"The Newsroom" on HBO

ninerbuff
ninerbuff Posts: 48,992 Member
in Chit-Chat
I saw a little of this and was mesmerized by Jeff Daniels especially when he made the statement that "America is longer the greatest country in the world. We used to be."
"We lead the world in 3 catagories:

Number of incarcerated citizens.
Number of adults who believe angels are real.
Defense spending, more than the next 26 countries combined, 25 of whom are our allies."

"First step in solving any problem is realizing there is one.....................America isn't the greatest country anymore".

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Replies

  • Raiderxx
    Raiderxx Posts: 105 Member
    I concur with his statement.
  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
    I really don't see how he draws that conclusion from the 3 categories listed. I didn't see this report. I'm just reading your post, but it seems he's just trying to stir up something that may or may not be there.
  • DMZ_1
    DMZ_1 Posts: 2,889 Member
    The three criteria Daniels mentioned are not enough to say what he did. However, a very good argument can be made that the USA is not as great of a nation as it was at one time if you do a more comprehensive analysis.

    USA is not the country it once was relative to other nations. Pax Americana (the era of the USA being the undisputed #1) is over. There's been a gradual decline since the 1970s, but the current economic downturn has accelerated some negative trends that were there prior to the recession.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,992 Member
    I really don't see how he draws that conclusion from the 3 categories listed. I didn't see this report. I'm just reading your post, but it seems he's just trying to stir up something that may or may not be there.
    Most incarcerated prisoners in the world.
    The United States has, for instance, 2.3 million criminals behind bars, more than any other nation, according to data maintained by the International Center for Prison Studies at King's College London.

    China, which is four times more populous than the United States, is a distant second, with [/b]1.6 million people in prison[/b]. (That number excludes hundreds of thousands of people held in administrative detention, most of them in China's extrajudicial system of re-education through labor, which often singles out political activists who have not committed crimes.)

    San Marino, with a population of about 30,000, is at the end of the long list of 218 countries compiled by the center. It has a single prisoner.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/23/world/americas/23iht-23prison.12253738.html?pagewanted=all
    Most adults that believe in angels.
    World Christians 33.32% (of which Roman Catholics 16.99%, Protestants 5.78%, Orthodox 3.53%, Anglicans 1.25%), Muslims 21.01%, Hindus 13.26%, Buddhists 5.84%, Sikhs 0.35%, Jews 0.23%, Baha'is 0.12%, other religions 11.78%, non-religious 11.77%, atheists 2.32% (2007 est.)

    United States Protestant 51.3%, Roman Catholic 23.9%, Mormon 1.7%, other Christian 1.6%, Jewish 1.7%, Buddhist 0.7%, Muslim 0.6%, other or unspecified 2.5%, unaffiliated 12.1%, none 4% (2007 est.)

    http://www.religionfacts.com/religion_statistics/religion_statistics_by_country.htm
    Spends more on defense in the world
    America spent nearly $700 billion in 2010. This accounts for about 43% of the entire global military spending and is nearly 6 times more than the amount spent by the next largest, China. In fact, the United States spends more on its military than the total spent by the second largest (China), third largest (United Kingdom), fourth largest (France), fifth largest (Russia)... and fifteenth largest (Turkey) combined.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/howard-steven-friedman/military-spending-united-states_b_1118851.html

    Facts are hard to deny.

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  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
    Facts are hard to deny.

    I don't doubt those statistics. I just don't think those are enough to draw that kind of conclusion.

    Now, do I doubt his conclusion? Not at all. I just think there are way too many other factors that have brought us to this point.
  • superpapa16
    superpapa16 Posts: 244 Member
    I really want to see this show. I've been a big Aaron Sorkin fan since "Sports Night". It sucks that HBO refuses to offer anything online except to subscribers...
  • lisasch67
    lisasch67 Posts: 135 Member
    I'm loving this show!!! But I am also a huge liberal.

    If you have xfinity you can get HBO for $10/mo and watch online thru them.
  • future_runner
    future_runner Posts: 136 Member
    Facts are hard to deny.

    I don't doubt those statistics. I just don't think those are enough to draw that kind of conclusion.

    Now, do I doubt his conclusion? Not at all. I just think there are way too many other factors that have brought us to this point.

    Well the quote he listed is not the whole quote, but it does get the point across. If that is all we lead in it means we don't lead the world in education, health care, feeding our citizens, growing middle class, equality in the work place, etc. it seems pretty clear to me that if the above 3 things are the only things we are best at, we are not the best country in the world. Why do you have a problem with the conclusion?
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,992 Member
    Facts are hard to deny.

    I don't doubt those statistics. I just don't think those are enough to draw that kind of conclusion.

    Now, do I doubt his conclusion? Not at all. I just think there are way too many other factors that have brought us to this point.
    There are. Google Jeff Daniels rant on "The Newsroom" and you can hear the whole thing. He was inspiring to listen to.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
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  • KaleidoscopeEyes1056
    KaleidoscopeEyes1056 Posts: 2,996 Member


    Facts are hard to deny.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
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    Shh... people around here don't like facts... Trust me, I already learned this on my own.
  • KaleidoscopeEyes1056
    KaleidoscopeEyes1056 Posts: 2,996 Member
    I'm loving this show!!! But I am also a huge liberal.

    If you have xfinity you can get HBO for $10/mo and watch online thru them.

    Have you seen the West Wing? It's by the same producer and it's awesome!
  • osc79
    osc79 Posts: 52 Member
    I'm a middle of the road guy, who leans more towards being conservative. I am Catholic, Latino, I believe in Angels and this show is good. The premise of the show is what got me. The idea that there could be a newsroom that would only report the facts. Unlike our current media situation, which is either too Liberal or too Conservative and nothing is getting accomplished.
  • archgrrrl
    archgrrrl Posts: 62
    My husband and I just watched this show last night for the first time. I thought it was a great show - interesting and humorous characters and a fascinating premise (ACTUAL honest NEWS reporting - instead of opinion-filled commentary that no one gives a crap about!).

    Jeff Daniel's character's speech was awesome. If you haven't seen this show, I would highly recommend it. I'm looking forward to watching the next episode!
  • dorothytd
    dorothytd Posts: 1,138 Member
    I'm not going to get involved in the debate, but need to comment that I absolutely love this show so far. First "drama" I've been interested in for a very long time. I don't even look at MFP for the whole hour. More significantly, I watch it at 10pm Sunday night. Past bedtime!
  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
    Facts are hard to deny.

    I don't doubt those statistics. I just don't think those are enough to draw that kind of conclusion.

    Now, do I doubt his conclusion? Not at all. I just think there are way too many other factors that have brought us to this point.

    Well the quote he listed is not the whole quote, but it does get the point across. If that is all we lead in it means we don't lead the world in education, health care, feeding our citizens, growing middle class, equality in the work place, etc. it seems pretty clear to me that if the above 3 things are the only things we are best at, we are not the best country in the world. Why do you have a problem with the conclusion?

    I don't doubt the conclusion. I just think there is much more to consider.
  • archgrrrl
    archgrrrl Posts: 62
    I'm loving this show!!! But I am also a huge liberal.

    If you have xfinity you can get HBO for $10/mo and watch online thru them.

    Also, I didn't get the impression from watching the first episode that it was "left" (or "right") leaning. More of a "let's get back to the kind of reporting and investigative journalism that greats like Morrow and Cronkite did". *shrug* I didn't pick up a particular political bent to the show.
  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
    Facts are hard to deny.

    I don't doubt those statistics. I just don't think those are enough to draw that kind of conclusion.

    Now, do I doubt his conclusion? Not at all. I just think there are way too many other factors that have brought us to this point.
    There are. Google Jeff Daniels rant on "The Newsroom" and you can hear the whole thing. He was inspiring to listen to.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    Will do!
  • k8blujay2
    k8blujay2 Posts: 4,941 Member
    I like the show... and I'm a libertarian Republican that also "believes in Angels"... I like Aaron Sorkin's writing... even though he is a Democrat, he does a really good job of being moderated... he doesn't turn Republicans into some stark raving lunatics that have more in common with Steve Colbert's caricature than a normal person.
  • future_runner
    future_runner Posts: 136 Member
    Facts are hard to deny.

    I don't doubt those statistics. I just don't think those are enough to draw that kind of conclusion.

    Now, do I doubt his conclusion? Not at all. I just think there are way too many other factors that have brought us to this point.

    Well the quote he listed is not the whole quote, but it does get the point across. If that is all we lead in it means we don't lead the world in education, health care, feeding our citizens, growing middle class, equality in the work place, etc. it seems pretty clear to me that if the above 3 things are the only things we are best at, we are not the best country in the world. Why do you have a problem with the conclusion?

    I don't doubt the conclusion. I just think there is much more to consider.

    Yep you said that. Like what?
  • Jesstruhan
    Jesstruhan Posts: 331 Member
    This is currently one of the, if not THE, best show on TV right now. At least the most well written. Sorkin has a furiously paced dialogue that DEMANDS your attention. Every time I step out of the room we have to pause the show so no detail is missed, because the details really do matter to him. I don't mean to insult other TV writers by way of saying they aren't as good, but I DO mean to say that Sorkin is a master of his craft.

    The speech at the outset of the show is explosive but really keeps you watching because it hits a nerve. It hurts to read. It hurts more to hear it so eloquently summarized. I think the whole of the speech was better than its component parts. To portion the first half of the speech alone is to miss part of the argument. His recovery after the rant is fantastic.

    "We aren't the greatest country in the world anymore. But we can be."

    I just did a quick google to see if I could grab the rest of the speech but all I found were amusing headlines from different newsmedia picking the show apart. One of the titles was "Angry Liberals Lecturing America". BWAHAHAHAHAHHA
  • ItsCasey
    ItsCasey Posts: 4,021 Member
    I would like to know which country IS the greatest in the world. Maybe all of you can pack up and move there.
  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
    Yep you said that. Like what?

    Poor leadership from both sides of the aisle, entitlement program misuse, unions and special interest groups.
  • BigDaddyBRC
    BigDaddyBRC Posts: 2,395 Member
    First, let me guess...you never served 1 Day in Uniform...have you?

    Take anything out of context and you can make an argument for the opposite.

    There is NO GREATER COUNTRY!
    More Defense Spending? Because the world EXPECTS the USA to fix it's own problems.
    More belief in Angels? Because our country was FOUNDED on religious beliefs and Freedoms of oppression.

    yada yada yada....If you dont like it here. Renounce your citizenship and TRY to live as Free as you do now with the luxuries you have. And if you do like your freedoms and the money you make, and everything else that comes with being a US Citizen, STOP SAYING OUR COUNTRY SUCKS. The government is not the greatest, but this country IS!
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,992 Member
    I would like to know which country IS the greatest in the world. Maybe all of you can pack up and move there.
    It's probably Sweden and if you're willing to PAY for the move, I'll go.:laugh:

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  • _Elemenopee_
    _Elemenopee_ Posts: 2,665 Member
    I can't even express how much I love this show and we're only what, 3 episodes in? AWESOME!

    ETA: I love my country and wouldn't trade it for anywhere else in the world! Would I like to see changes in the way things are run, ruled, controlled, and all the things that have gone down the $#itter? Of course! Still the best Country in the world, to me!
  • macpatti
    macpatti Posts: 4,280 Member
    Not sure why these three things are negative:
    Most incarcerated criminals? Perhaps that suggests that we have better law enforcement and keeping criminals off the street. To me, that's a plus.
    More people who believe in angels? Another plus to me.
    We pay more on defense? Right. The USA does far more for other countries than any other country.

    I'm staying where I am.
  • DarkFlutter
    DarkFlutter Posts: 336 Member
    THIS SHOW IS FANTASTIC!

    Though I'm leaning more to Mac's character than Jeff Daniels as a favorite.

    Glad to see him back though...I always liked him.
  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
    First, let me guess...you never served 1 Day in Uniform...have you?

    Take anything out of context and you can make an argument for the opposite.

    There is NO GREATER COUNTRY!
    More Defense Spending? Because the world EXPECTS the USA to fix it's own problems.
    More belief in Angels? Because our country was FOUNDED on religious beliefs and Freedoms of oppression.

    yada yada yada....If you dont like it here. Renounce your citizenship and TRY to live as Free as you do now with the luxuries you have. And if you do like your freedoms and the money you make, and everything else that comes with being a US Citizen, STOP SAYING OUR COUNTRY SUCKS. The government is not the greatest, but this country IS!

    This is a very good point. Not to mention the fact that we can talk about these things freely on the internet.

    If you were/are a soldier, thank you for your service.
  • cdngrl81
    cdngrl81 Posts: 434 Member
    First, let me guess...you never served 1 Day in Uniform...have you?

    Take anything out of context and you can make an argument for the opposite.

    There is NO GREATER COUNTRY!
    More Defense Spending? Because the world EXPECTS the USA to fix it's own problems.
    More belief in Angels? Because our country was FOUNDED on religious beliefs and Freedoms of oppression.

    yada yada yada....If you dont like it here. Renounce your citizenship and TRY to live as Free as you do now with the luxuries you have. And if you do like your freedoms and the money you make, and everything else that comes with being a US Citizen, STOP SAYING OUR COUNTRY SUCKS. The government is not the greatest, but this country IS!

    I am not saying the US sucks, but I live in Canada and you can have the same freedom and all the luxuries you have and have FREE medical services and make more money. :smile:
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,992 Member
    First, let me guess...you never served 1 Day in Uniform...have you?
    But what does that have to do with greatness? You can serve in the service and be a total nut job and go out and kill people. It's been done.
    Take anything out of context and you can make an argument for the opposite.
    But you can also take away the sugar coating and affirm the facts.
    There is NO GREATER COUNTRY!
    Tell that to Canadians, Swedes, and Japan.
    More Defense Spending? Because the world EXPECTS the USA to fix it's own problems.
    Or because it's one of our biggest ways to DEFEND charging tax payers more and more each year.
    More belief in Angels? Because our country was FOUNDED on religious beliefs and Freedoms of oppression.
    No it was founded on religious freedom. That means believing in ANY religion. That's why it's NOT illegal to burn an American Flag if one chooses. Not that I suggest it, but is protected as Freedom of Speech.
    yada yada yada....If you dont like it here. Renounce your citizenship and TRY to live as Free as you do now with the luxuries you have. And if you do like your freedoms and the money you make, and everything else that comes with being a US Citizen, STOP SAYING OUR COUNTRY SUCKS. The government is not the greatest, but this country IS!
    Marriages are commitments. But that doesn't mean you abandon them because of a few problems. I'm committed to living here, but I don't see why we shouldn't speak up against problems that are detrimental to us. Anyway isn't that FREEDOM OF SPEECH?:wink:

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