Intermittent fasting
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I was going to try, but after seeing Taubes invoked, it's useless.
Some questions could have been asked like the OP's current caloric intake and how long he's been eating at a deficit and his current stats, but I think he's got his mind made up and won't be amenable to any other answers.0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »I was going to try, but after seeing Taubes invoked, it's useless.
Some questions could have been asked like the OP's current caloric intake and how long he's been eating at a deficit and his current stats, but I think he's got his mind made up and won't be amenable to any other answers.
I tried and then he went ludicrous speed on me and said he does not believe in calorie deficits, then taubes was mentioned, and then insulin causes fat storage....we basically got a trifecta of bro science ....0 -
Wether you do IF OR IIFYM or any of these other bs diets it don't matter CALORIC deficit is what matters whether you eat so called clean or junk food your body don't know the difference now am not sayin I eat all junk I eat mostly whole foods as I need my proteins and fibre and so on i usually use 300 Cals for JUNK.....and i learned this from GReg Plitt when I met him at a fitness expo this guy knows everything and I have lost 2 stone in 11 weeks doing this is simple losing weight don't get caught in the *kitten* out there0
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the example you gave about 100cal is not accurate since both of them are very rich in carbs. Lets try in this way 100 cal donuts and 100 cal fats. The first will surge you insulin level which is ana lipogenic hormone that blocks fats elimination while the second one wont affect your insulin so if you are in catabolic state you will still use your fat as energy. Does it make sense?
no that makes absolutely no sense.
You are comparing carrots to a macronutrient, that is like comparing apples to oranges.
So you are trying to say that if I eat a 100 calorie donut, and I am in a deficit for the day, that I will still store fat even though I am in a calorie deficit, because insulin? Do you have any peer reviewed sources on this, besides Taubes? Secondly, protein also spikes insulin, so will that also lead to fat being stored?
and you never answered my question about if you use a food scale or not...
To answer your question you will still lose weight because you are still in caloric deficit. As I said before I beleive in physic law. But here is the issue. If you eat this 100 calorie donuts you will block the utilisation of your fat storge because the insulin peak you generate wont let you do it. Your energy need for that day will use your reserve of sugar(Glycogen) stocked in your liver and muscles.
I am open to any idea and I am not stuck in a corner. I was low fat diet for a years but I beleive that real science contradict with it0 -
the example you gave about 100cal is not accurate since both of them are very rich in carbs. Lets try in this way 100 cal donuts and 100 cal fats. The first will surge you insulin level which is ana lipogenic hormone that blocks fats elimination while the second one wont affect your insulin so if you are in catabolic state you will still use your fat as energy. Does it make sense?
no that makes absolutely no sense.
You are comparing carrots to a macronutrient, that is like comparing apples to oranges.
So you are trying to say that if I eat a 100 calorie donut, and I am in a deficit for the day, that I will still store fat even though I am in a calorie deficit, because insulin? Do you have any peer reviewed sources on this, besides Taubes? Secondly, protein also spikes insulin, so will that also lead to fat being stored?
and you never answered my question about if you use a food scale or not...
To answer your question you will still lose weight because you are still in caloric deficit. As I said before I beleive in physic law. But here is the issue. If you eat this 100 calorie donuts you will block the utilisation of your fat storge because the insulin peak you generate wont let you do it. Your energy need for that day will use your reserve of sugar(Glycogen) stocked in your liver and muscles.
I am open to any idea and I am not stuck in a corner. I was low fat diet for a years but I beleive that real science contradict with it
please provide a peer reviewed source to back up your claim....
if you are eating all the right foods/calories, why are you not losing weight?
Again, do you use a food scale to weigh all solid foods?0 -
I think this thread is dead now ndj1979 just totally owned it lol .....brb gain fat while in a deficit eating my Pringles haha0
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the example you gave about 100cal is not accurate since both of them are very rich in carbs. Lets try in this way 100 cal donuts and 100 cal fats. The first will surge you insulin level which is ana lipogenic hormone that blocks fats elimination while the second one wont affect your insulin so if you are in catabolic state you will still use your fat as energy. Does it make sense?
no that makes absolutely no sense.
You are comparing carrots to a macronutrient, that is like comparing apples to oranges.
So you are trying to say that if I eat a 100 calorie donut, and I am in a deficit for the day, that I will still store fat even though I am in a calorie deficit, because insulin? Do you have any peer reviewed sources on this, besides Taubes? Secondly, protein also spikes insulin, so will that also lead to fat being stored?
and you never answered my question about if you use a food scale or not...
To answer your question you will still lose weight because you are still in caloric deficit. As I said before I beleive in physic law. But here is the issue. If you eat this 100 calorie donuts you will block the utilisation of your fat storge because the insulin peak you generate wont let you do it. Your energy need for that day will use your reserve of sugar(Glycogen) stocked in your liver and muscles.
I am open to any idea and I am not stuck in a corner. I was low fat diet for a years but I beleive that real science contradict with it
please provide a peer reviewed source to back up your claim....
if you are eating all the right foods/calories, why are you not losing weight?
Again, do you use a food scale to weigh all solid foods?
You should know the answers to your two questions by now. Silence is a good answer in my book and I usually laugh at silence being an answer.
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If your body has nutrients and calories available, it will use those before going into its storage, so no it doesn't matter 100 cals is 100 cals. Only surplus calories get stored, so if you ate 1500 extra calories of p, f, or c, the excess would get stored. I can see possibly insulin spiking and nutrient timing make a difference when not in a deficit, but in a deficit, your body won't store calories...if it does you are not in a deficit0
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@EudoxySarasmaintaining wrote: »[I am sorry but I dont believe in calori deficit pe se. Our body always adapt to new conditions and tends to increase or decrese its basal metabolism accordingly. One year ago I can create a caloric deficit by consuming 2500 cal. For the last 4 month I have to go less than 1400- 1500cal which is so hard to maintain.
Going to take a wild guess that you're not running your numbers right-either you've figured out your calorie goals wrong, or you're not accurately measuring/recording your food.
As for IF-yes, I did alternate day IF for my weight loss phase, used 5:2IF as the transition into maintenance, and have been using 16:8IF for the past two years, as part of my maintenance plan. The first two methods have a calorie deficit built into them, but 16:8IF does not, and you still need to run your numbers (correctly) and plug them into your eating window. All's 16:8IF does is designate a certain time to eat, but you could still eat over on calories in your eating window and gain weight if you're not being intentional about eating at a deficit.
How do you do 2 very low calorie days per week without burning too much muscle? If you can only burn so much body fat per day?
Regarding 5:2 - Muscle is a fuel of last resort, a starvation response if you like.
You do not starve by eating very low for two days a week and eating normally five days a week. In fact you have a very moderate deficit over the course of a week.
I had no problems with loss of lean mass.
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the example you gave about 100cal is not accurate since both of them are very rich in carbs. Lets try in this way 100 cal donuts and 100 cal fats. The first will surge you insulin level which is ana lipogenic hormone that blocks fats elimination while the second one wont affect your insulin so if you are in catabolic state you will still use your fat as energy. Does it make sense?
no that makes absolutely no sense.
You are comparing carrots to a macronutrient, that is like comparing apples to oranges.
So you are trying to say that if I eat a 100 calorie donut, and I am in a deficit for the day, that I will still store fat even though I am in a calorie deficit, because insulin? Do you have any peer reviewed sources on this, besides Taubes? Secondly, protein also spikes insulin, so will that also lead to fat being stored?
and you never answered my question about if you use a food scale or not...
To answer your question you will still lose weight because you are still in caloric deficit. As I said before I beleive in physic law. But here is the issue. If you eat this 100 calorie donuts you will block the utilisation of your fat storge because the insulin peak you generate wont let you do it. Your energy need for that day will use your reserve of sugar(Glycogen) stocked in your liver and muscles.
I am open to any idea and I am not stuck in a corner. I was low fat diet for a years but I beleive that real science contradict with it
I'm afraid Taubes is a quack and that's nonsense about donuts/insulin/glycogen.
Time to stop believing in fairies and instead work on actually having a sustainable caloric deficit over a period of time.
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agreed well statedlongtimeterp wrote: »If your body has nutrients and calories available, it will use those before going into its storage, so no it doesn't matter 100 cals is 100 cals. Only surplus calories get stored, so if you ate 1500 extra calories of p, f, or c, the excess would get stored. I can see possibly insulin spiking and nutrient timing make a difference when not in a deficit, but in a deficit, your body won't store calories...if it does you are not in a deficit
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Where is my fat storge?0
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Well we I am not searching any challenge here. my thread was about intermittent fasting and somme feed back. To answer the questions:
1- I dont use a scale to measure my food but I eating exactly the same for the last 18 month and I have a good ideas about the calories I am intaking.
Please lets s return to the main subject. Intermittent fasting0 -
The insulin spike during a "feed" only prevents (for a very short period of time) fat burning and up to a couple of hours until the meal has been completely absorbed, then then insulin spike declines and move to fat burning for energy...
Is this not correct?0 -
Well we I am not searching any challenge here. my thread was about intermittent fasting and somme feed back. To answer the questions:
1- I dont use a scale to measure my food but I eating exactly the same for the last 18 month and I have a good ideas about the calories I am intaking.
Please lets s return to the main subject. Intermittent fasting
OK then, my feedback on IF - I did (and still do) a different version of IF (5:2) and found it a great way to achieve adherence to my calorie goal.
That's probably not helping is it?
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Exercise more. Everyone poo-poos exercise here, but it is calories in AND OUT. Walk. Ride a bike. Dance in front of the television. Do jumping jacks. Play ball with your kids or your neighbors' kids. Play golf. Go swimming. Run and run and run some more. Go hiking up a mountain. Take your kids to a playground and actually play with them. But most of all, stop eating too much!0
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Well we I am not searching any challenge here. my thread was about intermittent fasting and somme feed back. To answer the questions:
1- I dont use a scale to measure my food but I eating exactly the same for the last 18 month and I have a good ideas about the calories I am intaking.
Please lets s return to the main subject. Intermittent fasting
there is your problem right there...if you are not using a food scale you are more than likely under estimating your calories consumed.
I would suggest getting a food scale, and weigh/log/measure all of your food for two weeks and see what happens.0 -
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