Keto
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Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
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Has OP ever said if she had any reason to lower carb intake for medical reasons, or was she just looking to lose weight and has a preexisting issue with cholesterol? My take is the latter, OP just looking for a sustainable weight loss program that would help educate her about nutrition.
OP I'm not sure if you're still around but if so, maybe you could clarify your goals (how much do you want to lose and do you have any other conditions to consider besides the high cholesterol) and hopefully people can focus on what might be best for you rather than debating the merits of a certain diet.0 -
Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
Those are data points comparing types of diets, not total amount of weight loss, nor percentage of weight loss.
I already said weight loss can't guarantee triglyceride changes, but just as surely as low carb is going to lower glucose, losing weight is going to lower triglycerides, for pretty much the same reasons - less in, while metabolic demands still requiring more go out.0 -
Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
Those are data points comparing types of diets, not total amount of weight loss, nor percentage of weight loss.
I already said weight loss can't guarantee triglyceride changes, but just as surely as low carb is going to lower glucose, losing weight is going to lower triglycerides, for pretty much the same reasons - less in, while metabolic demands still requiring more go out.
Are you familiar with hepatic portal circulation, and its relevance to cholesterol levels, independent of dietary fat and body fat?0 -
lithezebra wrote: »Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
Those are data points comparing types of diets, not total amount of weight loss, nor percentage of weight loss.
I already said weight loss can't guarantee triglyceride changes, but just as surely as low carb is going to lower glucose, losing weight is going to lower triglycerides, for pretty much the same reasons - less in, while metabolic demands still requiring more go out.
Are you familiar with hepatic portal circulation, and its relevance to cholesterol levels, independent of dietary fat and body fat?
Do you possibly mean Enterohepatic circulation?0 -
That's another name for it.lithezebra wrote: »Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
Those are data points comparing types of diets, not total amount of weight loss, nor percentage of weight loss.
I already said weight loss can't guarantee triglyceride changes, but just as surely as low carb is going to lower glucose, losing weight is going to lower triglycerides, for pretty much the same reasons - less in, while metabolic demands still requiring more go out.
Are you familiar with hepatic portal circulation, and its relevance to cholesterol levels, independent of dietary fat and body fat?
Do you possibly mean Enterohepatic circulation?0 -
lithezebra wrote: »
That's another name for it.lithezebra wrote: »Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
Those are data points comparing types of diets, not total amount of weight loss, nor percentage of weight loss.
I already said weight loss can't guarantee triglyceride changes, but just as surely as low carb is going to lower glucose, losing weight is going to lower triglycerides, for pretty much the same reasons - less in, while metabolic demands still requiring more go out.
Are you familiar with hepatic portal circulation, and its relevance to cholesterol levels, independent of dietary fat and body fat?
Do you possibly mean Enterohepatic circulation?
No, they're different things. Hepatic portal circulation has to do with digestion going to the liver. Enterohepatic has to do with the liver sending to digestion.
The fact that I mentioned oatmeal as lowering cholesterol earlier in this thread has to do with it binding cholesterol used for bile creation for digestion.
Now, is your question going somewhere? If you're setting up discuss triglyceride and other lipid endogenous production, it doesn't negate anything I said.0 -
@senecarr Are legumes essentially doing the same thing as the oatmeal? Also, can I assume oatmeal in any state accomplishes this? Rolled, instant, steel cut etc.....thanks in advance.0
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_Terrapin_ wrote: »@senecarr Are legumes essentially doing the same thing as the oatmeal? Also, can I assume oatmeal in any state accomplishes this? Rolled, instant, steel cut etc.....thanks in advance.
Legumes might, depending on the amount and type of soluble fiber in the particular legume. The way oatmeal does it is soluble fiber. The type of soluble fiber in oatmeal (and it seems in some other foods) binds up part of bile that is to digest fats. Bile is made using cholesterol, so the body has to use up part of its stores of cholesterol to make more bile to replace the cholesterol that oatmeal essentially forces you to flush (sorry for the pun) out of your system.
Off the top of my head, I imagine the more processed the oat, the more fiber is gone, so the less benefit one would get in terms of cholesterol lowering.0 -
oyChihuahua wrote: »
I just saw them in another subforum's thread saying you can get all the vitamins and minerals you need from supplements.0 -
oyChihuahua wrote: »
I just saw them in another subforum's thread saying you can get all the vitamins and minerals you need from supplements.
Based on the guy who developed Soylent living off it himself, it would seem you can get all the ones you need to survive that way, but evidence points to not thriving that way.0 -
_Terrapin_ wrote: »@senecarr Are legumes essentially doing the same thing as the oatmeal? Also, can I assume oatmeal in any state accomplishes this? Rolled, instant, steel cut etc.....thanks in advance.
Legumes might, depending on the amount and type of soluble fiber in the particular legume. The way oatmeal does it is soluble fiber. The type of soluble fiber in oatmeal (and it seems in some other foods) binds up part of bile that is to digest fats. Bile is made using cholesterol, so the body has to use up part of its stores of cholesterol to make more bile to replace the cholesterol that oatmeal essentially forces you to flush (sorry for the pun) out of your system.
Off the top of my head, I imagine the more processed the oat, the more fiber is gone, so the less benefit one would get in terms of cholesterol lowering.
Thanks. Sounds like legumes and fiber content are next on the poop pile/lower cholesterol search.
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_Terrapin_ wrote: »_Terrapin_ wrote: »@senecarr Are legumes essentially doing the same thing as the oatmeal? Also, can I assume oatmeal in any state accomplishes this? Rolled, instant, steel cut etc.....thanks in advance.
Legumes might, depending on the amount and type of soluble fiber in the particular legume. The way oatmeal does it is soluble fiber. The type of soluble fiber in oatmeal (and it seems in some other foods) binds up part of bile that is to digest fats. Bile is made using cholesterol, so the body has to use up part of its stores of cholesterol to make more bile to replace the cholesterol that oatmeal essentially forces you to flush (sorry for the pun) out of your system.
Off the top of my head, I imagine the more processed the oat, the more fiber is gone, so the less benefit one would get in terms of cholesterol lowering.
Thanks. Sounds like legumes and fiber content are next on the poop pile/lower cholesterol search.
Soy and some plants do have sterols and stanols that have a similar structure to cholesterol that may cause reductions in cholesterol. Some research suggests it could generate, if I recall correctly, as much as a 10% reduction.0 -
_Terrapin_ wrote: »_Terrapin_ wrote: »@senecarr Are legumes essentially doing the same thing as the oatmeal? Also, can I assume oatmeal in any state accomplishes this? Rolled, instant, steel cut etc.....thanks in advance.
Legumes might, depending on the amount and type of soluble fiber in the particular legume. The way oatmeal does it is soluble fiber. The type of soluble fiber in oatmeal (and it seems in some other foods) binds up part of bile that is to digest fats. Bile is made using cholesterol, so the body has to use up part of its stores of cholesterol to make more bile to replace the cholesterol that oatmeal essentially forces you to flush (sorry for the pun) out of your system.
Off the top of my head, I imagine the more processed the oat, the more fiber is gone, so the less benefit one would get in terms of cholesterol lowering.
Thanks. Sounds like legumes and fiber content are next on the poop pile/lower cholesterol search.
http://examine.com/faq/is-soy-good-or-bad-for-me/
Soy and Health section of that link has more in depth information.0 -
_Terrapin_ wrote: »_Terrapin_ wrote: »@senecarr Are legumes essentially doing the same thing as the oatmeal? Also, can I assume oatmeal in any state accomplishes this? Rolled, instant, steel cut etc.....thanks in advance.
Legumes might, depending on the amount and type of soluble fiber in the particular legume. The way oatmeal does it is soluble fiber. The type of soluble fiber in oatmeal (and it seems in some other foods) binds up part of bile that is to digest fats. Bile is made using cholesterol, so the body has to use up part of its stores of cholesterol to make more bile to replace the cholesterol that oatmeal essentially forces you to flush (sorry for the pun) out of your system.
Off the top of my head, I imagine the more processed the oat, the more fiber is gone, so the less benefit one would get in terms of cholesterol lowering.
Thanks. Sounds like legumes and fiber content are next on the poop pile/lower cholesterol search.
Soy and some plants do have sterols and stanols that have a similar structure to cholesterol that may cause reductions in cholesterol. Some research suggests it could generate, if I recall correctly, as much as a 10% reduction.
Thanks. I see a nurse practitioner in 3 weeks who works in a cardiology group. Good information to have handy.
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Yes, as triglycerides represent long term fat storage, losing weight, at least losing fat, tends to require turning available triglycerides into energy. It is certainly possible (though rare) for someone to be in sustained calorie deficit and have their triglycerides go up, but it would tend to indicate some kind of other health issue that needs addressing.
The concentration of triglycerides in the bloodstream doesn't really tell us definitively about the flux or the reserves though. This summary of some diet trials shows changes in TG levels in blood :-
Those are data points comparing types of diets, not total amount of weight loss, nor percentage of weight loss.
I already said weight loss can't guarantee triglyceride changes, but just as surely as low carb is going to lower glucose, losing weight is going to lower triglycerides, for pretty much the same reasons - less in, while metabolic demands still requiring more go out.
They are but they show the change in triglycerides. The low carb arms achieved greater reductions in triglycerides, didn't they ?
I picked one reference off the graph, 2 kg of fat loss on the low fat arm left them with the same triglycerides at 6 months as baseline. So as you say weight loss doesn't guarantee reductions in triglycerides.
I don't follow your argument that less in means lower triglycerides. Weight loss does not per se mean less triglyceride entering the bloodstream, one could be eating more or less triglyceride while losing weight. The fat being drawn from storage is present as free fatty acids, not triglycerides. Triglyceride production from excess carbohydrate is also a consideration, irrespective of weight loss.
[ Ref ]0 -
oyChihuahua wrote: »
I just saw them in another subforum's thread saying you can get all the vitamins and minerals you need from supplements.
Like the supplementation in the food chain of fortified breads and flours ?0 -
"They" (meaning me) were saying that most people eating at a caloric deficit may want to consider taking a multivitamin. "They" also implied (or tried to imply) that perhaps the individual's health benefits from eating low carb would outweigh a recommendation to eat more servings of fruit and veggies, especially if they are high GI produce.
Others in that thread seem to think fruits and veggies are the only place to get your nutrients.0 -
"They" (meaning me) were saying that most people eating at a caloric deficit may want to consider taking a multivitamin. "They" also implied (or tried to imply) that perhaps the individual's health benefits from eating low carb would outweigh a recommendation to eat more servings of fruit and veggies, especially if they are high GI produce.
Others in that thread seem to think fruits and veggies are the only place to get your nutrients.
I can't speak for others in the thread but I think it is inappropriate to recommend that a large minority of the population would benefit from going low carb if it means that the individual, who may or may not have medical reasons to restrict carbs, would start building a large portion of their daily calorie consumption around whipping cream, butter, pork rinds, bacon and cheese at the expense of fruits and vegetables or other nutrient dense foods: whole grains, lean protein, etc.
The OP here never mentioned any medical reason to restrict carbs. She has high cholesterol and wants to lose weight. Her doctor advised her against keto. Yet once again, everyone is still arguing about the same thing we are arguing about in several threads simultaneously. If a ketogenic diet is beneficial health wise for someone who has not mentioned a medical reason to restrict carbs.
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WinoGelato wrote: »"They" (meaning me) were saying that most people eating at a caloric deficit may want to consider taking a multivitamin. "They" also implied (or tried to imply) that perhaps the individual's health benefits from eating low carb would outweigh a recommendation to eat more servings of fruit and veggies, especially if they are high GI produce.
Others in that thread seem to think fruits and veggies are the only place to get your nutrients.
I can't speak for others in the thread but I think it is inappropriate to recommend that a large minority of the population would benefit from going low carb if it means that the individual, who may or may not have medical reasons to restrict carbs, would start building a large portion of their daily calorie consumption around whipping cream, butter, pork rinds, bacon and cheese at the expense of fruits and vegetables or other nutrient dense foods: whole grains, lean protein, etc.
The OP here never mentioned any medical reason to restrict carbs. She has high cholesterol and wants to lose weight. Her doctor advised her against keto. Yet once again, everyone is still arguing about the same thing we are arguing about in several threads simultaneously. If a ketogenic diet is beneficial health wise for someone who has not mentioned a medical reason to restrict carbs.
Gee. Good thing I never said that then, eh?
I am not the one who brought up another thread.0
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