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Satiety

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  • sardelsasardelsa Member Posts: 9,611 Member Member Posts: 9,611 Member
    ahoy_m8 wrote: »
    sardelsa wrote: »
    ... I keep my deficit moderate, I also do higher calorie days (refeeds), diet breaks, and never stay too lean too long...

    Great comment. Wondering if you can say more about what "too lean for too long" means to you. I do notice I'm hungrier (less deficit tolerant) when I'm most lean.

    Sure @ahoy_m8 I think it's definitely going to be different for everyone and perhaps to do with genetics, dieting history, etc. Some people are able to sit at leaner levels more comfortably, others aren't. Too lean for me would be not only light but lower in bodyfat%. I don't have accurate numbers but I would say somewhere around 18-22% is a sweet spot for me where I am able to be comfortable . If I do go lower, it's just for the purpose of getting lean to bulk up again (so not there long). Even when maintaining I will add on 5lbs here and take 5lbs off here depending on the weather, events, vacations, etc so I never really sit at really lean levels for long periods of time. That works best for me.
  • ssorg9ssorg9 Member Posts: 30 Member Member Posts: 30 Member
    I find that nutritional foods seem to satisfy the most. Green vegetables & beans are great. I also make sure I sit and enjoy my food my by chewing it longer than I would on my own. One of my issues in life is inhaling food. Lastly, I try to drink at least 24 oz of water with a meal.
  • mnbvcxzlkjhgfdsa12mnbvcxzlkjhgfdsa12 Member Posts: 156 Member Member Posts: 156 Member
    For me it’s about eating unprocessed foods as much as possible. I don’t try to eat a certain ratio of protein/carbs/fat, and when I’ve tried to do that in the past I’ve just been hungry. I get lots of fiber because I’m vegan and eat lots of veg.

    I thought this article was interesting and rang very true to my experience https://www.theguardian.com/food/2020/feb/13/how-ultra-processed-food-took-over-your-shopping-basket-brazil-carlos-monteiro
  • NovusDiesNovusDies Member, Premium Posts: 8,283 Member Member, Premium Posts: 8,283 Member
    If I eat before about 11am I have a harder time controlling my hunger the rest of the day even when I eat the same things that normally give me excellent results.

    If my deficit has been too steep for a few days because I have not properly accounted for activity I will struggle to control my hunger at night.

    If I tell myself I can't have something I generally want it more.

    There have been times I have gone a bit nuts after drinking alcohol.

    Otherwise I am great on a moderate carb, high protein, high fiber system.

    What I have learned through trial and error is that for me food is only part of the equation.
  • MikePTYMikePTY Member, Premium Posts: 3,823 Member Member, Premium Posts: 3,823 Member
    Through trial and error, I've found that some foods satiate better than others. I'm partial to fruits and vegetables. But honestly, I'm a pretty hungry person, regardless if I'm in a surplus or deficit. So sometimes this is just my reality.

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  • katshearekatsheare Member Posts: 1,109 Member Member Posts: 1,109 Member
    Thank you all so much for the replies! There is plenty of food for thought in here (pun fully intended), and I've got some baby thoughts that I'll be exploring over the coming months. This really was the breadth of observation I was hoping for :)
  • AnnPT77AnnPT77 Member, Premium Posts: 16,444 Member Member, Premium Posts: 16,444 Member
    Despite your "closing message", I'm going to mention one other thing that might be worth checking, if you don't get results from the more obvious strategies above.

    That would be: Spot check a couple of typical days for micronutrient adequacy. MFP's data won't be adequate for this (it doesn't track micros well), but it's possible to use the USDA database (or something similar) to do a more thorough deep-dive with a couple of days of food log. Persistent deficiencies can lead to cravings. (Magnesium is one I've seen mentioned.)

    I wouldn't suggest supplementing generically (irrespective of knowing which nutrients seem low), but a spot check could be the basis for seeing whether the things that are low could be improved by reasonable eating changes, or are safe to supplement, or should lead you to ask your doctor to do a blood test before supplementing.

    It's a low-probability thing, but may be a thing.
  • bmeadows380bmeadows380 Member Posts: 2,771 Member Member Posts: 2,771 Member
    Meal timing makes a difference for me. I also get about 100g protein and about 35g fiber daily on my 1900-2300 calories. That seems to be the sweet spot.

    Speaking of sweets, if I have something really sweet and especially if it's sweet and wheat - without it also having a good amount of protein/fat/fiber I will be hungrier. So I can have a protein, fruit and nuts smoothie, but not a Costco blueberry muffin - even though they have similar calories. The wheat/sugar combo seems to trigger me for some reason.

    As always, YMMV.

    Yes, I found it helpful to think beyond just macros when focusing on satiety. I don't need to do low carbohydrate to feel satisfied, but snacking on just fruit doesn't fill me up at all. I can have a carby snack like popcorn and feel fine. If I eat just an apple, it makes me hungrier than I was before (fruit in the context of a full meal is just fine though).

    I thought I was the only person that happened to!

    I'm still working through what satiates me. Protein helps, but carbs are actually a big help too. I can have a slice of bread and it will hold me for quite a while; a handful of almonds (which is higher calorie than the bread), and its' like dropping a cup of water into the ocean - 1 serving of almonds won't even being to satiate me.
  • beulah81beulah81 Member Posts: 142 Member Member Posts: 142 Member
    Meal timing makes a difference for me. I also get about 100g protein and about 35g fiber daily on my 1900-2300 calories. That seems to be the sweet spot.

    Speaking of sweets, if I have something really sweet and especially if it's sweet and wheat - without it also having a good amount of protein/fat/fiber I will be hungrier. So I can have a protein, fruit and nuts smoothie, but not a Costco blueberry muffin - even though they have similar calories. The wheat/sugar combo seems to trigger me for some reason.

    As always, YMMV.

    Yes, I found it helpful to think beyond just macros when focusing on satiety. I don't need to do low carbohydrate to feel satisfied, but snacking on just fruit doesn't fill me up at all. I can have a carby snack like popcorn and feel fine. If I eat just an apple, it makes me hungrier than I was before (fruit in the context of a full meal is just fine though).

    I thought I was the only person that happened to!

    I'm still working through what satiates me. Protein helps, but carbs are actually a big help too. I can have a slice of bread and it will hold me for quite a while; a handful of almonds (which is higher calorie than the bread), and its' like dropping a cup of water into the ocean - 1 serving of almonds won't even being to satiate me.

    Ditto.
  • sijomialsijomial Member Posts: 16,911 Member Member Posts: 16,911 Member
    The thing that struck me when I did 5:2 fasting and had to be creative with 600 cals on fasting days was that high taste food, visually appealing and with interesting textures satiated me far more than the maybe more mainstream thinking of this macro or that macro.

    Intense flavours like lime, chilli, ginger, onion etc. made a tiny calorie allowance feel like a lot more. Sushi was a regular (but small) lunch on fasting days and the wasabi, soy and ginger really hit the spot. A lot of satiety for few calories.

    In terms of normal eating then at a macro view starchy carbs tend to satisfy me a lot more than protein (especially meat) or fats on a calorie basis. Don't forget fibre for satiety - in various "top ten" lists high bulk foods feature a lot but all three macros are often evenly represented.
  • gremloBBPTgremloBBPT Member Posts: 48 Member Member Posts: 48 Member
    I noticed from observation. A poster mentioned earlier that as a kid he noticed cereal didn't fill him up, and I had the same experience. For me, that included oatmeal. Oatmeal doesn't keep me full for long unless I add protein and/or fat to it--then it's great. But I didn't start doing that until I was cooking my own meals.

    What matters a lot for me is what I eat first in the day. If it's high carb (especially if it's high sugar) without a lot of protein, I'm pretty much hungry all day. If I make my first meal high protein and/or high fat and low'ish carb, then I have a smaller appetite all day.

    High carb (and low-fiber) snacks do nothing to satiate me, so I avoid ever eating them w/o also having protein or fat. Even some carbs with a decent amount of fiber, like an apple, can screw me up bc I'm apparently sensitive to that much sugar. So I always eat an apple with some cheese or nuts. Fats are filling for me.

    If I get in too much protein for me in one meal or spread out over the course of the day, it satiates me too much, actually. There's a certain upper limit where my appetite shuts down completely and the thought of food makes me sick. I avoid that because I like to eat. ;) But I've sometimes accidentally overdosed on protein and experienced that.
    edited February 14
  • vivo1972vivo1972 Member Posts: 116 Member Member Posts: 116 Member
    For me it was cutting out foods specially made for weight loss (apart from protein shakes meal replacements - I use those for nutrition boosts now and then).

    Increased these as brain satisfiers..

    Really nice bakery bread /wholegrain/seeded/rye/whatever but is has to taste like bread
    Butter - tastes yummy and satifies on fresh bread with a brew of coffee/tea.
    Stewed fruit - raw fruit just sits in my fridge rotting.
    A pudding every day - yaaaay. Made by me.
    A stoneground one person pizza from the shop - only 600 calories for that "cor I had proper pizza" feeling.
    Boiled eggs.
    Porridge, I've just discovered MOMA seeded and it's lush. Really filling.

    Stopped eating pasta completely as I can eat a bucketful and never feel full.

  • gothchiqgothchiq Member Posts: 4,558 Member Member Posts: 4,558 Member
    This is super individual. Experiment and take notes. For me, avoiding simple carbs and loading up on vegetables works, provided I also get enough protein. Drinking things has no effect on my hunger perception.
  • ElizabethKalmbachElizabethKalmbach Member Posts: 1,416 Member Member Posts: 1,416 Member
    I meal plan and use a day planner, so I just took notes on how I felt and did a 1-5 rating system on how full I felt over the course of the day. The 1-5 helped me flip through things QUICKLY and look for patterns. The notes helped me notice things like I'm more or less hungry based on TOM.

    In the end, *meal timing* ended up being the kicker for me. If I eat breakfast, I'm hungrier all day than if I skip it and just eat lunch and dinner. Once my insulin gets going, it goes and goes and goes until bed. So the closer to bed time I start eating, the less I eat.

    Maybe don't just observe the macros themselves, but other things that stand out to you about that day.
  • yirarayirara Member Posts: 5,358 Member Member Posts: 5,358 Member
    Carbs for me: bread, rice, pasta, couscous, potatoes, etc. Fats leave me hungry.
  • kshama2001kshama2001 Member Posts: 22,267 Member Member Posts: 22,267 Member
    sijomial wrote: »
    The thing that struck me when I did 5:2 fasting and had to be creative with 600 cals on fasting days was that high taste food, visually appealing and with interesting textures satiated me far more than the maybe more mainstream thinking of this macro or that macro.

    Intense flavours like lime, chilli, ginger, onion etc. made a tiny calorie allowance feel like a lot more. Sushi was a regular (but small) lunch on fasting days and the wasabi, soy and ginger really hit the spot. A lot of satiety for few calories.

    In terms of normal eating then at a macro view starchy carbs tend to satisfy me a lot more than protein (especially meat) or fats on a calorie basis. Don't forget fibre for satiety - in various "top ten" lists high bulk foods feature a lot but all three macros are often evenly represented.

    Yes, spicy, bulky foods that take a lot of chewing fill me quite well.

    I have to work to finish @ 400 calorie meals like Thai Beef Salad and Stir Fried Green Beans with Pork and Oyster Sauce (both with about a half cup of rice.)

    Rice is the starchy carb that fills me the best for the smallest amount when compared to potatoes and especially flour products like bread or pasta - I can eat a ton of those.
  • kshama2001kshama2001 Member Posts: 22,267 Member Member Posts: 22,267 Member
    katsheare wrote: »
    Thank you all so much for the replies! There is plenty of food for thought in here (pun fully intended), and I've got some baby thoughts that I'll be exploring over the coming months. This really was the breadth of observation I was hoping for :)

    Another thing of note is that for women with menstrual cycles, appetite can go up when we ovulate as well as premenstrually. I eat at maintenance for a few days before my period comes and tend to naturally want to exercise more around ovulation, so I am getting more exercise calories those days.
  • kshama2001kshama2001 Member Posts: 22,267 Member Member Posts: 22,267 Member
    katsheare wrote: »
    What methods have people used for determining what foods satiate? I get a little (okay, a LOT) jealous when I see people who know they just need to keep carbs down... or get a bit more fat.... or nail their protein..... or whatever to feel satisfied and full. My experience is so inconsistent as to make measuring (and isolating what does/does not work) a challenge to say the least.

    I have tried low carb (for about 3 weeks, several years ago) and not only was it not liveable with my family, it didn't do the trick. Hitting protein doesn't seem to do anything particularly noticeable for me. Fats seem to make no difference. Some days I'm all the foodz hungry and some days I'm meh, not hungry at all; looking at my diary for those days (food and exercise both) nothing obvious pops out.

    Strangely, the one thing that will sometimes make me feel not distractedly hungry is something warm to drink (it's not a hydration issue. I'm very well hydrated.) so I'll go through mugs and mugs and mugs of decaf tea and warm water. It doesn't satiate as such, but it's the closest thing I've found. (And only warm to drink. Cold doesn't do it at all. I can't drink hot :/)

    So I'm just wondering what other users have done to pinpoint what works for them. Would be handy information to have in my back pocket.

    What's your goal weight?

    I know you said you already considered protein, but looking at your diary that's what jumped out to me - I see your breakfasts tend to be very high in carbs in relation to protein and on the days I looked you were not hitting your protein goal, and some days you were way under for protein.
  • jhanleybrownjhanleybrown Member Posts: 229 Member Member Posts: 229 Member
    Everything above but for what it's worth avocados really work for me. Caloric so you need to track but I have avocado toast for breakfast every day not because I'm a hipster but because it's super filling for cal cost.

    But healthy fat, fiber + protein is the general prescription.

    Lastly, abstaining from alcohol also works for me. I have one drink and then I'll eat a 4th meal before bed. Consistently. And I'm ravenous. Hunger pangs spike for me what its worth. I love wine so it's a bummer. I still drink but a lot less frequently. But alcohol = hunger pangs. I've compensated by getting *really* nice wine which I really enjoy. But you would never open it for one glass on a random weeknight. So if you drink on occasion, cutting alcohol may help hunger pangs.

    I'm 80% to goal if that's relevant but appears to be working.
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