How can we give more effective advice on the forums?
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WinoGelato wrote: »The other one thing that I find unhelpful is when someone projects their own individual medical diagnosis on every single OP. Not every woman has PCOS, not every person who is overweight is insulin resistant, and not everyone needs to limit carbs, gluten, etc.
We do see a LOT of that. Also recommendations of yoga as the cure for everything. No, it's not helpful.0 -
In addition to posters practicing some introspection, it would be nice if MFP instituted a posting probationary period for new members. Being forced to lurk for 3 months would solve a lot of these communication issues.0
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tincanonastring wrote: »In addition to posters practicing some introspection, it would be nice if MFP instituted a posting probationary period for new members. Being forced to lurk for 3 months would solve a lot these communication issues.
We need a "like" button for this!!
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The old saying, "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink." seems appropriate.
People won't hear what they are not ready to hear. The problem is not in the delivery or availability of the information. Many people simply are not ready to really face their eating issues head on. Doing so means accepting and acknowledging things that can be painful, embarrassing and very difficult. Until a person is really ready and willing to do those things despite the discomfort, they are not going to "hear" any advice no matter how good or how well written.
You help those who are truly ready to be helped.
Its funny. Last march I was at lunch with a friend trying to decide between two meals. And I said I really love that dish but I know it isn't healthy at all. My friend said to me, "Do you want my advice about how you should eat?" I immediately said no. But I did pick the healthier option. Later I realised that when I answered him was really saying, "I am not ready to face the truth about my food choices just now." It really made me realise how even though I had been complaining about my weight for years, I had been totally unwilling to do what I knew deep down I needed to do to lose weight. No amount of good advice was going to change that. I am fortunate to have friends who recognised that and did not try to force the advice on me anyway I would have just resisted it. At the same time they never encouraged or validated my excuses either. It was only a couple of weeks after that that I made up my mind to get serious.
I had to face and accept that my weight was all my own fault. Not a health problem, not a metabolism problem, not something that needed just the right magic pill, drink or surgery and not genetics. I had to accept responsibility for my own choices and recognise the consequences of making the wrong ones for too many years. That was not easy to do.
MFP is a wonderful tool and resource for those who are ready to use it properly. When they are they will look for the information and find it. They won't even need to post threads asking all of the really common questions because the answers are already there by the hundreds for those who have the mindset to absorb the knowledge.0 -
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This needs a bump.0
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I think there should be some tighter policies on what is appropriate to talk about. It is a bit insane to me that a thread about oreo's is constantly on the front page. I get it, everything in moderation. But, seriously?
Everyone wants to push "their" diet. I have seen people constantly argue back and forth being critical of the other's lifestyle choice. Mods need to step in and say cool it. We can all present our lifestyles in a meaningful way without putting someone else down. My lifestyle choices work for me and I am happy to share why, but that doesn't mean I think everyone should follow it. I see it day in and day out and it really turns me off to reading the main forums. In fact, a lot of low carber's don't want to use the main forums anymore for the sheer attitudes they get. Everyone has to give their 2 cents on why they do or don't like what someone else is following. Sometimes that is totally appropriate, but often times you just see people mouthing off because they can.
Good forums work because there are rules and mods who are involved and care. Stickies are a start. Setting the tone that people need to be respectful is another step. Otherwise people are going to continue to go to private groups and we all miss out on a more active main forum.0 -
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PearBlossom9 wrote: »I think there should be some tighter policies on what is appropriate to talk about. It is a bit insane to me that a thread about oreo's is constantly on the front page. I get it, everything in moderation. But, seriously?
Everyone wants to push "their" diet. I have seen people constantly argue back and forth being critical of the other's lifestyle choice. Mods need to step in and say cool it. We can all present our lifestyles in a meaningful way without putting someone else down. My lifestyle choices work for me and I am happy to share why, but that doesn't mean I think everyone should follow it. I see it day in and day out and it really turns me off to reading the main forums. In fact, a lot of low carber's don't want to use the main forums anymore for the sheer attitudes they get. Everyone has to give their 2 cents on why they do or don't like what someone else is following. Sometimes that is totally appropriate, but often times you just see people mouthing off because they can.
Good forums work because there are rules and mods who are involved and care. Stickies are a start. Setting the tone that people need to be respectful is another step. Otherwise people are going to continue to go to private groups and we all miss out on a more active main forum.
What If I don't like to see all the keto or low carb threads on the front page ? Should the mods remove them or police them because I don't like them ?
What could the mods do to really stop people from talking about Oreo cookies ? How would that be a violation of the guidelines by discussing Oreo cookies or keto or low carb ? Do you see my point here ?
Just because you don't want to see it doesn't mean that others feel the same way . if someone doesn't like a thread, they do not have to participate in it . its as simple as that.
On any calorie counting or diet forum, you will often see people talking about food. That includes cookies. If that's really such a problem then the internet might not be the right place for those people. Go onto bodybuilding. Com or spark people and you will also see people discussing food items, again that includes cookies. If someone doesn't want to talk about the food items , they can easily not partake in the conversation. Its really that simple.0 -
PearBlossom9 wrote: »I think there should be some tighter policies on what is appropriate to talk about. It is a bit insane to me that a thread about oreo's is constantly on the front page. I get it, everything in moderation. But, seriously?
Everyone wants to push "their" diet. I have seen people constantly argue back and forth being critical of the other's lifestyle choice. Mods need to step in and say cool it. We can all present our lifestyles in a meaningful way without putting someone else down. My lifestyle choices work for me and I am happy to share why, but that doesn't mean I think everyone should follow it. I see it day in and day out and it really turns me off to reading the main forums. In fact, a lot of low carber's don't want to use the main forums anymore for the sheer attitudes they get. Everyone has to give their 2 cents on why they do or don't like what someone else is following. Sometimes that is totally appropriate, but often times you just see people mouthing off because they can.
Good forums work because there are rules and mods who are involved and care. Stickies are a start. Setting the tone that people need to be respectful is another step. Otherwise people are going to continue to go to private groups and we all miss out on a more active main forum.
It would be great if we could keep the focus on what we regular users can do, since commenting on mod policy is a sure way to see a thread shut down.
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diannethegeek wrote: »I'd like to see if we can brainstorm some ways to get advice across more effectively.
I think this is a great thread and really commendable and I really hope it'll result in some great ideas.
I don't mean to come across as negative when I say this but I think for some people through, even the most accurate, most effective and most kindly delivered advice will fall onto deaf ears because it simply isn't what they wanted to hear. I truly believe that many OPs don't return to their own threads because whatever quick fix they were looking for was not condoned, or they did not get reassured that they are the special snowflake they thought they were.
But in that case hopefully some lurkers can still benefit from the effective advice given.
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WinoGelato wrote: »The other one thing that I find unhelpful is when someone projects their own individual medical diagnosis on every single OP. Not every woman has PCOS, not every person who is overweight is insulin resistant, and not everyone needs to limit carbs, gluten, etc.
I wholeheartedly agree with that.
All too often someone posts that they have not lost an expected amount of weight within a given time frame, and someone pops up and tells them that they probably have some major thyroid dysfunction.
That opens up another can of worms; how to challenge those who give rubbish advice.
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diannethegeek wrote: »I'd like to see if we can brainstorm some ways to get advice across more effectively.
I think this is a great thread and really commendable and I really hope it'll result in some great ideas.
I don't mean to come across as negative when I say this but I think for some people through, even the most accurate, most effective and most kindly delivered advice will fall onto deaf ears because it simply isn't what they wanted to hear. I truly believe that many OPs don't return to their own threads because whatever quick fix they were looking for was not condoned, or they did not get reassured that they are the special snowflake they thought they were.
But in that case hopefully some lurkers can still benefit from the effective advice given.
There is a lot of truth in this. There is so much misinformation out there, that I can certainly understand why people come here confused. Add onto that the fact that so many people tie their self-esteem and self-worth in with their weight, that is becomes a hotbed of people looking for a quick fix. The sad part is that, for me, until I started dealing with the underlying issues, the weight wasn't budging, and when it did, I still didn't feel better about who I am. I think that each person coming here may have their own vulnerabilities and several are hyperreactive because of this. I try (although not always successfully) to remind myself of how overwhelmed I felt when I first started.
I did lurk here a lot when I first started. I learned a lot through people who continued to post and support those who were struggling. To be honest, I have often wondered why they continue to post, when so many people slam them for being unsupportive when they are proposing unhealthy and sometimes harmful methods. To be honest, the blunt posters probably were more helpful for me, in that I personally react better to a direct approach. It's easier, for me, to understand the directness from people who don't mince words.
In reviewing these it may seems that I'm speaking two different sides. I guess what I'm saying is that blunt works for me, but I can understand how it wouldn't work for others. I'm not saying I'm less vulnerable to it, but I personally take on direct honesty easier than someone handling me with kitten gloves. To me, the kitten gloves seem condescending. Additionally, I have always made it a policy to not ask questions I wasn't sure I wanted the answer to. So before posing a question, I ponder the potential answers and ask myself if I am ready to accept whatever answer I receive. This applies more to real life than on line though.0 -
For noobs starting threads, it would be helpful if they got a popup asking if they had tried using the Search feature first.
I can dream, can't I?
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snickerscharlie wrote: »For noobs starting threads, it would be helpful if they got a popup asking if they had tried using the Search feature first.
I can dream, can't I?
Or the least a check list0 -
In the past month there have been 5 or 6 posters that said they came to MFP specifically, because woo was shot down and people were not allowed to go on about the latest fad diet without a challenge--and science. I am very heartened by this. I would suggest to go on doing what we're doing. The sensitive folks, who are wrong, have to be told. Perhaps in a different way, but told, just the same. I usually tell them, when they get upset to hear that their lastest fad diet is crap, that no one wants them to fail. I really believe that. Even the snarkiest poster wants the OP to turn around and see the light. As for the nitpicking between members, that's just human. If it bothered me, I'd get off the boards. The regulars know each other and their positions and sometimes act like married couples bickering for fun. We know why they do it, and the newbees will learn. Actually, quite a bit of good information comes out.0
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I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.0 -
ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
See, I find this very interesting. Because I copy and paste my "pat answers" in order to be kind. It keeps my frustration from leaking through after 5-10 plateau threads a day while still imparting good information. I can flat out tell you that by the end of the day I do not have the energy to engage with the poster more personally. And in my experience, many threads get ignored or passed by, so I would rather give them a "pat answer" than see them get nothing.
It drives me nuts to be told that's not kind. Like, you should see my face right now. It makes me want to throw up my hands and give up here. If the energy that I do give isn't enough, I cannot do more.0 -
ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
Yep. While everyone is at a different place on their journey, with different knowledge, beliefs, mindset, everyone is looking for guidance and support. Kindness goes a long way when trying to take in new information.0 -
i think people need to be discouraged from answering in such a way that is snarky, belittling, or insulting to the person who asked the question (even if it seems like a dumb question).
i find the biggest problems come from people responding to questions of "i'm doing everything i should according to the trackers - what's going wrong?" and people more or less tell the person they're outright lying, or in denial, or measuring incorrectly, or otherwise being an idiot. those people are, unfortunately, louder and seem more numerous than the people who genuinely want to have a look at what's going on.
who wants to come in here if that's people's responses? everyone is different, so sometimes i like to cast a wide net and get a variety of responses. having a bunch of jerks come in and tell me i'm lying, or can't measure something, or am claiming to deny the laws of physics, or suggesting i'm so special the government would want to study me.. well that's just not ok.
and yeah, that last part literally did happen today. the message may or may not be great, but delivery is everything. uncomplicated, straightforward answers with no snark is usually the way to go at first.. then if we go into it more in depth we can toss in all the science we can at it, but ALWAYS should be done with a genuine desire to help the person not hurt them. you're bang on with your kindness comments!0 -
diannethegeek wrote: »ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
See, I find this very interesting. Because I copy and paste my "pat answers" in order to be kind. It keeps my frustration from leaking through after 5-10 plateau threads a day while still imparting good information. I can flat out tell you that by the end of the day I do not have the energy to engage with the poster more personally. And in my experience, many threads get ignored or passed by, so I would rather give them a "pat answer" than see them get nothing.
It drives me nuts to be told that's not kind. Like, you should see my face right now. It makes me want to throw up my hands and give up here. If the energy that I do give isn't enough, I cannot do more.
I think links are great- why knock yourself out offering the same answer to 10 different threads if someone else has covered it thoroughly, and possibly better? Are people discouraged by links? Does it make them feel like their question is being brushed off?0 -
ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
I agree with your thoughts about kindness. Advice is often received better when it comes with commendation. But I'm guessing many people would say they don't have the time for that (of course, they are on the forums....), or maybe don't care because it's *just* strangers on the internet. I just don't reply to more people than I have time to be polite to 0 -
Diane The Geek - I have never read a post from you that is demeaning to the OP, and that is also true for many of the posters here that I recognize from other threads. You guys give good and thoughtful information and maybe you have some badly bitten tongues out there as a side effect.
But many responses on threads are belittling and it sometimes seems as if it's done on purpose, for the entertainment of the taunter and his/her audience. Then the posters banter back and forth with insults and jokes about the OP. And it can look and feel a lot like bullying, which is not okay no matter how wrong the OP may be in their approach to weight loss. Maybe it's my Canadian showing through, but manners matter to me.
And I wish we had an "agree/disagree button" so piling on is reduced.0 -
ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
Lovely post Elizabeth.
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diannethegeek wrote: »ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
See, I find this very interesting. Because I copy and paste my "pat answers" in order to be kind. It keeps my frustration from leaking through after 5-10 plateau threads a day while still imparting good information. I can flat out tell you that by the end of the day I do not have the energy to engage with the poster more personally. And in my experience, many threads get ignored or passed by, so I would rather give them a "pat answer" than see them get nothing.
It drives me nuts to be told that's not kind. Like, you should see my face right now. It makes me want to throw up my hands and give up here. If the energy that I do give isn't enough, I cannot do more.
No one can ever say you don't do enough Diane--don't let a stray comment put you off. I remember when I first started the "beginners" threads (the so called stickies) were always posted, one at a time at the top of the column. "Sexy Pants" to name a favorite. As things stand now the newbs have to do a search and they don't know, or won't, so they just ask--frequently one after another. This gets tiring to answer everyone, and repeat, and repeat,...... You are very kind to bring those important threads up. You are just doing what used to be done. Anyone who wants to can give a personal answer, but with all the new people signing up, and the pool of veterans shrinking, and not posting for reasons we all know---well, it's like trying to hold back a tidal wave--alone.0 -
Bumping0
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snowflake954 wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »ElizabethOakes2 wrote: »I've run a number of writing workshops online- Here's my thought.
Weight loss, like creativity and art, is something highly personal. People are sensitive, afraid, even terrified, of asking questions and putting themselves out there. I think the number one answer to getting people to return to threads and participate in their discussion is very simple; it's a little tiny something called 'kindness'. Kindness goes a very long way towards building goodwill and keeping people participating.
I know it's easy to get sick of the same questions over and over again (In fact, just yesterday I posted a thread that about ten minutes later someone else posted the exact same question, with an identical header! I tried to participate fully in the new thread as well, and let that poster know they weren't alone, and I am very grateful for the people who responded in my thread.) and sometimes it's easy to forget that once upon a time, we asked the same kinds of questions. Instead of pat answers and a bunch of links, and the same infograph twenty times in the same thread, maybe we should try the same techniques I use in my writing groups?
Say something positive BEFORE saying something negative. If someone comes to my group with a piece of writing that has something severely wrong with it, before addressing it, I try to point out what they've done really well (even if it's a struggle from time to time). If someone asks if it's okay to eat under 1200 calories, maybe we could try saying "Hey! Great to see you here! It sounds like you really want to make changes! But even if you're really eager to lose weight, going under 1200 could cause some serious problems with malnutrition"... etc. Look for the positive thing to say, the supportive thing to say, and then suggest that a 'cleanse diet' is a pretty bad idea, or that weighing and measuring your food properly is the only way to make sure of the calories you're eating, etc, but look for the kindness first. Instead of leaping in and telling them every detail of everything they do wrong, tell them what you see that they do right, even if it's just coming here and trying to learn.
Kindness isn't hard, but it's in very short supply.
See, I find this very interesting. Because I copy and paste my "pat answers" in order to be kind. It keeps my frustration from leaking through after 5-10 plateau threads a day while still imparting good information. I can flat out tell you that by the end of the day I do not have the energy to engage with the poster more personally. And in my experience, many threads get ignored or passed by, so I would rather give them a "pat answer" than see them get nothing.
It drives me nuts to be told that's not kind. Like, you should see my face right now. It makes me want to throw up my hands and give up here. If the energy that I do give isn't enough, I cannot do more.
No one can ever say you don't do enough Diane--don't let a stray comment put you off. I remember when I first started the "beginners" threads (the so called stickies) were always posted, one at a time at the top of the column. "Sexy Pants" to name a favorite. As things stand now the newbs have to do a search and they don't know, or won't, so they just ask--frequently one after another. This gets tiring to answer everyone, and repeat, and repeat,...... You are very kind to bring those important threads up. You are just doing what used to be done. Anyone who wants to can give a personal answer, but with all the new people signing up, and the pool of veterans shrinking, and not posting for reasons we all know---well, it's like trying to hold back a tidal wave--alone.
ITA! It's all well and good to say "pat answers" aren't the best approach, but everyone here is volunteering their time and this information. Better to have someone politely posting "pat answers" that are CORRECT, than having a newbie post a question and get 5 answers of magic and woo, and no one to correct them because the veterans are tired of typing the same thing with personalized flourishes over and over and over again.
Maybe it's a personality thing, but no matter how nervous, I can't understand a grown adult needing a stranger on the internet to say: Hello lovely newbie, it's so wonderful that you are here and trying, before explaining that what they are doing might not be right. If it was me, I would see that as patronizing and insulting, not "kind". So different strokes, I guess.
Having said that, there is a difference between copy & pasted answers, and the ones that go - Detoxes are stupid, try using the search function - which I agree are counterproductive. It just makes the OP defensive and usually accelerates to a closed thread.
Once upon a time, I was a clueless newbie, and those pat answers (including Dianne's) are the reason I used MFP correctly, lost the weight, and am keeping it off.0
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