Disturbing Biggest Loser article
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TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
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TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.0 -
Three cheers to Jillian who had the moral decency to step away from a bad situation.
Sounds like Ms. Michaels quit because the show was no longer meeting her marketing requirements...
"After it was announced that Michaels wouldn't be returning for Season 16 of "Loser," she told People that her departure was due to the show's negative depiction of her and how she was portrayed as tougher than before. "You saw none of the relationships, none of the bonds that I build with my clients," she said."0 -
Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
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It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
That's really not how it works, for a LOT of people. There are very good reasons why sports and military training have lots and lots of "yelling".
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It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
That's really not how it works, for a LOT of people. There are very good reasons why sports and military training have lots and lots of "yelling".
And for a LOT of other people it is how it works, what's your point?
There are very good reasons many, many people who are yelled at as motivation rebel, so again, what's your point? Roll the dice and try to see whether the person you're yelling at will be one for whom it will "work"? And if so, maybe be "that coach" whose team won a trophy so you can have that little bit to brag about? I suppose that could work. Or not. Again, roll the dice, I suppose.
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Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.0 -
Jimmyftw94 wrote: »Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.
Strict does not equal yelling.
Statistics show that being screamed at is not overall successful, particularly for children. It lowers self-esteem and tends to lower motivation. I can link a few studies if you'd like. Let me know.
Since when does discipline and "being strict" equal being yelled at?
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It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
That's really not how it works, for a LOT of people. There are very good reasons why sports and military training have lots and lots of "yelling".
And for a LOT of other people it is how it works, what's your point?
That your blanket statement is wrong.There are very good reasons many, many people who are yelled at as motivation rebel, so again, what's your point? Roll the dice and try to see whether the person you're yelling at will be one for whom it will "work"?
That's not relevant to this situation. Everybody signing up for the program KNOWS ahead of time that there's lots of yelling, so those who don't like that approach won't be (or shouldn't be) applying.
And if they go anyway, tough ****, they made their choice.0 -
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Jimmyftw94 wrote: »Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.
No, sorry.
There is no correlation between success (or lack thereof) and strict parenting.
The depressing reality is that, outside of the negative extremes, parenting has surprisingly little effect on outcomes.0 -
Can we see those statistics?Jimmyftw94 wrote: »Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.Jimmyftw94 wrote: »Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.
Strict does not equal yelling.
Statistics show that being screamed at is not overall successful, particularly for children.
Since when does discipline and "being strict" equal being yelled at?
And can we see those statistics?
Sure! Be right back.
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parenting has surprisingly little effect on outcomes.Jimmyftw94 wrote: »Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.
I don't think this is right, but everyone is entitled to their own opinion.0 -
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Here's a take on an interesting study showing "yelling" as resulting in depression, acting out and so on (obviously not exactly the discipline-and-positive-work ethic espoused here). I am trying hard to find the actual study, darned Google: http://www.news.pitt.edu/news/yelling-doesn-t-help-may-harm-adolescents-pitt-led-study-finds
Will keep searching, unfortunately I really haven't bookmarked studies I've read on this, largely because I've read them in actual books, not the internet...but will be back shortly.0 -
I find the show to be terribly de-motivational.
I think in the last episode I saw some guy had lost nearly 100lbs (or more) in about 16 weeks. 16 weeks?!?! That's just stupid. That ain't reality.
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"Authoritarian" parenting style and negative outcomes in Western societies, references (actual studies) at end of article. http://hdf600.wikispaces.com/Authoritarian+Parenting+Style+and+Child+Outcomes
Larger hipopcampus/better brain development in young children with nurturing v. yelling parenting styles. http://www.calorababy.co.za/news/stop-yelling-mom-youre-slowing-your-childs-brain-development.html
Frustrating to keep landing on paraphrasing rather than the actual studies, but am glad to suss those out for anyone who requires them.0 -
Jimmyftw94 wrote: »Jimmyftw94 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I remember some of the coaches from when I was in high school. The girls volleyball coach did the most yelling and he's the one that got them a state championship trophy.
And was it worth all that yelling?
One trophy?
It's not about the trophy.. It's the idea that hard work pays off. They're never going to learn this from having a lenient couch.
No, nor are they going to learn it from being yelled at.
What they're going to learn from that isn't that hard work pays off; it's that if they don't do very well, they'll get yelled at.
Ergo, take away the yelling = no more motivation to work hard.
So, not sure they learned much of a hard work ethic here, except that when you're not yelled at, you can slack off, but if, say, your boss screams at you, that's when to get to work.
Hopefully they all grew up to have screamer bosses so that they were able to excel in the workforce, and screaming spouses so that they were motivated to keep the house clean and so on.
This is your own theory based on no evidence or statistics.
Statistics have shown that people with strict parents are more hard working, have clearer boundaries, greater achievements, mental health and reduced social risk among other things.
Strict does not equal yelling.
Statistics show that being screamed at is not overall successful, particularly for children. It lowers self-esteem and tends to lower motivation. I can link a few studies if you'd like. Let me know.
Since when does discipline and "being strict" equal being yelled at?
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/07/110717204913.htm
Women who were taught to accept themseves lost 7% of bodyweight compared to women coached on nutrition who lost 2% of bodyweight
Positivity and self acceptance works better than negativity with long term weight management, healthy eating, and maintaining exercise
http://ncsu.edu/ffci/publications/2010/v15-n3-2010-winter/nichols-porter-peck-wade-brown.php
http://www.athleticinsight.com/Vol8Iss4/SelfTalkandPerformance.htm
"...those who used positive self-talk performed significantly better than those who used negative/mixed self-talk"
Positive self-talk improves athletic performance
Yelling and negativity are neither necessary nor helpful in weight loss or athletic performance. The trophy was won in spite of the yelling. Just think how much better they would have done without it.0 -
Sounds "mean" but I am not surprised at all...0
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It's not about the yelling. Personally I find it doesn't motivate me, but that's neither here nor there.
It's about the extremely unhealthy methods supported by the show. It's about the long-term medical damage done to the contestants. It's about feeding into the media stereotypes around fat-shaming and feeding unhealthy expectations around body image and rapid weight loss.
No, BL didn't invent any of the above, but it's certainly one of the major perpetrators of it recently, and is very influential on a lot of people. After all, what is criticizing the media for fostering unhealthy habits if not that? BL *is* media. It's fostering unhealthy habits. Should it be beyond reproach because some people find it entertaining to watch fat people suffer?
The counter-argument -- that slow, steady weight loss in a healthy, sustainable way doesn't make for "good TV" -- is the main reason why we can't let profit be the only consideration. I bet it would be "good TV" to watch people die on screen, too. People would watch. Thankfully there are laws against this, or else the Hunger Games would probably exist for real.
As for Jillian Michaels, she has done very nicely from the show, profiting by turning herself into a fitness enterprise. She got to the point where she was making more money by quitting the show and branching out. I don't think she deserves a trophy for that. It's all business, and most of her public persona (as well as her advice, like don't eat broccoli) is nonsense anyway, but hey, she's a celeb, that's what they do.0 -
I am not surprised at all because "reality" television is nothing but trash television in my opinion.0
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These people aren't forced to be there. They can leave if it's too hard.0
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DeadliftAddict wrote: »These people aren't forced to be there. They can leave if it's too hard.
Read the 6 pages of posts about this first.0 -
I've never watched the show, because it's not realistic for the rest of us at home. There's not many of us who can give over their lives to this.... we have lose weight and try to be healthy in the real world.0
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joanthemom8 wrote: »I've never watched the show, because it's not realistic for the rest of us at home. There's not many of us who can give over their lives to this.... we have lose weight and try to be healthy in the real world.
i can't imagine watching this show and thinking it's realistic for anyone else. i'd watch it because it's entertaining and that's about it.0 -
neveragain84 wrote: »It's about whether NBC and the show's creators (and everyone associated with it) are responsible for the damage that they're doing to millions of people who watch.
NBC's intentions are exploitative, reckless and profit driven, no doubt.
But the damage this show causes or has the potential to cause does have to be agreed to.
And with that said, I do feel sorry for anyone who signs up for the show and anyone duped into thinking this would be a good way to lose weight.
I'm so glad I got rid of cable TV a year ago!
Do they really know what they're getting into, though?
They probably don't, no. That's why I feel sorry for them. But it's up to them to investigate every angle independently before signing up or confer with someone in the know who is relatively unbiased. Plus, they've probably watched the show so although they may be unfamiliar with the real medical risks, they do have an inkling of the suffering and hardship involved.
This. Can't help but to feel bad for them. Yes they choose to do it, but I'm sure wanting to lose weight is just as important as the money. Unrealistic eating and exercising goals are a recipe for disaster and one, paycheck or not, I probably wouldn't be willing to push myself towards.
the money of $900 a week? that isn't a lot of money. i doubt that's a big motivator at all.
I'm guessing it's the prize money that's really the motivator.
On the flip side of this, there are people that pay $2,500 a week to go to a Biggest Loser resort (there are 3 of them). The website makes it sound more like a spa with some activity and cooking lessons thrown in.
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On the flip side of this, there are people that pay $2,500 a week to go to a Biggest Loser resort (there are 3 of them). The website makes it sound more like a spa with some activity and cooking lessons thrown in.
"Fat camp" has been around forever. Not surprising that someone would capitalize on the popularity of the show by opening some branded ones.
I presume that they don't put the participants through the torture that the contestants get. After all, there's no money in shaming people in private.0 -
The counter-argument -- that slow, steady weight loss in a healthy, sustainable way doesn't make for "good TV" -- is the main reason why we can't let profit be the only consideration. I bet it would be "good TV" to watch people die on screen, too. People would watch. Thankfully there are laws against this, or else the Hunger Games would probably exist for real.
Hell yeah. History and the Roman Empire prove this to be true.0 -
joanthemom8 wrote: »I've never watched the show, because it's not realistic for the rest of us at home. There's not many of us who can give over their lives to this.... we have lose weight and try to be healthy in the real world.
i can't imagine watching this show and thinking it's realistic for anyone else. i'd watch it because it's entertaining and that's about it.
I don't even find it entertaining, really. It just makes me sad.
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