What really makes us fat (NYTimes.com)
Replies
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The British Medical Association sponsored a study about five years ago, and presumably using more advanced and accurate technology, that measured consumed and expended calories in a closed system and found that Atkins only works when more calories are burned than consumed, like any other diet. I'll see if I can track it down.0
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People are not overweight because you eat too much, people eat too much because you're overweight. People are not thin because run marathons, people run marathons because they are thin. People are not responsible for their weight gain, carbs are. Exercise only makes you hungrier, doesn't burn as many calories as you'd think (but... wait.... why would that even matter since calories are bogus...hmmm) and has no benefit to weight loss.
How can anyone believe this stuff? Taubes is helping create a stereotype for the low-carb dieter that they are lazy and refuse to take responsibility for themselves. I know a Taubes devotee who claims eating something like a Greek yogurt would MAKE him then go on a carb binge at Taco Bell. He wouldn't want to eat 3000 cals, but the carbs would MAKE him.
Taubes is a hack.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!0 -
The usual garbage from Taubes
Yep
I agree. I'll be honest, I eat like **** most days. It hasn't slowed me down yet. I FEEL better when I eat better, but it has zero effect on my weight loss.0 -
Likewise.
I wished I'd noticed it before reading it.I stopped reading at "By GARY TAUBES".0 -
Good read, thanks for posting!0
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In other words, carbohydrates are fattening, and obesity is a fat-storage defect. What matters, then, is the quantity and quality of carbohydrates we consume and their effect on insulin.
I have been saying this for YEARS
So you've been living in a fantasy world for years where the bold is true?
No, I live in the REAL world where many people have health problems due to the reasons stated in the article.
You should really open your mind because most everyone can not eat junk food and lose weight due to insulin and other hormone issues.
They are proving this more and more each day and the people need to wake up.
The fake food is not helping any of us and that is why I no longer partake in fake food.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.0 -
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
Oh the irony.0 -
In other words, carbohydrates are fattening, and obesity is a fat-storage defect. What matters, then, is the quantity and quality of carbohydrates we consume and their effect on insulin.
I have been saying this for YEARS
So you've been living in a fantasy world for years where the bold is true?
No, I live in the REAL world where many people have health problems due to the reasons stated in the article.
You should really open your mind because most everyone can not eat junk food and lose weight due to insulin and other hormone issues.
They are proving this more and more each day and the people need to wake up.
The fake food is not helping any of us and that is why I no longer partake in fake food.
While I agree that fake food isn't helping anyone, I don't see where you get any of your information from. Please state some sources. Stating that "most everyone can not eat junk food and lose weight due to insulin and other hormone issues" doesn't make much sense. Please explain.0 -
I did low carb and lost the 15 lbs that the beer fridge at work tricked me into gaining. Then I signed up for the Warrior Dash, started Couch to 5k to train and got interested in being healthy rather than just skinny.
I didn't want to waste my effort (and I'm a nerd who likes to research things) so I was surprised that literally everything I real about putting on lean muscle told me I *had* to eat more carbs. I read the science looking for a loophole but it all seems valid (admittedly I only have an undergrad minor in biology, so I'm not an expert by any means).
I think there are two problems here:
1) "Carb" is such a tremendously broad category. Cake is a carb (a delicious, delicious carb). An apple is a carb. I bet you can see the difference. I'm trying to stop thinking "no carbs, they're evil" and instead think "no processes/refined grains and sugars, they're super evil." I still cringe when I see my macro pie chart each day and carbs are more than a sliver, but my body fat is dropping and I feel a thousand times better during and after workouts. Get your carbs from the right sources and they're great.
2) American portions are INSANE. This isn't directly related to carbs (nor is it a criticism of individual Americans), but it is a direct answer to the question "what makes us fat?". When I head south (I'm Canadian) I feel like I'm being pranked by restaurants. Virtually every meal I,mserved clearly contains upwards of 800 calories on my plate. It's easily 2 full portions. But if that's all you ever see it's difficult to realize that you shouldn't eat it all. (Add in the fact that we seem to be biologically wired to eat what's in front of us and you're in trouble. Now I specifically ask for things like bread, fries, potatoes, etc be left off the plate before it even gets to me.
If you are going to eat a really low carb diet to lose weight I can't criticize you, I did it myself and it worked. But please remember a few things. Atkins died of a heart attack (all meat and no veggies makes for sad organs), and even this article points out that this sort of diet should be short-term rather than a lifestyle. If you want a lifestyle try paleo or primal, you can forever refuse breads and processed grains, but you'll get healthy carbs from fruits and veggies.
Wow, that was a long rant for an iPad post.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
I wonder if they pushed a low fat, high carb diet, not because they thought it was the most nutritious, but because they thought it was the most sustainable for the majority of the population.0 -
[/quote]
You should really open your mind because most everyone can not eat junk food and lose weight due to insulin and other hormone issues.
They are proving this more and more each day and the people need to wake up.
The fake food is not helping any of us and that is why I no longer partake in fake food.
[/quote]
Taubes is against eating fruit. Are you going to argue that fruit is fake food?
No one is advocating eating junk food. The definition of junk food is not carbohydrate.0 -
The more we concentrate on hormones and the less on the overly simplistic calories in/out math problem the better off we'll collectively be.
If calories in/out worked as effectively as touted then we'd be able to do it, and we can't.
I always find it interesting that the younger people tend to be down on this idea, presumably because their metabolism has been battered around less and yeh, they can lose weight by cutting the calories a bit, no worries. And hey, look at my ripped profile pic to prove it, check out those 'guns', etc.
Compare that to yer average dieter approaching middle-age just wanting to lose a bit of wobble ... Hormones a bit more of a factor there I'd wager.
But hey, you go your way, you keep trying to exercise off that grub by burning xxxx calories, and keep it up, good luck to ya.
I agree with this - hormones play a significant role in metabolism function.0 -
Gosh, so we can all "go Adkins", get really svelte and "fit" and live thin and leave a good looking corpse while we all die of coronary artery disease.0
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"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
Seriously, I don't get the dogmatic adherence to low carb/paleo/atkins that so many of you embrace. I've done it all and have lost weight only when I burned more than I ate. Did I binge on grass fed steak and organic, pastured eggs? Oh heck yes I did. I binge, it's who I am. If more people could just come out and say "I have a problem with food, I don't know when to stop and sometimes I keep on eating even when I do know I'm full" we'd spend less time searching for sciencey sounding, self-righteous excuses from unqualified hacks and their business managers.0 -
Thanks for that ~ I needed a laugh.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
Seriously, I don't get the dogmatic adherence to low carb/paleo/atkins that so many of you embrace. I've done it all and have lost weight only when I burned more than I ate. Did I binge on grass fed steak and organic, pastured eggs? Oh heck yes I did. I binge, it's who I am. If more people could just come out and say "I have a problem with food, I don't know when to stop and sometimes I keep on eating even when I do know I'm full" we'd spend less time searching for sciencey sounding, self-righteous excuses from unqualified hacks and their business managers.
I understand that everyone is different, but so far I have never in my life had an urge to binge on steak or eggs. I even have a hard time with the clean plate club habits when eating those foods. If I'm full and I don't stop, I feel horrid! Pastries and candy though, I can eat that all day and rarely feel sick at all.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
Seriously, I don't get the dogmatic adherence to low carb/paleo/atkins that so many of you embrace. I've done it all and have lost weight only when I burned more than I ate. Did I binge on grass fed steak and organic, pastured eggs? Oh heck yes I did. I binge, it's who I am. If more people could just come out and say "I have a problem with food, I don't know when to stop and sometimes I keep on eating even when I do know I'm full" we'd spend less time searching for sciencey sounding, self-righteous excuses from unqualified hacks and their business managers.
Well maybe you just have a bad relationship with food.
I have never been an over eater. I really barely eat and I am trying to actually eat more.
For the record, My naturopathic Dr, Chiropractor, and my family Dr all advocate the Paleo lifestyle because it FOCUSES on eating REAL food and finding what works with your individual body.
I find it funny that so many people on this site saying that those of us that are living a controlled carb lifestyle say we are making excuses for the very people that MANY doctors are embracing and finding fact with.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
Seriously, I don't get the dogmatic adherence to low carb/paleo/atkins that so many of you embrace. I've done it all and have lost weight only when I burned more than I ate. Did I binge on grass fed steak and organic, pastured eggs? Oh heck yes I did. I binge, it's who I am. If more people could just come out and say "I have a problem with food, I don't know when to stop and sometimes I keep on eating even when I do know I'm full" we'd spend less time searching for sciencey sounding, self-righteous excuses from unqualified hacks and their business managers.
I understand that everyone is different, but so far I have never in my life had an urge to binge on steak or eggs. I even have a hard time with the clean plate club habits when eating those foods. If I'm full and I don't stop, I feel horrid! Pastries and candy though, I can eat that all day and rarely feel sick at all.
Unles there is a Leptin issue going on in the human body, there is NO way to binge on eggs, steak or other protein and fat rich foods.
Protein and fat provoke a Leptin response that sugar does not. That is why people stay hungry when eating a higher carb, lower fat and protein way of eating. Leptin is not sending that signal from the brain that says I am full when eating grainy, sugary high carb foods.0 -
MD's have very little nutritional training.
Chiropractors and naturopaths are quacks.0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
I wonder if they pushed a low fat, high carb diet, not because they thought it was the most nutritious, but because they thought it was the most sustainable for the majority of the population.
They push the low fat, high carb way of life because it feeds the lobbyists such as the Monsanto's, Cargill's, ADM's, Kelloggs, General Mills, Kraft's of the world.
The government could give less of a *kitten* about anyone except for lining their own pockets. Hence why the food pyramid now states to have 6-12 servings of grains per day.
Grains are fed to animals to make them FAT, what in the world did they think it would do to humans, which are animals also???? They have made us fat.0 -
MD's have very little nutritional training.
Chiropractors and naturopaths are quacks.
My M.D. has a great nutritonal background, thank you very much.
And my Naturopathic Dr is a registered holistic dietician as well as a General M.D. - she is far from a quack. My Chiropractor is GREAT.
There are no quacks or anyone in my medical team that are lacking in any education.
I took great lengths to find Dr's that treat the ROOT of the problem and don't mask issues with a prescription pad.0 -
Grains are fed to animals to make them FAT, what in the world did they think it would do to humans, which are animals also???? They have made us fat.
Yes, because the human digestive system is exactly like that of a ruminant.0 -
The British Medical Association sponsored a study about five years ago, and presumably using more advanced and accurate technology, that measured consumed and expended calories in a closed system and found that Atkins only works when more calories are burned than consumed, like any other diet. I'll see if I can track it down.
America!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Medical Association.
your argument is invalid0 -
"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
Seriously, I don't get the dogmatic adherence to low carb/paleo/atkins that so many of you embrace. I've done it all and have lost weight only when I burned more than I ate. Did I binge on grass fed steak and organic, pastured eggs? Oh heck yes I did. I binge, it's who I am. If more people could just come out and say "I have a problem with food, I don't know when to stop and sometimes I keep on eating even when I do know I'm full" we'd spend less time searching for sciencey sounding, self-righteous excuses from unqualified hacks and their business managers.
Well maybe you just have a bad relationship with food.
I have never been an over eater. I really barely eat and I am trying to actually eat more.
For the record, My naturopathic Dr, Chiropractor, and my family Dr all advocate the Paleo lifestyle because it FOCUSES on eating REAL food and finding what works with your individual body.
I find it funny that so many people on this site saying that those of us that are living a controlled carb lifestyle say we are making excuses for the very people that MANY doctors are embracing and finding fact with.
Well of course I have a troubled relationship with food. Those of us here seem to fall into two camps, first are the chronic dieters who spend their lives yoyoing and binging. Then there are those who've let themselves go and fallen into eating more than they should and not moving enough. I'm comfortable placing myself in the first group as I believe the best way to fix a problem is to admit it exists in the first place. I'm not sure what a naturopath and a chiropractor have to say about diet that's relevant to anyone, anywhere. All it takes to become a naturopath is a gullible personality and a willingness to hand over a cheque to some dodgy accrediting body. Or an education at a z grade school. Or a whole lot of chutzpah and access to Google U. Chiropractors are no better. I mean, they treat a bit of back pain and adjust your neck so that your natural rhythms align themselves to the call of sea snails or something. What the heck do they know about nutrition? I can't comment on your doctor, but there are a small number of MDs who believe that vaccinations are for idiots and that humans benefit from a good dose of whooping cough. It doesn't mean anything except that they should probably have their licences revoked.
So my point is... bully for these 'professionals'. If you were truly undereating and gaining/not losing you would be some sort of medical marvel and kidnapped by big pharma for incarceration and various degrading medical experiments. It didn't happen. Maybe you don't want to admit to a life of gluttony or you're ashamed of your inactivity. Goodness knows. I think it's a shame you need this crutch in your life but it's your life and who am I to tell you which bandwagon to jump on?0 -
Grains are fed to animals to make them FAT, what in the world did they think it would do to humans, which are animals also???? They have made us fat.
Yes, because the human digestive system is exactly like that of a ruminant.
Human's also have the ability to realize that overeating causes them to gain weight and control themselves. Stop blaming it on conspiracy and take personal responsibility.0 -
Thanks for posting the article. I agree with most of it...but I won't give up my carbs just so I can lose weight faster. I don't want to binge when I go in to maintenance and it's just not maintainable in this day and age unless you have unlimited funds. Generally I stick to rice and potatoes as my carbs with some oatmeal and english muffins thrown in for good measure.
I think you'll find everyone here split about whether carbs are good or bad for you.
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Low-carb diets increase the stress hormone cortisol, CRP, which is an inflammation marker linked to heart disease and diabetes, and overall mortality.0
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"As in any science, these experiments should be replicated by independent investigators. We’ve been arguing about this for over a century. Let’s put it to rest with more good science. The public health implications are enormous."
We could possibly all come to an agreement on the above, the last three sentences in the article. I want to see more research, please!
The proof is in society as a whole.
They have been pushing the "low fat, high carb" agenda since the 1950's and obesity and sickness in this country has risen every year of every decade since to the point we are at a crisis tipping point.
It is sad to see, but I will not be part of that. My lifestyle has changed and will never go back unless Monsanto, Cargill, ADM and the like take world dominion and finish creating the zombie population they have started.
It is so sad to see so many on this site and in society as a whole that are just blind sheep that totally buy into what they preach.
I wonder if they pushed a low fat, high carb diet, not because they thought it was the most nutritious, but because they thought it was the most sustainable for the majority of the population.
They push the low fat, high carb way of life because it feeds the lobbyists such as the Monsanto's, Cargill's, ADM's, Kelloggs, General Mills, Kraft's of the world.
The government could give less of a *kitten* about anyone except for lining their own pockets. Hence why the food pyramid now states to have 6-12 servings of grains per day.
Grains are fed to animals to make them FAT, what in the world did they think it would do to humans, which are animals also???? They have made us fat.
As far as sustainable, I didn't mean some eco-friendly, benevolent type of sustainable. I meant shoving cheap calories into workers with no regard for their long term health so they'll go out every day to produce and consume.
As far as corporations go, they can make money off beef just as easily as off bread, and they do. So long as beef and bread can be produced in equally limitless supply. Which they can't be. Beef is far more resource intensive to produce than grain.0
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