Why counting calories indefinitely perceived as bad thing?
Replies
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^^ I agree with everything rheddmobile said. My habits have changed at food events.
E.g. during the holidays when there are weeknight events (gosh, remember that?), having a weeknight glass of wine would be more calories than usual, so I would routinely eat before going and enjoy the glass of wine and ignore the food. I've discovered that exquisite little passed hors d'oeuvres often look yummy but taste bland. Also hard to count. Also hard to actually make a meal (feel full) on that stuff. Also messy when you're dressed nice. So if I'm already splurging a little on wine, it's easier skip the hors d'oeuvres and save the trouble.
But at other food events, like at a seated dinner, it really is about the food and I do enjoy it. If it's during a time I'm tracking closely, I'll do my best to estimate. If I'm tracking loosely, I might just make mindful choices and not worry about it at all. I generally prefer substantial servings of a few things than tiny bites of a million different things.1 -
This explains so much!
https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U 0 -
alisdairsmommy wrote: »I just read through this thread and I find myself thinking: in every area of my life where I have wanted to improve, I have done some kind of tracking:
- I began budgeting when I needed to learn about money
- I kept a booklist when I wanted to get more intentional about my reading
- I started a recipe file when I wanted to get better at cooking
- I have checklists for chores to make sure my house is in order
- I have a prayer journal for my spiritual health
...why wouldn't I, if I wanted to get more serious about nutrition and eating, start writing it down?
I struggle with procrastination and got so much done today after writing out a list first thing!0 -
This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
Here's a good write up debunking Fung's positions (not necessarily specific to that video, as I have not watched it):
https://www.myoleanfitness.com/evidence-caloric-restriction/5 -
Thanks, that is an interesting article! It sounds like he is mostly disagreeing that people will gain weight after calorie restriction whether they continually adhere to the diet afterwards or not( which I don't remember Dr.Fung addressing in his videos, but I am going to look into that.) I'm mostly researching why many people can't adhere to it long term, and Dr. Fung goes through a lot of research explaining that well, I think, even regardless of his personal opinions on the subject.kshama2001 wrote: »This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
Here's a good write up debunking Fung's positions (not necessarily specific to that video, as I have not watched it):
https://www.myoleanfitness.com/evidence-caloric-restriction/
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Thanks, that is an interesting article! It sounds like he is mostly disagreeing that people will gain weight after calorie restriction whether they continually adhere to the diet afterwards or not( which I don't remember Dr.Fung addressing in his videos, but I am going to look into that.) I'm mostly researching why many people can't adhere to it long term, and Dr. Fung goes through a lot of research explaining that well, I think, even regardless of his personal opinions on the subject.kshama2001 wrote: »This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
Here's a good write up debunking Fung's positions (not necessarily specific to that video, as I have not watched it):
https://www.myoleanfitness.com/evidence-caloric-restriction/
My personal opinion is forged by being at a healthy weight for 5+ years now (easily, I might add), via calorie counting, after 3 previous *decades* of obesity: I think Fung is a profiteering self-promoter, and wrong on the facts.
But it's just my opinion. 🤷♀️ I'm not even a nephrologist.7 -
I didn't get that feeling from his videos, but now I'm curious about him!;) I do think some health professionals come off that way when they focus more on the business side of it....Dr. Oz... I think it's rare for anyone to go through all that school without mostly wanting to help others, though. I've been reading a lot this week about hormone levels/weight loss in science journals, and he sort of dumbed it down to where I understand it a little better. (JSTOR has a lot of the scientific journals online for free until July because of COVID btw!)Thanks, that is an interesting article! It sounds like he is mostly disagreeing that people will gain weight after calorie restriction whether they continually adhere to the diet afterwards or not( which I don't remember Dr.Fung addressing in his videos, but I am going to look into that.) I'm mostly researching why many people can't adhere to it long term, and Dr. Fung goes through a lot of research explaining that well, I think, even regardless of his personal opinions on the subject.kshama2001 wrote: »This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
Here's a good write up debunking Fung's positions (not necessarily specific to that video, as I have not watched it):
https://www.myoleanfitness.com/evidence-caloric-restriction/
My personal opinion is forged by being at a healthy weight for 5+ years now (easily, I might add), via calorie counting, after 3 previous *decades* of obesity: I think Fung is a profiteering self-promoter, and wrong on the facts.
But it's just my opinion. 🤷♀️ I'm not even a nephrologist.
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Because it can be good to neutral for a lot of people but for the people it is bad for it is REALLY bad. I have people with serious, restrictive ED in my life. When it goes bad, it goes really bad. Most people are good or neutral with it and for it, but hit the wrong personality and it can be deadly.
And people project.5 -
I could definitely how some people that this could turn into an obsessive thing--myself included. In years past, tracking calories or points could be obsessive for me, especially if I set my calorie goal too low. I also would become anxious if I didn't think I could accurately calculate the amount of points or calories, and may have even avoided foods or situations where that was the case.
I lost weight in a healthy way using MFP about 9 years ago, but got to a point where I didn't want to continue to do it anymore. I was able to generally maintain the weight loss, but did start to creep up. When I decided to go back on MFP, I wanted to lose a bit more weight to get closer to my college weight (not unreasonable, as I was never super thin). I told myself to one--aim for a slow weight loss and 2--not get too obsessive about it.
So far, I think it's working and have been back on for about a year, even though I met my goal back in September. It's just a way to keep myself mindful of what I'm eating, something I've often struggled with. I don't know if/when I"ll stop, and some days I track more loosely than others.3 -
I have to consciously track and restrict calories or i'll gain weight. No doubt. The nice thing about tracking for me is that when I do go nuts and eat a bunch of ice cream or whatever, I see it in the context of so many days where I didn't. I see my average for the week is still reasonably good, etc. I think without the data, I could look at that splurge event as a failure and tend to give up. But with the data, I see it in context, see myself often follow the splurge day with several under-goal days, see the trend and weight loss or maintenance carrying forward. It gives my eating plan "inertia" so I don't get bumped around as easily. Data is power6
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Tracking your calories and exercise for the day and meeting your goal is an excellent way to fill daily fulfillment and happiness while building discipline that will make other aspects of your life better as well. I feel the same way after having a to do list with all the tasks crossed off. I would recommend taking 10% or a number of days you feel comfortable with to not count calories and just indulge without worry of failure or guilt. A vacation from this excellent health accountability tool can be helpful.0
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Explains what Jason Fung believes. He's been debunked by several other medical experts.This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Counting calories for life is personal choice. Just like counting your money everyday or just checking it occasionally. Some are more concerned about it than others.
My thought is that if one pays more attention to detail on ANYTHING, they are likely to be better aware and have less failure overall.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition 3 -
But but but....the dancing "Intuitive Eating Registered Dietitian" on TikTok tells me that calorie counting is evil!!
Here's the thing...this will be long term for me. My prior behaviors show that when I come off counting calories, I gradually slip back into bad habits. The weight slowly creeps on and before I know it, I'm back here starting over for the ????th time. I'm tired of that, so here I am to stay.3 -
pfeiferlindsey wrote: »But but but....the dancing "Intuitive Eating Registered Dietitian" on TikTok tells me that calorie counting is evil!!
Here's the thing...this will be long term for me. My prior behaviors show that when I come off counting calories, I gradually slip back into bad habits. The weight slowly creeps on and before I know it, I'm back here starting over for the ????th time. I'm tired of that, so here I am to stay.
Yep!
I had to swallow my pride and learn that eating "intuitively" just isn't likely for me. My mind is weird about food, for a variety of reasons, so I have to be more intentional about it. I don't have to worry about that for other substances or behaviors that aren't very tempting to me.
My husband can eat intuitively - he's never done any other way. And he's never had a problem with weight. But he has to be more intentional about other things that are more difficult for him, that I don't struggle with at all.
I think it's a mistake when we assume that everything that is hard for us is hard for everyone else, or everything that is easy for us is easy for everyone else (the latter seems to be at the root of a lot of judgment).4 -
Counting calories along with regular exercise has worked for me, lost 70 lbs. Then I quit counting and exercised less then I gained some back. so I am back to counting calories and moving more and it is working. Counting calorie's has also helped me pay attention to types of foods I eat and the nutritional value also. So it is more than Just Calories in vs out but it is a start for some people and telling people it wont work do it my way is wrong the truth is what works for you may not work for me and what works for you today may not work tomorrow. If I see a bowl of Ice cream is 1000 C and a full dinner is 800 and compare the nutritional value then I make a informed choice and somedays I may choose both. So when the guy in the video says counting calories does not work how does he explain my weight loss.0
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alisdairsmommy wrote: »pfeiferlindsey wrote: »But but but....the dancing "Intuitive Eating Registered Dietitian" on TikTok tells me that calorie counting is evil!!
Here's the thing...this will be long term for me. My prior behaviors show that when I come off counting calories, I gradually slip back into bad habits. The weight slowly creeps on and before I know it, I'm back here starting over for the ????th time. I'm tired of that, so here I am to stay.
Yep!
I had to swallow my pride and learn that eating "intuitively" just isn't likely for me. My mind is weird about food, for a variety of reasons, so I have to be more intentional about it. I don't have to worry about that for other substances or behaviors that aren't very tempting to me.
My husband can eat intuitively - he's never done any other way. And he's never had a problem with weight. But he has to be more intentional about other things that are more difficult for him, that I don't struggle with at all.
I think it's a mistake when we assume that everything that is hard for us is hard for everyone else, or everything that is easy for us is easy for everyone else (the latter seems to be at the root of a lot of judgment).
Agree, agree, agree. Everyone has things that are easy for them and things that are hard for them, and sometimes the hard things are really hard. The moral value that gets ascribed to certain behaviors or abilities doesn't help, either. Your husband is not a better person than you are just because he can eat intuitively. You're not a better person than your husband for having a functioning sense of time (or whatever his particular struggle is that is a strength of yours, I just used time as an example). We all have different strengths and it's well past time we stopped demonizing those differences.1 -
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goal06082021 wrote: »alisdairsmommy wrote: »pfeiferlindsey wrote: »But but but....the dancing "Intuitive Eating Registered Dietitian" on TikTok tells me that calorie counting is evil!!
Here's the thing...this will be long term for me. My prior behaviors show that when I come off counting calories, I gradually slip back into bad habits. The weight slowly creeps on and before I know it, I'm back here starting over for the ????th time. I'm tired of that, so here I am to stay.
Yep!
I had to swallow my pride and learn that eating "intuitively" just isn't likely for me. My mind is weird about food, for a variety of reasons, so I have to be more intentional about it. I don't have to worry about that for other substances or behaviors that aren't very tempting to me.
My husband can eat intuitively - he's never done any other way. And he's never had a problem with weight. But he has to be more intentional about other things that are more difficult for him, that I don't struggle with at all.
I think it's a mistake when we assume that everything that is hard for us is hard for everyone else, or everything that is easy for us is easy for everyone else (the latter seems to be at the root of a lot of judgment).
Agree, agree, agree. Everyone has things that are easy for them and things that are hard for them, and sometimes the hard things are really hard. The moral value that gets ascribed to certain behaviors or abilities doesn't help, either. Your husband is not a better person than you are just because he can eat intuitively. You're not a better person than your husband for having a functioning sense of time (or whatever his particular struggle is that is a strength of yours, I just used time as an example). We all have different strengths and it's well past time we stopped demonizing those differences.
You must have been reading my mind, because time management was actually exactly what I was thinking of!
When I dug out my scale (and now that I've bought a new one with a higher capacity), he didn't judge me although I could tell he thought what I was doing was odd. I have weights listed on my dry erase board in the kitchen so I can log them on MFP at a convenient moment (we usually use that for our ongoing grocery list). A couple of years ago I ranted at him about how hard it was to lose weight and he rubbed my back and said, bless him, "well...can't you just...eat less?" The poor man. I wanted to throttle him.
He's doing well now though. He will keep a plate in the kitchen for me and I assemble my plate in there before sitting down at the table. When the kids inquired about the change he told them, "Mommy is doing a science experiment." Which is true, I suppose - I'm the test subject. 2 -
I want to say : just don't talk about it. But it wouldn't work because you are talking about your boyfriend and if/when you live together it'll be harder to him to not notice.
You can show him some pictures from various periods in your life and tell him that's the tool you've found that helps you the best to stay accountable.
People talk about learning "good nutrition". If you've succesfully lost weight while counting calories, usually you already KNOW about good nutrition. I am just like you, OP. I slide easily if I don't keep myself accountable. Some people weigh themselves daily (instead of their food) and if weight creeps up on successive days then they reduce intake/increase output in order to get back to normal. I've found it doesn't for me. I'll pass the croissant if I know I have to log it. I don't need it, I don't have a craving. I just LIKE FOOD!!
Good luck anyway. Just ignore the naysayers and ask your BF for his support, not his judgment.
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alisdairsmommy wrote: »goal06082021 wrote: »alisdairsmommy wrote: »pfeiferlindsey wrote: »But but but....the dancing "Intuitive Eating Registered Dietitian" on TikTok tells me that calorie counting is evil!!
Here's the thing...this will be long term for me. My prior behaviors show that when I come off counting calories, I gradually slip back into bad habits. The weight slowly creeps on and before I know it, I'm back here starting over for the ????th time. I'm tired of that, so here I am to stay.
Yep!
I had to swallow my pride and learn that eating "intuitively" just isn't likely for me. My mind is weird about food, for a variety of reasons, so I have to be more intentional about it. I don't have to worry about that for other substances or behaviors that aren't very tempting to me.
My husband can eat intuitively - he's never done any other way. And he's never had a problem with weight. But he has to be more intentional about other things that are more difficult for him, that I don't struggle with at all.
I think it's a mistake when we assume that everything that is hard for us is hard for everyone else, or everything that is easy for us is easy for everyone else (the latter seems to be at the root of a lot of judgment).
Agree, agree, agree. Everyone has things that are easy for them and things that are hard for them, and sometimes the hard things are really hard. The moral value that gets ascribed to certain behaviors or abilities doesn't help, either. Your husband is not a better person than you are just because he can eat intuitively. You're not a better person than your husband for having a functioning sense of time (or whatever his particular struggle is that is a strength of yours, I just used time as an example). We all have different strengths and it's well past time we stopped demonizing those differences.
You must have been reading my mind, because time management was actually exactly what I was thinking of!
When I dug out my scale (and now that I've bought a new one with a higher capacity), he didn't judge me although I could tell he thought what I was doing was odd. I have weights listed on my dry erase board in the kitchen so I can log them on MFP at a convenient moment (we usually use that for our ongoing grocery list). A couple of years ago I ranted at him about how hard it was to lose weight and he rubbed my back and said, bless him, "well...can't you just...eat less?" The poor man. I wanted to throttle him.
He's doing well now though. He will keep a plate in the kitchen for me and I assemble my plate in there before sitting down at the table. When the kids inquired about the change he told them, "Mommy is doing a science experiment." Which is true, I suppose - I'm the test subject.
Oh, a dry erase board is brilliant. I keep a notepad and pen right beside the food scale, he knows that's where they live and not to put them "away" somewhere when he cleans the kitchen counters.
The OP of this thread was worried about, I guess, being judged by her BF when she moves in with him and he sees her weighing food or whatever. I would treat that as just part of "the mystique" that necessarily dies when you start sharing a space with an intimate partner - making a bowl of cereal should be as mundane and unremarkable as tweezing your eyebrows or brushing your teeth. Surely he didn't think OP just plugs into a charging station as-is or packs herself into a storage box in maximum-glamour mode when they aren't together. I hope her BF realizes he's dating a human woman who occasionally has to do the unsexy work of maintaining the meat suit her brain pilots and doesn't make it weird when he sees her doing that.3 -
The controversy surrounding his ideas is making him more interesting to me, haha...I'm looking into that more! Most of the debunkers, I've found, are debunking issues that I haven't heard from him or that I comprehended differently than the debunkers...For instance, I took what he said about calorie restriction not working as less a statement for individuals and more of a statement to health professionals and the medical community. Personally, I think it can work for individuals, but in treatments for obesity it is a failure so far because such a high percentage of people regain the weight back...
Explains what Jason Fung believes. He's been debunked by several other medical experts.This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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The controversy surrounding his ideas is making him more interesting to me, haha...I'm looking into that more! Most of the debunkers, I've found, are debunking issues that I haven't heard from him or that I comprehended differently than the debunkers...For instance, I took what he said about calorie restriction not working as less a statement for individuals and more of a statement to health professionals and the medical community. Personally, I think it can work for individuals, but in treatments for obesity it is a failure so far because such a high percentage of people regain the weight back...
Explains what Jason Fung believes. He's been debunked by several other medical experts.This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Ya - keep going - you will absolutely find his info being stated to individuals, not some Medical Conference presentation video (would they actually let him in for a presentation?) that was to health pro's.
And while he sometimes starts with a few facts on basic human physiology (and even there he get's it wrong like many with diet plans unless he is talking about unstated people with specific health issues) - where he takes it is way out there.4 -
pfeiferlindsey wrote: »Here's the thing...this will be long term for me. My prior behaviors show that when I come off counting calories, I gradually slip back into bad habits. The weight slowly creeps on and before I know it, I'm back here starting over for the ????th time. I'm tired of that, so here I am to stay.
Exactly this!
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The controversy surrounding his ideas is making him more interesting to me, haha...I'm looking into that more! Most of the debunkers, I've found, are debunking issues that I haven't heard from him or that I comprehended differently than the debunkers...For instance, I took what he said about calorie restriction not working as less a statement for individuals and more of a statement to health professionals and the medical community. Personally, I think it can work for individuals, but in treatments for obesity it is a failure so far because such a high percentage of people regain the weight back...
Explains what Jason Fung believes. He's been debunked by several other medical experts.This explains so much!https://youtu.be/5F5o0a4p_3U
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
He isn't talking to health officials...and calorie restriction "not working" pretty much right there puts him in the woo gang. Calorie restriction is the only way weight loss happens...you can't eat maintenance calories or a surplus and lose weight...calories have to be restricted. Every single diet plan on the planet involves calorie restriction.
"Calorie restriction doesn't work" is enough all by itself for me to never pay attention to anything that dude has to say given the absurdity of the statement. If he's going to start off with something that absurd, no telling how far down the stupid hole it goes.
I don't think he's quite on the Dr. Oz level of bogus doctors...but he's pretty damn close. If he's not a quack, he's definitely quackish.4 -
psychod787 wrote: »After losing and gaining back the weight over and over..I now decide that counting will be part of my life..I realized too that my maintenance calories won't be that much higher than what I'm eating right now as i'm only losing 0.5 lb per week. I only had 10 pounds to loose.
However, I was showing my boyfriend the myfitnesspal app and how i track my calories. And he said hopefully you will be able to know how much you need without having to check all the time..the problem is , when I don't have anything to keep accountable its easy to start over eating without realizing it. So counting will keep me on check
I can't help to feel that people might find me weird for constantly track and might have to track calories behind his back if we do move in together. Not to mention they're countless of videos on yutube of people encouraging people not to count calories and giving tips such as avoiding looking at food nutrition labels and that counting calories is unnatural and it's not way anyone should be living...And some give tips to stay in shape without counting but they all involved some type of restriction and interment fasting
I personally don't think feel like it's big deal having to track if that will prevent weight creep up. And people already have other things we have to do everyday as part of our routine without having second thoughts.
Have you been looked weird for counting calories?
Sure I have been looked at as "weird". I could care less. I don't have tattoos and don't want any myself, but are people who have them "weird"? If you are wanting to keep your body weight below the homeostasis weight for your lifestyle and genetics, then calorie counting is a good tool.
That's a really good way to look at it... Staying healthy, physically, emotionally and mentally, isn't an easy task for any human, and what works to balance the things we struggle with isn't for anyone to decide but ourselves. Sure, we can either use calorie counting as a temporary or permanent tool in our lives, but I personally worry about way too many things in life as it is. It's nice to not think about how well I ate today.0 -
I feel like once I reach my goal I will have to do the same thing for the same reasons. Since I have Crohn's Disease, adopting this permanently will be another reason to keep journaling. My kids are fascinated by the way I can log foods by scanning the UPC code.1
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I find counting to be a faff. I avoid it when I can. I generally maintain without counting because I know what I need to do but if I do find myself slipping eg after too many pre-Christmas mince pies, I jump back into counting for a while before it becomes a big deal.3
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