Too Much Protein

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  • pg3ibew
    pg3ibew Posts: 1,026 Member
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    Cliff notes: More protein > less protein.

    It promotes muscle growth and keeps you feeling full for a longer amount of time. MFP is great as a guide but for anyone working out you really can't get enough protein. Like others I shoot for 200+ grams a day and maybe more if I had a really hard workout.

    I do a lot of treadmill work. Not lifting yet.
  • d2footballJRC
    d2footballJRC Posts: 2,684 Member
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    Actually, yes, you can get too much protein. Your kidneys have to clear the byproducts of protein breakdown. When you eat too much protein, you make your kidneys work harder and push the toward dysfunction. Here's an article about what you are talking about:

    By Miriam Nelson
    WebMD Feature

    Reviewed By Gary Vogin

    Seems like everyone at the gym is doing it: filling up on protein to bulk up those biceps. But it's a misconception. Eating extra protein actually doesn't do much toward boosting your muscle mass and strength.

    In fact, medical research shows that consuming too much protein -- more than 30% of your total daily caloric intake -- could actually harm your body, says protein expert Gail Butterfield, PhD, RD, director of Nutrition Studies at the Palo Alto Veterans' Administration Medical Center and nutrition lecturer at Stanford University.

    She says that a diet containing excess protein can have the following adverse effects:

    Adding more protein but not more calories or exercise to your diet won't help you build more muscle mass, but it may put your other bodily systems under stress.
    Eating more protein and increasing total caloric intake while maintaining the same exercise level will build an equal amount of additional fat and muscle mass, according to a study published in 1992 in the Journal of the American Geriatrics Society.
    Too Much Protein
    So think twice when you consider sacrificing the carbohydrates for a protein-dominant diet, Butterfield says. Drastically cutting carbohydrates from your diet may force your body to fight back.

    She says that's because a diet in which protein makes up more than 30% of your caloric intake causes a buildup of toxic ketones. So-called ketogenic diets can thrust your kidneys into overdrive in order to flush these ketones from your body. As your kidneys rid your body of these toxic ketones, you can lose a significant amount of water, which puts you at risk of dehydration, particularly if you exercise heavily.

    That water loss often shows up on the scale as weight loss. But along with losing water, you lose muscle mass and bone calcium. The dehydration also strains your kidneys and puts stress on your heart.

    And dehydration from a ketogenic diet can make you feel weak and dizzy, give you bad breath, or lead to other problems.

    How Much Protein Do I Need?
    The amount of protein you require depends on your weight and your daily caloric intake. Most Americans consume more than enough protein in their daily diets. A few specific groups of people are at risk for being protein-deficient, including elderly women and people with illnesses or eating disorders. A protein deficiency is defined as eating 50% to 75% of the recommended amount of daily protein, Butterfield explains.

    Ideally, you should consume 0.36 grams of protein for every pound of body weight, according to recommended daily allowances (RDA) set by the Food and Nutrition Board. So if you weigh 170 pounds, you need about 61 grams of protein each day.

    Protein should also make up approximately 15% of your total daily caloric intake, also according to the RDA. In a diet of 1,800 calories a day, for example, about 270 of those calories should come from protein.

    It's Essential
    Although limiting protein intake is important, you should also realize that protein is essential to our bodies' normal functions. It assists in synthesizing enzymes and hormones, maintaining fluid balance, and regulating such vital functions as building antibodies against infection, blood clotting, and scar formation.

    Protein is also a building block for our muscles, bones, cartilage, skin, hair, and blood. Protein-rich foods include meat, cheese, milk, fish, and eggs. For vegetarians, protein can be found in soy products such as tofu as well as in combinations of foods, such as rice or corn with beans.

    Whether you are an avid strength trainer, a marathon runner, or just an average exerciser, a balanced diet that is rich in fruits, vegetables, whole grains, lean meats, fish, and complex carbohydrates is what nutritionists recommend.

    The article as some major major flaws and shocked its on webmd. #1 Keto won't happen period unless you are cutting carbs down low low. Next Keto is not as dangerous as much as you have a period of your body adjusting. Keto has been used to stop those with seizures and kids with autism.

    Next protein keeps you feeling fuller and there is countless articles about the benefits of protein for recovery.

    Add in that protein is broken into amino acids then extra aminos are turned into urea then excreted. First though your muscles will absorb all the aminos and glucose it can.

    Article is not an overall good article compared, the Keto mess up kills it for me.
  • d2footballJRC
    d2footballJRC Posts: 2,684 Member
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    There is no such thing as too much protein. 90% of people don't get nearly enough.

    Actually, most people eat way too much. As long as your kidneys are good and you hydrate properly, eating too much protein isn't a problem, but the human body really doesn't need nearly as much protein as a lot of people on here claim.

    All your body does is take all that extra protein and convert it to glucose.

    I smell tigerblood!

    It's one of this things. People make such a big deal about macro ratios, but to be totally honest, unless you have a specific medical condition, it's not that important. Your body can manufacture protein out of carbohydrates, it can manufacture carbohydrates out of protein, and it manufacture fats as well. So regardless of whatever ratio you insist on eating, your body reengineers it to whatever it happens to need, no matter what you eat. Now yes, there are essential amino acids and essential fatty acids that the body can't manufacture and you have to get through food, but those make up less than 50% of the amino and fatty acids your body uses. You can eat minimal protein, and as long as you get the right amounts of essentials, your body will manufacture all the protein it needs to support your muscle tissue, as long as you fuel it with enough total calories to do it.

    Also, if you're trying to lose weight and eating tons of protein at the expense of carbs, then your body will be using gluconeogenesis to convert the extra protein to glucose to make up for the lack of carbs. The downside to that is the liver can only do one thing efficiently at a time, if it's doing gluconeogenesis, it's not burning fat, which kinda sabotages the whole idea, doesn't it?

    Stop talking....as soon as you said carbs turn into protein you just discredited yourself.

    Add in carbs are a quick energy source and the first burnt, also the easiest for your body to digest. Protein takes longer to break down and has been shown to burn more calories digesting the protein.

    Carbs are great for quick energy. In fact they are the best pre work out you can get. Some quick oats about 45 mi utes before you workout for awesome energy that destroys most pre workouts on the market.
  • mcshaw10
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    I agree that the default protein on MFP is too low. You can go to goals and change your macro nutrient percentages if you like. Mine is set to 40% carbs, 30% protein, and 30% fat.

    My nutritionist referred me to the following article. Read and educate yourself and see what you think. This is a great article:
    :)
    http://www.precisionnutrition.com/protein-limit
  • notsureifsrs
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    There is no such thing as too much protein. 90% of people don't get nearly enough.

    Actually, most people eat way too much. As long as your kidneys are good and you hydrate properly, eating too much protein isn't a problem, but the human body really doesn't need nearly as much protein as a lot of people on here claim.

    All your body does is take all that extra protein and convert it to glucose.

    I smell tigerblood!

    It's one of this things. People make such a big deal about macro ratios, but to be totally honest, unless you have a specific medical condition, it's not that important. Your body can manufacture protein out of carbohydrates, it can manufacture carbohydrates out of protein, and it manufacture fats as well. So regardless of whatever ratio you insist on eating, your body reengineers it to whatever it happens to need, no matter what you eat. Now yes, there are essential amino acids and essential fatty acids that the body can't manufacture and you have to get through food, but those make up less than 50% of the amino and fatty acids your body uses. You can eat minimal protein, and as long as you get the right amounts of essentials, your body will manufacture all the protein it needs to support your muscle tissue, as long as you fuel it with enough total calories to do it.

    Also, if you're trying to lose weight and eating tons of protein at the expense of carbs, then your body will be using gluconeogenesis to convert the extra protein to glucose to make up for the lack of carbs. The downside to that is the liver can only do one thing efficiently at a time, if it's doing gluconeogenesis, it's not burning fat, which kinda sabotages the whole idea, doesn't it?

    I hope no one actually listens to this retard.
  • notsureifsrs
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    The rules I follow are no more then 30 g of protein ia sitting your body doesn't absorb more then that...

    Where do you people read this nonsense? rofl.
  • pg3ibew
    pg3ibew Posts: 1,026 Member
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    There is no such thing as too much protein. 90% of people don't get nearly enough.

    Actually, most people eat way too much. As long as your kidneys are good and you hydrate properly, eating too much protein isn't a problem, but the human body really doesn't need nearly as much protein as a lot of people on here claim.

    All your body does is take all that extra protein and convert it to glucose.

    I smell tigerblood!

    It's one of this things. People make such a big deal about macro ratios, but to be totally honest, unless you have a specific medical condition, it's not that important. Your body can manufacture protein out of carbohydrates, it can manufacture carbohydrates out of protein, and it manufacture fats as well. So regardless of whatever ratio you insist on eating, your body reengineers it to whatever it happens to need, no matter what you eat. Now yes, there are essential amino acids and essential fatty acids that the body can't manufacture and you have to get through food, but those make up less than 50% of the amino and fatty acids your body uses. You can eat minimal protein, and as long as you get the right amounts of essentials, your body will manufacture all the protein it needs to support your muscle tissue, as long as you fuel it with enough total calories to do it.

    Also, if you're trying to lose weight and eating tons of protein at the expense of carbs, then your body will be using gluconeogenesis to convert the extra protein to glucose to make up for the lack of carbs. The downside to that is the liver can only do one thing efficiently at a time, if it's doing gluconeogenesis, it's not burning fat, which kinda sabotages the whole idea, doesn't it?

    I hope no one actually listens to this retard.

    Retard seems a bit harsh. He did capitalize and use commas and periods and some pretty big words.
  • JacksMom12
    JacksMom12 Posts: 1,044 Member
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    I ate about 200 grams today. I quadruple (at least) the "recommended" amount every day. My muscles are happy.

    Just read through all the posts. Didnt realize there was a broscience convention going on. My bad.
  • notsureifsrs
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    Retard seems a bit harsh. He did capitalize and use commas and periods and some pretty big words.

    True.

    The run-on sentences revert my opinion back to what it was though.
  • pg3ibew
    pg3ibew Posts: 1,026 Member
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    I thank everyone for all opinions. We are all here to help each other to obtain the same goals.
  • badgerbadger1
    badgerbadger1 Posts: 954 Member
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    OH MY GAWD!!! I will have to call our world class burn doc and tell him to stop ordering high protein diets for all our severe burn patients. Their kidneys are already at risk, surely all that protein will put them into failure!!!

    Oh wait.......
  • notsureifsrs
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    Here's the most retard-proof/basic guide to follow:

    Don't put macros into your body that it doesn't need.

    Your body does not need 200+ grams of carbs to function properly unless you're a runner or exerting your energy other ways.
  • notsureifsrs
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    OH MY GAWD!!! I will have to call our world class burn doc and tell him to stop ordering high protein diets for all our severe burn patients. Their kidneys are already at risk, surely all that protein will put them into failure!!!

    Oh wait.......

    Lol. This ^

    The truth is, while our body will learn to utilize what it's being fed to sustain itself, it will never turn a protein into a carb... That's just idiotic.

    Your body's last source of energy is muscular catabolism.

    That would mean that your body is 100% carb depleted, glycogen stores are depleted and you're performing such an intense calorie burning activity that your body fat is not enough to keep going.
  • tigersword
    tigersword Posts: 8,059 Member
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    OH MY GAWD!!! I will have to call our world class burn doc and tell him to stop ordering high protein diets for all our severe burn patients. Their kidneys are already at risk, surely all that protein will put them into failure!!!

    Oh wait.......

    Lol. This ^

    The truth is, while our body will learn to utilize what it's being fed to sustain itself, it will never turn a protein into a carb... That's just idiotic.

    Your body's last source of energy is muscular catabolism.

    That would mean that your body is 100% carb depleted, glycogen stores are depleted and you're performing such an intense calorie burning activity that your body fat is not enough to keep going.

    It doesn't? So you're saying the gluconeogenesis metabolic pathway either doesn't exist or doesn't actually do anything? Gluconeogenesis, you know, the metabolic process of converting protein into glucose? Glucose, you know, a carb?
  • CharityEaton
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    here's an idea.....eat everything in moderation.....if you are treadmilling it alot and you get sore muscles...you need a bit more protein. By sore muscles I mean...yes, you are a bit tender after your workout but not in horrible pain. You go to bed and get up the next day still feeling sore...as in you are sore when you stand and sit.....you need more protein. Yes, a good workout will leave you a bit sore but if you are eating properly you should feel recovered by the next time you workout again if you are sticking to the same workout routine...such as 45 min. on the treadmill every day. NOW if you go from the treadmill to a different type of workout YES, you might be sore a bit more after the fact but this is the plan that I go by. If I start getting shin splints after running I look over my dairy and can usually see where I have dropped a bit in my protein. It helps. I promise...but I'm no expert I just listen to my body and give it what it needs. Carbs, protein whatever! Just eat and exercise that's all! It really is THAT simple! Everyone has their own opinion but you gotta figure out what your own body needs. So take all these opinions into consideration and tweek them to meet your needs.
    Good Luck!
  • d2footballJRC
    d2footballJRC Posts: 2,684 Member
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    OH MY GAWD!!! I will have to call our world class burn doc and tell him to stop ordering high protein diets for all our severe burn patients. Their kidneys are already at risk, surely all that protein will put them into failure!!!

    Oh wait.......

    Lol. This ^

    The truth is, while our body will learn to utilize what it's being fed to sustain itself, it will never turn a protein into a carb... That's just idiotic.

    Your body's last source of energy is muscular catabolism.

    That would mean that your body is 100% carb depleted, glycogen stores are depleted and you're performing such an intense calorie burning activity that your body fat is not enough to keep going.

    It doesn't? So you're saying the gluconeogenesis metabolic pathway either doesn't exist or doesn't actually do anything? Gluconeogenesis, you know, the metabolic process of converting protein into glucose? Glucose, you know, a carb?

    You still aren't getting the benefits of protien from the transformation, A carb isn't a protein and vice versa. The existence of glyoxylate cycles in humans has not been established, and it is widely held that fatty acids cannot be converted to glucose in humans directly. Fats are out of the question and with Protein In humans, gluconeogenesis is restricted to the liver and to a lesser extent the kidney. Which means that the food has been digested and is tracking out of your body by the time gluconeogenesis takes place.

    In the end a carb will never be a protein, they can both provide an energy form, yet they are very different. If gluconeogenesis was efficient, things like keto diet would not be possible.
  • tigersword
    tigersword Posts: 8,059 Member
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    What does digestion have to do with the body being able to make amino acids out of carbohydrates and fats? All I'm saying is most people eat far more protein than they need. As for protein advantages, what are they? Insulin response? Proteins can be just as insulogenic, and in some cases even more insulogenic than carbohydrates. Thermogenic effect? Irrelevant, as the energy used to digest food is diverted from other sources, there is no actual calorie burning benefit to it. The only real advantage I can think of is getting your essential amino acids, but that's a necessity, not an advantage.
  • becoming_a_new_me
    becoming_a_new_me Posts: 1,860 Member
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    This is one of the most highly debated topics. I created a blog entry to dispel some of the myths and opinions on this topic

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/blog/iddreams/view/the-truth-and-facts-about-protein-197731
  • pg3ibew
    pg3ibew Posts: 1,026 Member
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    Thanks for all the tips kids.
  • Helloitsdan
    Helloitsdan Posts: 5,564 Member
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    It's one of this things. People make such a big deal about macro ratios, but to be totally honest, unless you have a specific medical condition, it's not that important. Your body can manufacture protein out of carbohydrates, it can manufacture carbohydrates out of protein, and it manufacture fats as well. So regardless of whatever ratio you insist on eating, your body reengineers it to whatever it happens to need, no matter what you eat. Now yes, there are essential amino acids and essential fatty acids that the body can't manufacture and you have to get through food, but those make up less than 50% of the amino and fatty acids your body uses. You can eat minimal protein, and as long as you get the right amounts of essentials, your body will manufacture all the protein it needs to support your muscle tissue, as long as you fuel it with enough total calories to do it.

    Also, if you're trying to lose weight and eating tons of protein at the expense of carbs, then your body will be using gluconeogenesis to convert the extra protein to glucose to make up for the lack of carbs. The downside to that is the liver can only do one thing efficiently at a time, if it's doing gluconeogenesis, it's not burning fat, which kinda sabotages the whole idea, doesn't it?

    A recent study compared 4 different diets and the effects of macronutrients on weight loss.
    Seems that you get the same amount of loss from 15% protein macro as 25%.
    I prefer protein and even upped mine for the time being.
    Heres the article....
    http://www.ajcn.org/content/early/2012/01/17/ajcn.111.026328.abstract