No wonder our kids grow up to make bad food choices...
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So..
My children have LEARNED healthy food choices - at home. We ARE under the poverty line and my 3rd grader has to get the school breakfast and lunches. I cannot afford to pack him a lunch evey day even though he asks for it.
Some other details: children are not permitted access to microwaves, stoves or refridgerators which makes it very limited as to what they can take (at his school).
He HATES the school food. Hates it. He's a little foodie that love home cooked, fresh meals; he loves his veggies but isn't so big on fruit. I'm sure they have fruit but since he doesn't like it, he won't choose it. He *would* choose raw carrots, broccoli or other vegetables - cooked or raw IF they were cooked properly. Which they are not. They're overcooked, overprocessed and even the salads tend to taste like rubber.
The school I work at has portions that are too small for adolescents and either over cooked, undercooked or so friggin' processed it no longer resembles food. As this is a special school, many of the kids either a) are not capable of staying out of the food on the bus ride in and won't have a lunch at all because they'll eat it before hand; b) don't live with family and instead, live in homes or shelters where they're lucky to get a clean bed or clothes, much less food; c) parents are super broke due to medical expenses and I could go on. Some kids are texture sensitive and will NOT eat certain things, and on and on it goes.
Is it the parents responsibility? Well.. yes. At least, it should be. There are alot of illiterate adults; especially with the way we push students through the school system without actually having to learn much. Doesn't prevent those adults from bearing and raising children... doesn't mean that they are capable of teaching much of anything, let alone nutritional information. They buy what they think they can afford, probably don't have any idea how to cook a healthy meal much less shop on a budget and on and on that goes.
It is also the community at large's responsibility. Not everyone has the individual capacity to teach various aspects of life. Lessons, of every kind, needs to be a joint effort between everyone involved in raising that child. Which means, we need to find ways to encourage schools and contractors to provide the nutritional options and not just the facts. That's part of the hypocrisy in education. We can TEACH health, but there's not much option to provide healthy variety in the cafeterias.
I don't LIKE making my son eat the school food; I do what I can at home in the evenings and on weekends. But it's honestly not enough. He often comes home ravenous either because what there was wasn't enough or it was something so gross he refused to eat it. And this is a kid that LIKES veggies and healthy options.
As other have stated, it's not a simple or black and white issue; and it's not an easy fix.0 -
So..
My children have LEARNED healthy food choices - at home. We ARE under the poverty line and my 3rd grader has to get the school breakfast and lunches. I cannot afford to pack him a lunch evey day even though he asks for it.
Some other details: children are not permitted access to microwaves, stoves or refridgerators which makes it very limited as to what they can take (at his school).
He HATES the school food. Hates it. He's a little foodie that love home cooked, fresh meals; he loves his veggies but isn't so big on fruit. I'm sure they have fruit but since he doesn't like it, he won't choose it. He *would* choose raw carrots, broccoli or other vegetables - cooked or raw IF they were cooked properly. Which they are not. They're overcooked, overprocessed and even the salads tend to taste like rubber.
The school I work at has portions that are too small for adolescents and either over cooked, undercooked or so friggin' processed it no longer resembles food. As this is a special school, many of the kids either a) are not capable of staying out of the food on the bus ride in and won't have a lunch at all because they'll eat it before hand; b) don't live with family and instead, live in homes or shelters where they're lucky to get a clean bed or clothes, much less food; c) parents are super broke due to medical expenses and I could go on. Some kids are texture sensitive and will NOT eat certain things, and on and on it goes.
Is it the parents responsibility? Well.. yes. At least, it should be. There are alot of illiterate adults; especially with the way we push students through the school system without actually having to learn much. Doesn't prevent those adults from bearing and raising children... doesn't mean that they are capable of teaching much of anything, let alone nutritional information. They buy what they think they can afford, probably don't have any idea how to cook a healthy meal much less shop on a budget and on and on that goes.
It is also the community at large's responsibility. Not everyone has the individual capacity to teach various aspects of life. Lessons, of every kind, needs to be a joint effort between everyone involved in raising that child. Which means, we need to find ways to encourage schools and contractors to provide the nutritional options and not just the facts. That's part of the hypocrisy in education. We can TEACH health, but there's not much option to provide healthy variety in the cafeterias.
I don't LIKE making my son eat the school food; I do what I can at home in the evenings and on weekends. But it's honestly not enough. He often comes home ravenous either because what there was wasn't enough or it was something so gross he refused to eat it. And this is a kid that LIKES veggies and healthy options.
As other have stated, it's not a simple or black and white issue; and it's not an easy fix.
Wonderfully said!0 -
So..
My children have LEARNED healthy food choices - at home. We ARE under the poverty line and my 3rd grader has to get the school breakfast and lunches. I cannot afford to pack him a lunch evey day even though he asks for it.
Some other details: children are not permitted access to microwaves, stoves or refridgerators which makes it very limited as to what they can take (at his school).
He HATES the school food. Hates it. He's a little foodie that love home cooked, fresh meals; he loves his veggies but isn't so big on fruit. I'm sure they have fruit but since he doesn't like it, he won't choose it. He *would* choose raw carrots, broccoli or other vegetables - cooked or raw IF they were cooked properly. Which they are not. They're overcooked, overprocessed and even the salads tend to taste like rubber.
The school I work at has portions that are too small for adolescents and either over cooked, undercooked or so friggin' processed it no longer resembles food. As this is a special school, many of the kids either a) are not capable of staying out of the food on the bus ride in and won't have a lunch at all because they'll eat it before hand; b) don't live with family and instead, live in homes or shelters where they're lucky to get a clean bed or clothes, much less food; c) parents are super broke due to medical expenses and I could go on. Some kids are texture sensitive and will NOT eat certain things, and on and on it goes.
Is it the parents responsibility? Well.. yes. At least, it should be. There are alot of illiterate adults; especially with the way we push students through the school system without actually having to learn much. Doesn't prevent those adults from bearing and raising children... doesn't mean that they are capable of teaching much of anything, let alone nutritional information. They buy what they think they can afford, probably don't have any idea how to cook a healthy meal much less shop on a budget and on and on that goes.
It is also the community at large's responsibility. Not everyone has the individual capacity to teach various aspects of life. Lessons, of every kind, needs to be a joint effort between everyone involved in raising that child. Which means, we need to find ways to encourage schools and contractors to provide the nutritional options and not just the facts. That's part of the hypocrisy in education. We can TEACH health, but there's not much option to provide healthy variety in the cafeterias.
I don't LIKE making my son eat the school food; I do what I can at home in the evenings and on weekends. But it's honestly not enough. He often comes home ravenous either because what there was wasn't enough or it was something so gross he refused to eat it. And this is a kid that LIKES veggies and healthy options.
As other have stated, it's not a simple or black and white issue; and it's not an easy fix.
And when you shared your concerns with your school district's food and nutrition director, what was his/her response?0 -
I know this isn't true everywhere, but where I live, many of the so-called low income parents who are relying on the schools to feed their kids are driving newer cars, have at least one iPhone, cable TV, an XBox, etc. Some parents put their own needs first and leave the kids to fend for themselves. It really grinds my gears........0
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So what's the solution?
Policing? Saving others from making bad choices?
If you're going to complain about something shouldn't you be able to provide solutions?
Just *****ing isn't helping anyone.
The solution is the same as the problem. The federal government sets the food guidelines and distributes the funding for the lunch program. If the federal government sets healthy guidelines and a budget to go with it the problem is solved.
But, good luck trying to get that pack of idiots to agree on anything that is worthwhile and actually beneficial to the American public.0 -
:noway: :noway: :noway: :noway: :noway: :noway: :noway: :noway:0
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Bump this so I can find it later and read when kids are in bed0
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So..
My children have LEARNED healthy food choices - at home. We ARE under the poverty line and my 3rd grader has to get the school breakfast and lunches. I cannot afford to pack him a lunch evey day even though he asks for it.
Some other details: children are not permitted access to microwaves, stoves or refridgerators which makes it very limited as to what they can take (at his school).
He HATES the school food. Hates it. He's a little foodie that love home cooked, fresh meals; he loves his veggies but isn't so big on fruit. I'm sure they have fruit but since he doesn't like it, he won't choose it. He *would* choose raw carrots, broccoli or other vegetables - cooked or raw IF they were cooked properly. Which they are not. They're overcooked, overprocessed and even the salads tend to taste like rubber.
The school I work at has portions that are too small for adolescents and either over cooked, undercooked or so friggin' processed it no longer resembles food. As this is a special school, many of the kids either a) are not capable of staying out of the food on the bus ride in and won't have a lunch at all because they'll eat it before hand; b) don't live with family and instead, live in homes or shelters where they're lucky to get a clean bed or clothes, much less food; c) parents are super broke due to medical expenses and I could go on. Some kids are texture sensitive and will NOT eat certain things, and on and on it goes.
Is it the parents responsibility? Well.. yes. At least, it should be. There are alot of illiterate adults; especially with the way we push students through the school system without actually having to learn much. Doesn't prevent those adults from bearing and raising children... doesn't mean that they are capable of teaching much of anything, let alone nutritional information. They buy what they think they can afford, probably don't have any idea how to cook a healthy meal much less shop on a budget and on and on that goes.
It is also the community at large's responsibility. Not everyone has the individual capacity to teach various aspects of life. Lessons, of every kind, needs to be a joint effort between everyone involved in raising that child. Which means, we need to find ways to encourage schools and contractors to provide the nutritional options and not just the facts. That's part of the hypocrisy in education. We can TEACH health, but there's not much option to provide healthy variety in the cafeterias.
I don't LIKE making my son eat the school food; I do what I can at home in the evenings and on weekends. But it's honestly not enough. He often comes home ravenous either because what there was wasn't enough or it was something so gross he refused to eat it. And this is a kid that LIKES veggies and healthy options.
As other have stated, it's not a simple or black and white issue; and it's not an easy fix.
And when you shared your concerns with your school district's food and nutrition director, what was his/her response?
sjtreely:
What food & nutrition director? Most districts go with the lowest bidder that is approved by and funded via state & federal monies. Usually private/independent schools and similar ones that do not have to rely so much on tax dollars and govt funding incorporate such positions. I am well aware of how schools are funded, what the legal food requirements are, who they are and are not allowed to contract with and that such laws and policies vary state by state in addition to district by district. None of our local districts have a "food and nutrition director". They don't have the funds for such a position. They have budget allocations, a list of contractors that they're allowed to use per the district agreements with various unions, and anything outside of those contracts must be approved at numerous levels before they can be utilized. Food service companies are often one of those contracts.
I'm not sure what kind of district your in but just by your question, I would probably guess a much wealthier one than mine. Which is great for those in your district. I wish we had people on staff who's focus was on nutrition in that capacity. This conversation wouldnt' be necessary, I should think. There would be someONE to go to.
Many people do not understand the complexity of the business-end of school operations and by just screaming loudly enough, we'll get things to change. It doesn't work that way. There are contracts involved - binding documents holding both parties to a particular set of agreements. Often, one of those agreements with food service companies DISALLOWS the use of fresh produce from another source, including school gardens. Why? Because those big companies have contracts with corporate funded food producers and to use outside sources is breaching THAT contract.
Now, with the state of our schools and funding - do you want YOUR school or district sued for multi-millions of dollars for breach of contract? I certainly don't.
So, let's say a school decides NOT to contract with a food service organization and instead decides to try to taking on feeding of .. hmm... there's almost a 1,000 kids in my son's school... that school will then spend at LEAST quadruple the funds to feed each child that it spends right now, reducing its ability to provide what I consider a relatively decent educational environment otherwise. Think the govt will subsidize those decisions? Hmm.. let's see... no contracting with a food service company which contracts with food producers who have a contract with corporations who, guess what? Make huge election donations, may share some of the same unions, has some sort of other tie-in... yeah, unlikely that those same food funds being used for those big companies are going to go to an in-house program. Then there's dealing with all the other regulatory agencies that have already approved those bigger companies - like the FDA.
You all seem to think this is a simple and local matter that you can just yell at and complain to someone and have it change. It doesn't work that way. As much as we'd like to think of schools as being JUST an educational program, it also has fiscal and legal responsibilities that it HAS TO adhere to. Schools and districts DO have a business component that many of us would rather pretend doesn't exist and to believe that's it all oriented in the local context of our neighborhood school. Well, it's not. Not anymore and hasnt' been for a long time.
Before you try to change anything in a school, you have to understand how many layers there are to get through before such changes can be addressed. It's frustrating and disheartening at times but even more than that, extraordinarily complex. If people want to change what's on their school menu, it's not even the school building you start with. It's the district office. The terms of the contract may or may not be of public record. You can request them and find out (this aspect, I honestly don't know). Then, you have to look at your district budget and then what's allocated to the school in question under that funding category. After that, you can cross reference the State and Federal guidelines for nutritional & cost requirements. Once all that is done, you might be able to independently draw up another budget proposal for a different idea that better suits your ideals. i skipped some steps, but if you've followed along thusfar, I'm sure you can figure out the rest. If not, then drop it just because it's even more complicated the simplistic formula I've provided.
Are you all getting this? I mean seriously.....
It really irks me when people who are doing the best they can - from BOTH ends - with what they have continually get bashed. Believe me, 90% of BUILDING Administrators would LOVE-LOVE-LOVE to put better quality food on your kids lunch trays. And, it's not their call. They dont' get to make that decision. So go ahead.. go yell at the person who already has a million complaints about what they can't change but wish they could. Go ahead and make that poor principal's shoulders a little heavier with your cries of woe. Go ahead and blame the parent that's working 2 jobs, 15 hours a day and still comes home to cook a decent meal and can't pack a lunch and add another straw to their back. Go on out there and judge with your misinformation, lack of knowledge, comprehension and understanding - not to mention compassion - for both sides and generalize away.
KKK is still alive and flourishing too. Sweeping generalizations carry alot of weight and frankly... they piss me off.
Peace out.0 -
As much as I hate school lunches and my daughter is picky so I pack for her, many students in Americas public schools don't get much food at home so the school meals might be their best nutrition overall. Many get free and reduced lunch and many students wouldn't pick healthier stuff if given the opportunity.
My daughter's school allows me to fill her lunch account with money and even specify what to use it for.not sure how it is across the country.0 -
What I really don't get about this topic is that so many people are saying that the school lunch is the only thing the kid gets to eat all day. Umm I don't think I've met other kids at that age that didn't have dinner or at least breakfast sometimes. I don't live in third world country. Yes, I understand a lot of people are poor but I don't really think most families let their kids go without dinner. So no, I don't think the crappy lunches kids get served at schools are the only things they eat every day. When I was in elementary school, I barely ever ate the school's lunches even when I didn't have a lunch packed because what they served was disgusting and unhealthy anyway. I mean they served hot dogs that were PINK! And a bunch of other gross stuff such as nasty *kitten* school pizza and chicken patties that tasted like garbage. At least in high school they had salad type stuff but the food was still gross.0
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Have you seen the news? 1 in 6 Americans go hungry. Yes, some kids only have lunch as their only meal "sometimes". Seriously 1 in 6!!! Are you kidding me? You think its not "that bad"?
The whole "Umm, I don't think I've ever met other kids at that age that didn't have dinner or at least breakfast sometimes" comment got to me. Do you think they are going to admit that? Sometimes is not enough...they should be having 3 meals everyday. It sounds like your downplaying it like, "hey, they sometimes get it, whats the big deal"?
Its so great that you had the choice to not eat your lunch. Lucky you. I would love you to tell that to the little girl or boy that doesn't have one. Next time you respond, maybe you should fact checking about the poverty in America before you give an opinion. Here is a website so you can start.
http://feedingamerica.org/hunger-in-america/hunger-facts.aspx0 -
sigh. There's no win in threads like this. No solutions. Bad thread.
Why are all these people having children they can't provide for anyway? Won't provide for? Priorities?0 -
Lect Im not downplaying anything. Im stating my opinions and I've heard about plenty of cases of child abuse where the children were malnourished. There really is no winning on topics like this because so many people are offended. What I meant by talking about third world countries is the fact that it's common sense that those countries are full of poverty and people who die of starvation. I don't need to post research about something that is common sense. Research isn't always the answer to things people have known of years. Jeez......
Oh yeah and if you're so offended but what I said, why even comment back? You could just ignore it and move on.0 -
Stand for something or you'll fall for anything.0
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sigh. There's no win in threads like this. No solutions. Bad thread.
Why are all these people having children they can't provide for anyway? Won't provide for? Priorities?
There ARE solutions - they just aren't easy ones nor straightforward. It's not a "bad" thread; it's an important one that needs all kinds of ideas tossed out. Statements like that really summarize the whole of the problems we face. "Just give up... there's no point - no hope"....
Clearly, there's much that you don't understand about life. Things happen. Life happens; whether we're ready or not. This is a silly question; about as silly as "Why did the chicken cross the road?". Every person, every situation, every culture/sub-culture is unique and to try to generalize in this kind of context is, frankly, ridiculous.
Why was that baby killed? Why was that child starved? Why was that woman raped? Why was that man killed? Why was that dog beaten? Why did that person win the lottery instead of this person? Why did he win and the other guy lose? Why did she get that job instead of her?
The human condition cannot be summarized so simplistically. Very little can be.0 -
sigh. There's no win in threads like this. No solutions. Bad thread.
Why are all these people having children they can't provide for anyway? Won't provide for? Priorities?
There ARE solutions - they just aren't easy ones nor straightforward. It's not a "bad" thread; it's an important one that needs all kinds of ideas tossed out. Statements like that really summarize the whole of the problems we face. "Just give up... there's no point - no hope"....
Clearly, there's much that you don't understand about life. Things happen. Life happens; whether we're ready or not. This is a silly question; about as silly as "Why did the chicken cross the road?". Every person, every situation, every culture/sub-culture is unique and to try to generalize in this kind of context is, frankly, ridiculous.
Why was that baby killed? Why was that child starved? Why was that woman raped? Why was that man killed? Why was that dog beaten? Why did that person win the lottery instead of this person? Why did he win and the other guy lose? Why did she get that job instead of her?
The human condition cannot be summarized so simplistically. Very little can be.
Fair. I was actually responding to someone else that replied after my previous post, my fault for not quoting/replying correctly. I'd love to hear solutions.So what's the solution?
Policing? Saving others from making bad choices?
If you're going to complain about something shouldn't you be able to provide solutions?
Just *****ing isn't helping anyone.0 -
What I really don't get about this topic is that so many people are saying that the school lunch is the only thing the kid gets to eat all day. Umm I don't think I've met other kids at that age that didn't have dinner or at least breakfast sometimes. I don't live in third world country. Yes, I understand a lot of people are poor but I don't really think most families let their kids go without dinner. So no, I don't think the crappy lunches kids get served at schools are the only things they eat every day. When I was in elementary school, I barely ever ate the school's lunches even when I didn't have a lunch packed because what they served was disgusting and unhealthy anyway. I mean they served hot dogs that were PINK! And a bunch of other gross stuff such as nasty *kitten* school pizza and chicken patties that tasted like garbage. At least in high school they had salad type stuff but the food was still gross.
I work with special needs kids who will eat of the trash at school because it's the only place they get fed and sometimes, clothed. I see it first hand and up close every day.
Last year, a boy died because he parents denied him food and water as a form of punishment.
You probably met them and just didn't know it. Kids that poor don't advertise it. They grow up fast, learn to keep their business to themselves and do what they have to - including eating crappy school food in order to get to the next day. It's called survival. Fortunately, most people here probably never had to deal with life in that context. I know there's some but not most. Consider yourselves fortunate, but don't ever assume you know something about a person's life without having lived in their world for quite some time on a 24/7 basis. You don't know people's secrets just by looking at them and extreme poverty is a pretty well kept secret.
But the subject was originally about obesity and the issues around that is also related to a lesser degree of poverty; much of which revolves around generations of ignorance, bad habits being passed from parent to child and as there's a high chance that those folks are living in communities where such habits are the "norm" in their world, there's no opportunity to learn something different, experience an alternative and in fact, may be resistent to change because change that big is a culture shock for them and a painful experience as it brings to light all those years of ignorance. No one wants their lack of knowledge spotlighted like that and many do not have the emotional or psychological endurance to deal with something that big. They have to change their entire way of life....
I'm amazed that so many folks are so unaware of the people around them; the reality of harshness that others have to endure.
A tune:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OImcilEpbDc 0 -
My High school took out all the yummy food from the vending machines and put in baked foods and dried food. They also replaced sodas with water and lemonade. On top of that they made a rule to where we couldn't visit the vending machine until certain times of the day.
For the first week people came to school with backpacks full of Little Debbie snacks and 20 oz sodas lol. Someone made a comment saying "This feels like we're in fat camp".
But our lunches aren't that bad. They even gave us a choice: each what they prepare (full meals) and go stand in line for 15-20mins in the "junk food" line where they served chicken fingers and nachos.
So really you can't blame the schools for making children eat "wrongly". Everything starts at home. If you as a parent can't teach your children to make right choices then you can't blame the school for not teaching them.0 -
sigh. There's no win in threads like this. No solutions. Bad thread.
Why are all these people having children they can't provide for anyway? Won't provide for? Priorities?
There ARE solutions - they just aren't easy ones nor straightforward. It's not a "bad" thread; it's an important one that needs all kinds of ideas tossed out. Statements like that really summarize the whole of the problems we face. "Just give up... there's no point - no hope"....
Clearly, there's much that you don't understand about life. Things happen. Life happens; whether we're ready or not. This is a silly question; about as silly as "Why did the chicken cross the road?". Every person, every situation, every culture/sub-culture is unique and to try to generalize in this kind of context is, frankly, ridiculous.
Why was that baby killed? Why was that child starved? Why was that woman raped? Why was that man killed? Why was that dog beaten? Why did that person win the lottery instead of this person? Why did he win and the other guy lose? Why did she get that job instead of her?
The human condition cannot be summarized so simplistically. Very little can be.
Fair. I was actually responding to someone else that replied after my previous post, my fault for not quoting/replying correctly. I'd love to hear solutions.So what's the solution?
Policing? Saving others from making bad choices?
If you're going to complain about something shouldn't you be able to provide solutions?
Just *****ing isn't helping anyone.
The solutions start with us becoming more aware and involved in our LOCAL policies and politics. Get involved with the school boards, volunteer at the schools, look for grant programs that can provide alternatives that will NOT conflict with those contracts (some segment of the Fed. - military I think - has a fresh fruit program that provides fruit to the ENTIRE school; not the cafeteria - I'd have to look for it to get details), get a food pantry started for the school for kids who aren't getting enough of a balanced diet, encourage school to bring back "home ec" (different districts call it by different names now, but we all know what it means!), encourage community gardens - although the cafeteria can't use the produce, other classrooms can. Volunteer in your local elementary school, particularly if you're coming from a different cultural background adn offer culture-related lessons for a couple of days which includes sampling of culture-specific foods (this one can be hard because of all the food sensitivities now, but I'm sure each district provides different opportunities for something along these lines). There's LOTS of ways to help children and families learn without putting so much pressure on the administrators or parents, individually. Just attacking people is not an answer to anything and we have to collectively think outside the box. Traditional protests will not work on the complex school environment anymore.
How's that for a start?
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It is a combination of a lot of things that bring children to make bad food choices, it is not only the schools fault as these are public institutions that are run by tax dollars, or the parents that work full time and may not have all the time in the world, or any other one thing. The world is full of cop outs for why things like obesity happen and there is no one answer. I prefer to not pass the buck but it is still a multi faceted issue nonetheless.0
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