Calorie counting doesn't work according to a new study. Apparently.
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
What is "such a solution" for getting rid of obesity? Government-mandated boxed meals? I'm not clear on the connection you're trying to draw here.TimothyFish wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
People are going to stay obese, then, for a very long time.
That is likely true, but it wasn't that many years ago that schools started providing lunches for children, because their parents weren't feeding them enough. The fact that we went from one extreme to the other is an indication that there might be such a solution.
Mandatory strength training?
What I really want to see and it needs to be talked about is since these obesity rates are so high, what are the statistic increases of diseases?0 -
TimothyFish wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
People are going to stay obese, then, for a very long time.
That is likely true, but it wasn't that many years ago that schools started providing lunches for children, because their parents weren't feeding them enough. The fact that we went from one extreme to the other is an indication that there might be such a solution.
And they still do, because there are still malnourished children in the United States.
There are overweight and obese children as well.
The two do not cancel each other out.0 -
yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
Calorie counting is a method that will 100% work 100% of the time if adhered to. But the reality is that most people find it difficult to adhere to. So Fishman is right - a better approach is needed.
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yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find.
Did you read what I quoted? Context?
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TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
People are going to stay obese, then, for a very long time.
Most likely, yes.
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That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find.
I definitely agree here. I also think it's pretty myopic to believe that people who are obese or who are unable to adhere to a given method are "lazy".
Could it be accurate for some people? Probably. But I wouldn't apply that to everyone.Calorie counting is a method that will 100% work 100% of the time if adhered to. But the reality is that most people find it difficult to adhere to. So Fishman is right - a better approach is needed.
I don't mean to be pedantic but I disagree with the bold.0 -
TimothyFish wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »I don't think I'm disagreeing with you.
Then your statement below...TimothhFish wrote:The statement actually deals with the fact that a runner who is making good nutritional choices will tend to out perform a runner who is not." is false?
... is wrong. You can outrun a "bad" diet. Because people typically think bad = processed foods such as pizza and mcdonalds. There are many factors that affect the performance of one athlete. And as demonstrated by people like Michael Phelps, diet isn't as big of a factor.
What I was disagreeing with in that statement was that "bad diet" as meant by the "You can't outrun a bad diet" assertion has anything to do with calories. "Bad diet" is talking about nutrition.
interpretation is subjective.
I always took that to mean you can exercise all you want but if you are not in a deficit you won't lose weight.
Agreed. In fact, I rarely have ever seen it referenced in regards to nutrition but rather if your diet is crap, you won't lose weight.
In Phil Gaimon's book, "Pro Cycling on $10 a Day: From Fat Kid to Euro Pro", he discusses a conversation he had with another cyclist, in which a similar statement was used that was very clearly about nutrition, rather than weight. As I recall, the context included something along the lines of, "You aren't going to win races while eating nothing but cookies." When doing a Google search, I find pages of articles in which the statement is used, along with a discussion of eating too much sugar. It is only when it gets translated into MFP speak that it becomes about calories, because the focus of MFP is on calories, rather than on nutrition.
The bold is 100% false. If you read any of our post, you will see we start with calories (because the controls loss/gain/maintenance), but advocate getting 80-90% of your diet from nutrient dense foods.
Also, if I am a pro cyclist, I would include gummy bears in my diet, especially while riding as it's mainly dextrose (fasted converting sugar) which can help replenish glycogen fast. But that is just me personally.
Also, i haven't read the book, so if that is where you automatically draw our information from, it would be hard to put that in context. But my general context has always been about losing weight, particularly in the area of getting abs/flat stomachs.
I want to know why, if every other part of the world besides MFP supposedly interprets the phrase "you can't outrun a bad diet" to be about nutrition, every single headline stemming from that BSJ article on exercise not being enough to counter obesity said EXACTLY that.
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It's perfectly possible to be lazy in one aspect of one's life while not being lazy in others. Someone could work his butt off at a profession and be lazy when it comes to yard work. Or losing weight.yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
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Seriously, how come this tread is not even closed yet, definatly qualifies as NSFW with all the food porn on McDonalds
I've been thinking about this thread all morning and the 'challenge' that was put forth to eat only Mcds for year. I mentioned it to my husband (as were sitting in drive through for Arbys), and he was really interested in seeing what would happen if I actually did the challenge. He knows how I eat (fast food on a regular basis), and also how I've been so successful not only with my weight, but also with improving my health.
We got brainstorming and I'm going to do a pitch to corporate Mcds-I used to be a blogger (I've actually been on national tv/magazine back in the day, related to my old blog), and I could start a blog to record myself eating a year of Mcds, to prove that I can maintain a healthy weight, and also continue to be in good health. They'd get some publicity, and in return they pay for the food
They probably won't take me up on it, but I'm going to try-who knows, I could be the next Twinkie guy lol. 0 -
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find.
I definitely agree here. I also think it's pretty myopic to believe that people who are obese or who are unable to adhere to a given method are "lazy".
Could it be accurate for some people? Probably. But I wouldn't apply that to everyone.Calorie counting is a method that will 100% work 100% of the time if adhered to. But the reality is that most people find it difficult to adhere to. So Fishman is right - a better approach is needed.
I don't mean to be pedantic but I disagree with the bold.
There is a difference between someone who try there hardest to accomplish weight loss for example even if they failed or took them longer to do then someone putting in no effort hoping the world finds some way that you could take something and boom you are magically x amount of pounds down with no effort. You would not call the latter being lazy?
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yopeeps025 wrote: »That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find.
I definitely agree here. I also think it's pretty myopic to believe that people who are obese or who are unable to adhere to a given method are "lazy".
Could it be accurate for some people? Probably. But I wouldn't apply that to everyone.Calorie counting is a method that will 100% work 100% of the time if adhered to. But the reality is that most people find it difficult to adhere to. So Fishman is right - a better approach is needed.
I don't mean to be pedantic but I disagree with the bold.
There is a difference between someone who try there hardest to accomplish weight loss for example even if they failed or took them longer to do then someone putting in no effort hoping the world finds some way that you could take something and boom you are magically x amount of pounds down with no effort. You would not call the latter being lazy?
The latter could potentially be lazy.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »tlflag1620 wrote: »Commenting without having read thru all the comments -
Research on the gut microbiome (much like research on epigenetics) is in its infancy. We simply don't know enough to be making any kind of recommendations. The fact is, there are more NON-human cells in our body than there are human ones. So the notion that out "gut bugs" influence our health (and quite possibly our weight) in a significant way is not a totally off-the-wall notion. That said, we don't know (yet) what the optimum gut microbiome looks like, nor do we know how to get there. Some foods seem beneficial (fermented foods, like yogurt, sauerkraut, kieifer, etc) and others appear more harmful (refined carbohydrates), but like I said, it's just too soon into this field of study to be making recommendations to the general public. Theories are great in the world of science and academia. But for practical applications in the real world, we need more concrete evidence of what to do in order to obtain "optimal" gut bacteria. Until then, the best advice is to do the best you can with the info you actually have - we know that calorie restriction (however you happen to go about it) and increased activity works. It's not fun. It's not glamorous. Its doesn't sell newspapers. But it will work. And until science gives us something more concrete to work with, everything else is just snake oil.
Yup. Sick to death of the media jumping on preliminary speculative findings and then the internet gurus running away with it.
I predict the "gut flora diet" will be the next big thing. Everyone will be eating lacto-fermented veggies and yogurt to lose weight.
It already kinda is. Mercola is all over it! Ferment your own veggies so you don't get fat and die of cancer and Alzheimer's!
And it is sad, because the research IS really fascinating. I would suspect gut flora does play a role in weight management, due to how it might affect satiety, digestive ease, and nutrient absorption, not by magically making you fat or skinny. I read something that vaguely suggests it is our gut flora that causes specific food cravings. So maybe it's not a little devil on my shoulder, telling me to eat the whole bag of chips. It is my not-diverse-enough-gut-bacteria! Of course it's still me sticking my hand back in the bag
OMG... MERCOLA.... of course he would jump on preliminary findings and start preaching conclusive gospel.
I agree, it IS fascinating, but I suspect that it's an extraordinarily complex issue to find anything conclusive about given all of the possible variables involved in individual dietary choices and how they might react with individual biology.
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TimothyFish wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
People are going to stay obese, then, for a very long time.
That is likely true, but it wasn't that many years ago that schools started providing lunches for children, because their parents weren't feeding them enough. The fact that we went from one extreme to the other is an indication that there might be such a solution.
I.... see your point. I don't necessarily share your vision, but, ever consider a career in public health?
Your comments make me think of adding Fluorine to water, or something. No one has to think about that. Like some have asked, I'm just not sure what the equivalent for obesity would be. They've tried soda taxes and such which went down like a lead balloon, or health related benefits from corporations which I'm not sure make much of an impact at all
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
It's perfectly possible to be lazy in one aspect of one's life while not being lazy in others. Someone could work his butt off at a profession and be lazy when it comes to yard work. Or losing weight.yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
That's not laziness, that's prioritization.
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yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
Calorie counting is a method that will 100% work 100% of the time if adhered to. But the reality is that most people find it difficult to adhere to. So Fishman is right - a better approach is needed.
No, SEVERAL options are needed. There can never be a one-size fits all approach. Different people, different things will click.
This whole idea that there will be one "right" answer is just wrong-headed.
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
It's perfectly possible to be lazy in one aspect of one's life while not being lazy in others. Someone could work his butt off at a profession and be lazy when it comes to yard work. Or losing weight.yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
That's not laziness, that's prioritization.
now we are back to playing word games again..
you can be a hard worker and then be lazy and not workout because you would rather sit on the couch after work.0 -
mamapeach910 wrote: »yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
Calorie counting is a method that will 100% work 100% of the time if adhered to. But the reality is that most people find it difficult to adhere to. So Fishman is right - a better approach is needed.
No, SEVERAL options are needed. There can never be a one-size fits all approach. Different people, different things will click.
This whole idea that there will be one "right" answer is just wrong-headed.
That's what I said, and have said repeatedly.
And usually when I do, you disagree with me - so....welcome to the club. 0 -
DeguelloTex wrote: »
It's perfectly possible to be lazy in one aspect of one's life while not being lazy in others. Someone could work his butt off at a profession and be lazy when it comes to yard work. Or losing weight.yopeeps025 wrote: »TimothyFish wrote: »asflatasapancake wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »skysiebaby wrote: »IMO rubbish like this is part of the reason we have an obesity epidemic- the public are constantly told by the media its not always their own fault they are fat.
Can't have it both ways. If people have a "choice", then it's not all science. If it is all science, they don't have anything but the illusion of choice and - yeah - it's not really their "fault".
But do you not think that all the media hype and confusion in what they choose to publish surrounding issues like weight loss have probably not helped the situation? Genuinely interested in other peoples opinions on this. I took the time to educate myself and not just believe in the next fad that comes along, but a lot of people don't. I believe in CICO, its worked for me, but in real world conversations no one wants to hear it.
I mentioned in an earlier post about an ITV documentary that was shown last week here. Media is where a lot of the general public get their information, whether its 100% accurate or not and that annoys me.
It's because CICO is not the latest, greatest, coolest thing. It's too easy of a solution in plan. And much too hard for a lot of people in practice. Everyone, including myself, are always looking for an easier way to do things. Trying to be more efficient. The "obesity epidemic" makes it easy for media/companies/marketing groups to run with whatever to solve the problem. Also, the whole social media explosion over the last few years has made it far too easy to get things out there that may not hold a shred of truth to them, but people believe because, why would someone put it on the internet if it wasn't true? I remember something that, of all people, Marilyn Manson said that I find very true. The media/government want people to be afraid. The idea is "Fear, fear, fear". Then "Consume, consume, consume."
Whatever the reason, there are a lot of people who aren't going to track their calories, even if they are convinced that it works. In looking at the obesity problem, that's something to take into consideration as well. It does not good to have a solution that works if no one follows it. The CDC has been preaching diet and exercise for years, but if they're going to make an impact on the problem the solution needs to be one that people can do without thinking about it.
When I read this I think of laziness.
That's demonstrably not correct, most of the time. Most obese people in my life are hard working dedicated professionals, for whom the word "laziness" is about as incorrect description as you could find. That "laziness" is the word people jump to says more about the person using the word, frankly, than about the people being labelled as such.
That's not laziness, that's prioritization.
Lazy=averse or disinclined to work, activity, or exertion; indolent
no it's laziness per it's definition...
0
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