Thoughts on Paleo
Replies
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Whoa! So much hostility about food.
To the OP, if you're looking to get some good information on Paleo and what it's about, the science behind it, ect. then you should read "The Paleo Diet" by Dr. Loren. It's very insightful!
Good luck!
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Paleo makes some sense, bt it really doesn't answer a few questions.
1. Didn't cave people die at or before age 30?
2. Didn't cave people only eat that way because that's all they had available.
And, as a side bar, I think the asian cave people probably ate rice, right? So, were focused on American cave people? LOL. This whoel part confuses the hell out of me.
3. Is there any eveidence that Paleo people are living longer than non-paleo people?
4. I thought animal meats were bad for the human body, thus the out-pouring of vegetarians and vegans? So, why did that suddenly shift?
5. If we had an unfrozen caveman suddenly appear in society, he/she would probably be stoked to eat ice cream. Just a guess, but I'm pretty sure the only reason they didn't eat ice cream is because they didn't have refrigeration. That problem is solved. So, have at it.
1. Yes, the lifespan of paleolithic people was much shorter than it is today. They had to contend with diseases/complications that are now easily prevented by modern medicine (like an infection). However, due to their diet and active lifestyle, they probably wouldn't have ever developed obesity-related diseases that many people suffer from today, like cardiovascular disease and diabetes.
2. Yes, obviously. But that's kind of part of the paleo argument - people ate certain available foods for long periods of time and therefore become "well-adapted" to eating them.
Paleolithic people are those that lived before the advent of agriculture - that's why grains and rice aren't allowed in the paleo diet.
3. I don't think so - pretty sure that the diet hasn't been around long enough to do a long-term study like that.
4. I personally see nothing wrong with meat, so I haven't ever explored that line of argument.
5. Not even touching this "question"
1. No one really did until around the 1960's or 70's.
2. But, that was just availablbility issue. It doesn't mean they would not have eaten them if they were available.
3. News flash: There never will be that study. Just a hunch though.
4. Yeah, that's the problem. Which is correct? Is meat bad or good?
5. OK, fair enough. That was a twist.
What happened in the 60's and 70's that changed the way Americans eat?
The government adopted the low fat/high carb diet as gospel. Processed foods like cereals exploded. It snowballed from there.
Every diet has the fanatics that take things to the extreme. If you are listening to people on the internet about nuances of diet, you're in for a world of misinformation and dispute.
Find someone well versed and knowledgeable about a subject (like the often mentioned Mark Sisson) read his introductory stuff, and decide for yourself if it makes sense.
It clicked for me and I've been incredibly successful following a primal diet. I'm rarely hungry after eating a normal primal meal. I tried and failed over and over again with Nutrisystem, calorie counting, low fat, etc.
Losing almost 50 lbs in 7 months on primal has been the easiest long term weight loss I've ever achieved, and no other diet came close to these results. I can't speak highly enough about how well it has worked for me.0 -
And one more thought: I personally don't have time to grow my own food, and I live in west Texas where gardening is really kind of impossible anyway with the drought conditions, so I eat what I buy at the grocery store. I gained weight because I stopped exercising and was eating WAY too much food, not because government conspiracy is killing me. Now I eat in moderation and I exercise, and lo and behold, I'm losing weight and I feel great. And I eat carbs and cheese.
It's kind of about accountability.0 -
I did the Paleo diet for 30 days and had great results. I did not follow it completely but still had lost weight.
Good Luck!0 -
Take gluten and dairy for example, I am a person who has no problem eating gluten and is not lactose intolerant...why should I completely eliminate these foods instead of just having them in moderation within a balanced diet?
Ummmm hello, inflammation.
Even if you don't know that you have it, it is there, making you feel forever less good. Chemicals from processed foods will build up in this inflammation and will give you cancer. The inflammation will cause nutrients to not work and not be absorbed and you will not be healthy. This will cause large insulin spikes when you eat any food containing even a grain of processed sugar which will make you fat and make it impossible to diet off.
Your trying to tell me everyone who consumes gluten and dairy get cancer?
Apparently some don't see the blatant sarcasm in my post.
The comedy of which is the not sarcastic post immediately following mine. LOL.
Paleo is the cure to all that could possibly ail you. If everyone were Paleo, medicine and doctors would be obsolete.0 -
The premise of the Paleo diet is absurd.
People were ENORMOUSLY UNHEALTHY in prehistoric times.
They died at 40 or earlier.
Why would you want to emulate any part of that? Are we all just getting stupider?0 -
The premise of the Paleo diet is absurd.
People were ENORMOUSLY UNHEALTHY in prehistoric times.
They died at 40 or earlier.
Why would you want to emulate any part of that? Are we all just getting stupider?
What all do you know about it beside the basic premise?
Is the diet otherwise not sound?0 -
My thoughts on the paleo diet: The full name of the program is the paleolithic diet. Paleolithic people? Cavemen. Out of necessity, cavemen were nomadic and couldn't really farm all that much, so the only growing things they could eat were things they foraged, and they couldn't farm cattle for dairy. They subsisted primarily on meat and fat, because that's what you get when you have to hunt for your food. But they were also extremely active, since survival kind of depended on it- they had to hunt, they had to be able to escape predators, they had to walk from place to place, and meat and fat provide the necessary energy for that kind of life. We aren't cavemen though. We tend to drive everywhere, we aren't running from predators on a regular basis, and we simply don't need as many calories as cavemen did. So while some of the concepts of the paleo diet are good, I really don't think it's somthing to get religious about unless you need to for health reasons. I'm not lactose intolerant, I don't have celiac disease, and I'm not diabetic. Dairy and grains are certainly not poisonous, and they aren't going to kill me.
Regarding 'inflammation' caused by dairy and grains: Well, my energy levels are fine, the only joint pain I have is from an injury, and the basic science of calories in vs. calories out seems to work fine for weight loss as long as I exercise (and I'm almost 32, so I don't have some crazy metabolism like a kid) I don't really see how this could be a hidden problem that I don't realize I have. It's a gimick.
My point in a nut shell: I suppose paleo can work for you, but I don't really think it's necessary.
This is always my main point, i.e., the paleolithic man only ate what was available because that's the only choice they had. It wasn't for any other reason. So, to now hold it up on a pedestal is silly.
There was a book written in the 60's or 70's called "Mucusless Diet Healing System" by Arnold Ehret.
The Paleo stuff is not new or revolutionary.0 -
Not all Paleos are crazed and will spout out that this way of eating and living is the "best" for everyone. I follow a pretty strict Paleo diet except for the occasional cheese (gfcheddar) or alcoholic drinks. I love what it's done for my body. It's not really about weight loss. I do count calories...otherwise I wouldn't be on MFP. It's about not putting toxins into your body by way of processed foods. It's eating real foods prepared by yourself, and enjoying how they make you feel. I've never been happier & healthier. My body fat % has dropped significantly since going Paleo. However, if you find some other way of eating and living works better for you, I think that's awesome. Not all Paleos crush vegans, vegetarians, etc. I do think grains & gluten are potentially toxic to your body, though. And...I do think that getting your carbs from limited fruits and lots of veggies is the way to go...for me. Some of you are spouting off lies about the way Paleo people act. You're being very stereotypical. Not all of us are SAD-haters. Everyone should experiment with food and different ways of eating to find the way that makes them happiest & healthiest. SAD did NOT work for me....but Paleo does. I have abs for the first time in my life...without doing a million crunches either! I have less cellulite (actually hardly any now!) since doing Paleo. I never feel deprived. If I want something SAD...I will, but I know that it's going to make me feel like ****. I eat out all the time. I don't preach to my non-Paleo friends ever. Please don't make broad generalizations about ALL Paleos unless you've really talked to us. 0
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Hey all - first time poster here.
I thoroughly researched the Paleo diet a while back and encountered the same odd dogmatism I am seeing here. It caused me to develop a new rule when looking for any kind of dietary or medical advice: listen to the guy who's not trying to sell you anything, be it book, miracle food or supplement.
What I did find is this:
http://www.archevore.com/
A blog written by a doctor who started out as being intrigued by the Paleo diet, but decided to eliminate any parts of hit he found to be pure fantasy. He clearly explains his reasons why, and his diet goes like this: Here are 12 rules. Start at the top and adopt as many as you feel comfortable with. The End.
He ranks them in order of importance, and most importantly - he explains WHY he ranks them that way. And perhaps most importantly of all - he gives all this advice away for free. There's no book, no video, no supplements, nothing at all to buy.
I have heard his diet referred to as "Paleo 2.0". And I think even he would balk at the concept of someone being ridiculously dogmatic and making inflammatory statements like "you will get cancer if you keep eating that" or whatever.
Anyway. I tried and enjoyed it for a while before falling off the wagon. Check it out. Perhaps it will work for you.
Good luck. 0 -
Being a neanderthal myself, I can say with definitive authority that cavemen are absolutely saturated with pure awesomeness.
That being said, we cavemen are not exactly known for our "healthy lifestyles." I would closely scrutinize any "diet" from a group of people who's average life-expectancy was 23, and anyone living past 30 was "really, really, really f**king old."0 -
My crossfit instructor recommended that I start a paleo diet...does anyone have any experience with this diets? What are your thoughts? Any tips with starting out?
Thanks!
Try it for 3-4 weeks, see how you feel. If you don't like it/don't see results/don't feel good, stop doing it. I follow a Primal way of eating and my health is better and the weight is coming off without feeling like I am "sacrificing" anything. It's not for everyone.0 -
Is the diet otherwise not sound?
There isn't anything particularly wrong with the diet itself, other than villification of foods that are JUST FINE. I personally couldn't/wouldn't do it because a) there is no scientific basis that establishes that this way of eating is healthier than a well balanced diet and b) it pretty much cuts out a huge number of foods that I couldn't live without.
But, if you have carbs/sugars are eeevil leanings, this might be an easy diet for you to follow/get behind.0 -
[I believe the issue with chickpeas is that they're cultivated. The entire philosophy behind paleo seems to be that as soon as we settled down to farm we began to do ourselves in through a diet of grains, legumes, dairy and fruit.
Yes, as evidenced by the increasing longer life spans. :laugh:0 -
I am on the paleo diet and I love it. I have had great results from it. Although sometimes I do have a fat free diary product but that is only about once a week because I love diary, but it doesn't love me!0
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And one more thought: I personally don't have time to grow my own food, and I live in west Texas where gardening is really kind of impossible anyway with the drought conditions, so I eat what I buy at the grocery store. I gained weight because I stopped exercising and was eating WAY too much food, not because government conspiracy is killing me. Now I eat in moderation and I exercise, and lo and behold, I'm losing weight and I feel great. And I eat carbs and cheese.
It's kind of about accountability.
Amen! Same here!0 -
The grain hate is strong. I shall go die in my grain loving bliss! Fiber one cookie here I come!0
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[I believe the issue with chickpeas is that they're cultivated. The entire philosophy behind paleo seems to be that as soon as we settled down to farm we began to do ourselves in through a diet of grains, legumes, dairy and fruit.
Yes, as evidenced by the increasing longer life spans. :laugh:
Nuh uh. Everyone knows it's healthier to live hand to mouth, totally dependent on catching and finding your food than it is to stockpile grain and legumes for lean periods. Starving to death is so much more fun than suffering the indignity of a barley pilaf with lentils and a few dried apricots.0 -
Being a neanderthal myself, I can say with definitive authority that cavemen are absolutely saturated with pure awesomeness.
That being said, we cavemen are not exactly known for our "healthy lifestyles." I would closely scrutinize any "diet" from a group of people who's average life-expectancy was 23, and anyone living past 30 was "really, really, really f**king old."
yeah, they died because they would snap an ankle and couldn't outrun tigers.... not from type 2 diabetes! Give a caveman today's modern medicine and he'll be active and healthy into his 90's!0 -
teeheehee:laugh:[I believe the issue with chickpeas is that they're cultivated. The entire philosophy behind paleo seems to be that as soon as we settled down to farm we began to do ourselves in through a diet of grains, legumes, dairy and fruit.
Yes, as evidenced by the increasing longer life spans. :laugh:
Nuh uh. Everyone knows it's healthier to live hand to mouth, totally dependent on catching and finding your food than it is to stockpile grain and legumes for lean periods. Starving to death is so much more fun than suffering the indignity of a barley pilaf with lentils and a few dried apricots.0 -
Hey all - first time poster here.
I thoroughly researched the Paleo diet a while back and encountered the same odd dogmatism I am seeing here. It caused me to develop a new rule when looking for any kind of dietary or medical advice: listen to the guy who's not trying to sell you anything, be it book, miracle food or supplement.
What I did find is this:
http://www.archevore.com/
A blog written by a doctor who started out as being intrigued by the Paleo diet, but decided to eliminate any parts of hit he found to be pure fantasy. He clearly explains his reasons why, and his diet goes like this: Here are 12 rules. Start at the top and adopt as many as you feel comfortable with. The End.
He ranks them in order of importance, and most importantly - he explains WHY he ranks them that way. And perhaps most importantly of all - he gives all this advice away for free. There's no book, no video, no supplements, nothing at all to buy.
I have heard his diet referred to as "Paleo 2.0". And I think even he would balk at the concept of someone being ridiculously dogmatic and making inflammatory statements like "you will get cancer if you keep eating that" or whatever.
Anyway. I tried and enjoyed it for a while before falling off the wagon. Check it out. Perhaps it will work for you.
Good luck.
Interesting blog! I stopped after #2. I can't live without #3 and #4 for sure!0 -
Agree if we eat too much of anything will be over weight! I am somewhere in between Paleo/ Atkins. Seems to wrk well for me when I follow it!0
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A cookie won't give you cancer but research has shown inflammation is the leading cause of most disfunction in our bodies. And the leading cause of inflammation is sugar.0
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A cookie won't give you cancer but research has shown inflammation is the leading cause of most disfunction in our bodies. And the leading cause of inflammation is sugar.
Cites please? Primary sources or articles that cite them?0 -
Don't be stupid - grains are killing all of us. Americans consume grains because of a great conspiracy between the government and the farming industry. All of the clinical studies done to show that grains are harmful have been buried by the governemnt cover up. Gary Taubes is a genius - all hail Gary Taubes.why should I completely eliminate these foods instead of just having them in moderation within a balanced diet?
The above is a small example of what to expect from the Paleo community. Yes, by all means do your research and proceed with caution. IMHO, there's nothing wrong with eating a balanced nutritional diet and exercising on a regular basis. Keep it simple.
Okay, other than personal slams on the 'Paleo community', so far I haven't heard much that should be disagreeable. I admit, I need to do more research before I can speak with any depth.
Why would the concept of eating whole foods trigger such a disproportionate back lash?
Because people are so addicted to the fast food, chain restaurants and junk, processed food products the thought of having to give them up makes people lose their minds.
I've never read the book, so I definitely don't consider myself a Paleo, but it turns out I'm a little closer to that type of eating than I had realized. Over the past few weeks, I've passed on the rolls, the bread, the cereals, etc. - and of course, sugar - and gone with more greens and I've eased up on restricting the meat and fat. And weirdly, I've dropped weight, and I feel good.
As far as timeframes go, it's been quite a journey - I used to let myself have the occasional burger at BK, etc.; and if someone told me that I'd give that up, I would have told them they're nuts. I really liked them, and looked forward to them. But after a winding rode, I'm at the point where I really feel deep down, no, I don't want to put that in my body. (I confess, I do indulge in a piece of pizza about once a month, but I always pay for it... I bet by the fall, I'll have totally moved off that, too)
So, my experience has been a slow progression. I never gave up anything until it seemed the right thing to do. I really eat pretty well at this point, but I could never have made a complete switchover all at once. Baby steps.0 -
Take gluten and dairy for example, I am a person who has no problem eating gluten and is not lactose intolerant...why should I completely eliminate these foods instead of just having them in moderation within a balanced diet?
Ummmm hello, inflammation.
Even if you don't know that you have it, it is there, making you feel forever less good. Chemicals from processed foods will build up in this inflammation and will give you cancer. The inflammation will cause nutrients to not work and not be absorbed and you will not be healthy. This will cause large insulin spikes when you eat any food containing even a grain of processed sugar which will make you fat and make it impossible to diet off.
Your trying to tell me everyone who consumes gluten and dairy get cancer?
Apparently some don't see the blatant sarcasm in my post.
The comedy of which is the not sarcastic post immediately following mine. LOL.
Paleo is the cure to all that could possibly ail you. If everyone were Paleo, medicine and doctors would be obsolete.
No sarcasm doesnt always come across in text unfortunately LOL It went over a couple people's heads. That being said I'm relieved you were kidding.0 -
I think eating whole foods is a wonderful thing, especially if they are all organic. Personally, I'm not sure how anyone knows that paleolithic people were healthy. Are there preserved tissue samples that have been analyzed? DNA extracted from their teeth perhaps? I don't understand where the science is behind this so if someone has a legitimate source, I'd love to read it. (A source other than someone selling a book.) Surely that archaeological find would have been in the news or in a journal.
I come from a family of homesteaders/farmers. I think that people started to get obese when they moved off the farm, into town, and quit doing so much physical labor for a living. Add that to the post-WWII manufacture of plastics and Hungry Man dinners, and you have an obesity epidemic. I don't think we need to look as far back as prehistoric times to really understand that we need to stay away from junk food and move more.
I also fail to see how lactose and gluten are the enemy of all people. I know true Celiac's who are so pissed that everyone is now claiming to be sensitive to gluten. It has belittled their suffering and now products all over the place are claiming to be gluten-free when some of them are not. My family has a history of autoimmune disease, which I have inherited. I resent the implication that my conditions are caused by gluten. That's not how the diseases work. I see one of the top rheumatologists in my state and we have talked about diet. There is no scientific evidence to support diet as a cause for things like RA. If I had to hazard a guess, I would blame chemicals in our entire environment for weakening our bodies, especially BPA. I did, however, try going gluten and dairy free and it did not help my symptoms. In fact, my disease got worse.
I think people lose so much weight on this diet because they are eating low-carb and low-fat diets. That certainly is good for your body. So really, there is no harm in doing this diet. However I do not condone people coming on here and acting like a nutritionist and a doctor and a scientist while making claims that dairy and grains cause cancer. That's incredibly irresponsible to make such claims that are not true.0 -
Thanks for all the input guys!
I'm gonna go ahead and give it a shot, maybe 2-4 weeks just to see how it goes. I anticipate some dairy withdrawals lol0 -
This article seems to cite a lot of studies but if you're interested in reading them it shouldn't be too hard to dig them up.A cookie won't give you cancer but research has shown inflammation is the leading cause of most disfunction in our bodies. And the leading cause of inflammation is sugar.
Cites please? Primary sources or articles that cite them?
http://173.254.46.30/articles/diet/sugar-is-pro-inflammatory.html0 -
i started off trying Paleo but the organic/grain-fed foods were too expensive. hard to argue about the dangers of eating all the chemicals we do, but just pricey. i've switched to Keto and love it. it's the same sort of philosophy, but pro-dairy and you won't get a finger-wave after eating processed stuff. a difference, though, is that it's even lower-carb. the first week is as low as 25g net carbs per day to kickstart you into ketosis, before you can up the carb levels just slightly.
no sugar (including fruits) and no grains. took a few weeks before i stopped cheating, but i'm sticking to around 25g of net carbs per day and the weight has been flying off. there's a website somewhere that has a script you can download for this website to track Net Carbs.
if you really want to keep your milk and whipping cream, or don't want to buy grass-fed beef, look into Keto.0
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