Have You Tried an Anti-Inflammatory Meal Plan? Has It Helped?

I didn't do a formal anti-inflammatory diet, but do feel like my systemic inflammation has been reduced with changes in eating and other habits. I can't think of any other way to fully explain the reduction in certain symptoms, including reduced joint pain. (I haven't been tested for CRP or the like, so I can't prove it. Of course weight loss helped joint pain be less severe/frequent, but I don't think it's the whole story. Unlike you, I didn't get materially fitter/stronger alongside weight loss, nor increase exercise load significantly, either.)

Do you have a medically diagnosed reason for the ramped up joint pain? For sure, over-exercise can contribute to that directly and physically. But there are other potential issues, of which systemic inflammation is only one.

Some possibilities are purely physical, of course. But if I can be brutally honest, from your other posts here I feel like you're pretty hard on yourself psychologically, and quite driven. Those are not inherently overall bad things, but things which IMU can contribute to systemic inflammation, too, loosely speaking through the stress pathways (via hormones, cytokine production, etc.).

I'd suggesting including your doctor in the picture, if you haven't already done so, to rule out relevant physical conditions. In parallel, no harm, and possible help, in consulting the RD and working to move your eating in a less pro-inflammatory direction, if possible.

Best wishes for sorting this out and finding improvement!

Ohhh I just typed a long detailed reply on my phone then lost it 😦 in a nutshell, I use my EMS to reduce swelling, increase blood flow and reduce pain. I love it, worth every penny but don’t know if it will work on everyone.

Don't whomp me over the head for the pseudoscience, but have you tried acupuncture? Serious massage therapy? Osteopathic manipulation?

Those won't cure auto-immune issues, but all have helped me with joint pain. Actually, I think good massage therapy and osteopathic medicine aren't very vulnerable to pseudoscience claims.

Acupuncture is a little more suspect IMO, and anecdotally it seems like practitioners vary a great deal. I was a huge skeptic, but our (believe it or not, kids) out-of-town senior kung fu teacher came here to do a martial arts workshop, stayed with us, and wanted to do acupuncture (and moxibustion) on me to see if it could help my quite constant knee pain and routine swelling.

I had serious doubt that it would help, but was confident it wouldn't injure me (clean with sterile needles, all that jazz). One session only. Huge pain reduction right away - though not total elimination - that lasted for months/years, and the knees that had been so swollen I couldn't kneel on them much of the time haven't swollen again ever, from that day to this. (That was Fall 1997ish maybe, or earlier?) I still kinda can't believe it, but that's how it played out, no matter why it played out that way. If placebo effect, I'll take it, absolutely. Bizarre.

Turns out that in the martial arts lineages he was trained in in Taiwan, they think that if you're going to learn how to break people, you should also learn how to fix them, thus he practiced acupuncture, acupressure, and related modalities. Not sure whether he was licensed anywhere in any of it. Don't care about that, either.

Not saying any of those things will work for you, but they've all helped me reduce or even eliminate joint pain. I don't think any have great injury risk (assuming cleanliness/sterility with the acupuncture one), so might be worth trying, if you haven't.

People think osteopathic manipulation is like chiropractic, but IME it's not. It's gentle, and mysteriously helpful. I go to a university clinic here that's associated with a College of Osteopathy in the university. These are full medical doctors (D.O.s, analogous to M.D.s), with one sub-specialty being musculoskeletal issues. My primary care doc and my new neurosurgeon are both D.O.s now, too, just different specialties (obviously ). The ones that specialize in musculoskeletal issues don't pretend to be experts in all things health and diet, and extra medical specialties besides, in the way that IME the skeezy fringe of chiropractors do.

Can I ask a few questions first. I know a little about your journey @springlering62 and was wondering if joint pain was a problem before you lost weight? Also, you said you had blood work done recently and wondering what your triglyceride numbers are and if you know what your C-reactive protein level is? What percentage of your diet are carbohydrates and what type is prominent in your diet now. Also have you changed anything in your diet over this time period, even the smallest changes can have an effect, so it's why I'm asking.

I was wondering considering your complaint was inflammation did your Dr's do a enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay (ELISA) or multiplex immunoassays test which can detect and quantify various cytokines which are extremely pro inflammatory and show up constantly, so why I'm asking and these again are related to the inflammatory nature of sugars in general.

Of course inflammation has a litany of confounders and engaging in weight training especially on an aggressive level contributes to inflammation but I'm going to discount that as a recent cause of your concerns simply because that is not the type of inflammation that becomes chronic and actually helps mitigate the actual type of inflammation that is more associated with joint pain, yeah, basically exercise of any kind reduces chronic inflammation, and I can elaborate if you want me to.

For me, joint pain flares up when I eat wheat. Which I am allergic to. If you suspect allergies that is a path.
My son is being investigated for celiac and that is an auto immune disorder that in some people causes joint pain.

I guess what I am saying is that a particular allergy may worsen inflammation. If you are an allergic person… are you avoiding your allergens?
Your inflammatory foods may be a bit different from mine. Maybe for me it’s wheat and for you it is dairy.

I have had help from massage and PT because if something hurts (say your right knee) then you might start walking differently and then that causes other pain. Yoga and Pilates have also helped a lot! And maybe I will try acupuncture, which has helped me with other issues!

Oops sorry @springlering62, electrical muscle stimulation device. It includes TENS machines but the frequency I use is to increase veinous blood flow rather than pain relief. (I know some orthopaedic surgeons and they use it to help reduce swelling after knee and hip surgeries).
I use it on this setting: 300us pulse width, 40Hz 0.5 second burst then 2 seconds rest, then repeats. I use it for 30 mins, it contracts the muscle and significantly increases blood flow. Ill try and take a picture of the electrode placements to attach.

I have no idea what that might be, and asked an AI

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/new?q=pending&newFrontendContextUUID=c49c1866-202a-43e7-a8b2-47545819c6bf

So basically rather Mediterranean. I don't know if this lines up with what Americans consider a Mediterranean diet looks like to be honest. I eat naturally like this. That I don't have any joint and similar problems is of course no evidence that it works. I hope you find answers.

Yes, I’ve been on an anti inflammation diet for over a year and it has been the best I have felt.

Arthritis does run in my family/ so I’m trying to prevent, my blood work came back with a higher CRP and my doctor suspected low grade inflammation - we ruled out infection.

Inflammation can be caused by many things but in my case the doctors deduced it was stress, sleep, and possibly diet.

@springlering62 - per my Dr -
There is also sub clinical inflammation that can be possibly reduced through diet. It takes some trying out to see what works for you.

So- per doctor and allergist I did an elimination diet to see if I could have any sensitivities that tests couldn’t pick up..

I also cut out all processed food, and increased my greens (leafy green juice every morning) and omega 3s. I limit saturated fat, sugar, caffeine and wine… I stay low glycemic, routinely my carbs are under 50 net carbs per day — my CRP went down by 70% . Turns out I’m sensitive to gluten. (Not allergic to it though)

I sleep better and have a lot more energy. I used to have some back pain that has resolved itself.. in my case adhering to an anti inflammation diet has helped immensely.

@AnnPT77 - I also do acupuncture 1x per week for blood flow. I only started it after a trip to China where I tried it and slept so well afterwards.. I found a Traditional Chinese medical practitioner back in NY and I’ve found an East meets West approach has suited me best.

also check out enzymes for joint pain (they are also anti inflammatory - I like Wobenzym N / made in Germany)

There are also anti inflammatory foods I incorporate such as ginger, turmeric, etc .. herbs 🌿 (but that’s a much longer post!!!)

Well, I certainly don't envy your situation, I'm also a high carb kinda gal and just attempting it sounds like a miserable idea. But then again, being miserable from the pain is no fun either 😔
If I were you, I might try the elimination diet first to see if certain foods are triggers? And if that doesn't yield (enough) results, try lowering carbs gradually?

I don't have anything close to what you've described and never went on a "anti-inflammatory" diet.
I was diagnosed with both rheumatoid arthritis and osteoarthritis about 25 years ago. Actually felt pain from arthritis one time in my life--about a month ago. But I have fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue. I was like neanderthin describes. Considering that there might be only one way left to stop the pain.
I found a Doctor who had fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue when he was in med school. He almost dropped out, but listened, learned, and dug his way out. He still listens, repeats what works for others as a suggestion to try. He doesn't advocate "anti-inflammatory" or "keto", but many of his suggestions are similar.
The one thing I see he advocates that is very unlike your normal diet is to go as near no sugar, no non-sugar sweeteners as YOU possibly can. Then eat a little less sugar. It works for me--most of the time. The less sugar I eat, the better I feel. The better I feel, the less I want sugar bursting my happy bubble. It doesn't always work, but mostly it does. I still eat fruit, sweet potatoes, etc.
I eat lower and lower carb through the years. Not because I'm aiming at keto. I'm definitely not. But if I live long enough, I may end up there.
I hope you find some relief.
Oh, and you thought weight loss was slow. Patience.

@springlering62, have you talked with your registered dietitian yet? That's a really good idea, and I know you've found that kind of conversation very beneficial in the past. That should give you some personalized advice from a well-credentialed person who's looking at your actual food choices (beyond macronutrients), and can advise you about how to approach an elimination diet in a well-constructed way.

Here, as you know, you're just talking with other regular MFP users, and AFAIK none of us have relevant degrees or certifications in nutrition. Some of us have "done our own research" . . . that isn't really research, but is maybe reading in depth in places we found information, sources of which may or may not have been biased in some way, and have certainly been considered in ways that might reflect our own confirmation bias; and to that we've added our n=1 personal experience. That's just human, and it's better than just believing marketing and the general blogosphere, but it has limitations.

I don't want to start a food-religion fight here, but I'd say this: If you read around a bit from fairly well-respected mainstream sources, I think you'll find that some encourage including whole grains, legumes, and starchy vegetables as part of an anti-inflammatory diet (along with a range of other foods, of course).

There are those who feel that the mainstream has been unduly influenced by the farm lobby, though I admit I'm curious about whether Big Grain, Big Meat, Big Dairy or Big Veggie actually might have the most effective lobbyists, if that truly is a factor. Am I saying the mainstream experts (or "experts" ) are 100% right? No. But IMO it's worth thinking about how to weigh mainstream advice against other alternative experts, some of them relatively self-appointed.

We haven't seen Team Vegan show up on your thread yet, but there are also experts/"experts" that claim that's the most anti-inflammatory way to eat. I'm not going to say that. I try not to have a food-style religion, because I think that's silly, but I'm sure I slide that way sometimes. Human, y'know? For sure, though I'm vegetarian, I'm not going to tell you that that's the best way to eat, because it isn't; or that it's sure to be anti-inflammatory because I don't personally have as much inflammation as I used to. It's complicated.

I'll add this: I don't think we can say much from looking at your macros plus a few micros that we all know MFP doesn't track very accurately. I think specific food choices really matter. As a much too general generality, ultra-processed foods are more likely to contain substances we wouldn't use when cooking in our own kitchen, and some of those substances don't have a long record of consumption through a sweep of human history. Are they bad? Dunno. The US regulatory practice of letting things remain in food when nothing horrible has yet been proven against them . . . not helpful in this regard, I think.

Some other things that are mentioned in general mainstream, conservative sources as potential influences on systemic inflammation are trans fats and omega-3/omega-6 balance.

You have one gram of trans fat showing in your average.
An outfit like WHO suggests trans fat be limited to no more than 1% of daily calories, and others deem it as having no safe level. Generally, trans fats are believed to be pro-inflammatory.

To top it off, that may one gram of trans fat may not be all you're eating. The US nutrition labeling laws may not be our friend when it comes to limiting trans fat to tiny levels: Last I knew, a serving had to have 0.5g or more of trans fat in order to have trans fat be non-zero on the label. When the 2000-calorie US reference diet plus the WHO recommendation would limit trans fat intake to no more than 2.2g of trans fats, that 0.5g issue IMO may becomes meaningful.

O-3/O-6 balance is another thing we can't tell from just your nutrient list. Most USA-ians are getting an overbalanced ratio, i.e. more O-6 than considered ideal compared to their O-3. That seems to be considered pro-inflammatory. Without knowing things like your intake of high O-3 fish (among other things), it's hard to know what your ratio might be.

Personally - and I know I am getting a little bit food-religion-y here - I would want to be eating more poly- and mono-unsaturated fats than you are. That doesn't relate clearly to O-3/O-6 balance, though. I also was surprised to see that your fiber intake was only 28g, given that you have quite a large calorie budget. That 28g should be an adequate level, but it tees off questions in my head about micronutrient levels, beneficial phytochemicals, pre-biotics and that sort of thing, since the foods with those aspects often also deliver a good bit of fiber (pre-biotics literally are types of fiber).

Once again, this is a long ramble. I'm also just another random idiot on the internet, one with no degrees or certifications in nutrition, just personal interest (and presumably as much confirmation bias as the next person).

So, TL;DR: See your RD. Consider more than one view of what an anti-inflammatory diet might be, and (IMO) prefer views from well-credentialed sources. Your specific food choices may matter more than just the macros and a few micros (that are questionably accurate on MFP anyway).

I hope you can find a solution to the pain you're experiencing, sincerely.

springlering62 wrote: »

pS: got curious about that transfat.

The only transfat I’ve logged in months has been the occasional Cookout burger (“Bye Bye Eat” is a huge treat for the dog, because he gets to sit on their patio, act like he’s got some sense, and gets a burger to himself).

But the bulk has been tortilla chips, which I make nachos with every month or two.

I eat no fried foods at all other than a large apple fritter every Sunday morning. That’s probably got some transfers that aren’t reported, but finding an entry for one is ridiculous.

I’m not too worried about fiber. I feel like that’s one of those that has a lot of erroneous database entries. As long as I’m over, I figure I’m probably getting even more than that IRL.

Ditto with transfats. Even if they’re a gram or two above, due to database errors, it’s still a heckuva a lot better than it used to be.

Although, if I want to try anti inflammatory or elimination, I’ll need to get over that line of thought. 🧐

I worry about the continuously high sodium, but otoh I sweat a TON, so I figure it’s just visiting for the most part.

High sodium is pretty well a given in a diet that has enough processed foods for that to be a concern, and processed foods also is where your going to find most of the trans fats in food as well.

There is a reason why they're reduced to those low levels and a reason why those low levels are acceptable.

The 900 lb gorilla when it comes to trans fats is "partially hydrogenated oil" which are actually polyunsaturated fats from various seed oils, originally back in the day, 1911 or 12 Proctor & Gamble used cottonseed a left over waste product that was primarily being used for animal feed and the oil used for lubricating the industrial revolution and that's when they decided this PHO could be used to replace lard and butter called Crisco, of course they couldn't know the health implication at the time but the USDA knew in 2000 they shouldn't be consumed and finally dropped the GRAS ( Generally Recognized as Safe) status in 2015 and the compliance ban didn't take place until Jan 2021. 21 years later. Refined seed oils, like corn and canola today contain trace amounts of trans fats but that's from the refining process and not because they contain PHO's.

The USDA recommends that half of the grain products we consume come from refined grains, which has to do with vitamin and mineral fortification from the fiber content in an all whole grain diet and would leave the Country deficient in many vitamins and minerals from the lack of absorption, so we can expect that the .05g's per serving to be around forever and of course and therefore so will refined seed oils simply because refined carbs are only found in processed and ultra processed foods.

Trans fats do more than increase inflammation and inflammation is the result of all that bad stuff which include actually messing with our cellular membrane integrity and fluidity which is really important, which effect cell signaling and obviously it effects our lipid metabolism and negatively effect our mitochondria, which all lead to pro inflammatory cytokines.

As far as people doing their own research, I believe it pays dividends in spades especially when it's on a continual timeline. All the data that Doctors and dietitians are given is on the internet and some are going to explore that same data, saying people are not capable of understanding or connecting the dots is short sighted. There's literally thousands of studies, yes actual studies and RCT's unlike the WHO for example and the same studies Dr's are using as learning data is available to everyone and it will become apparent to anyone that actually does the leg work and soon realize that the majority of studies on the ketogenic diet for example (over 90%) show improvement and reversal of many of the non communicable disease, especially diabetes and inflammation.

Pretty much all Doctors that have left mainstream medicine and opened their own clinic dealing with metabolic disease use dietary interventions as the medicine and pretty much all of them use a very low and/or ketogenic diet, coincidence, I don't thinks so. It really isn't rocket science. IMO of course.