Unrealistic Protein Requirements! Can an Obese Woman Build Muscle?

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ChaoticMoira
ChaoticMoira Posts: 103 Member
in Food and Nutrition
I have read a ton of articles, and watched videos up the wazoo to learn about building muscle. Everything I read says the same thing. Eat about 1 gram of protein per lb of body weight.

Note: I do know the recommended amount for the average person is lower than this. I am speaking specifically about the needs required for people focused on building muscle.

However, all of these articles etc. talk about, and give examples of people who are healthy, or near healthy body weight (e.g. have 0 - 20 lbs to lose). Nothing ever talks about obese people who need to be in a decent calorie deficit and want to try to maintain muscle, or even attempt to build it whilst in a deficit. Even the articles specifically about body recomping are focused on those with 20 pounds to lose; 30 tops. A few mention as side note that people with more weight to lose will have an easier time recomping, but they don't talk in any depth on it.

I cannot possibly truly be expected to eat 275 freaking grams of protein a day, whilst in a calorie deficit! Even if I managed to eat all of that in some form of pure protein, it would be 1100 calories a day. Which would be about what... around 70% of a 1500 calorie diet. I am a 5.3" female with a low calorie expenditure.

Does anyone know if the protein requirements are different for seriously obese people?
Is it pointless to strength train if I can't meet this level of protein?
Frustratingly, I wouldn't want to eat that much protein even if I could.

Replies

  • justanotherloser007
    justanotherloser007 Posts: 578 Member
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    By the way, thank you for posting this and for the response - because when I ran into the protein requirements I faced the same question and couldn't figure out for the life of me what my protein requirements say. But now that I see your answer, I get it. Thank you thank you! By the way Moira feel free to add me, 5'3" 48 yo I started at 277 in 2013. 69 lbs down 75ish to go. Still learning about nutrition evidently!
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    read articles from who?

    There are good and bad sources out there - and knowing who their general audience is too.

    http://mennohenselmans.com/the-myth-of-1glb-optimal-protein-intake-for-bodybuilders/
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,874 Member
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    heybales wrote: »
    read articles from who?

    There are good and bad sources out there - and knowing who their general audience is too.

    http://mennohenselmans.com/the-myth-of-1glb-optimal-protein-intake-for-bodybuilders/

    I was trying to find that exact article....
  • HoneyBadger302
    HoneyBadger302 Posts: 1,975 Member
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    I'm no doctor, but from what I understand, the typical obese person actually has a fair bit of muscle already, simply due to toting around that kind of weight. Basic activities are a lot more work than they would be for someone my size. Discussed this with a friend who was obese when we were walking around San Francisco one day - she was apologizing for going 'slow,' meanwhile, I was like - um, if I had a 200 lb rucksack on right now, I wouldn't be getting up this hill to begin with! She laughed, and that spurred that conversation that she had been having with her doctor about it.

    So, in your shoes, I would focus more on maintaining what you already have and general activity. How much protein is required to keep what you while losing the extra fat I would have to do more research on (sorry, not something I've dug into), but I would imagine the 1gr/day would be a bit excessive! Maybe more like 1gr/day for the weight range you believe you can reasonably end up in?
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 32,267 Member
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    If you don't know your lean body mass (most of us don't, and the home/gym BIA scales that claim to tell us . . . aren't very reliably accurate): For many 0.8g protein per pound of a healthy goal body weight is generally close enough to be fine.

    If you don't have any idea of "healthy goal body weight", use the weight that would be about the middle of the healthy BMI range for your height. Close enough.
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,394 MFP Moderator
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    Like others say, the protein recommendation are based on lbm. And the more obese you are, the lower they can be since you have adequate fat mass to fuel your body. Lean people are generally those who need more protein since it's harder to maintain muscle mass.


    Most importantly, your workout should be the primary thing to concentrate on. That will more likely determine muscle gains or sustainment.


    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
  • ChaoticMoira
    ChaoticMoira Posts: 103 Member
    edited July 2021
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    Thanks everyone. I did wonder at one point, "could they mean LBM," because that seemed more logical; but I only came across one mention of it, so I wondered which was correct. I guess body builders assume only other already fit people are going to be reading and listening to the info. They rarely talk about obese people who want to get healthy, and grow muscle - even when they talk about newbies to lifting, they are usually discussing the barely over weight to underweight..

    That is still a LOT of protein for me, but at least I find it doable.

    justanotherloser007 wrote: »
    By the way, thank you for posting this and for the response - because when I ran into the protein requirements I faced the same question and couldn't figure out for the life of me what my protein requirements say. But now that I see your answer, I get it. Thank you thank you! By the way Moira feel free to add me, 5'3" 48 yo I started at 277 in 2013. 69 lbs down 75ish to go. Still learning about nutrition evidently!

    Thanks for the invite. I am glad the question benefits another as well. :)

    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    I've put on muscle in the gym and I don't track macros or calories at all. I mean, how did people ever put on muscle before these "rules" about protein? I once read a book by Jim Wendler and in it, he basically LMFAO at the protein recommendations thrown out there and says he just eats and has no earthly idea what his protein intake is...

    I have had some thoughts along the lines of what you mention here. I mean in "a more natural sense" we would never put on the type of muscle that bodybuilders do, but we would still build muscle, and surely these levels of protein wouldn't be required to do so..

    That is interesting about the the body builder. I will have to look him up.

    heybales wrote: »
    read articles from who?
    There are good and bad sources out there - and knowing who their general audience is too.
    http://mennohenselmans.com/the-myth-of-1glb-optimal-protein-intake-for-bodybuilders/

    Thank you for the article. That was interesting. I have been reading a lot, and listening to many people, and haven't retained most of their names. But a few have caught my attention more than others (usually because they share science and explain things in depth), and their names have stuck with me. Those are Jeff Nippard, Eric Helms, and Bret Contreras..

    Interestingly on the site you shared there is a respectable dispute shared between Eric Helms, and Menno on the article you linked, and the overall view of protein intake. I will link it if you are interested. :)

    https://mennohenselmans.com/eric-helms-protein/

    psuLemon wrote: »
    Most importantly, your workout should be the primary thing to concentrate on. That will more likely determine muscle gains or sustainment.
    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1

    Thank you. I will take a look that the link.

  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    edited July 2021
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    You got some good names down - either Dr's or they understand how to analyze studies and look for them.
    You can add Layne Norton to the list for his short videos.
    Brad Schoenfeld is brought on by many for his studies.
    Jeff Cavaliere as physical therapist when you start doing workouts in case you have existing issues or develop any (athleanx).
    Lyle McDonald for getting lost in the weeds of details if desired, videos interesting when he's a guest.

    And they will disagree on things that are usually the minor things compared to the major to be done first.
    You always gotta read what audience they are discussing in recommendations.

    As you point out - big difference between even body building and show prep time, and training time.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,811 Member
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    Keep in mind the difference between optimal and adequate.
    A bodybuilder or elite strength athlete needs to approach optimal because it's become so hard for them to continue adding more muscle when they have been training for years, are unusually lean and close to their maximum genetic potential. Muscle gains slow to a crawl and needs to be carefully nurtured to get anywhere.

    But those factors don't tend apply to your regular gym goer.
    Training effectively with an adequate diet (both in size and nutrients) is normally good enough.

    Of course if someone can get closer to optimal without downsides that's a good idea but often in articles optimal levels are presented as necessary rather than beneficial. I didn't find any downside in trying to hit 1g / 1lb of estimated LBM most of the time.

  • ChaoticMoira
    ChaoticMoira Posts: 103 Member
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    heybales wrote: »
    You can add Layne Norton to the list for his short videos.
    Brad Schoenfeld is brought on by many for his studies.
    Jeff Cavaliere as physical therapist when you start doing workouts in case you have existing issues or develop any (athleanx).

    Thanks, I will make a note of these names as well. I find reading and listening to people in this field is very motivating.

    sijomial wrote: »
    Keep in mind the difference between optimal and adequate.
    A bodybuilder or elite strength athlete needs to approach optimal because it's become so hard for them to continue adding more muscle when they have been training for years, are unusually lean and close to their maximum genetic potential. Muscle gains slow to a crawl and needs to be carefully nurtured to get anywhere.

    But those factors don't tend apply to your regular gym goer.
    Training effectively with an adequate diet (both in size and nutrients) is normally good enough.

    Of course if someone can get closer to optimal without downsides that's a good idea but often in articles optimal levels are presented as necessary rather than beneficial. I didn't find any downside in trying to hit 1g / 1lb of estimated LBM most of the time.

    Very good points to keep in mind. I really appreciate this input. :)

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