Sugars/Intolerance? Help me Understand.
arditarose
Posts: 15,573 Member
I'm a little embarrassed to post how little I understand about carbs/sugars and even though I am googling, I'd like a little input especially on an issue I'm having.
So, when I over eat-or just eat a large meal even though I've stayed in my calorie goal, the meal will usual be more carb heavy than I eat on a day to day basis.
The result can be extreme pain all over my body. I feel bruised. It hurts to touch along my flanks, chest, glands around my neck, even my face and thighs can hurt. I used to notice it when I was fat, but I didn't think much of it because it usually came after a night of drinking, which was also coupled with eating...and I just thought it was a hangover of some sort.
So after tracking when this happens, it seems like carbs are the culprit. It can happen with a lot of sweets, but last weekend I ate a burger and fries and noticed it a LITTLE the next day.
Recently I went apple picking and I seriously ate about 6 apples in the orchard (I never eat apples but they were so good right off the tree). Next day...extreme pain.
First, does anyone else experience this? Second, what is going on in my body? What is the difference between sugars from an apple or added sugar in cakes or sugar in bread?
So, when I over eat-or just eat a large meal even though I've stayed in my calorie goal, the meal will usual be more carb heavy than I eat on a day to day basis.
The result can be extreme pain all over my body. I feel bruised. It hurts to touch along my flanks, chest, glands around my neck, even my face and thighs can hurt. I used to notice it when I was fat, but I didn't think much of it because it usually came after a night of drinking, which was also coupled with eating...and I just thought it was a hangover of some sort.
So after tracking when this happens, it seems like carbs are the culprit. It can happen with a lot of sweets, but last weekend I ate a burger and fries and noticed it a LITTLE the next day.
Recently I went apple picking and I seriously ate about 6 apples in the orchard (I never eat apples but they were so good right off the tree). Next day...extreme pain.
First, does anyone else experience this? Second, what is going on in my body? What is the difference between sugars from an apple or added sugar in cakes or sugar in bread?
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Replies
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This is probably something you should talk to a doctor about - I've definitely never experienced anything comparable. It's possible it's some form of allergic reaction, although it wouldn't be possible to be allergic to sugar itself you could have an allergy to some other common food product.0
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rankinsect wrote: »This is probably something you should talk to a doctor about - I've definitely never experienced anything comparable. It's possible it's some form of allergic reaction, although it wouldn't be possible to be allergic to sugar itself you could have an allergy to some other common food product.
I don't have health insurance so that's not happening. When I google the issue it is very rare and the people who have talked to their doctors about it have gotten no help. I'm generally fine but it's annoying that sometimes it will happen when I'm not really over indulging, but staying within my goals and trying to enjoy something yummy.0 -
Have you ever considered food allergy testing? Maybe in the future when you have insurance?0
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I think there is something going on though. When I was fat, I would often eat and feel sick afterward. To the point where I would get really quiet after a meal because I was afraid I was complaining about it to my friends too often. Obviously when I overeat SOMETHING my body says no bueno.0
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You might benefit from measuring your fasting blood sugar and then 2 hours after a meal. Many pharmacies do these tests free or cheap, or for about $20 you can get a meter with 10 test strips. This should reveal any diabetic tendencies.
High levels of blood glucose / insulin are associated with inflammation and other issues, so I would start with blood glucose in the absence of insurance.0 -
That is quite a story!0
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You might benefit from measuring your fasting blood sugar and then 2 hours after a meal. Many pharmacies do these tests free or cheap, or for about $20 you can get a meter with 10 test strips. This should reveal any diabetic tendencies.
High levels of blood glucose / insulin are associated with inflammation and other issues, so I would start with blood glucose in the absence of insurance.
Oh snap...now we're talking diabetes here?
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arditarose wrote: »You might benefit from measuring your fasting blood sugar and then 2 hours after a meal. Many pharmacies do these tests free or cheap, or for about $20 you can get a meter with 10 test strips. This should reveal any diabetic tendencies.
High levels of blood glucose / insulin are associated with inflammation and other issues, so I would start with blood glucose in the absence of insurance.
Oh snap...now we're talking diabetes here?
It isn't uncommon and if nothing else good to rule it out. Diabetes Type 2 is the end product of insulin resistance and impaired glucose tolerance so checking now gives you a heads up. I can't think of any other common factor with apples and carby meals0 -
arditarose wrote: »You might benefit from measuring your fasting blood sugar and then 2 hours after a meal. Many pharmacies do these tests free or cheap, or for about $20 you can get a meter with 10 test strips. This should reveal any diabetic tendencies.
High levels of blood glucose / insulin are associated with inflammation and other issues, so I would start with blood glucose in the absence of insurance.
Oh snap...now we're talking diabetes here?
Diabetes is usually silent until late stages, and I'm not familiar with transient pain being a component of diabetes. (Common symptoms of later stage T2 diabetes include: Neuropathy (extremities (usually) pain , but not pain that comes and goes in response to eating carbs), vision issue, slow to heal wounds, frequent urination (earlier), dry mouth (earlier)).
That said, it doesn't hurt to test blood glucose. You can actually buy a starter TrueResults kit online for under $6.
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Apple season is over. Maybe they were rotten apples, and it was the alcohol content that sent your blood sugar into a spike?0
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Lovee_Dove7 wrote: »Apple season is over. Maybe they were rotten apples, and it was the alcohol content that sent your blood sugar into a spike?
I went apple picking during apple season, a couple months ago.0 -
Sigh0
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Could it be an allergy to gluten?0
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Well, if you go to the doctor even without insurance, a typical office visit is only about $70 on average; you can ask their self-pay rates. You'll probably be getting labs, too, which will be more.
There is one risk, though - if you're diagnosed with something, and you want to purchase insurance to cover the treatment, then this becomes a pre-existing condition and insurance isn't required to cover it for the first year of your new policy, after which they have to cover it fully. If you get the insurance first (even if the condition started previously but you sought no medical advice) they will be paying from day 1.
You should look into whether your income qualifies you for Medicaid or for Affordable Care Act subsidies - at the low end of the income scale those subsidies can pay for almost all of the cost of a policy.0 -
JanetYellen wrote: »Could it be an allergy to gluten?
I don't think so0 -
If you don't have health insurance, here's what I'd do in your shoes (I was having bizarre symptoms myself for a long time, to food, and this is what I ended up doing until I could get diagnosed).
1. If you are a healthy weight, and getting enough nutrients, I'd consider dropping the 8 major allergens (wheat (gluten is easier to do, honestly), eggs, dairy, soy, peanuts, tree nuts, shellfish, and fish...plus sesame and sulfites, is usually good). I would ditch these ingredients as though you are allergic, so no ingredients derived from either (like natural flavors - can be from gluten).
2. After this, you're pretty much going to be making food from scratch, even condiments and salad dressing, because you just can't avoid all of those ingredients and buy pre-made food, typically.
3. Which makes it easier to do this: start a food journal. Usually, one would just write down food eaten, time, and then note symptoms and time when they show up. However, since you are having symptoms that you think may be quantity dependent, I'd personally write down food including amount of food, plus the time, and make sure the severity of the symptoms is noted. You want to write down EVERY item included in the food that you ingest, including oils or salt (some salt brands add things like corn - to stabilize iodine - so this actually can make a difference).
Do this for a few weeks, and then see what connections you can make.
There are a number of what are currently called intolerances (very poorly named, because it really just means that the body doesn't tolerate them, but can be for many reasons) that are in numerous, seemingly unrelated foods, so might be worth exploring when you are checking your food journal over.
1. Fructose malabsorption - a low FODMAP diet is required for this. The Monash University has the best, most up to date information I've seen on this yet. Involves a lot of carbs, especially fruits and veggies with more carbs.
2. sulfite sensitivity - some people with this can also have issues with foods high in sulfur, like eggs, broccoli, onions, and so on. But apples is typically not the issue, so this seems less likely.
3. Salicylate sensitivity - needs a low sals diet
4. histamine intolerance - needs a low histamine diet
5. sensitivity to taurines - need to eat low taurines
6. There's a few others that are simply intolerances to certain proteins. Sometimes it's a problem with a few of them at once, so it's really simple intolerances or low level allergies, but they just have to be hunted down. They CAN cause full body pain, and the intolerances seem more likely to cause pain the next day as opposed to right after eating.
7. An odd one, but could apply - celiac disease. This involves the body attacking its intestines when gluten - even tiny particles or contamination of it - are ingested. For at least a third of people with this, they can have NO symptoms when they eat gluten and don't start noticing OTHER problems when they eat. For example, the villi that are destroyed by this are where certain enzymes are made, like those that help digest lactose, or digesting certain sugars, which would be more commonly found in high carb foods. The trouble with this is that it takes weeks for the body to heal on a gluten free diet, so it takes a while of being gluten free (at celiac level compliance, which you 'd need to research) before symptoms start to improve. So this one wouldnt' have a quick fix. But it can cause pain, inflammation, muscle aches, all sorts of stuff that is usually not mentioned outside of literature shared among experts, :-/
8. Parasites or diseases- some parasites, like giardia, are affected by diet. Some diseases like lyme disease are affected by diet. And can cause more symptoms when you eat certain foods. I know gluten seems to have a negative impact on lyme disease.
9. carbohydrate intolerance - this is typically due to a lack of certain enzymes, or too low levels (again, celiac disease could potentially affect this, from what I read). But it doesn't seem to cause the level of pain you are experiencing.
I wish you well - it took me a few years to find out what was going on with my own body (mast cell activation disorder), but there's SO much more information out there that I hope you can figure it out faster!
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JanetYellen wrote: »Could it be an allergy to gluten?
Apples? No.0 -
I don't know. This all seems complicated. I'm sure I'm fine, was just curious. I just have to eat 2 slices of pizza instead of 4 and I feel okay
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Sorry to hear about your problem. It sounds painful and confusing.
I think the advice from @shaumom is great. I had chronic pain and inflammation that would flare up in my leg and wrist (previous injuries) and found that foods were a huge factor after doing an elimination diet. My worst triggers are processed meats, but I also get symptoms if I gorge on wheat products or sugar. While my experience is different from yours, I think you'd benefit from trying it out. Just google "the 4 R's of gut health" or something like that and you'll find a lot of good resources to follow. Basically, its Remove, Repair, Restore, Replace, which is referring to potential intolerances and gut health and flora.
http://www.precisionnutrition.com/elimination-diet
Fruit sugar is fructose while sugar in cakes or breads might be regular white sugar (sucrose) or could be fructose (from high fructose corn syrup), depending on how it was made. HFCS is cheaper than white sugar. Sucrose will break down into glucose and fructose. Glucose and fructose are processed differently by the body.arditarose wrote: »What is the difference between sugars from an apple or added sugar in cakes or sugar in bread?
It's hard to say without more info, but I'd suspect fructose. Just cause your reaction to apples was so severe. Could be an apple-specific problem, though. Do you react to other fruits? Honey is pretty high in fructose. Do you react to that?0 -
Sorry to hear about your problem. It sounds painful and confusing.
I think the advice from @shaumom is great. I had chronic pain and inflammation that would flare up in my leg and wrist (previous injuries) and found that foods were a huge factor after doing an elimination diet. My worst triggers are processed meats, but I also get symptoms if I gorge on wheat products or sugar. While my experience is different from yours, I think you'd benefit from trying it out. Just google "the 4 R's of gut health" or something like that and you'll find a lot of good resources to follow. Basically, its Remove, Repair, Restore, Replace, which is referring to potential intolerances and gut health and flora.
http://www.precisionnutrition.com/elimination-diet
Fruit sugar is fructose while sugar in cakes or breads might be regular white sugar (sucrose) or could be fructose (from high fructose corn syrup), depending on how it was made. HFCS is cheaper than white sugar. Sucrose will break down into glucose and fructose. Glucose and fructose are processed differently by the body.arditarose wrote: »What is the difference between sugars from an apple or added sugar in cakes or sugar in bread?
It's hard to say without more info, but I'd suspect fructose. Just cause your reaction to apples was so severe. Could be an apple-specific problem, though. Do you react to other fruits? Honey is pretty high in fructose. Do you react to that?
I mean I really ate a lot of apples that day. Kind of embarrassing to admit. I generally don't eat too much fruit because I'm not drawn to it so I can't say for sure.
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I'm PMing you to avoid a dumpster fire here.0
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I would do an elimination diet like what was suggested and go from there.0
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Have you noticed similar reactions after low carb meals?
Generally pain would indicate an allergy (in my experience). You could try some protocols of cutting out foods and then incorporating them back in to determine the source of pain.0 -
Have you noticed similar reactions after low carb meals?
Generally pain would indicate an allergy (in my experience). You could try some protocols of cutting out foods and then incorporating them back in to determine the source of pain.
No. I started paying attention because I thought it could just be water retention/sodium issue on some of my more extravagant days but really I am a sodium monster 7 days out of the week so I don't think that's it. Mostly carbs, admittedly when I go quite hard/over eat...but not always. Sometimes it'll happen with a moderate amount.
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arditarose wrote: »
There's a lot of information out there for sure, but a lot of it is anecdotal, etc. so I can definitely see why! You've got me curious and doing lots of reading.0 -
Have you noticed similar reactions after low carb meals?
Generally pain would indicate an allergy (in my experience). You could try some protocols of cutting out foods and then incorporating them back in to determine the source of pain.
He's right about the allergy piece- there is a good possibility it's an inflammatory response to something.0 -
I'm PMing you to avoid a dumpster fire here.
I wish you would post here because I would love to know you opinions.
So here is my experience with food allergies and it has yet been explained to me.
If i eat even a part of an oyster, sallop, mussel or clam I feel like I am being stabbed in the stomach and i spend the night snuggling some porcelain instead of my wife. Found this out on a business trip and confirm on my first vday with the wife... sexy right?
This is the interesting one... I can eat a limited quantity of shrimp (<6 small or 3-4 large) pieces of shrimp... after that, hives, throat closing and anaphylaxic shock. So most people assume shelf fish.... nope... i can pound lobster and crab like its my job. Seriously, 3 lbs of snow crab or 2.5 lbs of lobster with not issue. It makes me sad because i love shrimp cocktail.0 -
I'm PMing you to avoid a dumpster fire here.
I wish you would post here because I would love to know you opinions.
So here is my experience with food allergies and it has yet been explained to me.
If i eat even a part of an oyster, sallop, mussel or clam I feel like I am being stabbed in the stomach and i spend the night snuggling some porcelain instead of my wife. Found this out on a business trip and confirm on my first vday with the wife... sexy right?
This is the interesting one... I can eat a limited quantity of shrimp (<6 small or 3-4 large) pieces of shrimp... after that, hives, throat closing and anaphylaxic shock. So most people assume shelf fish.... nope... i can pound lobster and crab like its my job. Seriously, 3 lbs of snow crab or 2.5 lbs of lobster with not issue. It makes me sad because i love shrimp cocktail.
So basically, allergies can be tricky lol. I would really rather not do an elimination diet. bleh0
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