Not sure what's more annoying....

alyssamiller77
alyssamiller77 Posts: 891 Member
edited October 3 in Health and Weight Loss
So I saw this article on MSN this morning and it's really annoying me. However, what I find even more annoying are many of the comments following the article. Basically the article talks about prejudice against obese people. And while I don't agree with judging or discriminating against people, we should absolutely be prejudiced against obesity itself. Am I the only one that's tired of the increasing level of acceptance of obesity in this country? Or more frustrating than that to me is the lack of responsibility people take for their own eating habits that most often lead to this condition. I hope I'm not alone in that.

I seriously respect the people here on MFP who've made a decision to improve their health (regardless of what size you started from). I really wish more Americans could find the resolve and motivation to do the same. But just as putting people down or discriminating against them does nothing to help them out, I fear the more we simply just accept obesity from a social level, the less people are going to be motivated to do anything to improve their condition.

http://fitbie.msn.com/2011/09/26/do-americans-hate-fat-people-fight-prejudice-against-overweight?gt1=50002
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Replies

  • richiedbond
    richiedbond Posts: 58
    Very well said, I totally agree.
  • MikeSEA
    MikeSEA Posts: 1,074 Member
    I think the most frustrating thing is that people tend to generalize inappropriately. Sometimes people equate "don't discriminate against the obese" as "coddle obese people and give them excuses." As you point out, they're different stances completely; they just happen to both involve obesity.
  • martinbeks
    martinbeks Posts: 255 Member
    A few years back a "frenemy" told me during a bout of attempted weight loss that I should be proud of being a big beautiful woman. I hate that phrase. Because when I see big, I don't see beautiful. I see extreme health problems that need to be taken care of. My grandmother was one of the greatest, most beautiful women I've ever met, but she was grossly obese for my entire life. In the end, her weight is what killed her. I want to see people who respect their bodies enough to take care of them. Being thin doesn't matter to me, but being healthy and at the top of my "game" (whatever that might be) is what is most important.
  • bethdris
    bethdris Posts: 1,090 Member
    I agree. The price of healthcare is NUTS, and just getting worse. I know local hospitals have told all their employees that they have 2yrs to quit smoking, or they will not have a job. Being that no one will be a smoker employed by them, their health ins costs will go down greatly. I wonder how long it will take for such places to do the same with obese employees?

    I find it stunning how many drs, are over weight but preach healthy diets, etc!
  • kyylieeeeee
    kyylieeeeee Posts: 197 Member
    I think the quote from this article that REALLY made me angry was this: "What’s true is that, if weight loss could be attained by strength of effort and willpower, I would have been rail thin 40 years ago."

    I think everyone here can agree that strength of effort and willpower are exactly what you need to be healthy, and it seems to me that most of the people on MFP have attained weight loss through those very things. This quote is myopic and misleading; it makes me think that the person who said this quote has never given one serious effort towards weight loss. Because strength of effort and willpower to start exercising and make healthy-eating decisions is all one needs to attain weight loss.
  • healthy_KT
    healthy_KT Posts: 57 Member
    I think rather than coddling people, they need to be given more information. No, it is not healthy to be overweight and yes everyone has the power to change. What America should be doing is putting plans in place to help people. They are already starting with the children. Cafeterias are becoming healthier and even Nickelodeon and Disney have commercials about playing outside. Every so often they even turn off their programming and tell children to go outside. We need programs in place for adults as well. Programs that teach them how to eat better and exercise. I know they can find it all online but most people aren't willing to look. And a lot of the programs available such as weight watchers are too expensive.
  • wildman51
    wildman51 Posts: 12
    Because strength of effort and willpower to start exercising and make healthy-eating decisions is all one needs to attain weight loss.

    ROGER THAT!
  • My1985Freckles
    My1985Freckles Posts: 1,039 Member
    Because strength of effort and willpower to start exercising and make healthy-eating decisions is all one needs to attain weight loss.

    ROGER THAT!

    Amen!
  • cramernh
    cramernh Posts: 3,335 Member
    My dermatologist ran into a situation with a patient.... (he never shared any personal identification with me, fyi)
    Mind you, I absolutely LOVE my dermatologist - very kind, soft spoken and he is definitely a guy who doesnt beat-around-the-bush...

    His patient was seeing him for hair growth where it didnt belong. She was also 300lbs overweight and had a history of extremely heavy/painful monthly periods.

    He did the usual obtain-the-pt's history and then asked her if she had been currently on any weightloss plans with her primary care physician - which is a question HE HAS TO ASK!!!!!

    The patient became belligerent, vocal and downright nasty with him (the nurse had to come in to help calm her down)... the patient automatically accused him of being insensitive and being unprofessional.. yadda yadda yadda.... she reported him to the Medical Board of Ethics over the whole 'are you on any weight loss plans with your PCP" question!!! GIVE ME A BREAK!??!?!

    He said that each time he asks a patient this question, he worries because... despite the effort of being a doctor is always a good one, you just dont know how well it will go - like for example, that one patient.

    He had thanked me for not being so sensitive about it when he asked me... I told him that 'hell, I know Im overweight - this PCOS has messed with me for a long time and I cant seem to find anyone who knows how to help me! Why the hell would I yell at you??? You have been so kind to me!!!"

    I told this doctor that I would WILLINGLY go with him if the Medical Board wishes to investigate the complaint..... I dont want to see this wonderful doctor get a red flag on his record for DOING HIS JOB!!!!!

    Besides - this dermatologist was the person who diagnosed me with something else that no one could ever find.... I have a condition called Metabolic X Syndrome, and he is also treating me for alopecia (which I am WINNING!) The man's diagnosing me with X on top of my PCOS and Alopecia helped me find an open door to an Endocrinologist who specializes in BOTH of my current diagnoses.... and Im on the road to getting better and losing weight.... Youre damn RIGHT Im defending that Dermatologist from that rediculous patient who just didnt want to deal with a simple question!
  • MikeSEA
    MikeSEA Posts: 1,074 Member
    I think rather than coddling people, they need to be given more information. No, it is not healthy to be overweight and yes everyone has the power to change. What America should be doing is putting plans in place to help people. They are already starting with the children. Cafeterias are becoming healthier and even Nickelodeon and Disney have commercials about playing outside. Every so often they even turn off their programming and tell children to go outside. We need programs in place for adults as well. Programs that teach them how to eat better and exercise. I know they can find it all online but most people aren't willing to look. And a lot of the programs available such as weight watchers are too expensive.

    I don't know how much of it is education, though. What you're suggesting sounds sort of similar to cognitive behavioral therapy, which works for some but not all. In fact, to those for whom it doesn't work, it's downright insulting. I think people just need to be honest with themselves and the people they love. A dash of compassion is always nice too :) If someone doesn't have the motivation they need to get healthier, then they should be prepared for consequences. If any education is required, it might trying to help people realize what they're giving up by not being motivated.
  • HMonsterX
    HMonsterX Posts: 3,000 Member
    I know local hospitals have told all their employees that they have 2yrs to quit smoking, or they will not have a job.

    I'd tell them where to stick it! They have no right telling you want you can or cannot do in your personal time. I'd just sue them for unfair dismissal!
  • hellokehtty
    hellokehtty Posts: 94
    I think the quote from this article that REALLY made me angry was this: "What’s true is that, if weight loss could be attained by strength of effort and willpower, I would have been rail thin 40 years ago."

    I think everyone here can agree that strength of effort and willpower are exactly what you need to be healthy, and it seems to me that most of the people on MFP have attained weight loss through those very things. This quote is myopic and misleading; it makes me think that the person who said this quote has never given one serious effort towards weight loss. Because strength of effort and willpower to start exercising and make healthy-eating decisions is all one needs to attain weight loss.

    This. Exactly.

    And also, I'm not sure if education is the answer to the "obesity epidemic"...I mean, I'm pretty sure that people know that eating and drinking tons of junk for a long period of time will cause problems. It's like trying to stop someone's drug addiction by educating them about drugs. They know drugs are bad! It's more than education, it's application.
  • CJK1959
    CJK1959 Posts: 279 Member
    I think rather than coddling people, they need to be given more information. No, it is not healthy to be overweight and yes everyone has the power to change. What America should be doing is putting plans in place to help people. They are already starting with the children. Cafeterias are becoming healthier and even Nickelodeon and Disney have commercials about playing outside. Every so often they even turn off their programming and tell children to go outside. We need programs in place for adults as well. Programs that teach them how to eat better and exercise. I know they can find it all online but most people aren't willing to look. And a lot of the programs available such as weight watchers are too expensive.

    I agree that education is important in the fight against obesity, especially childhood obesity, but I find it more disturbing that people fail to be accountable for decisions they make in their lives. I know that I am the only one who is responsible for the state of my weight and I am the only one who can change it....through determination and strength of will. People in this country want to blame anyone and everyone else for their problems without ever considering who is really in charge of their lives. Parents need to take charge of their children and adults need to be accountable and responsible for the choices they make.
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member
    You are not the only one.
  • armymil
    armymil Posts: 163 Member
    Because strength of effort and willpower to start exercising and make healthy-eating decisions is all one needs to attain weight loss.

    I agree!

    I'm overweight and been over weight for 7-8 years. I was borderline in school. I recently researched and researched about food and exercise and found out all the details that was so hard to comprehend. I'd start reading a site before that would say one thing and then another would out that idea.

    I'd hate to see this thread into an anti-fat people thread which it could be going there. Sure lets not baby the over weight but let's not out them either. Some just don't have the knowledge.

    Now, the ones that make me angry is the stubborn ones. We can out them. :)
  • greatdaneaddict
    greatdaneaddict Posts: 30 Member
    Definitely agree with original post!
  • cramernh
    cramernh Posts: 3,335 Member
    I know local hospitals have told all their employees that they have 2yrs to quit smoking, or they will not have a job.

    I'd tell them where to stick it! They have no right telling you want you can or cannot do in your personal time. I'd just sue them for unfair dismissal!


    The company I work for sends out a notice to everyone signing up for benefits that "if you are a smoker, or use smoke-related products, your premiums are 20% higher than the non-smoking plans".... they go into detail the why-it-is-higher and state that if you are in the middle of a cessation program, you need to submit proof so you dont have to pay the higher premium. Then the insurance demands records for each visit to prove you are still in that program and participating.

    We work in a food-related environment and to encourage non-smoking is actually smart.

    The problem with smoking is that it has been proven to cost more in healthcare services (respiratory/circulatory related) where you are basically contaminating your lungs with products that induce medical problems.

    If people lie on their benefit application saying they dont smoke, when in fact they do... once that medical claim goes in for payment, and they see the diagnosis come in with something smoking-related, that patient's claim gets denied, potential loss of benefits (considered fraud)(because of how the contract was drawn up with the company), and if they do keep their insurance, they pay a penalty AND the higher premium for lying on the application.
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member
    I agree. The price of healthcare is NUTS, and just getting worse. I know local hospitals have told all their employees that they have 2yrs to quit smoking, or they will not have a job. Being that no one will be a smoker employed by them, their health ins costs will go down greatly. I wonder how long it will take for such places to do the same with obese employees?

    I find it stunning how many drs, are over weight but preach healthy diets, etc!

    Yeah, I work with a few of those doctors, and even more nurses who are overweight. One Internal Medicine doctor on our staff, who has steadily gone from overweight to morbidly obese in the years I've known him, admits that he tells his patients "do as a I say and not as I do".
  • paladeac
    paladeac Posts: 81 Member
    I saw commercials for a new show following young, obese women in New York (one of whom was a plus size model.) The promo was very much in your face, "We're big and beautiful and you're going to have to deal with it." It made me very sad.

    I don't want them to feel shame for their weight, but it's just plain denial to say, "this is a great lifestyle."
  • armymil
    armymil Posts: 163 Member
    It's like trying to stop someone's drug addiction by educating them about drugs. They know drugs are bad! It's more than education, it's application.

    How can you know how to drive without some education?

    Some people need intervention because food makes them happy. It tastes good and those bad carbs make them feel good. If one was raised like this around bad food or like my mom's southern food, you don't think much about it. Junk food is so easy to obtain and healthy food cost (i dont know twice as much?) a lot more. For some people, it is easier and cheaper to prepare box meals or order out. Sometimes only one in the relationship wants to change and their loved one doesnt want to. So they have to prepare meals to suit them both. They can't cook 2 meals because they can't afford that.

    I think most people if a clinic were to exist (say biggest loser for everyone) they could take people for 1 month to teach them proper eatting habits and reshaping their mind. Possibly give them education lessons for them to take tests and for a 100% give them a free meal or something. Who knows. Someone take that and make it happen.

    But its not "put down the fork, fattie" but rather, "this is why you need to put down the fork." Since my fiancee and I are overweight, we've heard for the millionth time about heart disease and everything else. It gets to be a nag. But, nothing opened my eyes more than a little education and finding out how easy it was. Overcoming the first few days of my diet was the hardest.
  • yanicka
    yanicka Posts: 1,004 Member
    Totally agree with you
  • tnic86
    tnic86 Posts: 134 Member
    I couldn't agree more with your statement!
  • armymil
    armymil Posts: 163 Member
    I find it stunning how many drs, are over weight but preach healthy diets, etc!

    LOL, my cousin is a dietician. She is overweight, probably in her mid 200s. I never understood how that would work out. I'd never take the advice of a person like her. I want a skinny chick or some buffed out dude to say you need to eat more veggies. I'd believe them over her.
  • Laura32412
    Laura32412 Posts: 23
    It's interesting you bring this up because I had a similar feeling towards a segment on Rachel Ray either last year or the year before. The segment was about finding fashionable clothing for sizes 22 and up women. Now, on one hand I was thinking, that's a great idea, everyone should be able to wear something fashionable and be comfortable, but on the other hand I was thinking why don't these women work towards losing the weight and get into sizes 12 or 14 or even 16? All the women claimed to be happy with their bodies, which I find hard to believe since they weren't taking the time to go out and find the fashionable clothing the stylists put them in but rather going around in large shirts and sweatshirts.

    When I related the segment and my thoughts to someone they said who am I to judge, it's not like I'm skinny (I was wearing a size 10 at the time and though overweight for my 5'4" frame, by no means obese or morbidly obese). While I agree that discrimination is wrong, I don't know how I feel about including obesity in the list. Weight is something you can change about yourself if you make the effort to do so.

    Sorry if I'm coming off holier than thou or rude . . .
  • sarkris
    sarkris Posts: 41
    I thinn self compassion takes us a lot further than berating ourselves our "accepting ourselves". It is compassion towards ourselves that brings lightbulb moments and the motivation to stick with things when they are tough. It's compassionate to ourselves when we admit that we aren't perfect and that's ok - but we are tired of being tired, tired of our knees hurting everyday and that awful feeling of "riding the sugar pony". If compassion for ourselves is our motivation to steam up some veggies and lace up our sneakers - it will go 10,000 times further than either telling ourselves that we're happy even though we are fat (when we know it just isn't true) - or telling ourselves that we are the worst people ever.
    The nifty thing is - when we learn compassion for ourselves we start to feel it for others. And that can change the world. Sorry if I'm rambling and not making any sense at all - I haven't slept in 32 hours...

    Hope this made sense to someone :)
  • anvacarz
    anvacarz Posts: 58
    I think rather than coddling people, they need to be given more information. No, it is not healthy to be overweight and yes everyone has the power to change. What America should be doing is putting plans in place to help people. They are already starting with the children. Cafeterias are becoming healthier and even Nickelodeon and Disney have commercials about playing outside. Every so often they even turn off their programming and tell children to go outside. We need programs in place for adults as well. Programs that teach them how to eat better and exercise. I know they can find it all online but most people aren't willing to look. And a lot of the programs available such as weight watchers are too expensive.

    I agree that education is important in the fight against obesity, especially childhood obesity, but I find it more disturbing that people fail to be accountable for decisions they make in their lives. I know that I am the only one who is responsible for the state of my weight and I am the only one who can change it....through determination and strength of will. People in this country want to blame anyone and everyone else for their problems without ever considering who is really in charge of their lives. Parents need to take charge of their children and adults need to be accountable and responsible for the choices they make.

    EXACTLY. People need to be held accountable. Providing programs and even more education than is out there already is coddling. Just fess up, own up and change. You know exactly when and what you are doing wrong when you are gaining.
  • MikeSEA
    MikeSEA Posts: 1,074 Member
    It's interesting you bring this up because I had a similar feeling towards a segment on Rachel Ray either last year or the year before. The segment was about finding fashionable clothing for sizes 22 and up women. Now, on one hand I was thinking, that's a great idea, everyone should be able to wear something fashionable and be comfortable, but on the other hand I was thinking why don't these women work towards losing the weight and get into sizes 12 or 14 or even 16? All the women claimed to be happy with their bodies, which I find hard to believe since they weren't taking the time to go out and find the fashionable clothing the stylists put them in but rather going around in large shirts and sweatshirts.

    When I related the segment and my thoughts to someone they said who am I to judge, it's not like I'm skinny (I was wearing a size 10 at the time and though overweight for my 5'4" frame, by no means obese or morbidly obese). While I agree that discrimination is wrong, I don't know how I feel about including obesity in the list. Weight is something you can change about yourself if you make the effort to do so.

    Sorry if I'm coming off holier than thou or rude . . .

    Discrimination in itself isn't a bad thing. We discriminate against criminals all the time...for good reason. It's the reasons we have to take into consideration. I think instead of discrimination, we should focus on respect and honesty. We need to respect and be honest with ourselves about the choices we make and do the same to others. I also think some people who are obese get overwhelmed by all the negativity that surrounds it. Along with respecting ourselves and being open and honest, we also need to celebrate ourselves. I could be off base here but I think someone is probably much more likely to get healthier if they don't feel like they should be punished for being obese.
  • armymil
    armymil Posts: 163 Member
    Discrimination in itself isn't a bad thing. We discriminate against criminals all the time...for good reason. It's the reasons we have to take into consideration. I think instead of discrimination, we should focus on respect and honesty. We need to respect and be honest with ourselves about the choices we make and do the same to others. I also think some people who are obese get overwhelmed by all the negativity that surrounds it. Along with respecting ourselves and being open and honest, we also need to celebrate ourselves. I could be off base here but I think someone is probably much more likely to get healthier if they don't feel like they should be punished for being obese.

    Right, I agree. "I could be off base here but I think someone is probably much more likely to get healthier if they don't feel like they should be punished for being obese."

    Though you should be more careful on comparisons. "Discrimination in itself isn't a bad thing. We discriminate against criminals all the time...for good reason."

    You shouldn't compare good over weight citizens to criminals.
  • hellokehtty
    hellokehtty Posts: 94

    How can you know how to drive without some education?

    I'm not saying that education is unimportant; I agree that it is. I just mean that I don't feel that education alone solves the problem. Action, commitment and accountability are also key. For me, I knew what healthy eating habits were. It was actually taking the step to create those habits that was hard.
  • jkestens63
    jkestens63 Posts: 1,164 Member
    As a former super morbidly obese person, I have a couple thoughts:

    - I fully admit that my weight was my problem and I had to deal with the negative aspects that came along with it. I never expected special treatment because of my weight. HOWEVER, it was unfair that I was passed over for a promotion because I was overweight. It is also extremely wrong for people to make nasty comments to me or about me.
    -Treating overweight people like criminals is wrong. Its all well and good to say stop coddling them and say they need to lose weight. If it was really that easy then we wouldn't have an obsesity epidemic. You don't have to hold their hand and tell them its gonna be okay but you don't have to be judgemental. People have to realize that losing weight is one most difficult things to do - ever - period. I quit smoking cold turkey and couldn't believe how easily I was able to do it. I wish I could have taken the weight off so easily. But I've never had to pick up a cigarette again in order to survive. Daily we are confronting and trying to control the thing that we need to continue to exist yet is the cause of our problem. Anyone who says its easy is being holier than thou.
    - Some people are happy being overweight, I was for a long time (until it affected my life and health). Then I made the choice to change. Buts that's me. Some people will be happy their entire lives being heavy, others will die miserable. But the same can be said for thin people, rich people, pretty people, ugly people, etc.
    - And if we are going to pick on obese people and smokers, why is it that everyone is okay people who drink too much???? My being fat is not going to hurt you. You can avoid second hand smoke. But if I'm driving down the road and a dead drunk driver hits me head on... me and possibly the rest of my family are dead. Yet you don't get the hue and cry about drinking as you do about smokers & fatties!

    Everyone needs to mind their own business, worry about themselves, support others who ask for it, and live the life you choose.
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