Deep Ketosis
PiPDream01
Posts: 41 Member
I am a nature bodybuilder and starting a contest prep for April. We all know as we get older it is harder and harder to lose fat so this time, I was going to try something different. Instead of dieting with macros and dropping calories I am going to try to do the lion diet and get into deep ketosis to force my body to burn fat.
1
Replies
-
I'm quite familiar with the carnivore and the lion diet brought to us by Mikala Peterson and I've been Keto for quite a while but any diet can do what you propose and especially one that is higher in protein.
There are no RCT's (studies) on pretty much anything carnivore but antidotally from the general population that aren't body builders or people that work out much find losing weight pretty easy, a given actually and quite a few also saw increased muscle mass, now that could be simply a diet that was previously pretty low in protein, but nevertheless it is a common theme. I would suggest your consumption of protein be high in the context of a carnivore diet. Good luck.
1 -
Jonathan Griffiths is a carnivore bodybuilder from the UK, I believe and has a good podcast I have been listen to, and Robert Sikes is a natural bodybuilder who is also a user of keto diet to stay in shape and cut. If anyone else wants to check them out1
-
There is no backdoor shortcut into burning stored fat it’s gonna come down to your calories so unless keto causes you to eat fewer calories there’s no sense in doing that plus most people have a very hard time with energy levels doing those diets and if your contest prepping you need energy for your training so I would rethink things before you jump into it2
-
Just a thought experiment, if I bring in 1 gram of protein per lean body mass and then fill my energy /hormonal needs with fat from food, just sit on the edge so the body has to use some body fat because I am running on ketones.
So now I am oxidizing fat for energy or to make ketones and breathing it out
Google " The process of fat oxidation, also known as beta oxidation, is the way the body breaks down fatty acids to generate energy:
Activation: Fatty acids are activated.
Transport: Fatty acids are transported into the mitochondria.
Oxidation: Fatty acids are oxidized inside the mitochondria.
Here are some more details about fat oxidation:
Location
Fat oxidation occurs in the mitochondria of cells, especially in the heart, skeletal muscle, and liver.
Energy source
Fat oxidation is the main energy source for many tissues, especially during fasting or stress.
Efficiency
Fat oxidation is more efficient than sugar oxidation because it yields more ATP per unit of fuel.
Exercise
Fat oxidation increases during low- to moderate-intensity exercise, peaking at around 60–65% VO2max.
Glycogen
When exercise intensity increases above 50% VO2max, the body also uses more muscle glycogen.
Auto-oxidation
Fats can also undergo an irreversible oxidation process called auto-oxidation, which occurs when fatty acids and oxygen form peroxides and hydroperoxides. Antioxidants can help delay this process.-1 -
Fat oxidation, also known as beta-oxidation, is the process where the body breaks down fatty acids from fat stores into acetyl-CoA molecules, which can then be used for energy production; when this process occurs at a high rate in the liver, it produces ketone bodies (like acetoacetate and beta-hydroxybutyrate) as a byproduct, which can be utilized by other tissues as an alternative fuel source, particularly when glucose is scarce, like during fasting or a low-carb diet; essentially, ketones are a result of significant fat oxidation in the liver.
Key points about fat oxidation and ketones:
Process:
When fat is broken down in adipose tissue, fatty acids are released into the bloodstream and taken up by the liver. Inside the liver mitochondria, these fatty acids undergo beta-oxidation, a series of reactions that cleave off two-carbon units (acetyl-CoA) from the fatty acid chain.
Ketone formation:
When the liver produces more acetyl-CoA than it needs for immediate energy, these acetyl-CoA molecules are converted into ketone bodies (acetoacetate, beta-hydroxybutyrate, and acetone).
Utilization of ketones:
These ketone bodies are then released into the bloodstream and can be used by other tissues, like muscle and brain, as an alternative fuel source, especially when glucose levels are low.
Ketosis:
A state where the body produces a significant amount of ketone bodies due to increased fat oxidation, often occurring when carbohydrate intake is restricted.-1 -
"then fill my energy /hormonal needs with fat from food, just sit on the edge so the body has to use some body fat because I am running on ketones."
You would have to be eating less than your body's energy needs. If you fill your body's energy needs, your body will burn the fat you're eating, not the fat on your body. So yes, in keto you switch to using fat for fuel. But you do still have to be in a caloric deficit for your body to use BODY fat as fuel.5 -
True, so being on that edge if I go for a walk or do resistance training and not include that as part of my total daily energy needs than it will burn body fat.2
-
PiPDream01 wrote: »True, so being on that edge if I go for a walk or do resistance training and not include that as part of my total daily energy needs than it will burn body fat.
Yes, that would definitely be one way to do it!1 -
Just another thing I do, and I know other people do as well, I don't eat back or include calories I use in the gym. But I do find it easier for myself to diet or restrict calories if I am in ketosis, I Like to KISS.
Also, if I am using fat for energy, it would be easier to burn body fat as energy.
I'll post in update in February1 -
Your goal is to reduce body fat for a bodybuilding contest and you believe that being in ketosis which utilizes fat for energy that somehow it will then use your fat stores as energy and will help you get lean for this contest. Only when in a deficit will a reduction in adipose tissue take place, not because your in ketosis which seems to be a common misconception with people that aren't familiar with the science.
Anyway, there are mechanisms in the carnivore diet that helps people maintain and build muscle more easily than other dietary solutions and maybe you'll benefit from one of those but as far as contest prep goes and reducing body fat, you'll need to be in a deficit.
4 -
I’m not in ketosis, but my body burns fat every day when I’m in a calorie deficit in a process called lipolysis. As long as we’re in a deficit, weight loss will happen. I really hope you’ve found the key to sticking with it this time—how much are you aiming to lose, and how’s it going so far?
You mentioned not counting some of your activity to create a deficit. Just curious—don’t you want to know exactly what your body is doing, for knowledge and future reference? Why not track everything so you have more data down the road? Imagine fast-forwarding five years, looking back at your diary, and thinking, ‘I lost weight before eating X calories, so why isn’t it working now?’ Your caloric output plays a big role, so leaving that out of the equation might make things less clear over time.
As for the idea that using fat for energy makes it easier to burn body fat—interesting thought. That hasn’t been my experience, but definitely keep us posted on how your energy levels and overall progress are going. If you hit any roadblocks, others here might have some great workarounds to share.3 -
I am tracking my BW/BF%/BMI/Muscle Mass and will post the weekly changes and let's see where this goes1
-
Track BW and waist circumference at the navel. Those BMI/muscle mass calculators are inaccurate.PiPDream01 wrote: »I am tracking my BW/BF%/BMI/Muscle Mass and will post the weekly changes and let's see where this goes
Waist measurements don’t lie.
4 -
1/01/2025 Measurements I took, 217.2BW, 20%BF, 32.9BMI, 173.6LBFFBW
1/05/2025 Next Measurements1 -
-
Personally whilst cutting on keto, I hate the way I look, muscles look stingy the leaner you get, I found it messed with my head, these days i cut with the maximum amount of carbs I can while been in a deficit, usually cutting fats down the the minimum1
-
1/04/2025 so far, I'm feeling good, body is responding good, my digestion feels good, 0 bloating
I'm going to keep riding this out and see where it goes
2 -
The next lever to be pulled getting into deep ketosis, fasting.
A couple years ago when I did a cut and went from 210 to 173 what I did was I counted and tracked my macros 2400kcals, 50% Carbs 30% Protein 20% Fat and exercises but every Sunday I fasted. It was pretty easy, and I felt great, So When I started this, I looked into and planned on utilizing that tool to help. So, Sundays I am going to implement fasting.
Benefits of a 40-Hour Fast
"A 40-hour fast, also known as an extended fast, may offer several potential benefits, including:
Weight Loss:
Fasting reduces calorie intake, which can lead to weight loss. Studies suggest that intermittent fasting, such as a 40-hour fast, may be as effective as traditional calorie restriction for weight management.
Improved Metabolic Health:
Fasting can improve insulin sensitivity, lower blood sugar levels, and reduce inflammation, which may benefit metabolic health conditions such as type 2 diabetes.
Cellular Regeneration:
During fasting, the body enters a state called autophagy, where it breaks down and recycles damaged cells, promoting cellular regeneration.
Brain Health:
Fasting may improve cognitive function, memory, and protect against neurodegenerative diseases.
Reduced Risk of Chronic Diseases:
Some studies suggest that extended fasting may reduce the risk of certain chronic diseases, including heart disease, cancer, and Alzheimer's disease.
Spiritual and Psychological Benefits:
Fasting can be a spiritual practice for some individuals, providing a sense of introspection and connection. Additionally, it may improve mood and reduce stress levels.
Important Considerations:
Consult with a healthcare professional before starting a 40-hour fast, especially if you have any underlying health conditions.
Gradually increase the duration of your fasts to avoid adverse effects.
Drink plenty of water, unsweetened tea, or black coffee during the fast.
Break the fast gradually with nutrient-rich foods.
Fasting may not be suitable for everyone, including pregnant women, breastfeeding mothers, people with eating disorders, and those with certain medical conditions."
https://www.doctorkiltz.com/40-hour-fast/0 -
Making a slight adjustment to todays planned fast, woke up very hungry so just going with a PSMF, Protein Sparing Modified Fast. So just going to down some whey isolate protein a few times today and use that protein leveraging technique.
PSMF stands for Protein-Sparing Modified Fast. It is a type of very-low-calorie diet (VLCD) that restricts carbohydrates and fat while providing a high amount of protein.
Purpose:
PSMF is typically used for rapid weight loss in individuals with obesity. It aims to induce ketosis, a metabolic state where the body burns fat for energy instead of carbohydrates.
Components:
Calories: 400-800 kcal/day
Protein: 1.2-1.5 g/kg body weight/day
Carbohydrates: <20-30 g/day
Fat: <10-20 g/day
Fluids: 2-3 liters/day
Vitamins and minerals: Supplementation may be necessary
Benefits:
Rapid weight loss, Preservation of muscle mass due to high protein intake, and Improved blood sugar control.
Risks:
Fatigue, Muscle weakness, Electrolyte imbalances, Nutritional deficiencies, Gallstones, and Kidney damage.
Precautions:
PSMF should only be followed under the supervision of a healthcare professional.
It is not suitable for everyone, including pregnant or breastfeeding women, children, people with certain medical conditions, and those with a history of eating disorders.
It is essential to monitor electrolyte levels and receive regular medical checkups during the diet.
Conclusion:
PSMF can be an effective way to achieve rapid weight loss, but it is a restrictive and potentially risky diet that should only be undertaken under medical guidance. It is important to weigh the potential benefits and risks carefully before considering this option.0 -
PiPDream01 wrote: »1/01/2025 Measurements I took, 217.2BW, 20%BF, 32.9BMI, 173.6LBFFBW
1/05/2025 Next Measurements
1/01/2025 Measurements I took, 217.2BW, 20%BF, 32.9BMI, 173.6LBW
1/05/2025 Measurements I took, 211.8BW, 19.5%BF, 32.1BMI, 170.6LBW
1/12/2025 Next Measurements0 -
I Love Mondays!!! It's all about perspective, and I look at Mondays as a start of a new week that I can make a great difference in my life, another chance. It's a stepping off point. LOOK, anyone can do anything for a week, and this time of year everyone sees that. Your new workout or diet is always easiest the first week but a couple weeks in and it starts to suck so I look at it as Monday I can do this for a week, I can train hard for a week. This week will be almost the same as last week a few small adjustments to the diet, I am going to add MCT Oil C8/C10 to my meals, one Tbsp and start taking COQ10 200mg a day. The overall picture of doing this is to make my cells healthier, by time restricted eating and zero process foods or sugars. Zero carbs! I got this, I can push myself hard for 1 week and so can you. I Love Mondays!!!1
-
Good Morning, Feeling great on day 7. Funny thing yesterday afternoon sitting in my office with my partner working and I could smell the French Vanilla Creamer he had in his desk for his coffee, it smelled so sweat. It's been a week, and I have dropped 1% BF so I'll take that as a victory. No cravings yet, strength is still good, #carnivore #keto1
-
Fatty Coffee ☕1
-
It's Friday, fell of the track the other day working late but now I'm back on. Totally wasn't worth it.
But everything is back to where it was, and I feel good. Yesterday I came across a few YouTube videos on how sugar effects your immune system, pretty interesting.0 -
I love the weekends but it's boring when you are focused on a goal and cut out all distractions. Had a weird dream about BBQ sauce last night. But everything is working the way is supposed to, feel very hot all the time. My weight is dropping still and the mirror feedback looks good, muscle still there. Not going to fast this weekend.0
-
/01/2025 Measurements I took, 217.2BW, 20%BF, 32.9BMI, 173.6LBW
1/05/2025 Measurements I took, 211.8BW, 19.5%BF, 32.1BMI, 170.6LBW
1/12/2025 Measurements i Took, 210.6BW, 19.3%BF, 31.9BMI, 170.0LBW
1/19/2025 Next Measurements0 -
Good morning Monday, let the week begin!0
-
You have the freedom to choose to eat what you need or eat what you want. Freedom to eat when you need to or when you want to. Morning thought 🤔1
-
So if you are tracking your food, taking accountability you can make a change. Enjoy1
-
It's 2 weeks in! This is the third cut I've done like this and I can say since I've been logging I seem more aware of myself. I've cut a couple different times in my life but this time I'm more aware and recognizing some the funny things. First consistency is a pillar accountability is a pillar. But I have noticed when I am dieting I always have 2 conversations with myself, 1 is I get hungry and want to "cheat" and tell myself I'll go harder tomorrow to make up for it. 2 I'm getting results but want more, want it faster and talk myself in going harder which both sabotages my diet, refer to the pillars. Have a great day 😊0
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 394K Introduce Yourself
- 43.9K Getting Started
- 260.3K Health and Weight Loss
- 176K Food and Nutrition
- 47.5K Recipes
- 232.6K Fitness and Exercise
- 432 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.6K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153.1K Motivation and Support
- 8.1K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.4K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.9K MyFitnessPal Information
- 15 News and Announcements
- 1.2K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.7K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions