idea if I'm adding fat or not... If these markers increase, you are adding fat, if they stay the same and your weight increases... Congratulations, you're adding muscle...

    With your waist and neck measurements... You can look up the navy body fat test method and get a rough idea of your percentage but don't focus on the number but rather the trend... If you gain a 0.25" in your waist but add 0.75" to your neck... You've actually lowered your body fat percentage while adding muscle, again congrats! Lol...

    It's also important as well to track things like your shoulder circ, chest circ etc... These numbers week to week will tell you if you are gaining muscle as well, but if you are increasing the weight on the bar every week, trust that you likely are...

    Jefit is a great app that you can use to track all these measurements! Best of luck!
    edited February 11
  • elfin168elfin168 Member Posts: 183 Member Member Posts: 183 Member
    from my perspective, i think that you look thin/slender. i can see the bones in your elbows, scapula and collar. there is nothing wrong with that it is just what i think i can see. i do wonder if you have low hormone levels due to undereating and overexercising/spinning your wheels if it were. i can see from a previous post that you are frightened of putting on weight and quite careful with controlling your weight/eating. from my perspective it would be attractive to see a bit of weight on you, even if that did include a bit of body fat along with muscle. i suggest seeing a personal trainer and/or doing a bit of slow reverse dieting, very slow. focus on the positive changes to your body. ps congratulations on losing 70lb
    edited February 11
  • cupcakesandproteinshakescupcakesandproteinshakes Member Posts: 800 Member Member Posts: 800 Member
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    elfin168 wrote: »
    from my perspective, i think that you look thin/slender. i can see the bones in your elbows, scapula and collar. there is nothing wrong with that it is just what i think i can see. i do wonder if you have low hormone levels due to undereating and overexercising/spinning your wheels if it were. i can see from a previous post that you are frightened of putting on weight and quite careful with controlling your weight/eating. from my perspective it would be attractive to see a bit of weight on you, even if that did include a bit of body fat along with muscle. i suggest seeing a personal trainer and/or doing a bit of slow reverse dieting, very slow. focus on the positive changes to your body. ps congratulations on losing 70lb

    Yes you do see my collar bones and my scapula for sure. My shoulder region is extremely bony, as is my butt (though it’s not as apparent). I don’t like that feeling at all, but have struggled for the past 5 or so years with the idea of building muscle. It’s been a journey that I hope I can finally succeed with this time around honestly
  • cupcakesandproteinshakescupcakesandproteinshakes Member Posts: 800 Member Member Posts: 800 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).
  • giancarlov1191giancarlov1191 Member Posts: 381 Member Member Posts: 381 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).

    Hey man,

    Remember the fact that you've lost weight before! You know what to do, you can do it again, but this time (if you bulk a bit) it'll be easier because you have more experience and you will have built some muscle. In my opinion, we will never be HAPPY to put on fat, particularly if we've lost it before, but if we can come to accept it as a temporary part of the process, a means-to-an-end, it will be easier.

    In this last year, I've gone from 170lbs to 138lbs back up to 159lbs and now I'm burning again. Onwards and upwards bro 🙏
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).

    Hey man,

    Remember the fact that you've lost weight before! You know what to do, you can do it again, but this time (if you bulk a bit) it'll be easier because you have more experience and you will have built some muscle. In my opinion, we will never be HAPPY to put on fat, particularly if we've lost it before, but if we can come to accept it as a temporary part of the process, a means-to-an-end, it will be easier.

    In this last year, I've gone from 170lbs to 138lbs back up to 159lbs and now I'm burning again. Onwards and upwards bro 🙏

    I’m not scared of cutting after. I’m scared of looking bad in between. I don’t care about a little temporary fat gain a. Means to an end. I just don’t want to look BAD at the end of a bulk either
  • giancarlov1191giancarlov1191 Member Posts: 381 Member Member Posts: 381 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).

    Hey man,

    Remember the fact that you've lost weight before! You know what to do, you can do it again, but this time (if you bulk a bit) it'll be easier because you have more experience and you will have built some muscle. In my opinion, we will never be HAPPY to put on fat, particularly if we've lost it before, but if we can come to accept it as a temporary part of the process, a means-to-an-end, it will be easier.

    In this last year, I've gone from 170lbs to 138lbs back up to 159lbs and now I'm burning again. Onwards and upwards bro 🙏

    I’m not scared of cutting after. I’m scared of looking bad in between. I don’t care about a little temporary fat gain a. Means to an end. I just don’t want to look BAD at the end of a bulk either

    If you take it slow, eat clean, and progressive with your lifts, you will gain moderately and I doubt you will look BAD. Nobody would every look at you and say you look BAD. It's US who do that to ourselves man, I know because I do it too. Something will have to give here though. Either you can accept the current state, or you can accept the changes that can and will happen.

    If I may suggest, don't wait too long to decide. I know it's never too late and all, but while age is on your side, it will be easier.
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).

    Hey man,

    Remember the fact that you've lost weight before! You know what to do, you can do it again, but this time (if you bulk a bit) it'll be easier because you have more experience and you will have built some muscle. In my opinion, we will never be HAPPY to put on fat, particularly if we've lost it before, but if we can come to accept it as a temporary part of the process, a means-to-an-end, it will be easier.

    In this last year, I've gone from 170lbs to 138lbs back up to 159lbs and now I'm burning again. Onwards and upwards bro 🙏

    I’m not scared of cutting after. I’m scared of looking bad in between. I don’t care about a little temporary fat gain a. Means to an end. I just don’t want to look BAD at the end of a bulk either

    If you take it slow, eat clean, and progressive with your lifts, you will gain moderately and I doubt you will look BAD. Nobody would every look at you and say you look BAD. It's US who do that to ourselves man, I know because I do it too. Something will have to give here though. Either you can accept the current state, or you can accept the changes that can and will happen.

    If I may suggest, don't wait too long to decide. I know it's never too late and all, but while age is on your side, it will be easier.

    God you’re so right. And I know that if I never just bear down and try I’m gonna wonder for the rest of my life what it could have been with my age being favorable.
  • giancarlov1191giancarlov1191 Member Posts: 381 Member Member Posts: 381 Member
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).

    Hey man,

    Remember the fact that you've lost weight before! You know what to do, you can do it again, but this time (if you bulk a bit) it'll be easier because you have more experience and you will have built some muscle. In my opinion, we will never be HAPPY to put on fat, particularly if we've lost it before, but if we can come to accept it as a temporary part of the process, a means-to-an-end, it will be easier.

    In this last year, I've gone from 170lbs to 138lbs back up to 159lbs and now I'm burning again. Onwards and upwards bro 🙏

    I’m not scared of cutting after. I’m scared of looking bad in between. I don’t care about a little temporary fat gain a. Means to an end. I just don’t want to look BAD at the end of a bulk either

    If you take it slow, eat clean, and progressive with your lifts, you will gain moderately and I doubt you will look BAD. Nobody would every look at you and say you look BAD. It's US who do that to ourselves man, I know because I do it too. Something will have to give here though. Either you can accept the current state, or you can accept the changes that can and will happen.

    If I may suggest, don't wait too long to decide. I know it's never too late and all, but while age is on your side, it will be easier.

    God you’re so right. And I know that if I never just bear down and try I’m gonna wonder for the rest of my life what it could have been with my age being favorable.

    You can do it man. Take advantage of the community for support, there are lots of going through the same thing and feeling similar. You just have to take that first step 🙏
  • nkzardnkzard Member, Premium Posts: 19 Member Member, Premium Posts: 19 Member
    Finally some good advice on this website from jseams above. Completely agree with that last comment. Nothing to cut to, nothing to recomp to, you just gotta gain some weight.
  • giancarlov1191giancarlov1191 Member Posts: 381 Member Member Posts: 381 Member
    Excellent advice above. I believe OP understands the mechanics, I think he needs the motivation and support from us!
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    Excellent advice above. I believe OP understands the mechanics, I think he needs the motivation and support from us!

    This is exactly what I need! Thank you. I just need to know the reality of what to expect which I’m sure is no where near as bad as I think it is...
  • dpr73dpr73 Member Posts: 492 Member Member Posts: 492 Member
    jseams1234 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    dpr73 wrote: »
    OP. Why don’t you get yourself on a structured lifting programme: there’s a thread at the top. If you haven’t been following a programme then this is where you have been going wrong. Pick any beginners programme it really doesn’t matter too much.

    Lift for a few months. Reap the newbie gains.

    In your shoes after a recent large weight loss I wouldn’t cut or bulk, just lift and maintain ur weight. Get used to training properly. I speak as a former fat person who was scared to gain. It has taken me a few years to even contemplate gaining. I would get into good habits with training and then when you are ready to bulk, you can. Or not. It’s your body, after all.

    You have years of training ahead of you and potentially a great physique, but it will take time to build and you have to accept that those quick transformations on insta are not all ‘real’. Real life is much more complicated than a 6 pack magically appearing after 3 months training. For most of us at least.

    I totally agree with what you said.i am not a quick fix type of person. I actually enjoy the long process. What frightens me is that I bulk and put on fat, then I don’t look good/healthy after bulking. I know cuts have to follow even the leanest bulls oftentimes, but I don’t ever want to appear fat/out of shape, this is what has me spinning wheels.

    That’s why I suggested you recomp. Train at the weight you are. Is it optimal? Maybe not, maybe yes. But for where you are mentally it feels to me like the best way. Because if you bulk there will be a period where you look fatter. If that sends you to a cut after only a few weeks in a surplus this is why you aren’t seeing progress. Well that and not following a progressive lifting programme.

    Not everyone is mentally cut out for bulking. That’s ok, we are all different.

    Maybe in the future you will reach a place where you don’t fear looking fatter. I’m just about there. It’s taken a few years at maintenance and lifting for me to feel ready to bulk. I had a long period of being overweight and a period in my teens of anorexia ( 25 years ago, I’m old) I had a lot of *kitten* to sort out mentally around food.

    I personally really want to bulk though. I’m sick of people not thinking I lift (which I do religiously...it’s my favorite hobby). And I would like to be bigger and more muscular and wouldn’t mind a little
    More fat (I currently don’t fill out my
    Clothes very well at all). I just need help knowing what to expect cause in my head I get this view that I’ll be far with a big gut after bulking with 15lbs slowly (like .5-1lb a week).

    Hey man,

    Remember the fact that you've lost weight before! You know what to do, you can do it again, but this time (if you bulk a bit) it'll be easier because you have more experience and you will have built some muscle. In my opinion, we will never be HAPPY to put on fat, particularly if we've lost it before, but if we can come to accept it as a temporary part of the process, a means-to-an-end, it will be easier.

    In this last year, I've gone from 170lbs to 138lbs back up to 159lbs and now I'm burning again. Onwards and upwards bro 🙏

    I’m not scared of cutting after. I’m scared of looking bad in between. I don’t care about a little temporary fat gain a. Means to an end. I just don’t want to look BAD at the end of a bulk either

    I don't quite understand this... nobody is suggesting you bulk until you are 200+ pounds, gut hanging over your belt and wider in the middle than you are in the shoulders.

    Yes, bulking 20 pounds might give you some pooch and add some to the love handles but in clothes you will probably look better and less DYEL as you will fill out your clothes better, your sleeves will be tight on your arms and your shoulders and traps won't be hidden when wearing normal clothing. Maybe relaxed, caved chest, stomach popping in a side view in the mirror naked won't be optimal - but unless you are spending a lot of your time around others half naked it shouldn't matter. For me, I know I look a heck of a lot more powerful and thick at the top of my bulk when I'm clothed... I just purposefully avoid dwelling on my naked side profile in the mirror. ;)

    About the "recomp" thing. I'd not suggest it. You have been basically recomping for years now. Besides the time you spent in a purposeful deficit losing weight you have been yo-yo'ing between a minor surplus and deficit for years - maintaining about the same weight the entire time. This is in essence, a recomp. However, you are nowhere near your target weight and don't really have much to work with in terms of stored energy and body fat which has resulted in the glacially slow to non-existent gains you are experiencing. Look at the last few pages of the "recomp" thread and you'll see that most of those people just actually cut. They lost weight and look a bit more defined because of that. Very few of them actually maintained and the ones that actually did and aren't using angles and lighting don't look any different. Recomp does work but if you have any advanced physique goals it's so slow that you will be my age before you actually see (if you even do) any real changes... imo of course. Obviously, I'm not a huge proponent of recomp for bodybuilding/physique.

    This is amazingly helpful for me to stay dedicated to gaining! Thank you!!
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