Calories in vs calories out.....is it that simple?

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  • LemonDiva
    LemonDiva Posts: 61
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    I am disabled, not wheelchair bound but with reduced mobility... i can stand and walk but not for long periods so I use a power chair... and yet 5 years ago I lost 17 kgs without vigorous exercise... it can be done... and I'm aiming to do it again...

    I am a firm believer that stress has a great deal to do with weight loss... increase stress and i believe the body will not release the fat... if we worry and badger apply scare tactics etc, it doesn't work... does no good at all.

    The calorie count matters, energy in energy out, but for some of us eating little and often keeps the metabolism going... for some of us the type of food matters too some cannot tolerate carbs because of insulin resistance... I am certain other phenomena exist which is why it is sooo important to know one self.

    To just stop eating or eat less and less skipping meals etc is wrong wrong wrong it just stop metabolism and makes one incredibly miserable and confused...I know from experience.
    Likewise relying on supplements is as bad for the body as processed foods... eat fresh, organic where possible, employ the senses and enjoy the food, we need to nurture mind, body and spirit for the body to release its excess stores.
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
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    Reduce duration of cardio? What kinds of exercise are best?

    Any kind of cardio will work as long as its short duration/ high intensity. The quickest way to a plateau is hours on a treadmill and a large caloric deficit with your diet.

    Short duration = 15 min? 20 min? 30 min?

    The higher the intensity the shorter the duration can be. For example, 15 minutes of sprints would be an awesome fat burning workout. 30 minute medium paced run would be good. You start getting into an hour or more on cardio and bad things typically happen.
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
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    Reduce duration of cardio? What kinds of exercise are best?

    Any kind of cardio will work as long as its short duration/ high intensity. The quickest way to a plateau is hours on a treadmill and a large caloric deficit with your diet.

    Wondering if this is why when one works out like a mad man/woman (during a day), it can up the cortisol levels because the body is starting to get stressed, therefore inhibiting weight loss?

    Exactly. Usually working out harder is not the answer.
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
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    Has there been any properly run studies to show the effects of a spike day. I would imaging something along the lines of same food and exercise for the 6 days then one group has a spike day and they other has a normal day?

    Looking at calories in vs calories out over a week the spike diet will have a net deficit, hence give a weight loss. Also the spike day may keep people on a diet longer as it is a way to control cravings.

    My concerns are that it will prolong my weight loss period by 14% (1/7), keep my leptin receptors dull so increase the risk of putting weight back on once I have hit my target weight and keep me craving the food that helped get me massively overweight in the first place.

    There have been studies done on leptin and they have shown that over eating, specifically carbs, has a positive effect on lelptin and also the conversion of thyroid hormone t4 to t3. In my own experience and experience with many others, your weight loss actually happens at a faster rate than not having a spike day, even if calories averaged the same for the week.
  • Elle_Jamaicangirl81
    Elle_Jamaicangirl81 Posts: 418 Member
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    Hmm, this is all very interesting..
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
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    That could be explained by sodium levels. Eat rubbish -> increase water retention -> decrease weight loss then eat well -> decrease water retention -> increased weight loss.

    You only weigh in on spike day morning so this is a non issue. When you lose weight using a spike day, it is not an illusion like you are eluding to, but a real weight drop.
  • smithmom531
    smithmom531 Posts: 140 Member
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    bump - to read for later
  • jslane
    jslane Posts: 17 Member
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    I think eating well is important too. Just because you're losing weight on Doritos and soda doesn't mean you're healthy!

    Not sure what you are getting at here??

    To me the kind of calories in are as, if not more, important that the number of calories in. It's not simply calories in, calories out.

    Nevermind. I just read your profile and can see that you won't agree :-)

    While I do think you can lose weight eating junk food if you create a calorie deficit, you're certainly not going to be healthy eating that way. I've been "skinny" my whole life, but I haven't always been healthy. I'd choose healthy over "skinny" any day!
  • porcelain_doll
    porcelain_doll Posts: 1,005 Member
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    Thank you for posting your responses. I plateau a lot, but when I actually lose, it is typically after I have changed something in my exercise routine or eating. I haven't changed things up as often as I should. Next week I am starting an aqua-cise class. There is also aqua boot camp I'm going to try. Hopefully these new movements will challenge my body once again, and I'll begin seeing more progress. I also enjoy my spike days once a week, usually on Saturdays. :smile:

    My cardio workouts usually consist of 45-60 min. of medium to vigorous effort, usually on the elliptical or Expresso bike (the bikes that have a computer screen where you ride on a virtual track of your choice - they're really neat). I used to weight train but I stopped about a year ago (long, sad story). I am planning on getting back into it since I no longer use my scale.
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
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    I think eating well is important too. Just because you're losing weight on Doritos and soda doesn't mean you're healthy!

    Not sure what you are getting at here??

    To me the kind of calories in are as, if not more, important that the number of calories in. It's not simply calories in, calories out.

    Nevermind. I just read your profile and can see that you won't agree :-)

    While I do think you can lose weight eating junk food if you create a calorie deficit, you're certainly not going to be healthy eating that way. I've been "skinny" my whole life, but I haven't always been healthy. I'd choose healthy over "skinny" any day!
    Having a spike day has nothing to do with eating junkfood. All that is required is an increase in carbohydrates and calories.
  • kyle4jem
    kyle4jem Posts: 1,400 Member
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    My whole diet & exercise plan is basically... There is no diet & exercise plan!

    By that, I mean I work to a calorie deficit but there are days I go over, days I go under. I exercise about 4-6 days a week, but that could be swimming, cycling or just walking, and then because of work commitments and other unforeseen events, I have a few days when I get practically no exercise whatsoever.

    I eat well, but I don't cut out, rather I've cut down. I was never a junk-food junkie, apart from chocolate & biscuits which I now eat as treats rather than as staples. But I still eat practically the same types of foods as I used to, except I've cut down on bread & pasta, and my portion sizes are now regular not supersized. :laugh:

    This works for me because I'm your archetypal "absent-minded professor". My (private) life is semi-organised chaos and if truth be know, professionally it's not much better, but I've found my niche and that's the same with my diet & exercise plan.

    Great info & replies 4theking :bigsmile:
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    So in essence, if you netted right at your weekly BMR total calories avg'd out through the week (so basically eating at BMR and exercise calories avg'd out), and then on your off day you ate the same amount, but of course with no exercise, so a "spud" day (not quite a spike!) you might say, what would you be missing out on compared to netting below your BMR on 6 days, and then making it up on one day?

    I see both ways keep you from constantly netting under your BMR, hopefully not slowing it down. That is great.

    So in essence, what would be the benefit to a big spike day balancing out bigger deficits, compared to non-workout days balancing out smaller deficits?
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
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    So in essence, if you netted right at your weekly BMR total calories avg'd out through the week (so basically eating at BMR and exercise calories avg'd out), and then on your off day you ate the same amount, but of course with no exercise, so a "spud" day (not quite a spike!) you might say, what would you be missing out on compared to netting below your BMR on 6 days, and then making it up on one day?

    I see both ways keep you from constantly netting under your BMR, hopefully not slowing it down. That is great.

    So in essence, what would be the benefit to a big spike day balancing out bigger deficits, compared to non-workout days balancing out smaller deficits?

    Both deficits are going to bring about the bad things that happen when dieting. By having a larger deficit and 'saving' more calories for your spike, you get one day to reverse the hormonal responses.
  • tmfpartyof4
    tmfpartyof4 Posts: 125 Member
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    bump...

    I get the concept, but just have to be more organized at applying it.
    this is my first full week of MFP and working out. I lost 6 pounds. I dont want to do the spike day TOO soon, or I will feel like I will gain it back. (I have a lot to lose)

    one thing I did notice: I have been good all week.
    This morning, I opted for 2 eggmcmuffins for breakfast. Thats what I wanted, and boy were they so good... and still in my calorie minimum MFP gave me....

    I see that the "spike" is eating over your calories, but you can "spike" by just changing the types of foods and maintaining your calories, right? If I have been eating Shredded wheat every day for breakfast, and then today eat the egg mcmuffins, does that count?

    Im sorry if I sound ignorant, but I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.

    congrats on your weight loss.
  • 4theking
    4theking Posts: 1,196 Member
    Options
    bump...

    I get the concept, but just have to be more organized at applying it.
    this is my first full week of MFP and working out. I lost 6 pounds. I dont want to do the spike day TOO soon, or I will feel like I will gain it back. (I have a lot to lose)

    one thing I did notice: I have been good all week.
    This morning, I opted for 2 eggmcmuffins for breakfast. Thats what I wanted, and boy were they so good... and still in my calorie minimum MFP gave me....

    I see that the "spike" is eating over your calories, but you can "spike" by just changing the types of foods and maintaining your calories, right? If I have been eating Shredded wheat every day for breakfast, and then today eat the egg mcmuffins, does that count?

    Im sorry if I sound ignorant, but I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.

    congrats on your weight loss.

    Thank you! The spike is about eating more calories than your body needs one day a week. It's not about the type of food.
  • gregthegroove
    gregthegroove Posts: 98
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    I've lost close to 100lbs and I KINDA agree with the spike theory. Although what I do is, I have a day where I eat pretty much what I want as long as I kinda dont eat too much sugar. I'll eat burgers, burrito or pizza but stay away from ice cream or sugar or regular soda.

    I also still try to workout that day as well. I only do this once every two weeks the day after my weigh in or right after my weigh in. This way I have a whole week to get back in gear. This has worked for me a great deal because it keeps me focused and I know realistically I wont ever just CUT OUT everything caloric or bad for me forever. I was and still am a fast food a holic. So I figure Im good 90% and it does really work. I look forward to that day every 2 weeks and it keeps me going.

    There are so many theories and ideas and opinions out there. I truly believe that it is really all about calories. My life proves it. Im a regular human being not an athlete or weight lifter. So for me, I focus on calories period. What I can do to restrict them and what I can do to burn off a certain given amount 5-6 days a week. I never eat back my excersise calories either. An athelete would look at protein, carbs, sodium and be precise about what they eat and good for them! For me, easiest way guarantted, is calories. Simple as that.
  • tmfpartyof4
    tmfpartyof4 Posts: 125 Member
    Options
    bump...

    I get the concept, but just have to be more organized at applying it.
    this is my first full week of MFP and working out. I lost 6 pounds. I dont want to do the spike day TOO soon, or I will feel like I will gain it back. (I have a lot to lose)

    one thing I did notice: I have been good all week.
    This morning, I opted for 2 eggmcmuffins for breakfast. Thats what I wanted, and boy were they so good... and still in my calorie minimum MFP gave me....

    I see that the "spike" is eating over your calories, but you can "spike" by just changing the types of foods and maintaining your calories, right? If I have been eating Shredded wheat every day for breakfast, and then today eat the egg mcmuffins, does that count?

    Im sorry if I sound ignorant, but I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.

    congrats on your weight loss.

    Thank you! The spike is about eating more calories than your body needs one day a week. It's not about the type of food.

    thank you for clearing that up for me. :smile:
  • tmfpartyof4
    tmfpartyof4 Posts: 125 Member
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    I've lost close to 100lbs and I KINDA agree with the spike theory. Although what I do is, I have a day where I eat pretty much what I want as long as I kinda dont eat too much sugar. I'll eat burgers, burrito or pizza but stay away from ice cream or sugar or regular soda.

    I also still try to workout that day as well. I only do this once every two weeks the day after my weigh in or right after my weigh in. This way I have a whole week to get back in gear. This has worked for me a great deal because it keeps me focused and I know realistically I wont ever just CUT OUT everything caloric or bad for me forever. I was and still am a fast food a holic. So I figure Im good 90% and it does really work. I look forward to that day every 2 weeks and it keeps me going.

    There are so many theories and ideas and opinions out there. I truly believe that it is really all about calories. My life proves it. Im a regular human being not an athlete or weight lifter. So for me, I focus on calories period. What I can do to restrict them and what I can do to burn off a certain given amount 5-6 days a week. I never eat back my excersise calories either. An athelete would look at protein, carbs, sodium and be precise about what they eat and good for them! For me, easiest way guarantted, is calories. Simple as that.

    congratulations on the weight loss! thats amazing!
  • 70davis
    70davis Posts: 348 Member
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    bump

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