Eating MFP calorie goal plus exercise calories - not losing

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  • moylie
    moylie Posts: 195
    I am so glad I posted - thank you all for your thoughts and advice.

    I will go calculate my % body fat but I did quickly go recalculate my TDEE and BMR.

    OK:

    TDEE
    using desk job 1745 kcal
    using exercise 1 to 3 x a week 2000
    using 3 to 5 x a week exercise (which is what I'm doing) 2254

    BMR
    1455

    My understanding is for weight loss calories should be above BMR and less than TDEE (should it be 500 calories less than TDEE??) If that is right, I should eat above 1455. The TDEE is where it gets tricky. 500 less than the desk job is 1245. I work in an office, I am walking back and forth, when I am home in the evening I do sit when on the computer, etc. I have been exercising 30-60 min depending on workout so that would be 1500 to 1754 depending on which TDEE I use (500 calories less than the TDEE using exercise listed above).

    So do I go
    a)1455 - 1500 or
    b)1455 - 1754 and not eat back calories or
    c)do I do 1260 (MFP goal) plus eat exercise calories or
    d)1260 and not eat exercise calories.

    Wow, you figured out all your numbers. GOOD JOB! Based on what you said earlier.... of eating 1600 and your body was thanking you for it, perhaps you should try just going up a bit. If you try 1700, that is a 15% CUT from the middle TDEE number. I wouldn't get stuck on a 500 deficit. That's not a "one-size-fits-all" number. Try taking a 15-20% deduction from the TDEE that you want to use. Then, on exercise days, just eat back calories so that your NET is no lower than your BMR of 1455.

    Sounds like you might just have to experiment to find what will work for you. Believe me, I'm also tired of not seeing immediate changes anymore. I'm within 10 pounds of goal, and this has been the longest, hardest part of the journey yet. I'm actually at 1800, and contemplating going to 1900. Give yourself 2-4 weeks doing a new routine, then re-evaluate.
  • Anita672
    Anita672 Posts: 32 Member
    Moylie, can you clarify: you said "Try taking a 15-20% deduction from the TDEE that you want to use. Then, on exercise days, just eat back calories so that your NET is no lower than your BMR of 1455."

    Using the TDEE of 3 to 5 times a week exercising, 20% less than that is 1804.

    Questions:
    1) when they say 'exercising' 3 to 5 times a week, what constitues exercise? Is the 30 to 60 minutes I am doing (see previous messages) appropriate?

    2) If the TDEE incorporates exercise already, do I still eat the extra calories 'earned' from exercising? So, if I say OK my calorie goal is 1800 then I exercise which is worth 300 calories, do I then eat 2100 or is the exercise already accounted for in the 1800?

    Again, thank you all for your help!
  • Anita672
    Anita672 Posts: 32 Member
    Moylie, just re-read your post and I think I know the answer to my second question:

    I would eat 15 to 20% below my TDEE.

    On the days I exercise, I would log those calories burned. I would eat the amount to ensure my net calories still equals my 15 to 20% below my TDEE.

    Right?!?! If so I may have had an ah ha moment! :)

    That being said, still not sure WHICH TDEE to use??

    The exercise I am striving for is 30 minutes on the days I am doing my running program (couch to 5 k) or walking/stairs intervals (very hard for me) or 60 minutes if walking on treadmill or elliptical. The workouts seem to average about 300 kcal using the MFP database or the amount displayed on the machine.

    My BMR is 1455. 20% less the TDEE using a desk job would put me at 1396 so I think that is ruled out because that is below my BMR, right?

    20% less using 1 to 3 days of exercise would put me at 1600. 20% less using 3 to 5 days of exercising is 1803.
  • moylie
    moylie Posts: 195
    Moylie, just re-read your post and I think I know the answer to my second question:

    I would eat 15 to 20% below my TDEE.

    On the days I exercise, I would log those calories burned. I would eat the amount to ensure my net calories still equals my 15 to 20% below my TDEE.

    Right?!?! If so I may have had an ah ha moment! :)

    That being said, still not sure WHICH TDEE to use??

    The exercise I am striving for is 30 minutes on the days I am doing my running program (couch to 5 k) or walking/stairs intervals (very hard for me) or 60 minutes if walking on treadmill or elliptical. The workouts seem to average about 300 kcal using the MFP database or the amount displayed on the machine.

    My BMR is 1455. 20% less the TDEE using a desk job would put me at 1396 so I think that is ruled out because that is below my BMR, right?

    20% less using 1 to 3 days of exercise would put me at 1600. 20% less using 3 to 5 days of exercising is 1803.

    You should really join the "Eat More to Weigh Less" Group here. It has a lot of posts on the whole BMR/TDEE equation. They suggest picking moderate as the TDEE level. This is basically your maintenance level. Theoretically you would eat at this (2200), and neither gain nor lose. To lose, they suggest cutting 15% off of that TDEE number. You would set MFP as that goal, plus change your macros to 40/30/30 (Carb/Protein/Fat). So, when you record your exercise, check your "home" screen here, and it will display your net value. That NET value shouldn't ever go below your BMR of 1455. I've seen others say it's OK to eat back up to 150 or so above BMR, and you should still be fine. I like to eat, so I push the limit :) Maybe set MFP for 1750 or 1800. If you fall short a bit to start, don't worry about it. It's all a guessing game to figure out what will work for YOU. It's just as important to hit your macro levels, especially protein. Try to always have above 100 or close to your weight for protein grams.
  • 2April
    2April Posts: 285 Member
    Hi, thanks in advance for your advice or encouragement.

    I am 10 lbs away from my goal which sounds great except I've been trying to lose these same 10 lbs for quite awhile!

    I have been using MFP with some success but recently was reading all of the posts discussing MFP calorie goals, TDEE, BMR, etc. I had only been eating my calories as set out by MFP which is 1260 to lose 1 lb per week. I am 5' 6", weigh 155 lb, 38 years old. I had put sedentary as my activity level as my job is in an office.

    After reading the various posts, I calculated my TDEE as 1744 and my BMR as 1450. I decided to try eating my MFP calories plus any exercise calories to see if that would trigger weight loss.

    I've been doing 30 min running/walking intervals, walking/stairs intervals and 60 min walking or elliptical which has pushed my calories into around the 1600 mark which is above my BMR and less than TDEE.

    I am weighing, measuring and journaling accurately.

    BUT I am not losing (and have even seen a gain of 0.2).

    So, of course I am panicking and wondering if I should restrict to the 1260 again. I am feeling good, energetic and happier on 1600 I must note.

    Thanks for sharing your ideas and thoughts! I appreciate your help.
    Try 1400 and don't eat back calories. If you find that you are tired/lack energy increase to 1500.

    So, if she eats 1400 calories, but then has a 500 calorie burn, she's only netting 900 calories for the day. That's way too little. Of course she would be tired and lack energy, because that's considered starvation mode.

    Not good advice at all, IMO.
    She is not burning 500 calories a day. Starvation mode is a myth. BMR and TDEE are a best guess. Therefore you need to find the calories where you have energy to work out and are losing weight. I eat 1450 a day and I do plenty of exercise and have lots of energy. I am gaining strength and increasing my running speed and distance. I can do a pull-up and can dead-lift more than my body weight and I am new to lifting. I am 35 and I have 2 kids - I am 2 lbs away from my goal of 114 lbs.
    If she isn't losing weight when she eats 1600 then she needs to eat a bit less - like 1400-1500.
  • em9371
    em9371 Posts: 1,047 Member
    First of all, if you have only just increased your cals it takes time fr your body to adjust. It's normal to see a small gain at first then the loss should start. I increased from 1200 net to 1600 net back in January, first week I gained 0.8 then lost 3,2,3,1.5 the following month. On 1200 I lost 1.5-2 max.

    If you exercise then this is included in tdee so you should go with lightly or moderately active, you don't eat back exercise Unless your net falls below bmr as its already included in the calculation OR eat the cals for sedentary plus your exercise.
    1700-1800 total or 1500 plus exercise sounds a good starting point, stick with it for a month then adjust up or down as needed. With 10lbs to lose you should be aiming for around 0.5 a week loss / 250 deficit.

    If you worked out your bmr / tdee on fat 2 fit, the numbers in the table are not your tdee, they are the tdee for your goal weight. To get current tdee you need to put your goal weight same as current then you will get your tdee/ cals to maintain.
    If you didn't input your body fat %, get it checked and rerun the numbers, this can make a big difference to your bmr and therefore the calories you should be eating.

    I would also add some heavy weight training, maybe for the last few pounds you need to work on increasing muscle / reducing body fat rather than losing weight. Lorina is a fabulous example of how this works!!
  • moylie
    moylie Posts: 195
    Hi, thanks in advance for your advice or encouragement.

    I am 10 lbs away from my goal which sounds great except I've been trying to lose these same 10 lbs for quite awhile!

    I have been using MFP with some success but recently was reading all of the posts discussing MFP calorie goals, TDEE, BMR, etc. I had only been eating my calories as set out by MFP which is 1260 to lose 1 lb per week. I am 5' 6", weigh 155 lb, 38 years old. I had put sedentary as my activity level as my job is in an office.

    After reading the various posts, I calculated my TDEE as 1744 and my BMR as 1450. I decided to try eating my MFP calories plus any exercise calories to see if that would trigger weight loss.

    I've been doing 30 min running/walking intervals, walking/stairs intervals and 60 min walking or elliptical which has pushed my calories into around the 1600 mark which is above my BMR and less than TDEE.

    I am weighing, measuring and journaling accurately.

    BUT I am not losing (and have even seen a gain of 0.2).

    So, of course I am panicking and wondering if I should restrict to the 1260 again. I am feeling good, energetic and happier on 1600 I must note.

    Thanks for sharing your ideas and thoughts! I appreciate your help.
    Try 1400 and don't eat back calories. If you find that you are tired/lack energy increase to 1500.

    So, if she eats 1400 calories, but then has a 500 calorie burn, she's only netting 900 calories for the day. That's way too little. Of course she would be tired and lack energy, because that's considered starvation mode.

    Not good advice at all, IMO.
    She is not burning 500 calories a day. Starvation mode is a myth. BMR and TDEE are a best guess. Therefore you need to find the calories where you have energy to work out and are losing weight. I eat 1450 a day and I do plenty of exercise and have lots of energy. I am gaining strength and increasing my running speed and distance. I can do a pull-up and can dead-lift more than my body weight and I am new to lifting. I am 35 and I have 2 kids - I am 2 lbs away from my goal of 114 lbs.
    If she isn't losing weight when she eats 1600 then she needs to eat a bit less - like 1400-1500.

    I'm merely speaking from my own experience. I was eating 1400-1500, and had plateaued and stalled for three solid months. Clearly my metabolism had adjusted to that level, and was hanging onto every calorie. I needed a change in order to kick start things again. I found two schools of thought on these forums 1. The Eat Less Camp, and 2. The Eat More Camp. I wasn't willing to eat less than 1400 calories. I'm a runner training for a half-marathon, and I also started lifting heavy. With around 10 more pounds to lose, it proved wise for me to lessen my weekly weightloss goal, and start eating closer to maintenance of the weight I want to be. It's all one big experiment, since this is not a one-size-fits-all program.
  • moylie
    moylie Posts: 195
    Here's some links to check out, courtesy of the Eat More to Weigh Less group:


    Great read on plateauing http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/501511-great-read-on-plateau-ing?page=8#posts-7150335

    Excellent information on why not eating enough works against you... http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/3047-700-calories-a-day-and-not-losing

    Proof that there are many eating and losing weight successfully http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/506349-women-who-eat-more-than-1800-calories-a-day

    Excellent article "Metabolic Damage Why It Happens, How to Avoid It and How to Fix It" by Tom Venuto
    http://www.burnthefat.com/metabolic_damage.html
  • 2April
    2April Posts: 285 Member
    Hi, thanks in advance for your advice or encouragement.

    I am 10 lbs away from my goal which sounds great except I've been trying to lose these same 10 lbs for quite awhile!

    I have been using MFP with some success but recently was reading all of the posts discussing MFP calorie goals, TDEE, BMR, etc. I had only been eating my calories as set out by MFP which is 1260 to lose 1 lb per week. I am 5' 6", weigh 155 lb, 38 years old. I had put sedentary as my activity level as my job is in an office.

    After reading the various posts, I calculated my TDEE as 1744 and my BMR as 1450. I decided to try eating my MFP calories plus any exercise calories to see if that would trigger weight loss.

    I've been doing 30 min running/walking intervals, walking/stairs intervals and 60 min walking or elliptical which has pushed my calories into around the 1600 mark which is above my BMR and less than TDEE.

    I am weighing, measuring and journaling accurately.

    BUT I am not losing (and have even seen a gain of 0.2).

    So, of course I am panicking and wondering if I should restrict to the 1260 again. I am feeling good, energetic and happier on 1600 I must note.

    Thanks for sharing your ideas and thoughts! I appreciate your help.
    Try 1400 and don't eat back calories. If you find that you are tired/lack energy increase to 1500.

    So, if she eats 1400 calories, but then has a 500 calorie burn, she's only netting 900 calories for the day. That's way too little. Of course she would be tired and lack energy, because that's considered starvation mode.

    Not good advice at all, IMO.
    She is not burning 500 calories a day. Starvation mode is a myth. BMR and TDEE are a best guess. Therefore you need to find the calories where you have energy to work out and are losing weight. I eat 1450 a day and I do plenty of exercise and have lots of energy. I am gaining strength and increasing my running speed and distance. I can do a pull-up and can dead-lift more than my body weight and I am new to lifting. I am 35 and I have 2 kids - I am 2 lbs away from my goal of 114 lbs.
    If she isn't losing weight when she eats 1600 then she needs to eat a bit less - like 1400-1500.

    I'm merely speaking from my own experience. I was eating 1400-1500, and had plateaued and stalled for three solid months. Clearly my metabolism had adjusted to that level, and was hanging onto every calorie. I needed a change in order to kick start things again. I found two schools of thought on these forums 1. The Eat Less Camp, and 2. The Eat More Camp. I wasn't willing to eat less than 1400 calories. I'm a runner training for a half-marathon, and I also started lifting heavy. With around 10 more pounds to lose, it proved wise for me to lessen my weekly weightloss goal, and start eating closer to maintenance of the weight I want to be. It's all one big experiment, since this is not a one-size-fits-all program.
    I agree - however the OP is doing half hour walk/runs which do not burn that many calories. Training for a half-marathon and heavy lifting would require hundreds more calories a day so your experience is not the same as hers. Also, she never reached a plateau when eating less. Your plateau may have been water retention which is quite common when you start a lifting program but you likely need the extra calories anyway due to your training requirements.
  • Anita672
    Anita672 Posts: 32 Member
    Lorinalynn, that would put me at 1500 plus exercise calories which have been averaging an additional 250 to 350 calories which I calculate from MFP database or the number of calories shown on the equipment I'm using.

    I have to admit eating even more really freaks me out in the sence that I couldn't stand my pants getting tighter when I'm trying to lose.

    Thoughts?

    Got to say I appreciate you posting replies. Thanks.

    I'm about your age and height, and did best at about 1500 plus exercise calories, so typically around 1800-2000 calories.

    I also found that even though I work from home and sit quite a bit, I needed to be at lightly active at a minimum. Once I went on maintenance, I had to bump it up to active, plus most of my exercise calories, to stop losing weight. I net around 1800 now.

    Even though MFP describes sedentary as someone having a desk job, I think it's a bit more than that. Sedentary is someone who sits all day at work, then comes home and sits the rest of the night. Someone who does cooking, cleaning, shopping, yard work, taking care of pets or kids, AND exercises is not sedentary. Sedentary implies someone who won't or can't be physically active.

    Take, for instance, my husband. He has a physically demanding job, so he's not sedentary, but once he comes home, he's on the computer or watching tv the rest of the night. I only work part time from home, so I take care of all the house-stuff. If he had a cushy desk job, and still came home and did nothing, he'd be sedentary. And I'd be pissed, but that's another story. :wink:

    Lorinalynn, can you give me some more info about activity levels? I am that person who "does cooking, cleaning, shopping, yard work, taking care of pets or kids, AND exercises is not sedentary". Right now I do have sedentary as my activity level on my profile.
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