Thoughts on Paleo

Paleo is too restrictive of a diet in my opinion. Sure, it works... You're going to struggle to get as many calories or carbs if you're on a Paleo diet, and then you'll lose weight. But it's not the only way to lose weight. Why deprive yourself of so much good food if it's unnecessary?

what good foods are you deprived of??? im confused by that.

What Magma said, except on my diet I avoid fruits unless it's a rare treat (once a week a little cup of strawberry or something.) Have been on it for 43 days now, my diet diary is public so peep it if you want to get an idea of what eating paleo style on a student budget is like! I have lost 13lbs so far and my energy levels seem a lot better than when I was carbin'. having said that, my cravings have not gone away and I've taken up soap making as a new hobby just to keep myself distracted from the thought of sweet sweet sugars...

Can I just ask... There seems to be a lot of cheese in your diary for paleo? Or are certain cheeses permitted?

What I'm actually doing is LCHF which shares it's principles with the paleo. For a no nonsense guide go here: http://www.dietdoctor.com/lchf

And yes, cheeses, cheeses galore. The hardest thing I struggle with is my protein intake which I should ideally balance with the fat. More tuna plz

Paleo is too restrictive of a diet in my opinion. Sure, it works... You're going to struggle to get as many calories or carbs if you're on a Paleo diet, and then you'll lose weight. But it's not the only way to lose weight. Why deprive yourself of so much good food if it's unnecessary?

what good foods are you deprived of??? im confused by that.

You're being deliberately obtuse. How about having fruit every day. Cheese. Milk. A slice of toast on occasion. Beans--you CANNOT TAKE AWAY MY BEANS. I know you'd argue that these aren't "good." And my vegan friends would argue that meat is killing you and isn't "good". So much of the dietary advice on this board is more philosophy than science.

naw im not.. you can still have fruit and cheese on primal. its a belief like i said -- everybody has their own. im not knocking your just way of thinking just saying that what most people think abt paleo and primal is skewed. its not abt deprivation, its abt altering and substituting changing your way of thinking; thats all.

IMO i think most people dont understand what this lifestyle is. this is not a diet in any shape or form IMO. its a lifestyle change 100% ... theres a ton more to paleo and primal then "what you eat" ... to me its a whole eye opening change, on how WHAT you eat, affects, drives, kills your body. imo to be paleo/primal you must believe in the science behind hit. which i do ten times over and could never go back to eating the way i did before... i see the comments "i dont really eat sugary things" so much and i dont think that anybody really understands that almost everything you eat if it is not fresh foods has sugar and crap in it. do you eat dressing? tons of sugar.. do you have k-up? sugar, mayo? sugar, crab salad? sugar, everything has sugar in it! i dont think most people look at the ingredients, only the "nutritional value" of things. i thought i didn't really eat so much wheat, then i realized almost everything i ate had wheat in it.

Science is not something you believe in. Either the research proves you correct, you find out you're way off base or it takes you somewhere else entirely. What you're describing sounds more like religion to me and if you find that worshipping at the church of paleo is what it takes for you to lose weight, then go for it, whatever works, right?. As for your list of wicked foods... well, I buy lovely fancy mayo which does not feature sugar as an ingredient, crab salad sounds disgusting, I make my dressing myself from oil and vinegar and wtf is a k-up? It sounds like the sort of protein shake they sell on late night infomercials.

Similarly, everything I eat is *not* made of wheat. Maybe you're the sort of person who once thought an informercial protein shake and a bowl of pasta was the height of gourmet dining, but I managed to get fat the old fashioned way: an excess of gin martinis, too many lamb cutlets (ooh, paleo, paleo!!!), a dedication to inhaling any and all olives set before me and a love affair with basmati rice.

This is why paleo is such a joke; its followers are so blindsided by their new-found sense of dietary superiority that they can't present a reasonable argument, resorting to scare tactics 'cancer, cancer, diabetusssssssss' and putting down other people's (often very sensible) dietary choices. Paleo diet books should come with a free guide on how not to come off as a sanctimonious twit.

Science is not something you believe in. Either the research proves you correct, you find out you're way off base or it takes you somewhere else entirely. What you're describing sounds more like religion to me and if you find that worshipping at the church of paleo is what it takes for you to lose weight, then go for it, whatever works, right?. As for your list of wicked foods... well, I buy lovely fancy mayo which does not feature sugar as an ingredient, crab salad sounds disgusting, I make my dressing myself from oil and vinegar and wtf is a k-up? It sounds like the sort of protein shake they sell on late night infomercials.

Similarly, everything I eat is *not* made of wheat. Maybe you're the sort of person who once thought an informercial protein shake and a bowl of pasta was the height of gourmet dining, but I managed to get fat the old fashioned way: an excess of gin martinis, too many lamb cutlets (ooh, paleo, paleo!!!), a dedication to inhaling any and all olives set before me and a love affair with basmati rice.

This is why paleo is such a joke; its followers are so blindsided by their new-found sense of dietary superiority that they can't present a reasonable argument, resorting to scare tactics 'cancer, cancer, diabetusssssssss' and putting down other people's (often very sensible) dietary choices. Paleo diet books should come with a free guide on how not to come off as a sanctimonious twit.

Okay, maybe its just me, but I've never witnessed this.

This sounds more like resentment of particularly pushy people than something intrinsically wrong with the concept.

Again, what is disagreeable about the food choices that is recommended under Paleo?

I'll admit, you probably know more about it than me so I'm open to seeing its downside beyond a few annoying people.

IMO i think most people dont understand what this lifestyle is. this is not a diet in any shape or form IMO. its a lifestyle change 100% ... theres a ton more to paleo and primal then "what you eat" ... to me its a whole eye opening change, on how WHAT you eat, affects, drives, kills your body. imo to be paleo/primal you must believe in the science behind hit. which i do ten times over and could never go back to eating the way i did before... i see the comments "i dont really eat sugary things" so much and i dont think that anybody really understands that almost everything you eat if it is not fresh foods has sugar and crap in it. do you eat dressing? tons of sugar.. do you have k-up? sugar, mayo? sugar, crab salad? sugar, everything has sugar in it! i dont think most people look at the ingredients, only the "nutritional value" of things. i thought i didn't really eat so much wheat, then i realized almost everything i ate had wheat in it.

Science is not something you believe in. Either the research proves you correct, you find out you're way off base or it takes you somewhere else entirely. What you're describing sounds more like religion to me and if you find that worshipping at the church of paleo is what it takes for you to lose weight, then go for it, whatever works, right?. As for your list of wicked foods... well, I buy lovely fancy mayo which does not feature sugar as an ingredient, crab salad sounds disgusting, I make my dressing myself from oil and vinegar and wtf is a k-up? It sounds like the sort of protein shake they sell on late night infomercials.

Similarly, everything I eat is *not* made of wheat. Maybe you're the sort of person who once thought an informercial protein shake and a bowl of pasta was the height of gourmet dining, but I managed to get fat the old fashioned way: an excess of gin martinis, too many lamb cutlets (ooh, paleo, paleo!!!), a dedication to inhaling any and all olives set before me and a love affair with basmati rice.

This is why paleo is such a joke; its followers are so blindsided by their new-found sense of dietary superiority that they can't present a reasonable argument, resorting to scare tactics 'cancer, cancer, diabetusssssssss' and putting down other people's (often very sensible) dietary choices. Paleo diet books should come with a free guide on how not to come off as a sanctimonious twit.

disagree.. plenty of "Science" thats bs and i dont believe in.

Paleo makes some sense, bt it really doesn't answer a few questions.
1. Didn't cave people die at or before age 30?
2. Didn't cave people only eat that way because that's all they had available.
And, as a side bar, I think the asian cave people probably ate rice, right? So, were focused on American cave people? LOL. This whoel part confuses the hell out of me.
3. Is there any eveidence that Paleo people are living longer than non-paleo people?
4. I thought animal meats were bad for the human body, thus the out-pouring of vegetarians and vegans? So, why did that suddenly shift?
5. If we had an unfrozen caveman suddenly appear in society, he/she would probably be stoked to eat ice cream. Just a guess, but I'm pretty sure the only reason they didn't eat ice cream is because they didn't have refrigeration. That problem is solved. So, have at it.

Science is not something you believe in. Either the research proves you correct, you find out you're way off base or it takes you somewhere else entirely. What you're describing sounds more like religion to me and if you find that worshipping at the church of paleo is what it takes for you to lose weight, then go for it, whatever works, right?. As for your list of wicked foods... well, I buy lovely fancy mayo which does not feature sugar as an ingredient, crab salad sounds disgusting, I make my dressing myself from oil and vinegar and wtf is a k-up? It sounds like the sort of protein shake they sell on late night infomercials.

Similarly, everything I eat is *not* made of wheat. Maybe you're the sort of person who once thought an informercial protein shake and a bowl of pasta was the height of gourmet dining, but I managed to get fat the old fashioned way: an excess of gin martinis, too many lamb cutlets (ooh, paleo, paleo!!!), a dedication to inhaling any and all olives set before me and a love affair with basmati rice.

This is why paleo is such a joke; its followers are so blindsided by their new-found sense of dietary superiority that they can't present a reasonable argument, resorting to scare tactics 'cancer, cancer, diabetusssssssss' and putting down other people's (often very sensible) dietary choices. Paleo diet books should come with a free guide on how not to come off as a sanctimonious twit.

Okay, maybe its just me, but I've never witnessed this.

This sounds more like resentment of particularly pushy people than something intrinsically wrong with the concept.

Again, what is disagreeable about the food choices that is recommended under Paleo?

I'll admit, you probably know more about it than me so I'm open to seeing its downside beyond a few annoying people.

Personally I have nothing against eating grass fed meat, wild caught fish, and plenty of vegetables. But then we have the grains will kill you and make your children deformed rubbish followed by "dairy causes inflammation and inflammation causes cancer and ohmigodddddddddddddddddddd you will die while I will live to 100" rubbish. This isn't just rubbish spouted by the daft paleo fanclub here but by the high priests of the cult. We need balanced diets in order to lose weight, not obsessiveness bordering on disordered eating.

I like dairy, grains, and peanuts way too much to cut them out. More importantly, I don't believe the "science" that suggests these foods are bad for me.

Paleo types get a bad rap because of the evangelicals who insist anyone who does not do Paleo is brainwashed by food corporations and the government and addicted to junk food. The whole "it's just whole foods; how can you be against whole foods?" schtick gets old. Dairy, grains and legumes are whole foods. It's not a whole foods diet. It's a low-carb diet with a caveman marketing ploy. The forbidden foods just happen to be high in carb. It's a coincidence, I'm sure.

Actually, and this is just my observation, the forbidden foods would be better categorized as foods that were the by products of high refinement and agriculture.

Which not only includes grains but manufactured vegetable oils.

But agree, I don't understand the issue with beans and nuts, and didn't know that they were on the 'bad' list with Paleo.

I like dairy, grains, and peanuts way too much to cut them out. More importantly, I don't believe the "science" that suggests these foods are bad for me.

Paleo types get a bad rap because of the evangelicals who insist anyone who does not do Paleo is brainwashed by food corporations and the government and addicted to junk food. The whole "it's just whole foods; how can you be against whole foods?" schtick gets old. Dairy, grains and legumes are whole foods. It's not a whole foods diet. It's a low-carb diet with a caveman marketing ploy. The forbidden foods just happen to be high in carb. It's a coincidence, I'm sure.

Actually, and this is just my observation, the forbidden foods would be better categorized as foods that were the by products of high refinement and agriculture.

Which not only includes grains but manufactured vegetable oils.

But agree, I don't understand the issue with beans and nuts, and didn't know that they were on the 'bad' list with Paleo.

When was the last time you wrestled a chickpea to the ground and beat it into submission before dragging its bloody carcass home for the family to feast on?

Never, but I'm not sure I get your point? (Yes I know that was meant as a pointed joke)

Are you saying that chickpeas are bad or good or that Paleo has an issue with it?

why should I completely eliminate these foods instead of just having them in moderation within a balanced diet?

Don't be stupid - grains are killing all of us. Americans consume grains because of a great conspiracy between the government and the farming industry. All of the clinical studies done to show that grains are harmful have been buried by the governemnt cover up. Gary Taubes is a genius - all hail Gary Taubes.

The above is a small example of what to expect from the Paleo community. Yes, by all means do your research and proceed with caution. IMHO, there's nothing wrong with eating a balanced nutritional diet and exercising on a regular basis. Keep it simple.

Okay, other than personal slams on the 'Paleo community', so far I haven't heard much that should be disagreeable. I admit, I need to do more research before I can speak with any depth.

Why would the concept of eating whole foods trigger such a disproportionate back lash?

Because people are so addicted to the fast food, chain restaurants and junk, processed food products the thought of having to give them up makes people lose their minds.

That's not true at all. That's one of those things you say when you can't come up with a valid argument.

The backlash is because Paleo tells you to cut out a large variety of foods such as legumes, grains, and dairy. While the current fad is to say those things are bad for you, there is a lot of research that reveals those things are good for you. The whole food concept of Paleo is good. Cutting out food groups just because some guy said you should? Not so good.

I like dairy, grains, and peanuts way too much to cut them out. More importantly, I don't believe the "science" that suggests these foods are bad for me.

Paleo types get a bad rap because of the evangelicals who insist anyone who does not do Paleo is brainwashed by food corporations and the government and addicted to junk food. The whole "it's just whole foods; how can you be against whole foods?" schtick gets old. Dairy, grains and legumes are whole foods. It's not a whole foods diet. It's a low-carb diet with a caveman marketing ploy. The forbidden foods just happen to be high in carb. It's a coincidence, I'm sure.

Actually, and this is just my observation, the forbidden foods would be better categorized as foods that were the by products of high refinement and agriculture.

Which not only includes grains but manufactured vegetable oils.

But agree, I don't understand the issue with beans and nuts, and didn't know that they were on the 'bad' list with Paleo.

Almond flour is allowed, but milk, beans and peanuts are not. Which seems more refined to you?

It's a low-carb, high-fat diet. If you don't believe me, go to Mark's Daily Apple and search for the carbohydrate curve.

What slays me about this lifestyle is that many of the adherents really believe it's impossible to develop diabetes or any sort of disease requiring western medical intervention while on this diet. Many of them think eating coconut oil will keep them from getting skin cancer better than sunscreen. It's that kind a cult like aspect that puts me off. I'm not dogging the diet, low-carb works for many people. It's all the other stuff that's creepy as hell.

Paleo makes some sense, bt it really doesn't answer a few questions.
1. Didn't cave people die at or before age 30?
2. Didn't cave people only eat that way because that's all they had available.
And, as a side bar, I think the asian cave people probably ate rice, right? So, were focused on American cave people? LOL. This whoel part confuses the hell out of me.
3. Is there any eveidence that Paleo people are living longer than non-paleo people?
4. I thought animal meats were bad for the human body, thus the out-pouring of vegetarians and vegans? So, why did that suddenly shift?
5. If we had an unfrozen caveman suddenly appear in society, he/she would probably be stoked to eat ice cream. Just a guess, but I'm pretty sure the only reason they didn't eat ice cream is because they didn't have refrigeration. That problem is solved. So, have at it.

1. Yes, the lifespan of paleolithic people was much shorter than it is today. They had to contend with diseases/complications that are now easily prevented by modern medicine (like an infection). However, due to their diet and active lifestyle, they probably wouldn't have ever developed obesity-related diseases that many people suffer from today, like cardiovascular disease and diabetes.

2. Yes, obviously. But that's kind of part of the paleo argument - people ate certain available foods for long periods of time and therefore become "well-adapted" to eating them.
Paleolithic people are those that lived before the advent of agriculture - that's why grains and rice aren't allowed in the paleo diet.

3. I don't think so - pretty sure that the diet hasn't been around long enough to do a long-term study like that.

4. I personally see nothing wrong with meat, so I haven't ever explored that line of argument.

5. Not even touching this "question"

1. No one really did until around the 1960's or 70's.
2. But, that was just availablbility issue. It doesn't mean they would not have eaten them if they were available.
3. News flash: There never will be that study. Just a hunch though.
4. Yeah, that's the problem. Which is correct? Is meat bad or good?
5. OK, fair enough. That was a twist.

My thoughts on the paleo diet: The full name of the program is the paleolithic diet. Paleolithic people? Cavemen. Out of necessity, cavemen were nomadic and couldn't really farm all that much, so the only growing things they could eat were things they foraged, and they couldn't farm cattle for dairy. They subsisted primarily on meat and fat, because that's what you get when you have to hunt for your food. But they were also extremely active, since survival kind of depended on it- they had to hunt, they had to be able to escape predators, they had to walk from place to place, and meat and fat provide the necessary energy for that kind of life. We aren't cavemen though. We tend to drive everywhere, we aren't running from predators on a regular basis, and we simply don't need as many calories as cavemen did. So while some of the concepts of the paleo diet are good, I really don't think it's somthing to get religious about unless you need to for health reasons. I'm not lactose intolerant, I don't have celiac disease, and I'm not diabetic. Dairy and grains are certainly not poisonous, and they aren't going to kill me.

Regarding 'inflammation' caused by dairy and grains: Well, my energy levels are fine, the only joint pain I have is from an injury, and the basic science of calories in vs. calories out seems to work fine for weight loss as long as I exercise (and I'm almost 32, so I don't have some crazy metabolism like a kid) I don't really see how this could be a hidden problem that I don't realize I have. It's a gimick.

My point in a nut shell: I suppose paleo can work for you, but I don't really think it's necessary.