Going Plant Based Vegan

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Replies

  • geimerst
    geimerst Posts: 17 Member
    . I just want to know the dos and donts of PBVeganism. Should I stay away from brown rice? Can I still eat natural organic pb? Do I count calories with this lifestyle??

    I'm also new to this, in my 3rd month, still working on phasing out cheese and eggs. I used the PCRM 21-day kickstart as a guide, and am investigating some of their recipes as well. I'm also involved in a local Plant Based Nutrition support group which follows the research of cardiologists John McDougall, Dean Ornish and Caldwell B. Esselstyn, Jr with a whole foods, plant based, no oils approach, which is one end of Ornish's Spectrum for people with heart issues (which I have).

    To answer your questions:
    Brown rice is great ! whole grain, fiber, lots of nutrients, the dietary staple of nearly 2/3rds of the world. McDougall promotes a starch based approach (complex carbs) for providing

    Organic PB is fine, but remember that nuts are generally high in fat. Being a whole food (nothing added or removed) it is fine, in moderation.

    Check out PCRM: Vegetarian and Vegan Diets for more information. The Spectrum by Dean Ornish is also a good resource, outlining how diet isn't 'one size fits all', but a spectrum of options and choices.


  • Garebearrr
    Garebearrr Posts: 41 Member
    edited April 2015
    Miss Claire, first I just want to say good job in changing your diet for the betterment of your health! It really depends what your goals are for what you should eat. I got diagnosed with Lyme disease is how I got into the plant based diet. Organic peanut butter is okay, I use to eat jars of it per day... not joking. But through research found out peanuts can obtain a decent amount of mold. There are better alternatives. Brown rice is a healthier option than white rice, and it is a good source of complex carbs along with sweet potatoes. Just be aware of quantity because if over consumed it can be high in carbs, with little protein. The best plant based food I found is lentils. It has the highest protein to carb ratio, with about 20grams protein to 40grams carbs per cup. Black beans or other beans you would be lucky to get 8-9grams of protein. Higher protein will allow the body to be leaner, since that's usually the main arguement of non plant based people "where do you get protein".

    Some other great foods I consume for plant based daily besides lentils... Chia seeds, fermented cabbage, kale, any vegetables, Sunwarrior protein powder (vanilla), beans/nuts/seeds, etc. Ideally all foods should be organic for best health outcome. Soy is also one of the most processed foods in America so steering away from it is best. I did this while trying to gain muscle and was successful. Getting close to 190grams of protein per day without any meat or eggs. It is possible through strategic nutrition.

    Your last question of "do I need to count calories?" Well, that's a very broad question. Depends what suites you best. If eating 3-5 small meals with portions sizes works best for you and counting calories is too stressful, do that. If you want precise, then count calories. Body composition does not care what foods you eat, meaning if you consume 2000 calories of plant based foods and 2000 calories of icecream, body composition wise, it's no different. Health wise, of course it's different. In the large scheme of things, counting calories is best if you want to lose weight or gain muscle. Personally I use a site called scoobies workshop calculator just type into google and it'll take you to the guys site, I found this app to be slightly off for me, especially since I'm in my early 20's my metabolism is faster. Anyway, best of luck. Keep making strides forward. Also, always record measurements of body per week and adjust diet/calories accordingly to meet your goals. It can be overwhelming at first but research research research, knowledge is power. Stick to the basics of lentils/seeds/nuts/vegetables and healthy fats like avacado, coconut oil, red Palm oil and you'll be just fine.

    Another topic to look into is juicing vegetables... Best way to get loads of nutrients for your body.
  • geimerst
    geimerst Posts: 17 Member
    edited April 2015
    I'll agree with the concept of 'healthy fats' but there is no such thing as a healthy oil. Oils are a processed food, it is better to consume the fat in the original package: coconut, olives, avocado.

    Arterial function following high fat vs low fat meal, over 6-hour time period:
    FMD+High+Fat+Meal.gif
    High fat meal: Egg McMuffin®, Sausage McMuffin®, 2 hash brown patties, and an unspecified beverage.
    Fat-free meal: Frosted Flakes®, skimmed milk, and orange juice.

    Additionally, Oils damage endothelial cells - the inner lining of blood vessels, inhibiting vasodilation. Increasing saturated fats on top of this increases the risk of developing atherosclerosis, arterial plaque, heart disease, and
    stroke.

    YouTube: Olive Oil Is Not Healthy - Michael Klaper MD

    The Newest Food-Cure: Coconut Oil for Health and Vitality
    My conclusion is that coconut is a natural plant food which can have a small place in most people’s diets. As a whole food the oils are combined with the fiber, vitamins, minerals, and other plant components in a way that makes them safe. When the oil is removed by processing from its natural surroundings then it becomes a medicine at best and a toxin at worst—just like other oils (corn oil removed from corn, olive oil removed from olives, etc.) The more processing— the worse the oil.

    If you decide to include this high fat food in your diet; then realize that coconut is very rich, packed with calories and fats. You will likely gain weight if this becomes a big part of your diet. People with weight-dependent diseases, like type 2 diabetes and degenerative arthritis of the lower extremities should be very careful about including coconut in any form. Otherwise, as a condiment—like other nuts and seeds—coconut will add unique flavors to your meals and provide quality nutrients. Just think of it as a treat. Have you ever tried to open a coconut? One reason they are packaged in such hard shells may be to keep people from eating too much of a good thing.

    Remember: “The fat you eat is the fat you wear.”
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    gparfitt09 wrote: »
    . Soy is also one of the most processed foods in America so steering away from it is best.

    What does this mean? Soy can be processed to varying degrees. You can eat the soy bean, tempeh, tofu, soy milk, or textured vegetable protein -- all of these are processed to different levels. "Soy" is not a single food.

    I am not even sure why it is "best" to stay away from processed foods. What in tempeh is going to be harmful to me?

  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    geimerst wrote: »

    Remember: “The fat you eat is the fat you wear.”

    This isn't true. The excess calories we eat are the excess calories we wear.
  • esjones12
    esjones12 Posts: 1,363 Member
    edited April 2015
    Recently I've decided to go plant based! Looking for others who also are plant based vegan.. And if love to hear some advice for newbies like me :)

    Look for reputable websites that explain the lifestyle. Talk one on one with people who have been actively using the lifestyle for a few years and who are healthy.

    Any type of diet needs to be properly balanced. And gaining/losing/maintaining weight is directly linked to calories consumed.

    I too second whoever said to take things slow. Most times going "all out" at a fast rate leads to failure. Make changes over time. Learn as you go. If you can, a dietitian who supports your desired diet would be the perfect person to talk with!

    Best of luck!
  • geimerst
    geimerst Posts: 17 Member
    edited April 2015
    geimerst wrote: »

    Remember: “The fat you eat is the fat you wear.”

    This isn't true. The excess calories we eat are the excess calories we wear.

    Overly simplified and in a closed system, true, but the human body isn't a closed system. The effect of calories when metabolised depends on the 'packaging' as well as the quantity

    Why Calories Don’t Matter by Mark Hyman, MD

    And you also disagree with Dr. John McDougall, a pioneer in low fat, whole foods plant based/vegan, starch centric approaches of treating obesity and heart disease. He has over 40 years of research to back up his positions. Research is also concluding that not all calories are equal.

    YouTube: Why You THINK Carbs Make You Fat | John McDougall, M.D.
    Bananiac asks Dr. John McDougall about where the notion of "carbs make you fat" originated from. Dr. McDougall is a promoter of a starch-based vegan diet, which is very high in carbohydrates, for getting his patients to lose weight and reverse diseases such as heart disease, diabetes, arthritis, and much more. Dr. McDougall has concluded that it's not the carbs that make people fat, but it's the fat itself.

    "The fat you eat is the fat you wear" ~ Dr. John McDougall.

    We'll have to just agree to disagree... :smile:

  • Justygirl77
    Justygirl77 Posts: 385 Member
    Recently I've decided to go plant based! Looking for others who also are plant based vegan.. And if love to hear some advice for newbies like me :)
    I am plant based, but not vegan. I'm not currently doing dairy, but I do eat fish. I eat about a lb of veggies daily. I just picked up an awesome protein drink by Garden Of Life, Plant Protein, honestly it's delicious. I'd like more veggie friends!

  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    geimerst wrote: »
    geimerst wrote: »

    Remember: “The fat you eat is the fat you wear.”

    This isn't true. The excess calories we eat are the excess calories we wear.

    Overly simplified and in a closed system, true, but the human body isn't a closed system. The effect of calories when metabolised depends on the 'packaging' as well as the quantity

    Why Calories Don’t Matter by Mark Hyman, MD

    And you also disagree with Dr. John McDougall, a pioneer in low fat, whole foods plant based/vegan, starch centric approaches of treating obesity and heart disease. He has over 40 years of research to back up his positions. Research is also concluding that not all calories are equal.

    YouTube: Why You THINK Carbs Make You Fat | John McDougall, M.D.
    Bananiac asks Dr. John McDougall about where the notion of "carbs make you fat" originated from. Dr. McDougall is a promoter of a starch-based vegan diet, which is very high in carbohydrates, for getting his patients to lose weight and reverse diseases such as heart disease, diabetes, arthritis, and much more. Dr. McDougall has concluded that it's not the carbs that make people fat, but it's the fat itself.

    "The fat you eat is the fat you wear" ~ Dr. John McDougall.

    We'll have to just agree to disagree... :smile:

    What research are you referring to? I clicked on your link, but it was a youtube video.

    If you're saying that McDougall's research proves that eating fat will cause one to gain weight, even at a calorie deficit, I would be really interested to see that. I don't think carbohydrates make people fat. I don't think fat makes people fat. You're disagreeing on the very basis of how energy works -- claiming that the body can sustain itself -- or even grow -- while taking in less energy than is burned. This just doesn't make sense.
  • kmbrvt99
    kmbrvt99 Posts: 19 Member
    Not sure if anyone recommended No Meat Athlete, Happy Herbivore or Engine 2 Diet but all good books. Feel free to add me if you want. I'm not quite vegan but I think it would be best for me moving forward. I just feel better and have way more energy since not eating meat. Disclaimer - I do eat organic eggs, cheese and greek yogurt.
  • AgentOrangeJuice
    AgentOrangeJuice Posts: 1,069 Member
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  • geimerst
    geimerst Posts: 17 Member
    geimerst wrote: »
    Research is also concluding that not all calories are equal.
    This was related to the Mark Hyman link: Why Calories Don’t Matter, which was towards the top of my post, sloppy reply on my part, sorry.

    What research are you referring to? I clicked on your link, but it was a youtube video.

    If you're saying that McDougall's research proves that eating fat will cause one to gain weight, even at a calorie deficit, I would be really interested to see that. I don't think carbohydrates make people fat. I don't think fat makes people fat. You're disagreeing on the very basis of how energy works -- claiming that the body can sustain itself -- or even grow -- while taking in less energy than is burned. This just doesn't make sense.

    My understanding is that fats are more readily stored than burned as fuel, the body prefers to carbs or even proteins before fats.

    On fat metabolism, Dr McDougall wrote in People Passionate about Starches Are Healthy and Beautiful
    Fat Is the Metabolic Dollar Saved for the Next Famine
    After eating, dietary fat (from lard, butter, meat, cheese, nuts, olive oil, etc.) is absorbed from the intestine into the bloodstream and transported to the millions of cells designed for storage—the body fat (adipose) cells. The metabolic cost for this transfer is relatively inexpensive (3% of the calories consumed).[11] No pricey chemical conversion is required, so this is a routine metabolic movement after every typical meal. When samples of a person’s body fat tissue are chemically analyzed the results reveal the kinds of fats which that person commonly eats.[14-17] For example, the consumption of margarine and shortening results in high proportions of “trans” fats in a person’s fatty tissues. A diet with large amounts of cold-water marine fish means omega-3 fats are deposited and stored in the body fat. The saying “from my lips to my hips” expresses the real life effects of the fat-laden Western diet. Fortunately, starches contain very little fat for us to wear.

    11) Danforth E Jr. Diet and obesity. Am J Clin Nutr. 1985 May;41(5 Suppl):1132-45.

    14) Thomas LH, Jones PR, Winter JA, Smith H. Hydrogenated oils and fats: the presence of chemically-modified fatty acids in human adipose tissue. Am J Clin Nutr. 1981 May;34(5):877-86.

    15) London SJ, Sacks FM, Caesar J, Stampfer MJ, Siguel E, Willett WC. Fatty acid composition of subcutaneous adipose tissue and diet in postmenopausal US women. Am J Clin Nutr. 1991 Aug;54(2):340-5.

    16) Baylin A, Kabagambe EK, Siles X, Campos H. Adipose tissue biomarkers of fatty acid intake. Am J Clin Nutr. 2002 Oct;76(4):750-7.

    17) Brevik A, Veierød MB, Drevon CA, Andersen LF. Evaluation of the odd fatty acids 15:0 and 17:0 in serum and adipose tissue as markers of intake of milk and dairy fat. Eur J Clin Nutr. 2005 Dec;59(12):1417-22.

    I also assumed others are familiar with the work of Professor T Colin Campbell and The China Study and Caldwell B. Esselstyn Jr, MD, from the Cleveland Clinic, who were featured in the movie Forks Over Knives, Dr Neal Barnard at PCRM, Dean Ornish, MD, Joel Kahn, MD, etc, the leading proponents of low fat (10% or less), whole food, plant based diets for treating obesity, Type-2 Diabetes and heart disease. This approach is also showing promise for MS and other autoimmune disorders.

    Thanks for putting up with my babbling.

    Back to the OP, I do agree with the Engine-2 Diet - good information, also Forks over Knives, Happy Herbivore (a McDougall follower), Dreena Burton (sp?), and I'm checking out "The Starch Solution" page on FaceBook (also a McDougall follower).
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 8,446 Member
    edited April 2015
    geimerst wrote: »
    geimerst wrote: »
    Research is also concluding that not all calories are equal.
    This was related to the Mark Hyman link: Why Calories Don’t Matter, which was towards the top of my post, sloppy reply on my part, sorry.

    What research are you referring to? I clicked on your link, but it was a youtube video.

    If you're saying that McDougall's research proves that eating fat will cause one to gain weight, even at a calorie deficit, I would be really interested to see that. I don't think carbohydrates make people fat. I don't think fat makes people fat. You're disagreeing on the very basis of how energy works -- claiming that the body can sustain itself -- or even grow -- while taking in less energy than is burned. This just doesn't make sense.

    My understanding is that fats are more readily stored than burned as fuel, the body prefers to carbs or even proteins before fats.

    On fat metabolism, Dr McDougall wrote in People Passionate about Starches Are Healthy and Beautiful
    Fat Is the Metabolic Dollar Saved for the Next Famine
    After eating, dietary fat (from lard, butter, meat, cheese, nuts, olive oil, etc.) is absorbed from the intestine into the bloodstream and transported to the millions of cells designed for storage—the body fat (adipose) cells. The metabolic cost for this transfer is relatively inexpensive (3% of the calories consumed).[11] No pricey chemical conversion is required, so this is a routine metabolic movement after every typical meal. When samples of a person’s body fat tissue are chemically analyzed the results reveal the kinds of fats which that person commonly eats.[14-17] For example, the consumption of margarine and shortening results in high proportions of “trans” fats in a person’s fatty tissues. A diet with large amounts of cold-water marine fish means omega-3 fats are deposited and stored in the body fat. The saying “from my lips to my hips” expresses the real life effects of the fat-laden Western diet. Fortunately, starches contain very little fat for us to wear.

    11) Danforth E Jr. Diet and obesity. Am J Clin Nutr. 1985 May;41(5 Suppl):1132-45.

    14) Thomas LH, Jones PR, Winter JA, Smith H. Hydrogenated oils and fats: the presence of chemically-modified fatty acids in human adipose tissue. Am J Clin Nutr. 1981 May;34(5):877-86.

    15) London SJ, Sacks FM, Caesar J, Stampfer MJ, Siguel E, Willett WC. Fatty acid composition of subcutaneous adipose tissue and diet in postmenopausal US women. Am J Clin Nutr. 1991 Aug;54(2):340-5.

    16) Baylin A, Kabagambe EK, Siles X, Campos H. Adipose tissue biomarkers of fatty acid intake. Am J Clin Nutr. 2002 Oct;76(4):750-7.

    17) Brevik A, Veierød MB, Drevon CA, Andersen LF. Evaluation of the odd fatty acids 15:0 and 17:0 in serum and adipose tissue as markers of intake of milk and dairy fat. Eur J Clin Nutr. 2005 Dec;59(12):1417-22.

    I also assumed others are familiar with the work of Professor T Colin Campbell and The China Study and Caldwell B. Esselstyn Jr, MD, from the Cleveland Clinic, who were featured in the movie Forks Over Knives, Dr Neal Barnard at PCRM, Dean Ornish, MD, Joel Kahn, MD, etc, the leading proponents of low fat (10% or less), whole food, plant based diets for treating obesity, Type-2 Diabetes and heart disease. This approach is also showing promise for MS and other autoimmune disorders.

    Thanks for putting up with my babbling.

    Back to the OP, I do agree with the Engine-2 Diet - good information, also Forks over Knives, Happy Herbivore (a McDougall follower), Dreena Burton (sp?), and I'm checking out "The Starch Solution" page on FaceBook (also a McDougall follower).
    Priceless, fat makes you fat. Brain feedback loop engaged.

  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    geimerst wrote: »

    Thanks for putting up with my babbling.

    So, in brief, there is no evidence that one will put on weight at a caloric deficit, even if one consumes fat. . . right?
  • Garebearrr
    Garebearrr Posts: 41 Member
    gparfitt09 wrote: »
    . Soy is also one of the most processed foods in America so steering away from it is best.

    What does this mean? Soy can be processed to varying degrees. You can eat the soy bean, tempeh, tofu, soy milk, or textured vegetable protein -- all of these are processed to different levels. "Soy" is not a single food.

    I am not even sure why it is "best" to stay away from processed foods. What in tempeh is going to be harmful to me?

    Processed meaning contains other chemicals. Pesticides, GMO's, potentially other harmful substances like antibiotics, etc. If you do the research you will learn how soy is one of the top foods containing these harmful things that are being added to the soy products. You should also do research what processed foods do to the body, it's not pretty and is very disturbing. Knowledge is power. Yes you may not see an immediate effect, although you might with feeling sick momentarily, but in the long scheme it will affect your body negatively. Our bodies aren't meant to process unnatural chemicals and it will create an adverse effect to some extent.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    gparfitt09 wrote: »

    Processed meaning contains other chemicals. Pesticides, GMO's, potentially other harmful substances like antibiotics, etc. If you do the research you will learn how soy is one of the top foods containing these harmful things that are being added to the soy products... . Our bodies aren't meant to process unnatural chemicals and it will create an adverse effect to some extent.

    Can you please give me an example of when antibiotics have been found in any soy product?

    Your posts have a lot of really scary words, but they are also very vague. I gave you an example of a specific food - - tempeh - - and asked what could be harmful about it. What research could I do to learn what harm has has been linked to it?

  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
    gparfitt09 wrote: »
    gparfitt09 wrote: »
    . Soy is also one of the most processed foods in America so steering away from it is best.

    What does this mean? Soy can be processed to varying degrees. You can eat the soy bean, tempeh, tofu, soy milk, or textured vegetable protein -- all of these are processed to different levels. "Soy" is not a single food.

    I am not even sure why it is "best" to stay away from processed foods. What in tempeh is going to be harmful to me?

    Processed meaning contains other chemicals. Pesticides, GMO's, potentially other harmful substances like antibiotics, etc. If you do the research you will learn how soy is one of the top foods containing these harmful things that are being added to the soy products. You should also do research what processed foods do to the body, it's not pretty and is very disturbing. Knowledge is power. Yes you may not see an immediate effect, although you might with feeling sick momentarily, but in the long scheme it will affect your body negatively. Our bodies aren't meant to process unnatural chemicals and it will create an adverse effect to some extent.

    What other chemicals? And all plants have pesticides on them, even and especially the organic ones.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,552 Member
    ana3067 wrote: »
    Why? If it's for weight loss.... why?

    I have struggled with an eating disorder and I'm just looking to change my lifestyle. My cousin is plant based and has over come her ED and I hope to do the same by fueling my body with healthy foods

    I think you would be hard-pressed to find anyone who is more pro-vegan than I am. I have been vegan for nine years and I think that it is possible to thrive as a vegan. That said, it is not a cure for ED. Layering food restrictions (which, even from a positive POV, veganism is) on top of an ED can be dangerous.

    There are some inspirational stories of vegans who have overcome EDs. If you are interested in reading more, I would suggest the "Green Recovery" series of posts on Gena Hamshaw's "Choosing Raw" blog (she doesn't advocate for a fully raw diet, just suggests ways to add more raw foods to the diet). There are also lots of people who found adding veganism to an ED made their physical and emotional health worse. My concern is that you would complicate your recovery and potentially set yourself back.

    Focus on getting better. Veganism will be here when you're ready.
    parisvt wrote: »

    So now the big thing. ..will you lose weight with a vegan diet?! Yes or no. It depends how you eat! There are plenty of vegan junk foods out there that with the exception of being animal friendly are no better nutritionally than a McDonald's. So avoid all the vegan hotdogs and fried "chicken" nuggets and other foods and go straight to the fresh veg and fruits! I opt for organic foods...as so many scary pesticides are used these days... I also limit soy because of the high estrogen levels. I feel like I get much more hormonal with too much soy...


    If someone is struggling with an ED, suggesting additional restrictions (avoiding "vegan junk foods") may do them harm. We don't know OP's weight. Calorie dense foods may be just what she needs. Restricting her diet to fresh vegetables and fruits may not be healthy.

    nod nods nods nods nods nods nods

    To all of these above.

    Seriously.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,552 Member
    geimerst wrote: »
    I'll agree with the concept of 'healthy fats' but there is no such thing as a healthy oil. Oils are a processed food, it is better to consume the fat in the original package: coconut, olives, avocado.

    Arterial function following high fat vs low fat meal, over 6-hour time period:
    FMD+High+Fat+Meal.gif
    High fat meal: Egg McMuffin®, Sausage McMuffin®, 2 hash brown patties, and an unspecified beverage.
    Fat-free meal: Frosted Flakes®, skimmed milk, and orange juice.

    Additionally, Oils damage endothelial cells - the inner lining of blood vessels, inhibiting vasodilation. Increasing saturated fats on top of this increases the risk of developing atherosclerosis, arterial plaque, heart disease, and
    stroke.

    YouTube: Olive Oil Is Not Healthy - Michael Klaper MD

    The Newest Food-Cure: Coconut Oil for Health and Vitality
    My conclusion is that coconut is a natural plant food which can have a small place in most people’s diets. As a whole food the oils are combined with the fiber, vitamins, minerals, and other plant components in a way that makes them safe. When the oil is removed by processing from its natural surroundings then it becomes a medicine at best and a toxin at worst—just like other oils (corn oil removed from corn, olive oil removed from olives, etc.) The more processing— the worse the oil.

    If you decide to include this high fat food in your diet; then realize that coconut is very rich, packed with calories and fats. You will likely gain weight if this becomes a big part of your diet. People with weight-dependent diseases, like type 2 diabetes and degenerative arthritis of the lower extremities should be very careful about including coconut in any form. Otherwise, as a condiment—like other nuts and seeds—coconut will add unique flavors to your meals and provide quality nutrients. Just think of it as a treat. Have you ever tried to open a coconut? One reason they are packaged in such hard shells may be to keep people from eating too much of a good thing.

    Remember: “The fat you eat is the fat you wear.”

    you're wrong.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,878 Member
    JoRocka wrote: »
    ana3067 wrote: »
    Why? If it's for weight loss.... why?

    I have struggled with an eating disorder and I'm just looking to change my lifestyle. My cousin is plant based and has over come her ED and I hope to do the same by fueling my body with healthy foods

    I think you would be hard-pressed to find anyone who is more pro-vegan than I am. I have been vegan for nine years and I think that it is possible to thrive as a vegan. That said, it is not a cure for ED. Layering food restrictions (which, even from a positive POV, veganism is) on top of an ED can be dangerous.

    There are some inspirational stories of vegans who have overcome EDs. If you are interested in reading more, I would suggest the "Green Recovery" series of posts on Gena Hamshaw's "Choosing Raw" blog (she doesn't advocate for a fully raw diet, just suggests ways to add more raw foods to the diet). There are also lots of people who found adding veganism to an ED made their physical and emotional health worse. My concern is that you would complicate your recovery and potentially set yourself back.

    Focus on getting better. Veganism will be here when you're ready.
    parisvt wrote: »

    So now the big thing. ..will you lose weight with a vegan diet?! Yes or no. It depends how you eat! There are plenty of vegan junk foods out there that with the exception of being animal friendly are no better nutritionally than a McDonald's. So avoid all the vegan hotdogs and fried "chicken" nuggets and other foods and go straight to the fresh veg and fruits! I opt for organic foods...as so many scary pesticides are used these days... I also limit soy because of the high estrogen levels. I feel like I get much more hormonal with too much soy...


    If someone is struggling with an ED, suggesting additional restrictions (avoiding "vegan junk foods") may do them harm. We don't know OP's weight. Calorie dense foods may be just what she needs. Restricting her diet to fresh vegetables and fruits may not be healthy.

    nod nods nods nods nods nods nods

    To all of these above.

    Seriously.

    This thread is really disturbing to me. There are a lot of "plant based" people who don't seem to care about the real harm their advice can do to people with EDs and use vague pseudoscience to inspire fear. Veganism as an ethical position has nothing to do with promoting fear about "processed food" or obvious untruths like "the fat you eat is the fat you wear." I've been in dozens of conversations like this and keep getting told to look at the "research" (which is often just a youtube video full of fearmongering or half-truths).

    So basically, a person with an ED is being told to avoid "processed food," soy, oils, foods with fat, non-organic foods, and foods that aren't "fresh fruits and vegetables." This is on top of restricting dairy, meat, eggs, and other animal products. The lack of compassion is astonishing. The irresponsibility angers me.

    It's personally distressing to me that this is helping form perceptions of veganism. I try not to take things seriously online, but there are people in this thread who need to step back and do thinking about the type of person they are and what they want to contribute to the world.

    I want to reiterate for everyone reading this thread that veganism is not about hurting yourself. It's about avoiding animal exploitation to the extent that is possible and practicable -- and if you are currently struggling with an ED, your treatment must come first. This means that if additional restrictions are going to trigger you, it is okay to focus on your treatment. The additional restrictions that are rolled into "plant based" eating often border on orthorexia themselves and lack a foundation in what research has shown us to be true about the types of diets that are nourishing for humans.

    Ugh. Just ugh.