Can you be fat and in starvation mode?

JavaJael

At some point - shouldn't your body start using fat to feed itself? And I know - I should be eating more, food is fuel. I've lost weight before (using a program called Body-For-Life). It's EXTREMELY scary to me to think of eating MORE calories. Iv'e managed to lose 10 lbs from my all time highest weight. I want to lose, not go back. When I eat more - I do gain more. Yet when I eat less, I don't seem to lose too much less. I get stuck at this point 260-262 lbs. I suspect it's a new "set point".


I've got other health issues going on.
PCOS & extreme insulin resistance
Wheat sensitivity (yes I've actually been tested - not just hopping on the gluten free band wagon)
What food I do eat - tends to go through my stomach too fast, and then my small intestine too fast - so there is concern that what food I am eating I'm not getting the full nutrients from.
I have Sjogrens Syndrome (an autoimmune issue)
and for whatever reason I seem to be tearing tendons really easily.
Fibromyalgia was also added my list of labels too

There's some other stuff going on, not sure it's relevant, but really - I want to be healthy. I know part of being healthy means being more fit and a lower weight. I am most definitely obese. Gaining even more weight is scary for me, from a health standpoint I don't want to get any bigger. I've already accepted that my body will never fit the standard level of "beauty" Right now I"d be happy with being able to run a 5K again, a 12 minute mile (though hey faster would be nicer too), I miss being strong. I miss lifting more weight then some of the men in the gym. I'm SERIOUSLY struggling with eating MORE though.

I have appointments set up with a counselor to talk to them about this.

The long and the short of it is.. I want to be healthy, how can I eat so little and NOT lose weight? Obviously eating so little is not the most healthy of plans either, but I was hoping to at least get back to 230-240 a more comfortable weight where I could up my exercise intensity and thus minimize the weight gain from eating more. Of course recently my doctors (more than one of them) has suggested I might want to look into weightloss. I'm desperate enough to think about doing it, but my biggest question is - how will it work for me if I'm already eating at a huge (supposed) deficit? What if I go through with the drastic surgery and still don't lose weight? When I bring this up - it sure seems like they insinuate that I can't possibly eat that little and be as big as I am. I MUST be eating more than I think I am.

So - what are your opinions? Is it possible to be fat, not eat enough, and still not lose weight? Is there anyone here that has actually busted out of starvation mode? Was it really only a few weeks and you repaired your metabolism? How much did you gain before you started to lose again?

rolemodel69

If you don't eat enough you will always ends up into starvation mode even if you are fat. You need to feed your body with enough food so that it can't use it for primay functions and start burning fat.

The other problem with no eating enough is that you slow down your metabolism and it is a lot harder to burn fat with a slow metabolism.

You are not eating more, you are eating enough for your body to function properly.

Timshel_

Is it possible to be fat, not eat enough, and still not lose weight? Is there anyone here that has actually busted out of starvation mode? Was it really only a few weeks and you repaired your metabolism? How much did you gain before you started to lose again?

Not too sure about the whole starvation mode becuase research shows that really only happens in longer term, more extreme instances. So reducing calories to lo a pound or two per week wouldn't really do it. The issue is usually too stagnant a lifestyle has lead to a sedentary metabolism rate. The reading of research I have done seems to always point more towards activating your metabolism as the key to optimizing weight loss. More so with your health issue.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/19/health/nutrition/19best.html?_r=1&

Your medical issue will compound the challenge of weight loss, but it isn't unsurmountable. It might be good to find a nutritionist or health counselor that can help you eat right and incorporate approriate levels of exercise.

I would be curious to see what others have found though.

JavaJael

You are not eating more, you are eating enough for your body to function properly.

This ^^ is a very good way to look at it, something I need to keep reminding myself. Thx for the reply!

deksgrl

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/3047-700-calories-a-day-and-not-losing

ElizaJay143

My first question is this: Have you seen a SPECIALIST about your desire to lose weight and the possibility of weight loss surgery? If not, then what your doctors think about the topic is only marginally more informative than the information you can obtain from the web yourself. A common misconception is that doctors are all knowing about anything related to medicine. Often times, while doctors do know a great many things about the human body, they don't necessarily have any more information about diet & nutrition as anyone else... UNLESS that's their field of study, hence why seeing a SPECIALIST is so important.

On the starvation mode thing, starvation mode doesn't happen in a few days or even weeks. Starvation mode is the long term effects of dramatic calorie deficits on the body. In the first week week/months the body will essentially re-engineer itself, it slows down the metabolism and works to conserve energy (to get you through the "long winter" it evolutionarly thinks is happening). IF you continue to eat at such a low deficit, it will continue to be more drastic in the process, meaning that it will store more nutrients as fat (think of this as the body's way of making homemade preservatives to last) and it will start to dissolve muscle tissue to consume as needed energy. EVENTUALLY, when you've run out of muscle, the body will start to eat away at those fat stores if it still doesn't get enough energy. But, by that point, you'll be weak and sick, and if you continue to not eat, eventually you'll die. Hence Starvation Mode.

But in the early stages, when the body is slowing down it's processes and starting to preserve fat, you wont see much more than the normal fluctuation on the scale. It can take months and months before the body halts it's efforts to store additional energy and begins to simply consume itself, this is completely against our nature, so naturally, it's the body's LAST resort to keep you alive when it thinks you're dieing.

So this simple answer is: YES. You can be overweight, in starvation mode, and NOT be losing noticeable weight. But you WONT be healthy.


If your goal is to get healthy, I recommend starting with an appointment with a specialist, and getting a plan going with your doctors that factor in your medical conditions. If you have the resources, I highly recommend a product such as the Body Media Link/Advantage/Core etc. (similar to the BodyBugg worn on the Biggest Loser). They run about $100 and will help you get an accurate assessment of what YOUR body does, instead of just general estimates from online sources.

If "healthy" is your goal, then start with a nutritious diet, then work on a more active lifestyle, focus on managing your medical issues and getting prescriptions organized and finding effective treatments. Weight loss will follow. Starting with weight loss, as you have now, will lead to unhealthy habits (like not eating enough), frustration, and likely little in the way of results because you're trying to achieve a goal "in spite of" your medical history and current physical condition. Instead, get yourself to a point where you're managing everything else, and then you'll have a much easier time doing the things that are required to reach your goals.

HIITMe

If you don't eat enough you will always ends up into starvation mode even if you are fat.

UNTRUE

JavaJael

Not too sure about the whole starvation mode becuase research shows that really only happens in longer term, more extreme instances. So reducing calories to lo a pound or two per week wouldn't really do it. The issue is usually too stagnant a lifestyle has lead to a sedentary metabolism rate. The reading of research I have done seems to always point more towards activating your metabolism as the key to optimizing weight loss. More so with your health issue.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/19/health/nutrition/19best.html?_r=1&

Your medical issue will compound the challenge of weight loss, but it isn't unsurmountable. It might be good to find a nutritionist or health counselor that can help you eat right and incorporate approriate levels of exercise.

I would be curious to see what others have found though.

I was eating 1200-1800 cals at 250 lbs. When I started ripping tendons with normal every day activity... my activity levels dropped a LOT. I wasn't as hungry - I naturally ate less. It wasn't (at the time) a conscious decision. Docs added in cymbalta to try to help with the fatigue, muscle & joint pain (and I think they suspected I was depressed) My weight started creeping up at that point. Either because of the medication, or possible also because at 1200-1800 cals I was still below maintenance calorie levels for that weight. Or maybe it was both (so hard to know). Or maybe it was just the lowered activity levels? Prior to ripping the one achilles tendon I was walking with my kids to school, then going to the gym for another workout - either cardio on the track, treadmill, or light weights, the occasional cardio class and sometimes a yoga or pilates class - I mixed it up to stay interested). Then I'd come home do the usual household chores (vaccumning, laundry up and down the stairs, playing with my then 2 year old, playing outside, more walks, soccer at the park, or bike rides). After the tear - I was down to almost no activity and in a walking boot for weeks. After I healed up to be able to walk without pain I added back in some gentle walks, and belly dancing classes, the occasional bike ride. But not nearly as active as I was before. I kept re-injuring the heel, went through physio when the boot didn't "fix" it. Near the end of the physio for the one heel - I injured the OTHER heel... trying to dig a hole in the garden to lay edging bricks. So I've gone through another round of trying to heal that one too... re-injuring both with just every day activities (like walking up and down the stairs).

Then I started having vertigo issues which compounded the difficulty in getting in exercise. At this point my weight was slowly edging up and I think I consciously started eating less. Scared because I felt I could no longer exercise like before (and didn't know when I would be able to again). Reducing to 800-1000 cals a day stemmed some of the weight gain. somewhere along the way I started logging my food again (again because of questions from the doctors about what I was eating). And realized there were days that I wasn't even eating 800 calories. Because I'd become so sedentary though I didn't change it... worried about what damage it might do, but didn't change it. I mean when your'e as fat as I am right now.... no one is exactly telling you should eat MORE. I've gotten continual pressure from the doctors to try to lose weight, lose weight and everything might get better.

I've seen many nutritionists throughout the years, and the recommendations change slightly depending on what the current government standard is. So far the recommendations from any of them have not helped me. The only time I ever lost weight continually was with the Body for Life program. 6 small meals, ratio of 40% protein, 40% carbs, 20% fat (healthy fats). I can do the cardio workouts on an elliptical, but the weight training is still an issue with my tendons being so friable. I've just been doing weight bearing exercise.


bahhh I just need to stop whining and do it right? Eat more lean protein, veggies, limited non wheat whole grains - and exercise more. Right? Gawd I even got sick of my whining just typing it out myself :P

JUST DO IT.

djshari

are you taking metformin for your pcos? that may be an option if you are not doing so. is there anywhere you can swim? that is my favorite summer activity and has the least impact on joints etc.

Timshel_

bahhh I just need to stop whining and do it right? Eat more lean protein, veggies, limited non wheat whole grains - and exercise more. Right? Gawd I even got sick of my whining just typing it out myself :P

JUST DO IT.

Not at all.

You have some challenges and they can most certainly wreak havoc on motivation and will power.

But then again, yes. You know you need to do something and unfortuately you do need o start now and continue consistently. Deit as needed and start adding in what exercise you can, then build on that. With your challenges, your success will most likely be slower, which again might make you feel like you are not progressing, but eating healthier and working out when you can will only serve to help your overall health. It just takes time and continued effort.

But you are here and asking the important questions, which means you WANT to do better. That is awesome.

Just build on that!

JavaJael

If you don't eat enough you will always ends up into starvation mode even if you are fat.

UNTRUE

Explain your thinking? Position? I'm interested in your thoughts, but you haven't given much of a supporting argument to your opinion.

JavaJael

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/3047-700-calories-a-day-and-not-losing

very helpful - thank you!

I feel compelled to note that what I am eating is mostly whole foods, lean meat. Unadulterated fruits and veggies. That kind of thing. I have been using some convenience items like the gluten free bread and wraps. I do eat dairy (including the occasional full fat cheese). I'm at home with my kids, so I have (theoretically) time to prepare meals. That said - we do eat out from time to time on the weekend. THOSE meals definitely aren't healthy. Typically it's a burger & fries from Culvers (local fast food chain). That one meal alone can be more cals than I eat in two days. So the theory postulated in the article hit home - even though I'm not over total calories for the week, that one meal can be construed as a binge by my body, and it might be shoving all of those calories, especially since they're not the healthiest, into fat cells. So that's something to think about for sure.

verjavec

I weighed 180# and only ate about 1000 calories per week. And I was gaining weight. I've since learned a lot more about how my body works. For me, it is not as simple as burning more calories than I eat. For me, it is all about what types of food I eat. I have to eat gluten free. I have to eat sugar free. Those two are crucial. And by sugar free... I mean all types of sugar - no splenda, no nutrasweet, no brown sugar, white sugar, organic sugar, honey, agave, glucose, corn syrup, HFCS, fructose, etc. Sometimes I can use stevia. This pretty much means I can't have anything from a box or a can because almost all of it adds some form of sweetener. Dairy and nightshades I need to avoid in order to not have bloating or joint pain. Avoiding those will speed my weight loss, but eating them doesn't stall my weight loss or make me gain like eating gluten and sugar does. For me, it is all about what foods I eat, and has nothing to do with the number of calories I take in, or the number of calories I burn.

My difficulty is maintaining what I know I need to do because I despise cooking. I'm currently looking for a cooking class to take because I think if I learn to do it right, and get better at it, I won't hate it so much. I'm working with a naturopath now that understands me better than any other naturopath I've seen. Now... it's only been a few visits so I don't know if it will continue... but she has me doing baby steps to stop. My ultimate goal will be to eat gluten, dairy, nightshade and sugar free. Consuming proteins, fruits, lots of veggies and nuts only. I would like to be full paleo because I feel the best when I eat that way. Maybe brown rice sometimes - we'll see how it makes me feel once I get the stuff out of me that I know makes me feel like crap. It's all about experiementing and seeing what works and what doesn't. But yes... you don't eat enough... you will gain if it is isn't all 100% healthy foods. Insulin messes with everything and any food that has sugar in it will get that insulin going. When you have a lot of insulin coursing through you, then your body is being told to store everything it can as fat.

ndj1979

you have to eat nothing for 72 hours to be in "starvation mode"

How many calories a day do you eat? If it is over zero then you are not in starvation mode...

Oh and in...for the oncoming eat more to lose more, TDEE, MFP eat back your exercise calories, and general storm that this thread will generate...

JavaJael

are you taking metformin for your pcos? that may be an option if you are not doing so. is there anywhere you can swim? that is my favorite summer activity and has the least impact on joints etc.

yup
2000 mg a day. Swimming will be an option when my current gym membership runs out in August, then I can pay for a new membership at the YMCA which has a pool. That's already my plan. Until then pool access is a bit limited. (unfortunately ). They do have water exercise classes too, so I'll be swallowing my pride and go swimming with the grannies

JavaJael

you have to eat nothing for 72 hours to be in "starvation mode"

How many calories a day do you eat? If it is over zero then you are not in starvation mode...

Oh and in...for the oncoming eat more to lose more, TDEE, MFP eat back your exercise calories, and general storm that this thread will generate...

right now averaging 800-1000 a day (so obviously more than 0). I've been at this level for about 4 months now. Prior to that it was even less (but with less exercise too). Exercise/activity right now is still pretty lame - just squats and lunges at home, arm lifts with the kiddos on "off days", walking about 2-3 miles at the gym either on the track, or elliptical - that's been about 3 times a week. Gardening now that summer is here. Daily attempts at stretching at home.

JavaJael

addendum: I've been eating sub maintenance levels for a long time (read years).

I do still have some processed stuff (like gluten free nut thins, wraps, and chobani yogurt, the occasional cup of icecream). I have dairy daily (2 tblsps of coffee cream in my coffee). Ketchup occasionally, and sugar that's in salad dressing, mayo etc. Rice wine vinegar when I make a cuc salad. Small amounts of brown sugar when I make a homemade sauce. So I'm not sugar free by any means.

JavaJael

bahhh I just need to stop whining and do it right? Eat more lean protein, veggies, limited non wheat whole grains - and exercise more. Right? Gawd I even got sick of my whining just typing it out myself :P

JUST DO IT.

Not at all.

You have some challenges and they can most certainly wreak havoc on motivation and will power.

But then again, yes. You know you need to do something and unfortuately you do need o start now and continue consistently. Deit as needed and start adding in what exercise you can, then build on that. With your challenges, your success will most likely be slower, which again might make you feel like you are not progressing, but eating healthier and working out when you can will only serve to help your overall health. It just takes time and continued effort.

But you are here and asking the important questions, which means you WANT to do better. That is awesome.

Just build on that!

Thank you for the encouragement - I appreciate it!

ndj1979

addendum: I've been eating sub maintenance levels for a long time (read years).

I do still have some processed stuff (like gluten free nut thins, wraps, and chobani yogurt, the occasional cup of icecream). I have dairy daily (2 tblsps of coffee cream in my coffee). Ketchup occasionally, and sugar that's in salad dressing, mayo etc. Rice wine vinegar when I make a cuc salad. Small amounts of brown sugar when I make a homemade sauce. So I'm not sugar free by any means.

you should probably make sure that you are at least netting 1200 calories a day ..

Are you doing TDEE method or MFP method?

momof8munchkins

I've not read all of the comments. But I really urge you to get off wheat and gluten- it is likely causing many of your problems- food going through you aka the runs, unexplained weight gain, inability to lose weight, loss of appetite, , vertigo, Fibromyalgia, depression, pain in your joints and muscles- that was me in a nut shell and a lot more before I went gluten free - except for the Fibromyalgia... I have Celiac Disease and a lot of what you talk about are symptoms of this disease- it affects the entire body.. Many people don't realize gluten intolerance /sensitivity to wheat cause more than just tummy issues.All caused by the body's inability to process the proteins in wheat, barley rye and oats.. At the very least go gluten free for a month just to test it and see if you feel better, if you begin to lose weight . I am two years post being gluten free and nearlly all of my symptoms have disappeared.. I have dropped weight .not as fast as I would like but it's coming along.. The main thing is my body is healing and I feel 100% better. Good luck hun. If you want more info on gluten free /celiac disease feel free to message me.

mommia0910

i started by just walking with my kids each and every night. we do dinner, bath time, evening walk to relax (about 30 minutes), then bed time.
Walking is easy on your body, but an activity that can be very effective. i have lost 9 lbs in 4 weeks.
good luck to you.