Overwhelmed by PCOS
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PeachyCarol wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »I agree with @KatherineNadeau Actually I had a visceral response to some of the replies.
I mean the OP said, in her post, that she felt she ate a lot. Off the bat. So much of what followed was unnecessary and shaming. People could have just presented their strategies, and left it at that. Obviously different approaches are working for people in different ways, and the condition itself is variable.
I also agree with KatherineNadeau (and you, tomatoey.)
And I disagree strongly with all 3 of you
So that's nice
Heh.
And me too.
Me also.
Regarding not being "qualified" to comment in this thread"? I know how weight loss works with other metabolic, emotional, medical, physically limiting, and lifestyle issues/complications.
People with EVERY disorder in the book, particularly the newly diagnosed or those going through a really rough patch think that they're alone and that no one can understand or relate or has it quite like they do. It's depressing, it's understandable, but it's wrong and after a point? It's self-indulgent to one's own detriment. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. When I realized how much I was hurting myself in retrospect, I was pretty angry at myself. I got over that too.
You can have all the issues in the world and think all the obstacles are in your way, but you are stronger than you think.
So yes, to the people who are not yet accepting the fact that they ate too much and still feel like helpless victims (this includes blaming the food) instead of proactive warriors? You've still got some work to do.
Those of us with limits are not bound or defined by them unless we let ourselves be.
That's great for you. Some people appreciate assistance in planning meals / diet to mitigate appetite. Some people have offered concrete advice that's worked for them, rather than moral condemnation. Willpower or wtf ever isn't the point, as far as I'm concerned. It's managing the condition in a sustainable way. That is low carb/low GI for many.
Those who offered that advice ,
@lemurcat12, were not derailing.
Have you noticed how many of the ladies with PCOS who have responded don't have to do anything but watch their calories?
FTR, I'm not making a moral judgment. You confuse me giving someone advice when I see that she's still at a point where she's thinking of things in a way that's counterproductive to long-term success because you don't like the fact that I was blunt about it.
I stated a fact. I didn't tell her not to eat low carb. She won't succeed long term in managing her weight, which will ultimately manage her insulin resistance, until she knows, deep down, the root cause. HOW you diet is a band-aid. Knowing why you need to diet in the first place is treating the underlying problem.
I don't care if you don't like what I said. I AM trying to help people here.
Whether a particular way of eating is "Counterproductive to long-term success " or a "band-aid" is a matter of individual experience. Many have successfully managed their conditions, long-term, using particular nutritional strategies. Low gi/carb isn't a recipe for failure for everyone. On the contrary, some do very well with those approaches. Long-term. Your truth isn't everyone's truth, and it's NOT helpful to present it as if it is.
You. are. missing. the. point.
I was not addressing her choice to eat low GI/low carb.
If you read enough threads on here, I often tell people with PCOS and even thyroid issues that some members of both groups do well eating that way.
I moderate my own carbs, btw.
Her long term success, now matter what her macros are, will hinge on her being able to manage her caloric consumption.
To do that, she will need to manage hunger, her emotions, stress, and a host of other things that lead people to eat and overeat. When you simply say... oh! It's high GI food and my hormones, you're leaving out massive parts of a very complicated equation.
You've still got work to do inside yourself.
I'm not saying not to eat low GI, or low carb. I'm saying to do that inside work.
I 'm just dandy, thanks. I'm very lucky in that I've never had any kind of psychological issues around food beyond planning issues. So I can't comment on strategies that might work for those who do have the kind of issues you seem to feel everyone has. I don't, in fact. I try to stay away from conversations to which I can't usefully contribute.
The OP has stated that she knew she overate.
That's an issue. Anyone who overeats and ignores it without addressing it has some kind of issue, even if it's just denial. WHY did they do that?
The "you" in that post was the general you, not talking to you specifically.
Our back and forth is derailing this thread at this point.
Since the OP is asking for advice to address some of these issues, perhaps it's time to leave this side issue aside.
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PeachyCarol wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »I agree with @KatherineNadeau Actually I had a visceral response to some of the replies.
I mean the OP said, in her post, that she felt she ate a lot. Off the bat. So much of what followed was unnecessary and shaming. People could have just presented their strategies, and left it at that. Obviously different approaches are working for people in different ways, and the condition itself is variable.
I also agree with KatherineNadeau (and you, tomatoey.)
And I disagree strongly with all 3 of you
So that's nice
Heh.
And me too.
Me also.
Regarding not being "qualified" to comment in this thread"? I know how weight loss works with other metabolic, emotional, medical, physically limiting, and lifestyle issues/complications.
People with EVERY disorder in the book, particularly the newly diagnosed or those going through a really rough patch think that they're alone and that no one can understand or relate or has it quite like they do. It's depressing, it's understandable, but it's wrong and after a point? It's self-indulgent to one's own detriment. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. When I realized how much I was hurting myself in retrospect, I was pretty angry at myself. I got over that too.
You can have all the issues in the world and think all the obstacles are in your way, but you are stronger than you think.
So yes, to the people who are not yet accepting the fact that they ate too much and still feel like helpless victims (this includes blaming the food) instead of proactive warriors? You've still got some work to do.
Those of us with limits are not bound or defined by them unless we let ourselves be.
That's great for you. Some people appreciate assistance in planning meals / diet to mitigate appetite. Some people have offered concrete advice that's worked for them, rather than moral condemnation. Willpower or wtf ever isn't the point, as far as I'm concerned. It's managing the condition in a sustainable way. That is low carb/low GI for many.
Those who offered that advice ,
@lemurcat12, were not derailing.
Have you noticed how many of the ladies with PCOS who have responded don't have to do anything but watch their calories?
FTR, I'm not making a moral judgment. You confuse me giving someone advice when I see that she's still at a point where she's thinking of things in a way that's counterproductive to long-term success because you don't like the fact that I was blunt about it.
I stated a fact. I didn't tell her not to eat low carb. She won't succeed long term in managing her weight, which will ultimately manage her insulin resistance, until she knows, deep down, the root cause. HOW you diet is a band-aid. Knowing why you need to diet in the first place is treating the underlying problem.
I don't care if you don't like what I said. I AM trying to help people here.
Whether a particular way of eating is "Counterproductive to long-term success " or a "band-aid" is a matter of individual experience. Many have successfully managed their conditions, long-term, using particular nutritional strategies. Low gi/carb isn't a recipe for failure for everyone. On the contrary, some do very well with those approaches. Long-term. Your truth isn't everyone's truth, and it's NOT helpful to present it as if it is.
You. are. missing. the. point.
I was not addressing her choice to eat low GI/low carb.
If you read enough threads on here, I often tell people with PCOS and even thyroid issues that some members of both groups do well eating that way.
I moderate my own carbs, btw.
Her long term success, now matter what her macros are, will hinge on her being able to manage her caloric consumption.
To do that, she will need to manage hunger, her emotions, stress, and a host of other things that lead people to eat and overeat. When you simply say... oh! It's high GI food and my hormones, you're leaving out massive parts of a very complicated equation.
You've still got work to do inside yourself.
I'm not saying not to eat low GI, or low carb. I'm saying to do that inside work.
I 'm just dandy, thanks. I'm very lucky in that I've never had any kind of psychological issues around food beyond planning issues. So I can't comment on strategies that might work for those who do have the kind of issues you seem to feel everyone has. I don't, in fact. I try to stay away from conversations to which I can't usefully contribute.
The OP has stated that she knew she overate.
That's an issue. Anyone who overeats and ignores it without addressing it has some kind of issue, even if it's just denial. WHY did they do that?
The "you" in that post was the general you, not talking to you specifically.
Our back and forth is derailing this thread at this point.
Since the OP is asking for advice to address some of these issues, perhaps it's time to leave this side issue aside.
I think that's a bit of backtracking on your previous statement (Ie not actually believing you) but I agree that it's a good idea to stop this exchange.
Best of luck to you, OP.0 -
I know for me that I eat when I am bored or sad. I am a total emotional eater.0
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RebeccaMaunder wrote: »I know for me that I eat when I am bored or sad. I am a total emotional eater.
But a great part of your strength is knowing (and admitting!) your weakness, Rebecca. Otherwise you can stay stuck in an oh-poor-me victim mentality and never rise above, never take responsibility for your part in all of it and never successfully lose weight.
You are already miles ahead! 0 -
RebeccaMaunder wrote: »I know for me that I eat when I am bored or sad. I am a total emotional eater.
I was too.
There are two components to emotional eating. One is the emotions themselves, and the other is the habit of eating as a response to them. Both need to be dealt with, in my experience.
As my lovely friend snickerscharlie said, you're miles ahead just realizing both of these are issues for you.
Let me ask you this... when you're bored, do you feel hungry, or do you just feel like eating?
When you're sad, does the eating soothe the emotion, sort of dull it? Or is it something to do to pass the time until you're less sad?
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RebeccaMaunder wrote: »I know for me that I eat when I am bored or sad. I am a total emotional eater.
Me too. That's important to know, because it affects the tools you use to keep from overeating.
I found it helpful to get really conscious of this and when I was doing it (I'd journal), as then when I wanted to eat I could ask myself if I was really hungry or just bored, etc. That helped me resist, and I'd focus on finding other things to do, like walk or listen to music or (this sounds kind of woo and was hard) sit with the feelings or write about them. Or else I'd eat, but only raw veggies.
Another thing that helped was deciding I would only eat at planned meal times. Since I never was so hungry I couldn't make a few hours before a meal (and it's fun to anticipate food you will enjoy), that worked and helped me get out of the habit of eating at other times, which made the desire diminish a lot. When you don't expect to be eating all the time you don't miss it.0 -
These are all great suggestions thank you so much.0
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lemurcat12 wrote: »RebeccaMaunder wrote: »I know for me that I eat when I am bored or sad. I am a total emotional eater.
Me too. That's important to know, because it affects the tools you use to keep from overeating.
I found it helpful to get really conscious of this and when I was doing it (I'd journal), as then when I wanted to eat I could ask myself if I was really hungry or just bored, etc. That helped me resist, and I'd focus on finding other things to do, like walk or listen to music or (this sounds kind of woo and was hard) sit with the feelings or write about them. Or else I'd eat, but only raw veggies.
Another thing that helped was deciding I would only eat at planned meal times. Since I never was so hungry I couldn't make a few hours before a meal (and it's fun to anticipate food you will enjoy), that worked and helped me get out of the habit of eating at other times, which made the desire diminish a lot. When you don't expect to be eating all the time you don't miss it.
You touched on something there when you said "sitting with your feelings". I think it's important for a lot of us who are emotional eaters to learn to be comfortably uncomfortable up close and personal with our emotions.
I used to sit and visualize mine. I'm an artist, so I used to sort of draw mine and give them shape and form in my head.
I used to eat as a way of not facing them. When they had form, I could face them, and I used that opportunity to tell myself that I was strong enough to be able to do that. It was some "fake it 'til you make it' at first, but over time, it started to work. Because I was stronger for setting aside the time to sit, contemplate and think... instead of eat.
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RebeccaMaunder wrote: »I know for me that I eat when I am bored or sad. I am a total emotional eater.
Yoga really helped me with emotional eating:
How Yoga Can Help End Binge Eating
One breath at a time, end the suffering of binge-eating
...According to Juliano, yoga gives people the skills to stay with what they are feeling, rather than turning to food to escape. People who are obese or suffering from eating disorders have a tendency to dissociate from their bodies -- to choose not to feel what they are feeling when they are angry, anxious, or sad. Often, they turn to food to numb themselves. "There's this sense that I have to feel better right now, " Juliano says. "There is a complete intolerance of what is happening right now." This need to escape unpleasant feelings triggers a binge.
When you eat to escape what you are feeling, you lose touch with the experience of eating, as well. This is one reason binges can spiral out of control. "You have no understanding that you are full, way past full, into uncomfortable, because you're so out of it," Juliano explains. "You have no connection to what you're eating. You're eating a pint of ice cream and can't even taste it. Or you go to make yourself some toast and before you know it, half the loaf is gone."
Mindful yoga directly challenges the habit of dissociating from your body and your present-moment experience. "The whole point of yoga is to stay connected to your body. You learn it through practice, through breathing, and through breathing through the sensations."
Read more: https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-science-willpower/201007/how-yoga-can-help-end-binge-eating
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Yikes!0
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ellesMFP93 wrote: »OP what was the idiot dr who told you this? The first and most important treatment steps for PCOS are losing weight, via controlling calories, and getting physically active. PCOS might be to blame for a few extra lbs clinging to your belly area. That's it. The end. The rest of the weight, it is from overeating. So the good news are, you have control over it. Count your calories and start moving, and you will be impressed.
The rest of the weight is not just from overeating. Insulin resistance means that there's a fault in the lock and key mechanism that takes glucose into the cells in the muscles. When it struggles with that it produces more insulin to compensate, converts the glucose to glycogen and stores it as fat. This drops your blood sugar quite quickly and you can get hypoglycaemic symptoms. This obviously makes you crave more sugar or carbs which continues the cycle on again. If it goes undiagnosed for a long time this can cause obesity and diabetes. It's not just 'overeating' like your eyes are bigger than your stomach. Your body is telling you it needs more.
I've found the best way to combat this is making sure to eat fats and proteins at the same time as carbs if I do eat them. This slows down the absorption. Eating low GI carbs obviously helps too.
Hypoglycemic symptoms do make you want to ravenously eat absolutely everything not nailed down. However, you have to mindfully treat it correctly, then it won't lead to unnecessary overeating (over correcting) which will just send you right back into the cycle of high blood glucose, need for more insulin, hypoglycemia.... And essentially wearing out your pancreas even more in the process.
Any doctor will tell you to treat hypoglycemia by checking blood glucose first, if the level is indeed low, then treat with 15g of fast acting carbohydrate, like orange juice, or glucose tablets (my daughter likes gummy bears or other fat free candy) then check blood glucose again in 15 minutes.
You have to check blood glucose and be in control of the feeling of hunger the insulin causes because it's common for someone who averages high blood glucose to feel like they are hypoglycemic when they are actually in normal range. This happens to my type1 daughter all the time when she's been running high consistently. She will tell me she's low, we check her glucose, she might be anywhere from 100-170 even and I practically have to stand guard in the kitchen or she will eat everything and sugar will be crazy high again!
My type2 sister has that problem too and she always wants to eat carbs that also have a moderate fat content. The fat will slow down the carbs from acting, therefore in 15 minutes even after eating 30g of carbs her glucose may still read lower. So she eats more. Then in an hour or two her glucose is through the roof!
You have to choose the right thing to treat with. And realize you are treating a medical condition. Your body isn't saying "I'm starving". It's saying "I need glucose ASAP"! But it only needs so much.0 -
@PeachyCarol ... I admire you.. a lot
Your advice may be difficult for some to take when they are at certain points of their journey .. but if they can absorb the message no matter how unpalatable it is they will start to succeed .. and success breeds success
time to take responsibility for the parts you can take responsibility for .. time to not be a victim or find an excuse. People with IR and PCOS lose weight .. it may be more difficult than without but it's the same rules
Why in the world is this flagged? This is a supportive statement that's basically saying "you can do it! Don't let this disorder make you a victim"!
What's wrong with that?!?!0 -
Sunny_Bunny_ wrote: »@PeachyCarol ... I admire you.. a lot
Your advice may be difficult for some to take when they are at certain points of their journey .. but if they can absorb the message no matter how unpalatable it is they will start to succeed .. and success breeds success
time to take responsibility for the parts you can take responsibility for .. time to not be a victim or find an excuse. People with IR and PCOS lose weight .. it may be more difficult than without but it's the same rules
Why in the world is this flagged? This is a supportive statement that's basically saying "you can do it! Don't let this disorder make you a victim"!
What's wrong with that?!?!
I understand, as a person with multiple medical conditions myself, that there's a phase you go through during things in which you do feel like a victim, and what's been said in this thread by me and others is not what you want to hear. People who don't want to hear things like that probably flagged posts like this.
Grieving for the old you, the you that didn't have problems, or even the idea of you that didn't have problems is a process.
I do understand that. I understand that different people are at different points along the path that grief takes you down. Acceptance is sometimes years coming. I don't think any of us win the battle with weight that's associated with medical conditions until we come to the point of acceptance, though.
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Ug. I've know about my PCOS since 2000. It's never been a problem for me (except infertility), I've never had any weight gain, or anything like that. In 2012, my liver failed (non alcoholic cirrohsis). Come to find out I also have Sjogrens syndrome and Lupus (auto immune disorders). In the last 2 years I've gained over 80+ pounds.
Just got tested for diabetes and saw doc today. I'm now well on my way to diabetes, doc says next 6-8 months. Yay. No one ever mentioned that the PCOS could help bring this on. Ug.
Now I'm banging my head against walls trying to resituate my diet. I went mostly vegetarian (I still eat chicken, seafood and occasionally dairy) in 2012 to accommodate my liver, also low sodium for same reason.
I don't eat white bread, rice and a lot of the other things I'm being told to cut out. Doc wants me on a low carb diet to help out the meds he put me on.
Pretty soon I'll hafta cut out food all together, lol. Thank goodness I have a great sense of humor.
I've been naughty diet wise this last month, my dad is visiting and has done all the cooking. Guess it was kind of a good thing, got one last go around of eating his cooking, won't be able to eat much of it now.
Sorry. Had to get it out. If anyone has any low carb, low sodium, vegetarian recipes they'd like to share I'd appreciate it.
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