adipex - diet pill
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maillemaker wrote: »I hate to say it, but this sounds like a very defeatist viewpoint. That hunger is a fixed and immovable thing and that without something to permanently silence it, people are powerless against it. For a certain number of people this may well be true. For the larger portion of people, I believe it is not.
The reality is that most people - between 80% and 95% - who attempt weight loss fail long term. If we are going to fix this, we have to understand why.And really, the two scenarios you put up above are more complementary than opposite. There is nothing to prevent a person using a suppressant and learning and to adapt and manage hunger. It is just that it is less likely, because the mindset going in is the same as any fad or crash diet: "this will be a temporary thing and I can go back to the same habits as before when I'm done."
The other problem is that in the "real world" medically, doctors do not give good support for transitioning off the pills. You're on them, you get to a stopping point, and you're off them. And again back to the previous habits.
Again, if this were an issue of "habits", then habits should be relearned within about 3-10 weeks. If you are on phentermine or similar appetite suppressant for 6 months this should be plenty of time to learn new habits.
It's not the habits that are the problem.
Most people try to lose too much weight too fast or use drugs to do it, and set themselves up for failure. 1 pound a week only takes a little bit of self control, and increasing activity level is the other half of the solution.
If those same people lost 1 pound a week and increased their activity level, 80% to 95% would keep the weight off.
It comes down to a life style change.0 -
bcalvanese wrote: »maillemaker wrote: »I hate to say it, but this sounds like a very defeatist viewpoint. That hunger is a fixed and immovable thing and that without something to permanently silence it, people are powerless against it. For a certain number of people this may well be true. For the larger portion of people, I believe it is not.
The reality is that most people - between 80% and 95% - who attempt weight loss fail long term. If we are going to fix this, we have to understand why.And really, the two scenarios you put up above are more complementary than opposite. There is nothing to prevent a person using a suppressant and learning and to adapt and manage hunger. It is just that it is less likely, because the mindset going in is the same as any fad or crash diet: "this will be a temporary thing and I can go back to the same habits as before when I'm done."
The other problem is that in the "real world" medically, doctors do not give good support for transitioning off the pills. You're on them, you get to a stopping point, and you're off them. And again back to the previous habits.
Again, if this were an issue of "habits", then habits should be relearned within about 3-10 weeks. If you are on phentermine or similar appetite suppressant for 6 months this should be plenty of time to learn new habits.
It's not the habits that are the problem.
Most people try to lose too much weight too fast or use drugs to do it, and set themselves up for failure. 1 pound a week only takes a little bit of self control, and increasing activity level is the other half of the solution.
If those same people lost 1 pound a week and increased their activity level, 80% to 95% would keep the weight off.
It comes down to a life style change.
What are you basing this claim on? I know plenty of people, including myself, who lost weight at a sensible rate (around 1lb/week or less), and still gained it back. I did maintain for a few years, but eventually, I lost vigilance, underwent emotional stress, life changes, injuries, etc....and poof...gained it all back. It wasn't all at once, of course. I just gained 10 lbs at first, maintained for a while, then gained 20 more...etc...0 -
"A logical fallacy is, roughly speaking, an error of reasoning. When someone adopts a position, or tries to persuade someone else to adopt a position, based on a bad piece of reasoning, they commit a fallacy." "Arguments consist of premises, inferences, and conclusions. Arguments containing bad inferences, i.e. inferences where the premises don’t give adequate support for the conclusion drawn, can certainly be called fallacious."
Just different ways of saying the same thing.
sigh
first off, arguments may consist of implications, but never inferences
a logical fallacy is one of two things:
- a formal logical fallacy (i.e. an error in the propositional logic of the argument, such as a syllogistic fallacy)
- an informal logical fallacy (e.g. ad hominem, tu quoque, circular reasoning, begging the question, etc.)
I should further mention that anecdotes are indeed formal fallacies. thus, to invalidate my argument, all you really had to do was call me out on giving an anecdote. but you wanted to delve into false implications, which were poor inferences on your part. you can't dissect my "premises" and "conclusion" if I am not presenting a logical argument in the first place.
take the posts here for what they are--anecdotes, plain and simple. if someone wants to provide a logical argument either for or against the use of stimulants for dieting, they are certainly welcome to do so!0 -
my vote is +1 for No Pills whatever the justification. These pills are just a gamble personally i,d rather be in control as inner strength is what really matters, Diet quick fixes are big profits & its been proved so many times before that a placebo drug works much the same way.
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"A logical fallacy is, roughly speaking, an error of reasoning. When someone adopts a position, or tries to persuade someone else to adopt a position, based on a bad piece of reasoning, they commit a fallacy." "Arguments consist of premises, inferences, and conclusions. Arguments containing bad inferences, i.e. inferences where the premises don’t give adequate support for the conclusion drawn, can certainly be called fallacious."
Just different ways of saying the same thing.
sigh
first off, arguments may consist of implications, but never inferences
a logical fallacy is one of two things:
- a formal logical fallacy (i.e. an error in the propositional logic of the argument, such as a syllogistic fallacy)
- an informal logical fallacy (e.g. ad hominem, tu quoque, circular reasoning, begging the question, etc.)
I should further mention that anecdotes are indeed formal fallacies. thus, to invalidate my argument, all you really had to do was call me out on giving an anecdote. but you wanted to delve into false implications, which were poor inferences on your part. you can't dissect my "premises" and "conclusion" if I am not presenting a logical argument in the first place.
take the posts here for what they are--anecdotes, plain and simple. if someone wants to provide a logical argument either for or against the use of stimulants for dieting, they are certainly welcome to do so!
So you just wanted to give a personal anecdote, but were not IMPLYING anything by it? So how is it related to this thread at all then?? I don't buy it. You were offering your own experience to support your opinion that weight loss drugs don't work. Please stop denying the obvious.
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"A logical fallacy is, roughly speaking, an error of reasoning. When someone adopts a position, or tries to persuade someone else to adopt a position, based on a bad piece of reasoning, they commit a fallacy." "Arguments consist of premises, inferences, and conclusions. Arguments containing bad inferences, i.e. inferences where the premises don’t give adequate support for the conclusion drawn, can certainly be called fallacious."
Just different ways of saying the same thing.
sigh
first off, arguments may consist of implications, but never inferences
a logical fallacy is one of two things:
- a formal logical fallacy (i.e. an error in the propositional logic of the argument, such as a syllogistic fallacy)
- an informal logical fallacy (e.g. ad hominem, tu quoque, circular reasoning, begging the question, etc.)
I should further mention that anecdotes are indeed formal fallacies. thus, to invalidate my argument, all you really had to do was call me out on giving an anecdote. but you wanted to delve into false implications, which were poor inferences on your part. you can't dissect my "premises" and "conclusion" if I am not presenting a logical argument in the first place.
take the posts here for what they are--anecdotes, plain and simple. if someone wants to provide a logical argument either for or against the use of stimulants for dieting, they are certainly welcome to do so!
So you just wanted to give a personal anecdote, but were not inferring anything by it? So how is it related to this thread at all then?? I don't buy it. You were offering your own experience to support your opinion that weight loss drugs don't work. Please stop denying the obvious.
And are you really nitpicking the fact that I used the word "infer" instead of "imply?" Are you trying to prove your superior intellect, or just that you took some college classes in formal reasoning? Because I couldn't give a rats @ss.0 -
You INSINUATED that the reason you gained back the weight was because you used diet pills to lose it. There, is that better?
Also, why anyone would ever take 100mg of ephedrine in a day is beyond me! No wonder you were so angry.0 -
"A logical fallacy is, roughly speaking, an error of reasoning. When someone adopts a position, or tries to persuade someone else to adopt a position, based on a bad piece of reasoning, they commit a fallacy." "Arguments consist of premises, inferences, and conclusions. Arguments containing bad inferences, i.e. inferences where the premises don’t give adequate support for the conclusion drawn, can certainly be called fallacious."
Just different ways of saying the same thing.
sigh
first off, arguments may consist of implications, but never inferences
a logical fallacy is one of two things:
- a formal logical fallacy (i.e. an error in the propositional logic of the argument, such as a syllogistic fallacy)
- an informal logical fallacy (e.g. ad hominem, tu quoque, circular reasoning, begging the question, etc.)
I should further mention that anecdotes are indeed formal fallacies. thus, to invalidate my argument, all you really had to do was call me out on giving an anecdote. but you wanted to delve into false implications, which were poor inferences on your part. you can't dissect my "premises" and "conclusion" if I am not presenting a logical argument in the first place.
take the posts here for what they are--anecdotes, plain and simple. if someone wants to provide a logical argument either for or against the use of stimulants for dieting, they are certainly welcome to do so!
So you just wanted to give a personal anecdote, but were not inferring anything by it? So how is it related to this thread at all then?? I don't buy it. You were offering your own experience to support your opinion that weight loss drugs don't work. Please stop denying the obvious.
And are you really nitpicking the fact that I used the word "infer" instead of "imply?" Are you trying to prove your superior intellect, or just that you took some college classes in formal reasoning? Because I couldn't give a rats @ss.
yes, I "nitpicked" your "argument", in response to you explaining the "definition" of "LOGICAL FALLACIES" to me in all caps in an incredibly condescending manner as if I'm a moron. therefore I replied in kind
5 year old version: "nu uh u started it first"0 -
You INSINUATED that the reason you gained back the weight was because you used diet pills to lose it. There, is that better?
Also, why anyone would ever take 100mg of ephedrine in a day is beyond me! No wonder you were so angry.
and yes 100mg is quite a bit; if you have ever dealt with stimulants personally then you understand tolerance levels and how quickly they ramp up. it was very dangerous and stupid and I was young (and stupid)0 -
"A logical fallacy is, roughly speaking, an error of reasoning. When someone adopts a position, or tries to persuade someone else to adopt a position, based on a bad piece of reasoning, they commit a fallacy." "Arguments consist of premises, inferences, and conclusions. Arguments containing bad inferences, i.e. inferences where the premises don’t give adequate support for the conclusion drawn, can certainly be called fallacious."
Just different ways of saying the same thing.
sigh
first off, arguments may consist of implications, but never inferences
a logical fallacy is one of two things:
- a formal logical fallacy (i.e. an error in the propositional logic of the argument, such as a syllogistic fallacy)
- an informal logical fallacy (e.g. ad hominem, tu quoque, circular reasoning, begging the question, etc.)
I should further mention that anecdotes are indeed formal fallacies. thus, to invalidate my argument, all you really had to do was call me out on giving an anecdote. but you wanted to delve into false implications, which were poor inferences on your part. you can't dissect my "premises" and "conclusion" if I am not presenting a logical argument in the first place.
take the posts here for what they are--anecdotes, plain and simple. if someone wants to provide a logical argument either for or against the use of stimulants for dieting, they are certainly welcome to do so!
So you just wanted to give a personal anecdote, but were not inferring anything by it? So how is it related to this thread at all then?? I don't buy it. You were offering your own experience to support your opinion that weight loss drugs don't work. Please stop denying the obvious.
And are you really nitpicking the fact that I used the word "infer" instead of "imply?" Are you trying to prove your superior intellect, or just that you took some college classes in formal reasoning? Because I couldn't give a rats @ss.
yes, I "nitpicked" your "argument", in response to you explaining the "definition" of "LOGICAL FALLACIES" to me in all caps in an incredibly condescending manner as if I'm a moron. therefore I replied in kind
5 year old version: "nu uh u started it first"
LOL Ok, fine. But you started it!! :P0 -
You INSINUATED that the reason you gained back the weight was because you used diet pills to lose it. There, is that better?
Also, why anyone would ever take 100mg of ephedrine in a day is beyond me! No wonder you were so angry.
and yes 100mg is quite a bit; if you have ever dealt with stimulants personally then you understand tolerance levels and how quickly they ramp up. it was very dangerous and stupid and I was young (and stupid)
Understood. I have done some pretty dumb stuff in my youth.0 -
"A logical fallacy is, roughly speaking, an error of reasoning. When someone adopts a position, or tries to persuade someone else to adopt a position, based on a bad piece of reasoning, they commit a fallacy." "Arguments consist of premises, inferences, and conclusions. Arguments containing bad inferences, i.e. inferences where the premises don’t give adequate support for the conclusion drawn, can certainly be called fallacious."
Just different ways of saying the same thing.
sigh
first off, arguments may consist of implications, but never inferences
a logical fallacy is one of two things:
- a formal logical fallacy (i.e. an error in the propositional logic of the argument, such as a syllogistic fallacy)
- an informal logical fallacy (e.g. ad hominem, tu quoque, circular reasoning, begging the question, etc.)
I should further mention that anecdotes are indeed formal fallacies. thus, to invalidate my argument, all you really had to do was call me out on giving an anecdote. but you wanted to delve into false implications, which were poor inferences on your part. you can't dissect my "premises" and "conclusion" if I am not presenting a logical argument in the first place.
take the posts here for what they are--anecdotes, plain and simple. if someone wants to provide a logical argument either for or against the use of stimulants for dieting, they are certainly welcome to do so!
So you just wanted to give a personal anecdote, but were not inferring anything by it? So how is it related to this thread at all then?? I don't buy it. You were offering your own experience to support your opinion that weight loss drugs don't work. Please stop denying the obvious.
And are you really nitpicking the fact that I used the word "infer" instead of "imply?" Are you trying to prove your superior intellect, or just that you took some college classes in formal reasoning? Because I couldn't give a rats @ss.
yes, I "nitpicked" your "argument", in response to you explaining the "definition" of "LOGICAL FALLACIES" to me in all caps in an incredibly condescending manner as if I'm a moron. therefore I replied in kind
5 year old version: "nu uh u started it first"
LOL Ok, fine. But you started it!! :P
:flowerforyou:0 -
I took Phentermine and lost 50 pounds. Having everyone comment on how good I looked was awesome. You know what wasn't awesome? Being a complete B*&#$, dry mouth and the massive headaches when the medicine wore off every day. I figured "hey, I've lost 50 pounds, I can do this on my own. Phentermine was just a little help to get me started." Fast forward a year, and I'm back. At my highest recorded weight, EVER.
I totally understand feeling like you need a little kick start. And I'm certainly not in any position to judge someone taking them, just be careful. Phentermine can seem like a god send in the beginning, but can (and most often does) bite you in the butt in the end.
yea I know the feels
on ephedrine I was a *kitten* dick 24/7
esp when I upped my dosage to 100mg/day
like, *kitten* rage machine
I have been on it for almost 2 months I have learned new habits with my foods I now weigh and track everything going into my body.
I do have a little more energy from taking the pill but no more than normal.
I also seem to be less calm and not as B**chy on it my mood swings seem to be more in check when I am on it compared to when I am not on it. I do get spouts of dry mouth so I just chug some water and I am back to normal.
As you see not everyone gets the same side effects from pills that's why they say this COULD happen or that COULD happen no one really knows.0 -
prettyleelee wrote: »I took Phentermine and lost 50 pounds. Having everyone comment on how good I looked was awesome. You know what wasn't awesome? Being a complete B*&#$, dry mouth and the massive headaches when the medicine wore off every day. I figured "hey, I've lost 50 pounds, I can do this on my own. Phentermine was just a little help to get me started." Fast forward a year, and I'm back. At my highest recorded weight, EVER.
I totally understand feeling like you need a little kick start. And I'm certainly not in any position to judge someone taking them, just be careful. Phentermine can seem like a god send in the beginning, but can (and most often does) bite you in the butt in the end.
yea I know the feels
on ephedrine I was a *kitten* dick 24/7
esp when I upped my dosage to 100mg/day
like, *kitten* rage machine
I have been on it for almost 2 months I have learned new habits with my foods I now weigh and track everything going into my body.
I do have a little more energy from taking the pill but no more than normal.
I also seem to be less calm and not as B**chy on it my mood swings seem to be more in check when I am on it compared to when I am not on it. I do get spouts of dry mouth so I just chug some water and I am back to normal.
As you see not everyone gets the same side effects from pills that's why they say this COULD happen or that COULD happen no one really knows.
good luck to you. others have given their advice already.
work with your doctor and stay safe.
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jdingus728 wrote: »I started adipex yesterday to help with weight loss, my goal weight is 150 and im currently 242. Was wondering if anyone on here has had any success with it?
I started Phentermine on 6/25 and today 6/30 I'm down 7 lbs. The first day was rough as my body had to adjust to the side effects of the medicine. I was really hyper and moody on day one. Day two I was no longer hype or moody but have started to experience headaches. I increased by water intake and took motrin ib for the headache. Don't have much of an appetite but make sure I eat three small meals a day. I haven't been able to finish a meal but I don't feel weak or hungry. I love the boost of confidence this pill gave me that it's possible that the weight can come off. One of the benefits is the burst of energy it gives me to work out and to chase my son around.0 -
I've been on it for month and half and i think it makes me very , but i haven't experienced the decrease in appetite!
my goal is 150-190 right now. I dint get why it's not helping! Yes its prescription.
Make sure you are drinking your water... I notice it works so much better when I drink water throughout the day. I like to aim for one gallon a day!
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It worked great for me, works ok for my husband. He has less willpower around food than I do. I did not have rebound weight gain. I tapered off of the meds the last week I took them.0
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I am down 61 lbs on it.0
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I'm down from 212 to 165. It helps me stick to my diet and I also lift weights and jazzercise0
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I don't think we prescribe this in the UK? Someone correct me if I'm wrong. I just can't get my head around taking a stimulant like that every single day for months. In my wilder youth I took stimulants recreationally and it was zero fun experiencing the withdrawals. To go through that even on a low level every day?! Nope. Then there's the well spoken about risks that come from taking a stimulant.
I also see many say they had already committed to a lifestyle change, were tracking calories, working out, losing weight and STILL they were prescribed this pill? If you don't know when you're hungry how can you make wise choices on how to best satiate that hungry through meal choices so that you can manage hunger.
I say this as someone who may have, in the past, considered a "magic pill". Now I've got a handle on what I knew but chose to unlearn I can see how much easier and more successful I am without any interference or crazy new methods of dropping the pounds. I'm learning how to manage my hunger, not hide it, I'm learning to portion control. If you're motivated enough, the pill shouldn't be necessary and if you make the right choices in your changes you should never be ravenous anyway.
This is like some warped 50s throwback where studio executives threw uppers an downers at their young stars to keep them thin and working.0
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