Fining Parents of Bullies

UsedToBeHusky

And let's say that most parents are like you. What about the ones that are already on budgets that are stretched to their limit? $100-200 means utilities and food to these families.

I know. I don't know the solution or the plan they have in place. Hopefully the family would have to go before a judge and let the judge make the call. Perhaps community service in lieu of payment as they do for other cases?

I'm not saying I agree with this, nor am I saying this would work. I'm wondering myself.

I think it would no more deter bullying than a ticket deters texting while driving and speeding.

My solution would be to call parents and schedule a counseling session with them and their child, discussing bullying and putting an action plan in place. Or as a most severe measure, community service for the child since it is THEIR behavior that is at fault.

That is a much more sensible approach.

Parents and teachers have to work together to curb this behavior, not against each other.

whierd

They need to just paddle them the way we got paddled when we messed up! Enough of this no spanking, no paddling BS! And if they keep it up...kick them out of school, 1st offense...no second chances. Eventually, the bully will get the point.

Furthermore, kicking them out of school would only ensure that they live a crappy life and likely become unproductive members of society at best, and criminals at worst.

Short sightedness.

DalekBrittany

IDK, the first thing that came to mind was that some kid beats up other kids on the playground, because he gets beat up at home and thinks it's okay. Add a 200 dollar fine on top of getting a call from a teacher and the kid gets the **** beat out of him...it just sounds like sticky situation. Obviously, this is not the case with every bully, but that is the scenario that played in my mind.

I also come back to nature vs. nurture, but not that everything has to be one or the other. Bullying does not have to be learned at home. Some kids are just unruly and maybe have some sort of deeper issue that has not been discovered. A parent may be having trouble teaching their kid not to do that, and then now they've gotta figure out how to pay a 200 dollar fine for their child's behavior and how they are gonna buy groceries/pay bills/etc. I grew up in a home where a difference of 200 dollars is the difference between eating something of substantial quality and having to scrape leftovers and share a pack of Ramen with my siblings.

ldrosophila

Instead of fining or putting people in jail why not start at the heart of the problem and get these kids some counseling and maybe some empathy training.

People are bullies because they feel not empathy for their victims. They have no concept about what it feels like to be someone else.

Many of us do not hurt someone with word or violence because we understand the pain that other person will endure. Unless they are some sort of sadist most people dont like to see someone hurt.

AlongCame_Molly

Sounds interesting, but I sure wouldn't want to have to cough up money every time my kid behaves like a douche when my back is turned. Yeah, a lot of bad behavior from kids can be traced back to lack of discipline from the parents, but there ARE just some out-of-control kids out there who will do what they want, regardless of parental involvement or consequences.

Ask me how I know--I was one of those kids.

whierd

As for nature vs nurture, if the kids are naturally unruly, then they need to have that energy and focus redirected.

DalekBrittany

Parents need to pay attention to their children & raise them properly. All 3 of my children are school aged & I would be damned if they didn't have respect for themselves & others around them. Children are not born bullies.. they are raised that way.

You're wrong.

PattyJane167

I raise my kids to defend themselves whenever possible. With that being said, if they grow up to be bullies, I pray they get the *kitten* whooping they deserve.

I so agree with SoVi, that is how I have raised my kids!!

UsedToBeHusky

Here's another point. Many kids go through school and into adulthood with undetected, untreated mental disorder. Parents might not be educated enough to recognize symptoms and teachers might be too busy to notice. The kid might get labeled as a bully when he or she is just reacting to different stressors the way their brains are wired to. Parents try everything that they know of to teach the kid to behave appropriately and it always fails. The parents get fined over and over until they can't afford to pay the fines anymore. What is their only option? Turn the kid over to the state. The kid feels abandoned, acts out even more, and grows up ready to enter the world an even angrier adult.

DalekBrittany

As for nature vs nurture, if the kids are naturally unruly, then they need to have that energy and focus redirected.

Agreed! Sometimes finding an activity appropriate for the child is what it takes, but I imagine it's frustrating when you are trying to teach your kid to be a good person but no matter how much you tell them or set good examples, they don't listen. I think in those cases the kid probably needs some sort of activity that's physical, like soccer, football, martial arts, etc. Something to channel all their energy, like you said.

wineplease

Here's another point. Many kids go through school and into adulthood with undetected, untreated mental disorder. Parents might not be educated enough to recognize symptoms and teachers might be too busy to notice. The kid might get labeled as a bully when he or she is just reacting to different stressors the way their brains are wired to. Parents try everything that they know of to teach the kid to behave appropriately and it always fails. The parents get fined over and over until they can't afford to pay the fines anymore. What is their only option? Turn the kid over to the state. The kid feels abandoned, acts out even more, and grows up ready to enter the world an even angrier adult.

Another good point. This is where I would hope that going before a judge in these cases might force the family to have the child evaluated.

watergirl75

I am a mom of 3. And I have a child that is the one that is always on the receiving end of the hitting, biting, rude words. Things like that. I have always taught my children to respect others and be kind to your friends and if you are angry you use your words and not physcial harm to others. I often wonder why "some" kids are the way they are. Why do they hit, kick, bite, say rude things.....it makes me wonder what they see at home. And I always have blamed the parents. But so many valid points have been brought up here that I never thought of. I never thought that some kidsare just simply mean and they lack the empathy factor. I guess in my naive thinking, I always thought that as longs as they were raised in a nurturing environment, there should be no reason they lack that empathy factor. So I do see where my thinking could be misconstrued however, getting them help and things like that sounds brilliant but in the meantime what do the children do that didn't deserve what this kid dished out? There still has to be some type of consequences for actions that harm others.

UsedToBeHusky

Here's another point. Many kids go through school and into adulthood with undetected, untreated mental disorder. Parents might not be educated enough to recognize symptoms and teachers might be too busy to notice. The kid might get labeled as a bully when he or she is just reacting to different stressors the way their brains are wired to. Parents try everything that they know of to teach the kid to behave appropriately and it always fails. The parents get fined over and over until they can't afford to pay the fines anymore. What is their only option? Turn the kid over to the state. The kid feels abandoned, acts out even more, and grows up ready to enter the world an even angrier adult.

Another good point. This is where I would hope that going before a judge in these cases might force the family to have the child evaluated.

I'll be honest. My daughter is one of these children. Finding an effective treatment plan hasn't been as easy at sounds either. From pre-K up until this year, we were not able to reign in her behavior. Should I have been fined every time she got frustrated and threw her pencil, shoes, whatever? Very often, my daughter is completely misunderstood by her peers and she doesn't even realize that her behavior is bully-ish. She hates bullies. But that's the label they have given her.

Is she really going to learn anything if I have to pay $200 for every incident? And trust me, at one point it was 2 to 3 times a week. I'm a single mom. That would have eventually broke up our home and kept her from having the support that she needed to keep her on the right path.

whierd

As for nature vs nurture, if the kids are naturally unruly, then they need to have that energy and focus redirected.

Agreed! Sometimes finding an activity appropriate for the child is what it takes, but I imagine it's frustrating when you are trying to teach your kid to be a good person but no matter how much you tell them or set good examples, they don't listen. I think in those cases the kid probably needs some sort of activity that's physical, like soccer, football, martial arts, etc. Something to channel all their energy, like you said.

Absolutely, a physical outlet is fantastic. Mentorship also helps as does teaching them useful skills. Oftentimes bullies bully for attention amd other times to feel powerful. Especially at the highschool level, some bullies don't see a very bright future for themselves and feel helpless, so they act out in a way that makes them feel in control. Teaching them something hands on gives them hope and makes them realize they aren't worthless.

ThatSoundsHard

It's already been touched on by several other posters but well, some kids are jus A-holes. Fining the parents who are probably already frustrated dealing with behaviour issues isn't really going to change the kids' personality. Sometimes there is something going on which causes them to act "badly"

That statement assumes that the parents are not jerkfaces and are actually TRYING to raise a good person.

I can speak from experience that it's really, really hard to raise a kid with behavioural issues. A lot of the time you're asking yourself/doctor/counsellor "WHERE is this coming from?! WHY is my child acting like this?" The answers are sometimes pretty hard to find and then dealing with the root cause on a day to day level is exhausting at best. I don't want to even think about how hard it would be for someone with no idea as to what causes their kid to act out.

Would fining my husband and I keep our kid from pitching a tantrum and punching someone? No. Not at all. Would the monetary loss keep my daughter from being able to access the care she needs to deal with her problems? Of course it would.

PlayerHatinDogooder

I am a mom of 3. And I have a child that is the one that is always on the receiving end of the hitting, biting, rude words. Things like that. I have always taught my children to respect others and be kind to your friends and if you are angry you use your words and not physcial harm to others. I often wonder why "some" kids are the way they are. Why do they hit, kick, bite, say rude things.....it makes me wonder what they see at home. And I always have blamed the parents. But so many valid points have been brought up here that I never thought of. I never thought that some kidsare just simply mean and they lack the empathy factor. I guess in my naive thinking, I always thought that as longs as they were raised in a nurturing environment, there should be no reason they lack that empathy factor. So I do see where my thinking could be misconstrued however, getting them help and things like that sounds brilliant but in the meantime what do the children do that didn't deserve what this kid dished out? There still has to be some type of consequences for actions that harm others.

I completely agree with you. I think that there should be some sort of punishment for children who bully. And I'm sorry to hear about your child's troubles. Have you considered that perhaps the best approach might be to encourage your children to be able to defend themselves from this sort of behavior both physically and verbally? Thigs like martial arts may help give them confidence in dealing with this behavior.

AlexThreeClaw

It's a nice idea but almost impossible to implement fairly. For a start fines will hit poorer families much harder than wealthy ones.
and in my experience the schools don't actually notice the actual bullies but crack down on people defending themselves from bullies.
Anecdote - The only time I got into serious trouble at school was when I was 9 and beat the snot out of a boy that kept trying to grope me. I'd complained to school staff about him but had been told to simply stay away from him. Do you know how impossible it is to stay away from someone when you're fenced in and they're intent on giving you grief? I had detention for a week, and my mum was called in for a serious talk with the headmistress. As far as the school were concerned I was the trouble maker and there was talk of suspending me. I wouldn't have been surprised if we'd been fined if it was an option.

The boy was eventually suspended after threatening some other pupils with a saw. Turned out he was lashing out from problems at home, and after therapy and such he's grown up to be a pretty decent bloke. I really don't think fining his parents would have made any difference. If anything, he'd have probably been a lot worse.

ldrosophila

I am a mom of 3. And I have a child that is the one that is always on the receiving end of the hitting, biting, rude words. Things like that. I have always taught my children to respect others and be kind to your friends and if you are angry you use your words and not physcial harm to others. I often wonder why "some" kids are the way they are. Why do they hit, kick, bite, say rude things.....it makes me wonder what they see at home. And I always have blamed the parents. But so many valid points have been brought up here that I never thought of. I never thought that some kidsare just simply mean and they lack the empathy factor. I guess in my naive thinking, I always thought that as longs as they were raised in a nurturing environment, there should be no reason they lack that empathy factor. So I do see where my thinking could be misconstrued however, getting them help and things like that sounds brilliant but in the meantime what do the children do that didn't deserve what this kid dished out? There still has to be some type of consequences for actions that harm others.

I completely agree with you. I think that there should be some sort of punishment for children who bully. And I'm sorry to hear about your child's troubles. Have you considered that perhaps the best approach might be to encourage your children to be able to defend themselves from this sort of behavior both physically and verbally? Thigs like martial arts may help give them confidence in dealing with this behavior.

As a child I was very fearful of confrontation. I was oblivious till I started school that people were mean. I was also slower due to some kinethestic issues, so martial arts probably wouldnt have given me the confidence to confront the faster bullies.

I agree encouraging confidence, but that doesnt always work especially if you have a very overly sensitive child.

Personally being an overly sensitive kid and on the receiving end of bullying. If I had a child who was put to the same situation I would now directly confront the schools, counselor, the parents and the child or children. I would ask for an apology. I would then ask the schools to monitor closely that the behavior doesnt continue, and get that all in writing. If it happens online I would monitor that and directly confront the parent with threats of a suit if it continued. I would then make sure my child got the proper counseling to deal with that feeling of victimization and constantly support that she is a worthwhile person so much better than the weak bullies and one day she will shine above them.

watergirl75

I am a mom of 3. And I have a child that is the one that is always on the receiving end of the hitting, biting, rude words. Things like that. I have always taught my children to respect others and be kind to your friends and if you are angry you use your words and not physcial harm to others. I often wonder why "some" kids are the way they are. Why do they hit, kick, bite, say rude things.....it makes me wonder what they see at home. And I always have blamed the parents. But so many valid points have been brought up here that I never thought of. I never thought that some kidsare just simply mean and they lack the empathy factor. I guess in my naive thinking, I always thought that as longs as they were raised in a nurturing environment, there should be no reason they lack that empathy factor. So I do see where my thinking could be misconstrued however, getting them help and things like that sounds brilliant but in the meantime what do the children do that didn't deserve what this kid dished out? There still has to be some type of consequences for actions that harm others.

I completely agree with you. I think that there should be some sort of punishment for children who bully. And I'm sorry to hear about your child's troubles. Have you considered that perhaps the best approach might be to encourage your children to be able to defend themselves from this sort of behavior both physically and verbally? Thigs like martial arts may help give them confidence in dealing with this behavior.

Thank you for seeing the validity in my point. Honestly nothing has happened that words can’t fix. I have been blessed with great teachers at school and I hold very good relationships with them on purpose. When something does happen I go to the school and talk with the teacher with my child present and try to set an action plan in place if he ever needs it. And I also request a conference with the child and their parents (if needed). I have never condone violence (hitting and such). I guess it’s something I should reconsider but it breaks my heart to think that children at 8 yrs old have to be taught how to fight. Simply floors me. My kids from a very young age learned to say I am sorry, please and thank you. Again in my naïve thinking, I always felt like that was the correct way.

UsedToBeHusky

I'd also like to add that the 'bullies' are often the ones being bullied. Most of the problems that my daughter has now is the way that she reacts to bullies. Because of her issues, she often reacts much stronger to a personal attack than expected. For example, recently, a boy intentionally threw a ball at her. She has intermittent explosive disorder. Her response was to choke him. Obviously, her response was retaliatory, but because the harm she could have caused was worse, she is the one perceived as the bully.