Need To Gain Muscle and NOT Fat

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nerditup
nerditup Posts: 4
in Food and Nutrition
I am a 30 year-old male with a height of 6' 3" and weight of 165 lbs. I am approx 15% body fat (according to the fat caliper method). I am considered "lanky/skinny" but I have a small "spare tire" that is forming around my waist. I am looking to gain muslce mass (first) and then lose fat (second) in the next 4 months (vacation coming up!). So far, in the past 3 weeks, I've been averaging the following per day:

244 grams of carbs
192 grams of protein
56 grams of fat

I am trying to eat around 2,500 calories while maintaining a decent carb/protein/fat ratio, but I'm finding it's VERY difficult (am only eating around 2200-2300 per day). I could increase the amount of fat per day, which would help me reach that goal, but is that the smart thing to do? Am I eating the right ratios?

My workout schedule is currently 4 days per week of strength/weight training. I will work 1-2 muscle groups at each session and try to push myself a little harder each time. Other than warming up on a bike for 5-10 minutes before working out, I do not perform any cardio.


So, I turn to you guys to help me with my diet/nutrition/etc in order to gain muscle mass without inflating my spare tire! =)
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Replies

  • ilovedeadlifts
    ilovedeadlifts Posts: 2,923 Member
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    if you're just starting out, you don't need to be on a 2 muscle groups per day split.

    either look into a fullbody routine 3x a week (starting strength, madcows)
    or do an upper/ lower split
    monday lower
    tues upper
    wed off/cardio
    thursday lower
    Friday upper
    weekends off or cardio, but take a day off at some point during the week.

    You don't need to be focusing on specific body parts right now, you need to focus on your body as a whole and try to add mass.
  • deathstarclock
    deathstarclock Posts: 512 Member
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    EAT MOAR. BLAST THOSE MUSCLES.

    Let EPOC do the rest ;]
  • lockef
    lockef Posts: 466
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    Day 1: Bench/Squat/Deadlift/Bent Rows
    Day 2: Rest
    Day 3: Bench/Squat/Deadlift/Bent Rows
    Day 4: Cardio
    Day 5: Rest
    Day 6: Bench/Squat/Deadlift/Bent Rows
    Day 7: Rest

    Lift heavy. A little cardio will help keep you burning fat.
  • nerditup
    nerditup Posts: 4
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    I could try the upper/lower routines to see if that helps. But as far as the cardio, I was under the impression (from what I've read) that you cannot gain muscle AND lose fat at the same time (with a high amount of success). So the goal was to focus only on gaining muscle for the first couple months and then lose fat for the next 2 months (then repeat again after vacation as needed).

    My big concern is how to gain that mass. Do I quit worrying about my fat/carb intake and only focus on calories and protein? Or do I keep my current ratios and add some weight gain shakes? Or are there other methods?

    Thanks!
  • coltrane23
    coltrane23 Posts: 30 Member
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    I'd recommend dropping your carbs and increasing your fats. Not just any fats, mind you: healthy fats. Coconut, avocado, olive oil, nuts . . . those sorts of fats. Your protein looks pretty good, but way too many carbs. Eating more fats will help your body process the proteins more effectively (i.e., build muscle). The carbs get in the way of that process.

    Also, lift heavy weights 3x a week. Three lifts each time: squats every time, and I alternate between bench press/deadlift and shoulder press/power clean. Do those exercises right, and you'll build muscle everywhere.

    Your results may vary, but this has worked well for me since I got serious about lifting a couple months ago. I came from the other end of the spectrum, though--I had to lose a lot of weight, and I lost so much so quickly that I needed to work on building up muscle mass. I'm still a work in progress, but my progress is visible when I look in a mirror.
  • lockef
    lockef Posts: 466
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    But as far as the cardio, I was under the impression (from what I've read) that you cannot gain muscle AND lose fat at the same time (with a high amount of success).

    You won't be "losing fat", but the weight you gain will be a smaller percentage from fat.



    Ninja edit
  • ArroganceInStep
    ArroganceInStep Posts: 6,239 Member
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    if you're just starting out, you don't need to be on a 2 muscle groups per day split.

    either look into a fullbody routine 3x a week (starting strength, madcows)
    or do an upper/ lower split
    monday lower
    tues upper
    wed off/cardio
    thursday lower
    Friday upper
    weekends off or cardio, but take a day off at some point during the week.

    You don't need to be focusing on specific body parts right now, you need to focus on your body as a whole and try to add mass.

    What he said. I personally like 5x5 best (I would suggest starting with 5x5 Strong Lifts and then progressing to Madcow after though).

    Protein shake after lifting, slow release protein shake at night before bed on days you lifted.

    Avocado and natural Peanut Butter (there's one's with flax seed oil in them too which are awesome) are your friends.

    Make sure you do compound exercises where possible.

    If you haven't been lifting much, try to find a spotter to work out with you. And if you can afford it, consider a personal trainer so you can get your form right.
  • agthorn
    agthorn Posts: 1,844 Member
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    Isn't this why some people do cycles of bulk and cut? Adding mostly muscle and a little fat during a bulk, and then losing mostly fat and a little muscle during a cut?
  • ArroganceInStep
    ArroganceInStep Posts: 6,239 Member
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    My big concern is how to gain that mass. Do I quit worrying about my fat/carb intake and only focus on calories and protein? Or do I keep my current ratios and add some weight gain shakes? Or are there other methods?

    Thanks!

    I'd say cut back on carbs and increase healthy fats. Also add in protein shakes on days you lift. What's worked best for me is a shake right after lifting, and a slow release protein shake at night before bed on days I lifted.
    But as far as the cardio, I was under the impression (from what I've read) that you cannot gain muscle AND lose fat at the same time.

    Cardio is still good for you, not even considering the scale. Beyond that though if you're going to cycle back to trying to reduce fat, do you really want to nix cardio for a couple months right before that? Keep your endurance up through the bulking stage, it's worthwhile. Also doing cardio will help reduce the amount of fat you gain when bulking up, even though it won't completely eliminate it.
  • nerditup
    nerditup Posts: 4
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    Thanks for all the replies so far!

    I will try to decrease my carbs and increase the healthy fats. I could use some suggestions on what exactly I could eat to increase those fats. I do NOT like any nuts or avacados. However, I LOVE peanut butter, and i'm currently including that in my daily diet. Any other suggestions are certainly welcomed because I'm a picky eater!

    As for the protein shakes, I currently take one protein shake before and after each workout (I workout in the evening, so the post-workout shake is usually less than an hour before bed).
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,017 Member
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    With your stats you won't be building anything on 2300-2500 calories a day. Eat more stick to compound lifts.
  • ArroganceInStep
    ArroganceInStep Posts: 6,239 Member
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    Thanks for all the replies so far!

    I will try to decrease my carbs and increase the healthy fats. I could use some suggestions on what exactly I could eat to increase those fats. I do NOT like any nuts or avacados. However, I LOVE peanut butter, and i'm currently including that in my daily diet. Any other suggestions are certainly welcomed because I'm a picky eater!

    As for the protein shakes, I currently take one protein shake before and after each workout (I workout in the evening, so the post-workout shake is usually less than an hour before bed).

    Make sure you get the right peanut butter. They're usually the ones that say 'natural' or some such. Look on the ingredients and make sure they don't have any hydrogenated oils. My personal favorite is Teddie natural peanut butter with flaxseed oil. Peanut butter bananas, or adding peanut butter and banana to your protein shakes, are a great way to up fat intake. You can also use whole milk for some of your protein shakes too.

    Fish is good as well, omega 3's and all.

    Also olive oil.

    Drink tons of water.
  • ilovedeadlifts
    ilovedeadlifts Posts: 2,923 Member
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    Day 1: Bench/Squat/Deadlift/Bent Rows
    Day 2: Rest
    Day 3: Bench/Squat/Deadlift/Bent Rows
    Day 4: Cardio
    Day 5: Rest
    Day 6: Bench/Squat/Deadlift/Bent Rows
    Day 7: Rest

    Lift heavy. A little cardio will help keep you burning fat.
    deadlifting 3x a week WILL get your hurt. absolutely not reccommended. I'd do deads 1-2 times per week, and squat twice a week. other stuff is fine 3x but your lower back isn't gonna stand up to 3 dl workouts per week.
  • ilovedeadlifts
    ilovedeadlifts Posts: 2,923 Member
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    Isn't this why some people do cycles of bulk and cut? Adding mostly muscle and a little fat during a bulk, and then losing mostly fat and a little muscle during a cut?

    yep.
    but when you're new, your body will put on a little muscle while losing fat. after the first 6 months to a year, you have to start picking a goal and eating for it. things get a lot harder then :(
  • joejccva71
    joejccva71 Posts: 2,985 Member
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    deadlifting 3x a week WILL get your hurt. absolutely not reccommended. I'd do deads 1-2 times per week, and squat twice a week. other stuff is fine 3x but your lower back isn't gonna stand up to 3 dl workouts per week.

    Reading this response and then looking up at your MFP username is a definate head scratcher.
  • lockef
    lockef Posts: 466
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    deadlifting 3x a week WILL get your hurt. absolutely not reccommended. I'd do deads 1-2 times per week, and squat twice a week. other stuff is fine 3x but your lower back isn't gonna stand up to 3 dl workouts per week.

    Interesting... I don't ever go all out everytime, it'll depend on how I feel.

    Will def cut back on the DL's. Thanks!
  • lockef
    lockef Posts: 466
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    Reading this response and then looking up at your MFP username is a definate head scratcher.

    :laugh:
  • deathstarclock
    deathstarclock Posts: 512 Member
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    There's alot of crap advice in this thread. Just my two cents.

    And I know how to weed it out.
  • joejccva71
    joejccva71 Posts: 2,985 Member
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    OP: All this strength training will do you nothing if your diet is not 100% in check. You also need to be eating a calorie surplus to build new muscle tissue. Energy in vs energy out. You WILL gain some fat along with muscle but what I recommend is:

    - Cut down to about 10-12% bodyfat first and then go on a bulk. You actually will have an easier time putting on muscle if your bodyfat is already somewhat low.

    - Bulk from 10-12% to 15%, then cut again.

    - During your bulk phase, there's really no reason to do cardio. Eat a calorie surplus with 1-1.25g of protein per lb of lbm. Eat .50g of dietary fat per lb of bw. Put the rest in carbs.

    - During your cut phase, cycle your carbs (low, med, high) and eat a 500 calorie deficit so you can retain as much lbm as possible. You can also start incorporating some cardio. I'd limit it to 2x a week (30 min sessions).

    What else did I miss?

    Oh and to save some folks some time on argueing with me about this method, I suggest you read this: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/initial-body-fat-and-body-composition-changes.html
  • mynameisuntz
    mynameisuntz Posts: 582 Member
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    I wouldn't bulk at 15% body fat...

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