does food realy make you fat
Replies
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Why do you all have to make it "skinny people eat less than they say"? I don't. Can you not accept the fact that there are naturally thin people?
No one said all skinny people eat less than they say.
What we are saying is that skinny people who try to claim they eat tons of food and therefore the calorie model is wrong eat less they say.
Nope. I eat a lot and I know it.
You don't eat more than you expend.0 -
"They absolutely are. The habits and desires that made you fat in the first place don't just go away when you get thin."
I agree Johnny, but I've never been overweight even when eating 2500+ daily when sedentary.0 -
Why do you all have to make it "skinny people eat less than they say"? I don't. Can you not accept the fact that there are naturally thin people?
No one said all skinny people eat less than they say.
What we are saying is that skinny people who try to claim they eat tons of food and therefore the calorie model is wrong eat less they say.
And that is not always true, though I don't doubt it often is. Some people absorb less of what goes in their mouth than others.0 -
The show 'Secret Eaters' is a very good show to watch and make you realize how easy it is for people to.
1. Lie straight to your face
2. lie to themselves
3. Write off calories
Its true that unless we stalked someone and logged their intake and output everyday for weeks we will never know whats really going on with them. But this show really is a good example of how much denial most people are in about how healthy they are and how much they are actually eating.
At the start of this show these people will talk and talk and talk about how they eat so healthy, cant loose weight, give estimates of how many calories they eat in a day, even provide food logs that back up their claims. Then they consent to be filmed in their home and they are also secretly followed to see how much they are really eating.
The show is a fabulous example of why someone who is 'super healthy and eating less than 1200 calories a day' cant lose weight. It shows all the spectrums of problems. For some people they would get something like a burger, which would be totally fine as it was but then they put 300+ calories worth of condiments on it. Or they would bake something 'healthy' but use half a pan worth of butter adding on another 400-500 calories for their serving. It would also show how people would snack and write it off as nothing. A bite here or there is no big deal so they didnt count it. For people like that they added up the calories of all their 'snacks' and found they were eating full extra meals worth of calories from these snacks.
They also found people who would eat like saints during the week then blow it all on the weekend with beer and junk food. So yeah they were good for most of the week but as most of us know it really only takes 1 day to blow a weeks worth of progress. This show took all those people claiming they couldnt lose weight even though they were doing everything right, put them under a microscope and proved that there was nothing wrong with the person, just something wrong with their diet. From all the episodes I have seen, not a single one of them didnt have a reason they werent losing weight. THey were all doing something wrong.
Someone else mentioned super fat vs super skinny. Almost every episode of that I have watched has been that the super skinny is living on junk food. So yeah you see someone super skinny living on junk food and even binging on it in some cases but they were still eating less calories than they needed for their daily use. There was one guy who ate tons of chocolate for his dinner or would buy 8-10 donuts for dinner and just binge on them but eat nothing else all day.
Truth is, people lie, they lie because they are ashamed, they lie because they are lazy and sometimes they lie because they are lying to themselves and dont even realize it yet.
Great summary!
I also watched Secret Eaters and I'm shocked at how many people are in denial of what they eat.0 -
"They absolutely are. The habits and desires that made you fat in the first place don't just go away when you get thin."
I agree Johnny, but I've never been overweight even when eating 2500+ daily when sedentary.
I find that extremely unlikely, but I know you're a very smart girl and not prone to throwing out statements like that with no way to back them up.
Do you have the data that I can look at? Long-term (3+ months) of detailed food and activity logging along with weight charts?0 -
Why do you all have to make it "skinny people eat less than they say"? I don't. Can you not accept the fact that there are naturally thin people?
No one said all skinny people eat less than they say.
What we are saying is that skinny people who try to claim they eat tons of food and therefore the calorie model is wrong eat less they say.
Nope. I eat a lot and I know it.
You eat a lot and you burn it all off ( if you're maintaining) or you burn even more ( if you're losing).0 -
Here's my 107 pound pics. Highest I've ever been in weight.
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Here's my 107 pound pics. Highest I've ever been in weight.
Nice toilet
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Why do you all have to make it "skinny people eat less than they say"? I don't. Can you not accept the fact that there are naturally thin people?
No one said all skinny people eat less than they say.
What we are saying is that skinny people who try to claim they eat tons of food and therefore the calorie model is wrong eat less they say.
Nope. I eat a lot and I know it.
You eat a lot and you burn it all off ( if you're maintaining) or you burn even more ( if you're losing).
Nooo... I eat a lot. No burning off when I'm lying in bed with broken bones.0 -
1. Metabolic rate varies between individuals, but anyone can gain weight by eating more or lose weight by eating less, it's just a matter of figuring out how much more or less.
2. How old is your sister? I think it's common that people can eat whatever when they're young and not get fat, but those bad habits catch up to them as they age. That happened to me!
3. Is it possible that she eats junk food, but small amounts and/or not so often? I think sometimes people will observe a skinny person eating something unhealthy and/or a large meal one time and assume they eat that way all the time when they really don't.
4. "I can't lose any weight ever because genetics" is b.s. Genetics *might* make it more challenging for you to lose weight, but you can.
Great reply!
)
I only have one sibling but he's been slim and fit all his life without workouts or diets or anything. I on the other hand have struggled with weight all my life. It's not the food, it's what food you eat and how much of it. Granted my brother and I obviously have some body composition issues that are opposite but the honest truth is, I eat too much and move too little.0 -
Here's my 107 pound pics. Highest I've ever been in weight.
Nice toilet
Knock it off, I WILL bite you.0 -
Here's my 107 pound pics. Highest I've ever been in weight.
Nice toilet
Knock it off, I WILL bite you.
I think I like it when you're like this.0 -
I find it gets rid of some confusion to look at calories and weight as a formula of intake for the day that can be modified at several places to get very different results. Calorie intake is first modified by ABSORBED AMOUNT, then metabolism x METABOLIC FACTOR uses calories, finally exercise/extra calorie use is subtracted, then any remaining absorbed calories are modified by a storage factor and stored. Altering any/all of these can cause wide variations in the amount each individual gains and loses.
So, your body doesnt absorb ALL calories, and some are more efficient than others, so you actually do uptake different amounts from the same meal in some cases. Likewise the amount your body absorbs can be changed by genetic programming, environmental factors, stress, illness, disease, etc.
Metabolism can change dependent on how active you are, how many hours you are active, your mood, your biochemistry, your genetics and how your body reacts to stress and exercise (all altered again by genetics and environmental factors).
Next, some are more efficient in exercise than others. Also, some fidget and move unnecessarily and burn excess calories. Some stay up longer hours and sleep less than others (you burn more awake than sleeping). Some toss and turn in their sleep, others sleep relatively still. Some people walk up the stairs to a building slowly and steadily, while others jump up a few steps, giggle with their friends, turn around, push up on the handrail, push themselves off and quickly go up the remaining stairs...using more calories for the "same activity".
Lastly, some people just tend to store weight, and "give it up" out of their fat cells at different rates than others.
If you change any one of these you will have a different result on the same amount of food, and some people are lucky enough to be on the extreme end where they dont absorb much, burn it fast, burn it less efficiently, and dont store weight easily and fat cells release it with more ease. However, age does tend to catch up with these people.
An example of an extreme non-gainer, I had a friend in high school desperately wanted to gain more weight, he would eat several (yes sometimes 3+, several times he force fed himself over weeks) Whoppers from BurgerKing with sodas daily to increase his calories, and it still didnt help at all, he gained almost nothing. Now, the idea that he "skipped meals" or "if you counted all calories he didnt eat enough" was completely and utterly wrong here, AND even if he ate NOTHING the rest of the day, go calculate 2-5 Whopper calories/day...plus he regularly ate several bowls of cornflakes with milk and sugar in the morning and dinner with his parents (I dont know what he ate for dinner but it wasnt negative thousands of calories). I could gain weight easily while weightlifting and when I tried eating Whoppers with him, I gained 5 lbs weight in just a couple days.
However, years later, now he's getting a small "potbelly"... So whatever increased metabolism/storage problem/etc he had going for him isnt going so well anymore. He's also balding, has some other issues and in general not as healthy as I am and looks much more aged. But you can start a new argument about how much of that is sodas, Whoppers, sugary cereal or genetics, etc....
The point is to find out how your own body responds, definitely change the quality of food and keep track of the calories you eat and exercise, and find how your body reacts individually. Calorie tracking is VERY important (on my weight loss journey, when I do it, I lose more, when I dont, I lose slower). The trick is to find out your own perfect zone, at which you can eat good food and not starve yourself, exercise but not exhaust yourself, still lose at a reasonable pace, and not get discouraged when you hit bumps in the road while your body is "rearranging" and you dont see the scale move for a while, but you are still on your way.0 -
"They absolutely are. The habits and desires that made you fat in the first place don't just go away when you get thin."
I agree Johnny, but I've never been overweight even when eating 2500+ daily when sedentary.
I find that extremely unlikely, but I know you're a very smart girl and not prone to throwing out statements like that with no way to back them up.
Do you have the data that I can look at? Long-term (3+ months) of detailed food and activity logging along with weight charts?
Well, now we are talking about two different things. Are we saying some people can eat 2,500 hundred calories while sedentary and not gain weight, or someone can eat 2,500 calories a day while sedentary and not be overweight? Because the two are vastly different. From a BMI standpoint, I could gain 20 pounds and still be in a healthy range (the top of healthy, but still). I could eat a ton of crap and gain the 20 pounds and say, look at me, I eat what I want and still don't get fat. That of course, relies entirely on me not continuing to gain any more weight after I hit the 20 mark.0 -
food doesnt make you fat, TOO MUCH food makes you fat....
lol nice!0 -
Here's my 107 pound pics. Highest I've ever been in weight.
Nice toilet
Knock it off, I WILL bite you.
I think I like it when you're like this.
Me too.0 -
oops ,sorry... that's me at 100 pounds or so...0
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What gets people confused is that your body has some control over how much calories it spends.
This. Hunger is also dismissed as a factor, but nobody with access to food can live with hunger (like starvation level hunger) long term. They will break.
This is where insulin resistence, leptin, etc... come in. Our body is not a simple bank, put a 100 in, take a 100 out. To start talking about the law of thermodynamics in this situation is true, but practically not so useful. I would highly recommend watching Sugar: The Bitter truth for an example of how the body uses the same amount of calories coming from different sources completely differently. It's fascinating.0 -
no, not necessarily.
"Why are thin people not fat":
http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/why-are-thin-people-not-fat.html
"Does dieting make you fat?" (Twin study):
http://www.nature.com/ijo/journal/v36/n3/full/ijo2011160a.html
There is also a very interesting study giving evidence for the pretty much complete lack of correlation between someone's weight and calories consumed, but I can't seem to find it right now...
Ok first one is really interersting. I like it good read.
The second one looks insane. Is it really pointing out that people who have attempted to lose weight are more likely to become overweight? ...duh. And then they claim that means that calorie restriction causes weight gain long term...isn't that like saying that because diabetics avoid sugar that avoiding sugar causes diabetes?
Yes, its probable, because most people reduce too many calories which can throw your body into more of a "survival" mode and cause it to store more and become more efficient. That's why its important to not run a calorie deficit that is too high for you: you may end up just making your situation worse in the future.
Relating it to diabetes is not accurate: diabetes results in an excess of glucose in the blood and not enough uptake into the cells fast enough. By reducing sugar you are reducing uptake of glucose and reducing blood sugar to a more "normal" state in a diabetic. So, this does not stress the body out and cause it to become worse at uptake of sugar (as reducing available calories can cause your body to become stressed out and change metabolism), instead it becomes "normalized" and avoids the problems associated with elevated blood sugar.0 -
no, not necessarily.
"Why are thin people not fat":
http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/why-are-thin-people-not-fat.html
"Does dieting make you fat?" (Twin study):
http://www.nature.com/ijo/journal/v36/n3/full/ijo2011160a.html
There is also a very interesting study giving evidence for the pretty much complete lack of correlation between someone's weight and calories consumed, but I can't seem to find it right now...
First one is a YouTube video on someone's blog. Yeah, no, that's not peer-reviewed research. Second one shows that yo-yo dieting (as opposed to permanent change of eating habits) leads to weight gain. Of course.
The research that fat activism people tend to cite that they think shows that diets don't work and weight loss is completely genetic are studies where fat people lose weight by following some strict eating plan and later gain it back *after going back to their previous unhealthy habits*. Again, of course. There are also some studies where thin people gain weight by eating fast food and being sedentary, and then quickly losing it again after the study with seemingly minimal effort *because they go back to their previous healthy habits*.
This stuff is not that complicated. My postdoc advisor had a lot of disdain for obesity research because we already know what causes obesity and how to fix it, and I'm inclined to agree. Yes, there are genetic differences in metabolic rate and things like reward value of food and hormones that influence satiety, but the bottom line is always calories in vs. calories out.0 -
Genetics alone, clearly.
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We have the first law of thermodynamics conversation of energy. Briefly energy cannot be created or destroyed only converted from one form to another including being stored or released from storage. If if you find a situation where energy appears to be being created it is being released from storage instead. This is true of burning things, radiance from the sun and nuclear power.
So as this applies to the body the energy released by digesting the food eaten minus the energy used must equal the (incremental) amount stored as fat. In any given time period if this difference is positive (more taken in than used) that will correspond to increase in fat and if the difference is negative (more used than taken in) that ill correspond to a decrease in fat.
So if two people eat the same number of calories as each other and one gets fat and the other doesn't then the difference must lie in the amount of energy used by each person. A difference in obvious and measurable physical activity may be part of the difference but there will likely be differences in BMR which, while it can be measured, is more generally estimated and maybe not very accurately. The obvious explanation for studies that found that some people, at least, maintain a stable weight in the face of large changes in calorie intake is that the body balances those with similar changes in energy use. That is a far more believable explanation that one that suggests we have found a unique exception to basic rules of physics.The amount that people eat when just left to themselves without thinking about calories varies enormously. Left to myself, I'd easy eat 3000-5000 calories a day. One of my friends who "eats whatever he wants and doesn't gain weight" consumes more like 1900-2200. I've actually observed and calculated this for several people. He eats almost nothing but junk food and fast food. He just doesn't eat nearly as much of it as I tend to.
It is interesting to consider the possibility that the people eating the junk food don't get fat not despite eating the junk food but because the eat the junk food. The current obesity epidemic seems to have really taken off since low fat eating has become mainstream. There are at least a couple of theories that relate to this:
1. Fat is often replaced with sugar to make a tasty product. It has been proposed that sugar and other highly refined carbs create a hormonal environment that causes enegy to be stored rather than used, i.e. they reduce BMR.
2. It has also been suggested that fat plays a role in saiety. So the skinny person who eats the meal full of fat feels full on a smaller portion (and fewer calories) than the person who opts for the low fat meal. We tend to think of fat as being high calorie but portion size has much to do with it. A smaller portion of a fat-rich meal can be lower calorie than a larger portion of a carbohydrate rich meal particularly if the carbohydrate rich meal is bigger to get the same level of satisfaction.0 -
What I've wanted to understand is how those tiny *kitten* chinese or japanese girls just plow through food and stay tiny.
I mean plow through food. I was at an L&L last time I was in hawaii. Three little japanese girls at a table. Each one had a large loco moco, plus there were two orders of spam musubi on the table, two open bags of beard papa they were eating from, and an additional pair of large meal boxes with mac salad and spare ribs.
They ate all of it and ordered more mac salad.
I couldn't finish my medium loco moco. wtf?0 -
What I've wanted to understand is how those tiny *kitten* chinese or japanese girls just plow through food and stay tiny.
I mean plow through food. I was at an L&L last time I was in hawaii. Three little japanese girls at a table. Each one had a large loco moco, plus there were two orders of spam musubi on the table, two open bags of beard papa they were eating from, and an additional pair of large meal boxes with mac salad and spare ribs.
They ate all of it and ordered more mac salad.
I couldn't finish my medium loco moco. wtf?
I know a lot of people like that. Many of them eat just that one meal. Some of them head to the bathroom and purge afterward. Both are quite common.0 -
What I've wanted to understand is how those tiny *kitten* chinese or japanese girls just plow through food and stay tiny.
I mean plow through food. I was at an L&L last time I was in hawaii. Three little japanese girls at a table. Each one had a large loco moco, plus there were two orders of spam musubi on the table, two open bags of beard papa they were eating from, and an additional pair of large meal boxes with mac salad and spare ribs.
They ate all of it and ordered more mac salad.
I couldn't finish my medium loco moco. wtf?
I once had a Chinese postdoc cook a meal for me and two of my friends, and we're all large people. So, she cooked the amount of food she figured it would take to feed people as large as we were. The food was actually incredibly healthy (not like Chinese takeout in the US), and there was massive quantities. And we'd have to consume twice to three times as much to get the same number of calories as a typical Chinese takeout.
Even if you see them out eating crap, they could be home eating incredibly health 95% of the time.0 -
u shouldnt be checking out ur sister bro0
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Last Sunday I ate waffle for breakfast, KFC crispy chicken and sweet corn for lunch, and Hardee's Jim Beam quarter pounder burger for dinner. I also drank one large McDonald's ice coffee. I weighed myself this morning, and I didn't gain anything. I actually lost a little weight.
To others it may seem that I eat all junk and not gain weight. Well, I counted the calories of every single thing, and I'm still netting under my daily goal, especially since I spent an hour riding a bicycle and most of the day walking around.
Also, I used sugar free syrup and no butter on my waffle, only two pieces of fried chicken with a cup of sweet corn, and the burger by itself with no fries & no soda.
Just count your calories, it works.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html0 -
Last Sunday I ate waffle for breakfast, KFC crispy chicken and sweet corn for lunch, and Hardee's Jim Beam quarter pounder burger for dinner. I also drank one large McDonald's ice coffee. I weighed myself this morning, and I didn't gain anything. I actually lost a little weight.
To others it may seem that I eat all junk and not gain weight. Well, I counted the calories of every single thing, and I'm still netting under my daily goal, especially since I spent an hour riding a bicycle and most of the day walking around.
Also, I used sugar free syrup and no butter on my waffle, only two pieces of fried chicken with a cup of sweet corn, and the burger by itself with no fries & no soda.
Just count your calories, it works.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html
I think most people are talking nutrients (micro and macro) when they speak of "junk", not calories.0 -
Ohhh... I watch my macros and micros and just eat whatever's needed to meet and exceed those numbers. I really don't care about calories.
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I mean plow through food. I was at an L&L last time I was in hawaii. Three little japanese girls at a table. Each one had a large loco moco, plus there were two orders of spam musubi on the table, two open bags of beard papa they were eating from, and an additional pair of large meal boxes with mac salad and spare ribs.
While I don't know what much of that is, I think we all know someone who eats a family size bag of chips and drinks a 2L of sugary soda, and stays skinny... most of those people that I know, when I thought about it, that was pretty much all they'd eat that day, and then over the next days, aware of it or not, they'd make up for any of the excess. As much as I might call it a sickness, it sounds like awareness of what your body needs to survive.0
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