Why r folks so afraid of healthy debate?
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I haven't gone back and read your posts, but I definitely think it has to do with the person who is arguing - there are certain ways in "debating" in which the person just sounds ignorant, stubborn, arrogant, and disrespectful. And, honestly, I totally understand why people wouldn't want to engage in conversation with someone like that. Especially on a health forum, where it's VERY important that wrong ideas are immediately countered and proven wrong so that beginners/people with ED aren't negatively affected. Having said that, I have seen unnecessary (read: all) attacks on posters and those are just unacceptable. If a person is being ridiculous, just leave that thread and hope that your own success will speak for itself.0
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Might have something to do with your approach. When someone posted a "date my daughter application" as a joke you turned it into an attack on the boy scouts accusing them to be homophobic. That was meant to be a fun post not a debate. If other people are getting a laugh out of something that doesn't harm you, do you really need to be a party pooper and spoil that by creating a debate?
Time and place is everything.
Well 1st, be accurate. I was by far not the 1st to oppose the post. I was just the one people decided to focus on. And, I didn't turn it into anything. I shared information. It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic. And the fatal flaw of your argument is that "the post wasn't causing harm." I have studied for years about the ill effects that discrimination causes in our society and words and jokes perpetuate attitudes. Lastly, this post is not only referring to the date application post. This post is a response to several previous personal experience in these forums as well as the way I see people treat others.
So the mere mention of boy scouts throws you into a tantrum on homophobia? That seems a bit extreme. And how exactly does the mention of the boy scouts become discrimination in the first place?0 -
Might have something to do with your approach. When someone posted a "date my daughter application" as a joke you turned it into an attack on the boy scouts accusing them to be homophobic. That was meant to be a fun post not a debate. If other people are getting a laugh out of something that doesn't harm you, do you really need to be a party pooper and spoil that by creating a debate?
Time and place is everything.
Well 1st, be accurate. I was by far not the 1st to oppose the post. I was just the one people decided to focus on. And, I didn't turn it into anything. I shared information. It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic. And the fatal flaw of your argument is that "the post wasn't causing harm." I have studied for years about the ill effects that discrimination causes in our society and words and jokes perpetuate attitudes. Lastly, this post is not only referring to the date application post. This post is a response to several previous personal experience in these forums as well as the way I see people treat others.
My roommate is an Eagle Scout and he's been out of the closet since about 1994. It may be that there are members of the board of directors that have homohobic characteristics, maybe.... but "THE BOYSCOUTS' are not an organized group of homophobic individuals- and to say that - is so generalizing and pitted against logic... I mean seriously... how can a 7 year old boy be a homophobe unless he understands what they really even means?
It is also extremely dangerous to cultivate the idea that you have 'the right to not be offended' as that has NOTHING to do with being American at all.
I have also studied the effects of what happens when people decide to give too much power to sticks and stones and not enough emphasis on emotional responsibilty, thickening their skin or choosing their battles but most importantly- understanding and teaching the next generation that Not everyone is going to like you, Not everyone is Nice and You need to learn to deal with it now... otherwise you will embrace a victim mentality and grow up to be someone that does nothing with their life because
I got picked on as a kid.
MAN UP. Take the teasing like every other generation in the past has had to do- its part of becoming socially well-rounded and self-preserving. Mama wont always be there to wipe tears when we are picked on, so we have to learn to deal with it instead of trying to stop it. It will never stop.0 -
"It is possible to debate issues without resorting to nasty personal attacks on the poster"
nope...and thats all the farther I got...0 -
I think the internet doesn't allow for facial expressions, and vocal inflections, and no emoticons don't work. So, you wind up with a very straight forward way of talking to someone. And, debating sounds like a challenge rather than an exchange of ideas. In person, it's much easier to quickly diffuse a debate that starts to get heated because you can see it coming and break in with some humor or just switch topics real quick. That's harder to do online. Not impossible, but it's harder to take back what you said because they can always go back and read it word for word. In person you can say, "That's not what I meant" and restate it, and smooth it over.
I sooo agree with this!! Well said. Once (not on the threads mentioned here but a completely different one that went south quickly) I tried over and over to explain I had been kidding - because I had - and people just kept hammering me. I just logged off.0 -
Well... It just depends. Somethings don't need to be debated.
If they're not asking for a debate, why push it?
What's the point in starting one.
I think that's where a lot of people go wrong. It's not that people are afraid of debating, it's just that sometimes no one really wants to.
I mean... I can understand if a topic is brought up as a question or if the topic is ASKING for opinions. That's when starting a nice, healthy debate is acceptable. However, there are times when you just don't.
Live and let live, eh?0 -
Fragile egos. Some people can't handle being wrong. I can, it's just so rare that it happens.
We have a group, Debatable Debating. That's where the real fireworks are.
Hahahaha! I would be SOL if I couldn't handle being wrong. It happens a lot! :-) But, that is how I learn.0 -
But just because someone doesn't agree with a lifestyle does not make them homophobic. I think you threw that term around pretty freely a few minutes ago.
Calling someone or a group associated with a large group of people Homophobic is not only a personal attack but its not even definitively correct.
Please see the definition....http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/homophobia.... without resorting to nasty personal attacks on the poster.
If anything its discriminatory which they have the right to be as a private organization0 -
It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic.
A fact you say? What a broad brush to paint a 100 year organization.
We're a Boy Scout Family and very non-homophobic.0 -
There are a lot of people in this world that really can't stand for anyone to think differently than them. I don't understand it, but it's as if they take it personally if someone offers a different point of view or they can't convince you to change to their view.0
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Because people can't talk about issues without separating the issue from the person. Especially online, apparently. I think the anonymity gives people an illusion of power, and they take EVERYTHING personally.0
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Might have something to do with your approach. When someone posted a "date my daughter application" as a joke you turned it into an attack on the boy scouts accusing them to be homophobic. That was meant to be a fun post not a debate. If other people are getting a laugh out of something that doesn't harm you, do you really need to be a party pooper and spoil that by creating a debate?
Time and place is everything.
Well 1st, be accurate. I was by far not the 1st to oppose the post. I was just the one people decided to focus on. And, I didn't turn it into anything. I shared information. It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic. And the fatal flaw of your argument is that "the post wasn't causing harm." I have studied for years about the ill effects that discrimination causes in our society and words and jokes perpetuate attitudes. Lastly, this post is not only referring to the date application post. This post is a response to several previous personal experience in these forums as well as the way I see people treat others.
Well I personally think that your "several previous personal experience in the forum" cannt be THAT much you just joined and we are only 9 days into the month, and I assume you sleep and leave MFP once and a while.
Secondly welcome to the internet... not everyone is going to be nice... and personal attacks happen - especially if you say something that someone doesn't agree with - you may call it a personal attack, others may call it educating the masses, and some people are just down right horrible. Sarcasm does not have a font, nor does humor. So what you think if funny or sarcastic someone else may take as a horribly honest answer - NOT everyone gets sarcasm, and NOT everyone has a sense of humor.
Not all of us want a debate.0 -
Might have something to do with your approach. When someone posted a "date my daughter application" as a joke you turned it into an attack on the boy scouts accusing them to be homophobic. That was meant to be a fun post not a debate. If other people are getting a laugh out of something that doesn't harm you, do you really need to be a party pooper and spoil that by creating a debate?
Time and place is everything.
Well 1st, be accurate. I was by far not the 1st to oppose the post. I was just the one people decided to focus on. And, I didn't turn it into anything. I shared information. It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic. And the fatal flaw of your argument is that "the post wasn't causing harm." I have studied for years about the ill effects that discrimination causes in our society and words and jokes perpetuate attitudes. Lastly, this post is not only referring to the date application post. This post is a response to several previous personal experience in these forums as well as the way I see people treat others.
So the mere mention of boy scouts throws you into a tantrum on homophobia? That seems a bit extreme. And how exactly does the mention of the boy scouts become discrimination in the first place?
I didn;t have a tantrum. I shared some information about the Boy Scouts.0 -
It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic.
A fact you say? What a broad brush to paint a 100 year organization.
We're a Boy Scout Family and very non-homophobic.
I didn't call your family homophobic. It is well documented that the ORGANIZATION of the Boy Scouts is.
And THIS.. is exactly why we have a debate group! Sign up now folks! Get your argue on where everyone can't click REPORT just 'cause.0 -
But just because someone doesn't agree with a lifestyle does not make them homophobic. I think you threw that term around pretty freely a few minutes ago.
Calling someone or a group associated with a large group of people Homophobic is not only a personal attack but its not even definitively correct.
Please see the definition....http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/homophobia.... without resorting to nasty personal attacks on the poster.
I am sorry you can't come to terms with the fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic. We will just have to agree to disagree about that and about what constitutes a personal attack because we obviously think differently.
Please stop calling my gay best friend a homophobe, lady. And an ORGANIZATION is incapable of having a phobia.....
(sriously wtf is happening here?)0 -
Stating an opinion as fact often gets people's feathers ruffled.0
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But just because someone doesn't agree with a lifestyle does not make them homophobic. I think you threw that term around pretty freely a few minutes ago.
Calling someone or a group associated with a large group of people Homophobic is not only a personal attack but its not even definitively correct.
Please see the definition....http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/homophobia.... without resorting to nasty personal attacks on the poster.
I am sorry you can't come to terms with the fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic. We will just have to agree to disagree about that and about what constitutes a personal attack because we obviously think differently.
So you dont understand the definition? What part?0 -
It is a fact that the Boy Scouts are homophobic.
A fact you say? What a broad brush to paint a 100 year organization.
Can I see the support for this fact? I'm trying to understand why you believe its a homophobic organization.0 -
the only thing to fear is fear itself.
oh, and Jason standing outside my bedroom window0
This discussion has been closed.
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