Mental Health and Weight Loss: The Right Balance
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The bible talks about transformation and how it happens by the renewing of one's mind. I echo it and will say, without a driven, determined and goal oriented mindset...healthy weightloss wont happen.1
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Hi everyone,
Apologies if I became a bit defensive/argumentative. I do appreciate that people come from a "good" place when reflecting on the very personal pursuits of improving mental and physical health. We share our stories in order to enlighten others and create new possibilities when the old pathways seem stale and f utile. I appreciate the degree to which people choose to be vulnerable and open with experiences and ideas and if I in any way demonstrated a lack of respect my apologies. There are facts which are undisputed with regards to both mental health and weight loss and there are also subjective/qualitative points of view that reflect the opinions and beliefs we develop over time. Perhaps, it is wise (saying this to myself) to listen more carefully and be a student/learner rather than an antagonistic "know it all" as I am struggling with how to find the balance between healthy thinking and feeling and appropriate self-management and self-regulation with regards to food and general eating behaviours. Thanks for your patients and thoughtful responses and I will work on separating emotion from cognitions so that the thread is safe and enjoyable for everyone.
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The bible talks about transformation and how it happens by the renewing of one's mind. I echo it and will say, without a driven, determined and goal oriented mindset...healthy weightloss wont happen.
Hmmm . . . yet here I am, a hedonistic, heathen, aging hippie type, not even remotely driven, marginally determined, and generally not goal oriented, yet in year 5+ at a healthy weight, strong & quite healthy at age 65 to all signs, after several previous decades of obesity and bad health markers.
It's almost as if people vary, and different approaches work for different people. 😉
I'm glad, sincerely, that you've found what works for you. 🙂 I'm sure it will work for some others, too. Good show!
(I do think that a cognitive tendency to frame overweight/unfitness as an insurmountably complex challenge, or a result mainly of powerful external forces (like, say, food products' marketing) . . . can be a counter-force to success. That framing is not insurmountable, but may potentially be an extra, mainly self-imposed burden.)9 -
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Relationship between diet and mental health is really complex. Our diet can affect our brain in many ways. Like taking a lots of vegetables, seafood, fresh herbs, garlic, olive oil, cereal and grains) supplemented with fish oil can reduce the symptoms of depression.1
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There is a definite link between gut health and brain health that has now been established. It wouldn't be too surprising that those of us who suffer from gut issues also have mental health issues (like myself--anxiety). I'm hoping that there is more research being done in this area. There are probably some foods that can cause gut/brain issues for most people who are prone to them, but I think, like anything else, it is much more individualized. What may cause problems for one person may be perfectly fine for another.
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Down day..... It all seems a bit pointless to start a new way of eating/behaving. I will most likely break my own rules and make things worse. I feel like giving up .
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So after reading through this thread, I'm not sure what's being sought after here - science-backed discourse about the role mental health plays with regards to weight/physical health, or personal stories from people who are also struggling? Since this isn't the debate section, I'll go with the latter.
I'm on my third major attempt at weight loss. The first time I was an extremely depressed teenager who resorted to anorexia and self-harm to cope, and I had to treat the depression with medicine to overcome the eating issues. I went from a healthy weight to an unhealthy weight, then re-established a healthy weight. In college I gained about 20 lbs from being more sedentary, every single meal being a buffet, and not knowing enough about nutrition to make good choices. This pushed me to very top of the normal BMI range, and after college I decided to lose the weight. I was unhappy with how I looked, but my unhappiness was deeply reinforced by how my boyfriend treated me. I'd spend hours working out just to be away from him, and while I pretended I was losing weight healthily, I was also purging after any indulgences. I lost 30 lbs, and then I dumped the boyfriend. Turns out that I don't abuse my body with disordered eating when I'm not suffering emotional abuse.
Being really fit brought on some really scary attention, including stalking and sexual assault. So when my back pain started to prevent me from working out and the weight slowly crept back on, I didn't really mind. I didn't intentionally eat my way into a protective weight, but I was pretty darn happy when comments on my body stopped altogether. I got up into the overweight range. So... here I am now. I think I want to get back down to my fit weight, but I'm not really acting like it. I've only lost 10 lbs in 5 months. I have pretty bad bouts of depression each month linked to my cycle, and that tends to derail me for a few days because I don't feel like exercising at all and I make more indulgent food choices. I started drinking a lot more due to physical pain, and now I'm questioning if I need to address a dependence. And I am genuinely afraid of the harassment I might get if I'm 30 lbs lighter. But I also want to be fit, healthy, capable, and not hate how I look in photos so much that I avoid them altogether. So I'm just going to take this one day at a time, go easy on myself on bad days, push forward on days I feel motivated, and see where I end up.
I do think it's incredibly important for people to address their traumas, treat their mental illnesses properly, do their best to put themselves in healthy environments, and have patience and grace with themselves if they're going to achieve a healthy weight long-term. I don't think anyone on MFP should be diagnosing or "treating" other forum members when it comes to mental health. That's far above our pay grade. The best I can do is share my story and hope it helps someone else feel less alone.17 -
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I have family members that are positively happy and are obese and I know people who need mental health therapy and are skinny. My opinion (and only an opinion) is that if you are using "mental health" as a crutch for your weight issues, you usually will just accept that nothing can help you because you have "mental health" issues. I believe you need to do your best to separate the two. Deal with your mental health with professional help. and find a good weight loss program and use this site to keep it recorded.9
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Hi Everyone,
Thank you thinasulike but everyone is entitled to their opinion. I must admit, having said this, that the biases that seem to apparent certainly make me sad as I really do not think I use my mental health issues as a "crutch". In fact, I have been most reluctant to even make references to my depression and anxiety as I understand that however my weight issues have come to pass, it is always about me and my choices. I wonder what my compel someone to be so harsh and critical rather than empathic and kind? I suppose there are unkind people who need to flout their points of view without consideration and objectivity. So be it. I was having a terrible day when I wrote my earlier post and I guess I made a mistake. I feel much better. I went for a run, spoke to a friend and regrouped. Not bad for someone who uses mental health as a "crutch". I haven't binged and feel better about myself despite the rude post which greeted me.
Back to positive thinking.
Thanks again
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I'm not seeing Lex's post as being rude. Looking at it objectively, it appears to me to be a response to the original post.I would like to explore the strategies that you are using to move forward in having healthy relationships with your body, with food and with the idea of "loosing" weight. One question that has really challenged me over the years is whether mental health factors link directly to how we create, establish, maintain and worry about how heavy we are. Do we use our bodies as a barometer of how we truly feel about ourselves? Do you we use weight as a protective measure in certain cases? Do we give up on our bodies and use food as a type of comfort or friend? I would really love to know what you think if you are comfortable sharing. Clearly, dieting in the conventional sense does not work for a lot of us. Why not? The "Gurus" tell us that, notwithstanding any metabolic problems that we face due to disease, genetics etc...it is just a matter of "Calories In and Calories out". If it is this simple, than why is it so hard for some of our brains to turn on to this simple mathematical reality? What goes on in our deeper minds to avoid, discourage and perhaps even sabotage our hard work? Look forward to hearing from you friends.lexcoulstring wrote: »I have family members that are positively happy and are obese and I know people who need mental health therapy and are skinny. My opinion (and only an opinion) is that if you are using "mental health" as a crutch for your weight issues, you usually will just accept that nothing can help you because you have "mental health" issues. I believe you need to do your best to separate the two. Deal with your mental health with professional help. and find a good weight loss program and use this site to keep it recorded.8
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TX_Bluebonnet wrote: »I'm not seeing Lex's post as being rude. Looking at it objectively, it appears to me to be a response to the original post.I would like to explore the strategies that you are using to move forward in having healthy relationships with your body, with food and with the idea of "loosing" weight. One question that has really challenged me over the years is whether mental health factors link directly to how we create, establish, maintain and worry about how heavy we are. Do we use our bodies as a barometer of how we truly feel about ourselves? Do you we use weight as a protective measure in certain cases? Do we give up on our bodies and use food as a type of comfort or friend? I would really love to know what you think if you are comfortable sharing. Clearly, dieting in the conventional sense does not work for a lot of us. Why not? The "Gurus" tell us that, notwithstanding any metabolic problems that we face due to disease, genetics etc...it is just a matter of "Calories In and Calories out". If it is this simple, than why is it so hard for some of our brains to turn on to this simple mathematical reality? What goes on in our deeper minds to avoid, discourage and perhaps even sabotage our hard work? Look forward to hearing from you friends.lexcoulstring wrote: »I have family members that are positively happy and are obese and I know people who need mental health therapy and are skinny. My opinion (and only an opinion) is that if you are using "mental health" as a crutch for your weight issues, you usually will just accept that nothing can help you because you have "mental health" issues. I believe you need to do your best to separate the two. Deal with your mental health with professional help. and find a good weight loss program and use this site to keep it recorded.
I don't see it as being rude either. Perhaps "crutch" isn't the clearest choice of words.
We get a lot of women thinking they can't lose weight because they are perimenopausal or post-menopause. This thinking does them a disservice. That's how I interpreted the "crutch" post.9 -
Mental health issues can totally play into weight loss. Entirely leaving out emotional eating and learning to cope with negative emotions by piling food on them, your mental health DOES make a difference.
Someone who's depressed may not eat at all because it's too much work to chew. Someone else may just keep eating because it makes them feel a little better. Someone in the throes of a manic episode may not eat, then eat too much on the way back down. Autism can make eating difficult due to sensory issues; I can't eat beans or mashed potatoes due to the texture, personally. But one of my stims is food that crunches. And if you are on medications for ADHD, they can interfere with your eating. I have learned to eat fast, or halfway through my meal I won't want to eat any more, and that's a problem when you need those 400 calories to get to your next meal.
And that leaves out the known weight gain issues on a lot of the psych meds. Some people get the choice, "Sane, or thin?" Some can disrupt your normal sleep cycles and that is proven to cause weight gain.
And then there's people like my girlfriend who needs to lose weight but can't. If she tries, the alternate personality in her head, which is about three years old, waits until she goes to sleep and then takes over, gets the body up, and goes in the kitchen and eats what SHE wants. Girlfriend finds this out when she finds a dirty plate in her room that she doesn't remember using.
So mental health does make a huge difference.
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Hi Everyone,
Thank you thinasulike but everyone is entitled to their opinion. I must admit, having said this, that the biases that seem to apparent certainly make me sad as I really do not think I use my mental health issues as a "crutch". In fact, I have been most reluctant to even make references to my depression and anxiety as I understand that however my weight issues have come to pass, it is always about me and my choices. I wonder what my compel someone to be so harsh and critical rather than empathic and kind? I suppose there are unkind people who need to flout their points of view without consideration and objectivity. So be it. I was having a terrible day when I wrote my earlier post and I guess I made a mistake. I feel much better. I went for a run, spoke to a friend and regrouped. Not bad for someone who uses mental health as a "crutch". I haven't binged and feel better about myself despite the rude post which greeted me.
Back to positive thinking.
Thanks again
I think some of it is speaking/writing style. Some people are just more direct. I have had to deliberately untrain myself from interpreting direct speech as rudeness, because growing up my family culture just did not involve speaking to each other frankly.
I will note here, rather frankly
, that you are engaging in some combative type speech here, too, but you're doing so in a roundabout way rather than directly - you aren't identifying the specific poster to ask for clarification, and you're making assumptions about motive that are really uncharitable and IMO, not well founded. You did the same to me earlier in the thread. I don't think that's a recipe for getting support, if you lash out at posters who really are trying to help, even if they don't couch it in terms that you like.
I think you will be much happier if you don't make these assumptions. Everybody has bad days. I have a history of depression and anxiety myself. It's not easy. When I've been in the throes of it I have thought everybody hated me and was out to get me, whether it was family members or close friends or strangers on the street (or the Internet, for that matter.) The reality is that depression and anxiety warp one's perception of reality. Just because I felt it didn't make it real, although it felt real at the time. (And everybody has these thoughts from time to time - the point is how you sit with them. Do you let them permeate and poison everything, or do you realize "this doesn't actually make sense, so I will disregard" and go on with your day? The more you can disregard the irrational stuff, the shorter I find those periods of melancholy are and the sooner I can get back to business.)
I really do wish you well.15 -
I accept the direct and indirect ways I have been resisting feedback and even helpful suggestions. I will slow my emotional responses down and just try and take in all of the helpful posts. My apologies.8
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I would go so far as to say that perhaps I inadvertently feel sorry for myself and look for excuses. Thank you all.
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I accept the direct and indirect ways I have been resisting feedback and even helpful suggestions. I will slow my emotional responses down and just try and take in all of the helpful posts. My apologies.I would go so far as to say that perhaps I inadvertently feel sorry for myself and look for excuses. Thank you all.
Thank you for the apology, though it's really not needed.
I hope even though it may not have turned out how you wanted initially, that this thread has been helpful for you moving forward to examine your own thinking patterns and it will be helpful to others. It struck a chord with me because I recognized some of my own patterns of thinking, so I don't want you to feel bad or like you're a bad person, because you're not. I think a lot of us deal with this in one way or another and it gets in the way of meeting our goals if we let it. My hope is that you can find it encouraging to know that many people succeed despite this, and I really think you can too. 5 -
Down day..... It all seems a bit pointless to start a new way of eating/behaving. I will most likely break my own rules and make things worse. I feel like giving up .
Been there done that, have the tee shirt, cap, and the tattoo. If I can be of any help feel free to lean an me. Everybody has down days, when you just can't seem to see the plan. I've been lucky, people I love have come to my aid, without judgment or platitudes. I'm grateful for them, and will always be thankful. Everybody needs a leg up now and then. Try and focus on the great things you've already accomplished. It's always easier to get down on yourself.4 -
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Hi Everyone, I don't know about medication and weight gain but I am aware that the side effects of psychotropic medications can often be more detrimental than the problem. Weight gain could, for some, be one of these paradoxes. Secondly, I think telling our personal stories regarding how we came to the point where our mental health issues have found their way into eating patterns and weight management challenges. For me, food was always considered to be expressions of love, concern, entertainment, gratification, substitution love and the list goes on. A friend that speaks through taste and "fulFILLment" (excuse the pun) and offers no criticism or judgement. A quick and immediate distraction and an ongoing source of relief from boredom and monotony. I am guessing that this is not nearly as uncommon as one might think and quite probably the issues become detrimental when they interfere with day to day life and of course physical health. I would say that I hit the precarious category of morbidly obese in my 40's and have moved in and out of that awful place several times over the past two decades. Not a nice place to be. 3xl shirts and some were tight. Chairs breaking, children staring and pants splitting unless they were so loose one could have used them as curtains. So.....I have tried to rethink my relationship with food and turn away from my caloric mistress. Instead, I am here, reading, learning and eating ideas and possibilities rather than KFC and chips. I am down to just XL and although I am still concerned about taking my shirt off at the beach about 5 minutes from here because someone from Greenpeace may try and rescue me, I am moving towards feeling better about myself. One step at a time. Hope I haven't bored you with my story. Would love to hear what others have been through. Thanks for reading..Shel
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I think you guys are having a discussion with an AI training program.4
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thinasulike wrote: »I have been thinking more about this thread and had a question for readers? Is there a direct relationship between most anti-depressants and weight gain? I have not come across any helpful literature that really explains how the two variables might correlate/cause weight gain. I would be grateful to learn what people think and/or understand about this?
Thanks
From what I have read, no, there is not a direct causal relationship between anti-depressants and weight gain for every user. There is definitely a correlation between some anti-depressants and weight gain for sure, with some being more likely to correlate with weight gain then others. Some classes of anti-depressants are more likely to be associated with weight gain, with tricyclic and MAOI's being more likely. SSRI's (more commonly prescribed these days) are less likely to be correlated with weight gain. Even within those classes, some individual drugs are more likely to be correlated with weight gain than others. For example, I'm currently on escalitopram (Lexapro), for which weight gain is listed as a side effect in 25% of users. To me, that's pretty high. Welbutrin (another SSRI), is more likely to actually be correlated weight weight loss, however.
In my experience, it did seem gained a bit of weight when I started taking Lexapro again last year. However, my weight then stabilized, and I've actually been able to lose about 10 more pounds since starting it. In fact, once my anxiety symptoms improved, I found myself not stress eating nearly as much.
The mechanisms at play as to what causes the weight gain in some are still unclear. There is the theory that because people are no longer depressed, they gain their appetite and therefore eat more. It also may cause increased carbohydrate cravings in others (I did notice this). It can also make people feel tired, and therefore, less active. Finally, there is some speculation that some can actually decrease your BMR. I know antipsychotic medicines can be much more highly correlated with weight gain than standard anti-depressants.
I used to be on the Reddit forum for Lexapro users, and there were many who gained weight. Some people claimed their eating habits/activity levels had not changed, while others knew they had an increased appetite and were eating more than they were before starting. Still others were so paranoid of weight gain that they were reluctant to take it, and I know that stopping medication because of it can be an issue.0 -
HawkingRadiation wrote: »I think you guys are having a discussion with an AI training program.
My spidey sense is also tingling, albeit not in that direction.2 -
thinasulike wrote: »I have been thinking more about this thread and had a question for readers? Is there a direct relationship between most anti-depressants and weight gain? I have not come across any helpful literature that really explains how the two variables might correlate/cause weight gain. I would be grateful to learn what people think and/or understand about this?
Thanks
I think like an engineer, and I believe in CICO. So the idea of a direct relationship between anti depressents and weight gain to me means the former directly causes the latter and I see that as a faulty premise.
Now that doesn't mean the medication might not have a direct impact on the CI or CO aspects, some medications might increase appetite which might result in a higher CI. Others might make you feel lethargic, and so you don't move around as much, changing the CO.
Why does it matter? If all you see is "medication causes weight gain" you might feel helpless to prevent it short of changing medications. If you know WHY, then that knowledge might help to counteract the actual cause.5 -
kshama2001 wrote: »HawkingRadiation wrote: »I think you guys are having a discussion with an AI training program.
My spidey sense is also tingling, albeit not in that direction.
Research paper?0 -
thinasulike wrote: »You have taken rudeness and insensitivity to new heights. No wonder individuals with mental health issues are reluctant to share their views and concerns. People like you shut them down, make them feel horrible about themselves and push them so deeply into their negative and distressed thoughts that they cannot feel safe; even on a forum like this . Your response was shameful, ill informed and I am surprised that the people that monitor these forums would not be concerned about letting you put people down and make them feel bad. The Op for this forum has been honest, reflective and sincere and I like what I am reading. You ought to apologise and act with more respect and mindfulness. I am so upset with your comment. It was demeaning and cruel and you have done damage to someone who did not deserve your horrible opinion,
I am not sure how my opinion was rude. But I'm not apologizing because it was not meant as a put down. I was very over weight at one time. I also had a heart attack at 38 and I am a T2D since 34 (I'm 44 now). What did I do for the most part. Nothing. Except became depressed. But people feeling sorry for me did not help me get better. They sympathized and say its all good. But it was my doctor who told me I would die and not see my kids grow up if I don't focus on 1) my mental health and 2) my physical health. And I did. I saw a therapist in which gave me good spirits to want to get healthier and I followed my doctor and figured out a lifestyle to over come my weaknesses. Sugar coating reality only postpones your futures health. We only have one life and we all have the same limited time to live. Like I said I had family that had heart attacks too because no one tried to kick some butt. I was trying to give my "opinion" . Perhaps crutch is a negative word where you are from, but its not that bad of a word here in Canada. Anyway, best of luck. I know you can achieve anything but you have to except it and work on it.
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